Nidus discussion Post Devstream 84

[Vilemyre]

2 hours ago, Dopey said:

Ok so the new infested frame lead me to think... what will happen when DE will release the prime version of it?

We aren't aware of the lore of it yet, however we can assume that there is a prime version of it... cause it's a Warframe.

 

So I imagine Ballas going like this: "Hi Orokin overlords, remember that infestation virus that almost destroyed us? Well we made a brand new ugly-vomitting-melting Infested Warframe!

and it also has gold spores on it! 

In all seriousness.. how will it work as a prime? I honestly can't see the orokin overlords approving such frame, simply because of the fact that they will find it disgusting, and lore wise The Orokin didn't approve of anything that's not perfect

I want to believe since  there has been hints that a warframe is basically a infested being contained within a suit that Nidus is what happens when the suit fails to contain the infestation.

Usually it would either turn the frame into a hulking mess of a creature with no sense of self control or in Nidus's case it became one with him.

Its very likely he will get a prime that will fit the lore because even the Orokin could have had this situation happen and Nidus Prime was created by pure accident. One (kind of like Rhino Prime's description) could have killed a bunch of people in the process.

[achromos]

I am actually happy with how the warframe looks, and functions in general.  However with some abilities I have a nagging nitpick (I know which probably will be solved BEFORE we get him or aren't as important)

 

His #3: Symbiotic Link is my main worry.

- I would hope for this enemy to have protection from allies akin to Mind Control where all the damage allies do will add up but it wont apply until Mind Control ends.

-I hope the range for both enemies and allies is a rather generous one or effected by range mods.  50m for enemies 75m allies?  This is a fast paced game and trying to aid your allies with something that requires them to hug you is like trying to hoard cats into a room...  :/

 

P.S: I know the frame isn't out, I'm just advertising my worries.  Telling me that I shouldn't worry until the frame comes out, or I shouldn't hold discussions about him until the frame is out isn't helpful.  Ignore this topic if you want, because this is a discussion based on his powers as shown in Devstream #84.
 

Edited December 10, 2016 by achromos
Edit: Sigh... did I really mis-post this into General... ugh x.X

[AdunSaveMe]

24 minutes ago, Phyrak said:

Kinda hope there is a slight dependence/ability buff based on level of secondary resource

1 gets greater damage/range etc

Passively gain additional resources etc

Make the ult only use 1 level rather than consuming all 4

Just some thoughts

 

It certainly would be more interesting, so you can decide if you want to keep those buffs or spend it all on your 4th.

[LogaMC1995]

2 hours ago, TheDefenestrater said:

Oh oh!  How about permitting you to cast it on allies?  The trolling would be amazing!  Or, change the effect to give both frames some buff while the link is active, like linked health and armor.  Assuming our guy has like 300 base armor, he symbiotes with some squishy caster, making them tankier while heals to one affect the other.

Symbiotic Link will be able to cast on allies to give damage boost.

[(XBOX)Knight Raime]

Titania says hi.  Also I don't consider it a big deal at the present.  Since titania's is easily forgotten and nidus's doesn't effect anything in his kit at all save for using his 4.  it might as well not exist if DE goes ahead and releases him as is.

[(PSN)Silverback73]

Merry Christmas!

Here's how to make Nidas' maggots special and balance him for very cool gameplay. In this post, I will show how DE can use existing frame mechanics with a twist to make a VERY COOL INFESTIVE NIDAS without reinventing the wheel.

#1.  How to specialize the maggotechnocyte!

Maggots need to be a very slow-acting Technocyte-Vector that has CC qualities AND give a chance to turn enemies into minions like Inaros and Nekros have...but with a twist.

Mechanic Number 1:

Borrowing from Nyx' Chaos, the maggots should create the CC squirm animation on targets for 1 second, biting and infecting their target, and then immediately jump off and head to the next nearest target.  The maggots aren't causing the damage; the technocyte is.

Mechanic #2.

 The technocyte acts like Ash's Slash Status Proc, bypassing armor values.  While bleeding out (see Nekros minions slow-health drain), the Technocyte causes incredible pain, and the target acts under the same rules as Nyx' Chaos, attacking all nearby targets (see Rhino Codex for lore-backing behavior).

Mechanic #3.

Enemies that die/are killed under the Status Effect become equivalent-level volatile runners (the animation model stays that of the original unit) that seek out the nearest non-infected target and explode, causing equivalent combustion beam damage and releasing 2-4 maggots to continue the process.

Mechanic #4.

Nidas leech power should also infect the target with the Slash Status Proc mentioned above and turn the target if it dies for a greater  RoI in a mob shooter.

