How acceptable is mission failure?

[Ciaus]

8 minutes ago, (PS4)SKRIMP-N-GRITZ said:

I'll have to look into this. Thanks, unless you're pulling my leg. ;)

No prob, careful cus there are 2 sensors not just one. 
You can check a guide if the path is confusing, but you can do the vaults with like no difficult parkour at all. 

[brainjelly2g0]

Take it like this. I've completed 4,394 missions, in about 3 and a half years of playing. In all that time, care to guess how many times I've failed a mission? 1,000? 500? 140. I don't put too much pressure on people <MR8, but if we're on Sortie 3, and its a Corpus Spy, and you're playing Loki, and you're MR 15+, I'm forced to assume that you've gotten a basic understanding of Spy missions. When people who, by the game's definition, are skilled, yet still screw up what I find to be the easiest mode in the game, there's just no excuse.

Generally though, when I do fail missions, I tell the squad what needs to go better, and then guide them through it. I don't abandon people, just teach them. But, here's a PSA: If you are of high MR and cannot complete a Spy, go learn. It's something I can do without a stealth frame at this point, and I expect more experienced players to be able to do it with one.

[ArcaneSnowdrop]

9 hours ago, ArchPhaeton said:

Why would you even squint your eyes, having a minimap to navigate? Also fire is quicker and simpler, which is why most people go for that, instead of failing the pipes defense (it happens)

Because if I just follow the minimap, I miss things like Napalms trying to set me on fire.

[SenorClipClop]

Personally, I think the punishment Warframe hands out for Mission Failure is pretty fair. But I wonder if the loss of most of your affinity and all your items is creating an issue with the player base. Since there are many players who are never okay with taking that kind of failure, I see many people playing into missions they are obviously overpowered for. Which is fine -- do what you wanna do -- but I can't help but feel it makes public matches really boring. If we know we're going to win, where's the joy in playing? I want to encourage Tenno to continually reach outside their comfort zone and try for harder missions. It's how we learn and improve.

[Zebiko]

Failure wasn't an option when it cost plat, and it's still not an option when losing time in the grind. The grind will only increase, so no time to waste.

[Jeoxz]

It's not a big deal at all. If you aren't failing a mission make sure t hit that randomize button and go have some fun.

But yeah the problem is that you failed the mission but it wasn't your fault, if you do A perfect and as you finish hacking someone activates C's alarm what can you do? Spy=Solo 90% of the time.

[Haxa6]

13 hours ago, Helljack84 said:

Could there be a way to make not winning everything (like 2 of 3 vaults) more acceptable?

Yes, just don't be a &#036;&amp;*^, I never do for my clanmates and friend list ppl, I'll explain, I'll work as taxi, I'll fail with them. It's just a game after all, why be mad?

[(XBOX)dabkevinhere710]

Sometimes when I'm playing with friends and talking and the conversation is good or I'm distracted with food or music IL fail a servival by forgetting to grab life support.

[Helljack84]

Wow, that's much more feedback than I was expecting.

So to sum a few things up:

Failing an objective isn't all that bad (yes, once in a while thousands of enemies might actually manage to blow up the defense onjective) unless it completely fails the mission. Which by itself isn't bad (because autowin would be stupid), you can probably try again (unless the alert is gone) but all that affinity and stuff you collected just going poof is a waste of time. 

Considering spy missions (depending on the difficulty level) some are fine with not getting all vaults, eg you suck at spy anyway and just want to unlock the note vs you speedrun lua ez all day farming for specific reward (efficiency). That's fine until they end up in the same pug or you need to get all 3 done no matter what, but there's still the solo/invite option. Players seem to be as likely to solo them because they don't want to inconvenience other players, as other players who solo them because someone else screwed up big time (ruining their efficiency/alert might be gone/mission failure).

(Nightmare) Trials are also a thing. Whether you prefer efficiency or not, bugs/trolls/incompetent/network issues/inexperienced players aside you might lose your investment and your chance to get anything out of it at all. No one likes that.

Might throw in (fissure) excavation, a good middleground. Unless you're in the get mission done fast or max efficiency group, you're always getting a reward out of it, maybe even an extra if you're doing fine. No threat of not getting anything out of it, but also no real threat of the enemy winning (or do we always lose because we run away in the end?...let's say we won because we got tons of stuff).

And lastly invested salvage. More about the mechanics, not bugs or C rotation rewards. Total failure is unlikely but each terminal you lose hurts your ability to progress further, up to a point where it's better to restart the mission (one terminal gone on first round but need 4 rotations).