Conclusion:

So what I've shown is a very specialized, very strong way that Nidas can be more fun, effective, and true to his theme.

The drawbacks to counter it are also theme-worthy:  He can't control affected targets, reflecting the deadly nature of Technocyte as it spreads.

It's basically a slow acting Aggro-CC version of Spores that acts under the rules of Chaos as it spreads.  They aren't Nidas minions so much as Technocyte minions.

Thoughts and Happy Holidays!

 

 

 

Edited December 10, 2016 by (PS4)Silverback73

[Slenderminion]

So, everyone who saw the last Devstream will know that Nidus, the new infested Warframe, will come soon with his own Quest. This Quest will involve the Perrin Sequence.

Am i the only one who is confused about this? I assumed that his Quest would belong to the Red Veil, and not Perrin Sequence. Think about it. Red Veil uses Infested Chargers as their Assassination Squad to hunt you down, sells Augment Mods for Infested weapons and has Infested in their Relay room. Giving the Quest to the Red Veil would have been more fitting, or do i see that wrong?

Considering that Nidus will come out before 2017, i'm guessing that there wouldn't be enough time to change it anyways, but it is something that i wanted to get off my chest beforehand.

What are your thoughts?

[Mcl_Blue]

Considering we still don't know what exactly the quest will entail, I think this kind of feedback is best suited for after it comes out.

[(PSN)LeBlingKing]

Aura: Rejuvenation (because we need that health)

Vitality (because we need that health)

Steel Fiber (because we need to protect that health)

Intensify (due to that 1st, we don't need efficiency if we get enough enemies in that line of phlegm)

Equilibrium  (because we need that energy)

Stretch (so that our army of cockroaches can spread across the land)

Natural Talent (because we need fast- paced casts in a fast-paced game)

Transient Fortitude (because unless you're using his 3, you don't need duration)

Armored Agility

And forma, lots of it 

Fashionframe Bonus: 

Embolist / Iliac Armor Set

Pink and purple color scheme with green energy

Alt helmet that will either cost 75 plat to buy, or 10 Nitain to build

[(PSN)LiamRising]

depends on what the quest entails it might be perrin but the quest might fit them and the frame well will have to wait and see.

[Katinka]

I think the lore reasons for Nidus being in the quest will have more to do with the actions of Perrin Sequence's enemy than Perrin Sequence themselves.

[(PSN)Mofojokers]

I'm going with sex slave trade and Perrin are the middle men in getting us Nidus contract.😂

Edited December 10, 2016 by (PS4)Mofojokers

[Phyrak]

28 minutes ago, AdunSaveMe said:

It certainly would be more interesting, so you can decide if you want to keep those buffs or spend it all on your 4th.

Tap for single use, hold for greater use?

[Phyrak]

21 minutes ago, (PS4)Silverback73 said:

Merry Christmas!

Here's how to make Nidas' maggots special and balance him for very cool gameplay. In this post, I will show how DE can use existing frame mechanics with a twist to make a VERY COOL INFESTIVE NIDAS without reinventing the wheel.

#1.  How to specialize the maggotechnocyte!

Maggots need to be a very slow-acting Technocyte-Vector that has CC qualities AND give a chance to turn enemies into minions like Inaros and Nekros have...but with a twist.

Mechanic Number 1:

Borrowing from Nyx' Chaos, the maggots should create the CC squirm animation on targets for 1 second, biting and infecting their target, and then immediately jump off and head to the next nearest target.  The maggots aren't causing the damage; the technocyte is.

Mechanic #2.

 The technocyte acts like Ash's Slash Status Proc, bypassing armor values.  While bleeding out (see Nekros minions slow-health drain), the Technocyte causes incredible pain, and the target acts under the same rules as Nyx' Chaos, attacking all nearby targets (see Rhino Codex for lore-backing behavior).

Mechanic #3.

Enemies that die/are killed under the Status Effect become equivalent-level volatile runners (the animation model stays that of the original unit) that seek out the nearest non-infected target and explode, causing equivalent combustion beam damage and releasing 2-4 maggots to continue the process.

Mechanic #4.

Nidas leech power should also infect the target with the Slash Status Proc mentioned above and turn the target if it dies for a greater  RoI in a mob shooter.

Conclusion:

So what I've shown is a very specialized, very strong way that Nidas can be more fun, effective, and true to his theme.

The drawbacks to counter it are also theme-worthy:  He can't control affected targets, reflecting the deadly nature of Technocyte as it spreads.

It's basically a slow acting Aggro-CC version of Spores that acts under the rules of Chaos as it spreads.  They aren't Nidas minions so much as Technocyte minions.

Thoughts and Happy Holidays!

 

 

 

I dig it

The 1 needs some power to it

On stream it was 145% str and rng and 130 eff and dur - the 1 needs a heap more range and damage to ve viable

A single line can only do so much vs a cone akin to frost

Or as was mentioned somwhere - let the duration add additional damage

Or even both

Side that with low hp regen against level 15s and you're in strife

[Whit3Powd3R]

I would hold on with armor mods. 

Why? 

In devstream Rebecca fought with low lvl mobs and Nidus health dropped pretty fast in some situations. I think he won't have much armor sadly :(

[Drakenreiter]

Okay.

[Zyrgi]

Already sounds like a terrible build. But that's just my opinion.

Edited December 10, 2016 by Zyrgi

[Koldraxon-732]

I guess Rage, Quick Thinking (optional) and Primed Flow would allow him to tether himself to enemies more often, increasing his survivability immensely.

Rejuvenation would speed up his health regen, aswell.

Possible build from my perspective:

Spoiler

 

Rejuvenation, and some Exilus mod if you can fit it.

Vigor (can be swapped for Quick Thinking or something else based on preferences), Rage, Primed Flow, Primed Continuity,

Vitality, Intensify, Stretch, and Streamline.

You may be wondering why I don't put Armour mods in my builds. That's because there's no room for them.

 

 

[Vilemyre]

35 minutes ago, Slenderminion said:

So, everyone who saw the last Devstream will know that Nidus, the new infested Warframe, will come soon with his own Quest. This Quest will involve the Perrin Sequence.

Am i the only one who is confused about this? I assumed that his Quest would belong to the Red Veil, and not Perrin Sequence. Think about it. Red Veil uses Infested Chargers as their Assassination Squad to hunt you down, sells Augment Mods for Infested weapons and has Infested in their Relay room. Giving the Quest to the Red Veil would have been more fitting, or do i see that wrong?

Considering that Nidus will come out before 2017, i'm guessing that there wouldn't be enough time to change it anyways, but it is something that i wanted to get off my chest beforehand.

What are your thoughts?

If you watched the devstream it was said the Perrin Sequence have a infesttation problem that needs taking care of. They don't support the use of infestation just it needs cleaning up on one of their ships no doubt.

[(XBOX)Knight Raime]

Inb4 "we haven't played him yet" comments.  This thread serves as a discussion on how to make him better.  As right now he seems niche as best.  and the showcase of him didn't really do any favors either other than seeing visuals.  I know DE want's to release him this month for PC.  I'd personally rather them wait till next month so they have more time to polish his kit.  As it stands right now I don't think he'd do well.  Why?  He's not very survivable, his damage isn't really worth mentioning, and his CC is clunky/inconsistent.  So i'm going to do my best to buff his kit into acceptable levels.  My ideas are not the only ideas or the best.  They should just be an idea of where DE needs to look in order to make him better.  Before I get into it though I want DE to go a bit harder on the sound effects.  He needs to sound disgusting.

Passive: His passive needs a buff.  Either faster ticking or more health per tick.  Perhaps allow a mod to make it better.  I'd also like to see him passively resist toxin damage.

His 1: Currently it gives energy back and damage and both are dependent on how many targets are effected.  I believe to add onto this it should give health back for each enemy effected.  If nidus has any stacks available it increase the damage, energy gain, health gain from this ability.  Multiple stacks will not make it any better.

His 2: I feel like it should grab enemies just a tad bit faster.  If Nidus has a stack tethered enemies will take damage and that damage will be funnled to Nidus for health.  The more stacks Nidus has the more damage it does and more health he gets in return.

His 3: I feel like the casting time should be cut down here to help with the flow of combat.  Also in addition to all damage on him being redirected to his link he should also be gaining health back based on a fixed percentage of the damage coming into the target.  if Nidus has a stack he gains increased health regeneration after the target dies for X amount of seconds.  the more stacks he has the longer the buff to his regeneration lasts.  This buff would not be effected by power duration.

His 4: I also feel like the casting time here should be cut down.  it's waaaaay too slow.  Upon looking through the footage yet again it seems Nidus already gains health back rapidly sitting in his AoE.  So that doesn't need to be added.  However I still think it needs tweaking.  For one it should not require 4 stacks to activate.  Instead you can cast it if you have the energy.  However having a stack or more will increase the amount of maggots that spawn, increase the AoE from the creep, and decrease the cost of his 4.  In addition to that I feel like while standing in his creep he should be getting an increase to his armor.  I'd also like the maggots to play a bigger effect.  Either the maggots give health regeneration as well so he's not forced to camp on the creep.  OR targets effected by maggots if they die should give Nidus some chunks of health back.

Other:  I do not know how much HP nidus will have at rank 30 with a max vitality on nor do I know his armor value.  But I feel whatever his health is at it should be buffed up some.  and his armor should sit somewhere between inaros and chroma.  Not so much that he's viewed as a tank.  But enough that he can take some hits while he's building up his health/regeneration.

So why these changes?  Well I already kind of touched on that in the beginning.  But i'll try my best to explain my thought process. First in for most disregarding his abilities I felt that he wasn't going to be survivable enough for higher content  He has health regeneration but nothing other than his 4 effect that.  And his CC while passable didn't seem to be enough.  Also they added in a new mechanic called stacks.  unfortunately they didn't play a huge role.  Which is why I wanted to make sure stacks were effecting him through out the kit as well as help him with surviving.  The buffs to his passive and his health/armor are meant to make sure he can live long enough to get going.  DE is creating a Warframe here that snowballs in terms of power.  So I tried to keep that in mind.  But he also needed to be strong enough at start so he can survive to snowball.  This is kind of why chroma isn't in a good spot just fyi.

 

I chose the buff on his 1 so it would always be useful.  It's cheap and potentially even more helpful if you set it up right.  I don't want multiple stacks effecting his 1 because I feel it would just turn into a spam power.  I chose the buff for his 2 that way he can recoup a little while things are not shooting at him.  Allowing multiple stacks to effect this ability makes since because it seems like you can only have 1 out at a time.  and I feel like his 2 is his bread and butter ability anyway since it allows him to setup his 1 or his 3.  The buff to 3 for me was really apperant because it seemed the most clunky.  You'd be risking yourself by trying to target the tankiest enemy.  And should that enemy die quickly due to amount of fire of other enemies or from an ally either way it would have screwed nidus.  So the health regeneration addition should keep him at least topped up regardless of how long his linked enemy lives.  and the regeneration buff after the guy dies should mean if Nidus escapes he shouldn't have much down time before being able to get right back in the fight.

As for his 4 I feel it was the best ability of the bunch design wise.  it seemed to hit all the basic needs.  However it still felt underwhelming. So the reduction in cast time just makes sense.  However the removal of the 4 stack requirement also makes sense.  If i'm spending energy to use the ability AND require an outside source to use his (current) best ability that just seems too gated.  You'd essentially be walking around with only 3 abilities which I just don't think is healthy for any frame.  Instead of adding a new effect based on stacks I simply kept DE's 4 stack thing but changed what the 4 stacks means.  Since he regens health at a rapid rate inside his creep it seems to stand that giving him an armor buff inside this would make him survive while having to sit in a spot.  The maggots getting an added effect can serve as 2 effects.  It can either further enforce him holding inside the area of creep or it can allow him to move around at the cost of some survivability but not completely screw him.  Overall giving the player the ability to choose when exactly to spend the stacks adds a layer of tactics I don't think has been seen really in WF.  since not only shedding the stacks impacts how effective his 4 is.  But it also effects the rest of his kit too.  Creating a risk/reward scenario without completely ruining your usefulness (ala chroma.)  I wanted to say that they should maybe increase how quickly you can get stacks.  But I feel that's something that needs to be found out through lots of people playing him.

Thanks for sticking with me this long.  I hope my ideas sound better polished now and make sense.  Feel free to share your own ideas or comment on mine.

Edited December 10, 2016 by (XB1)Knight Raime

[(PSN)Stanicek3]

For his passive, I wouldn't be surprised if the aura polarity matches Rejuvination to make it better.

[Iceheart125]

I'm gonna wait till I can get him to 30 with a forma or two before I pass judgement 

[(XBOX)Knight Raime]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)Stanicek3 said:

For his passive, I wouldn't be surprised if the aura polarity matches Rejuvination to make it better.

i'm 100% expecting that.  However when I said "mod" I was referring to things like power strength or what have you.

Just now, Iceheart125 said:

I'm gonna wait till I can get him to 30 with a forma or two before I pass judgement 

That is fair.

[Beggining]

Maybe the quest will be related to the Black Seed as well, a so-called Corpus  like faction that unleashed the Juggernauts into the Origin System?

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Black_Seed

[(XBOX)Warden Cleric]

Yeah I was confused as well, but as others say, it probably has to do with helping them clear infested in some way which will lead to the frame. Was expecting a tech focus frame. :l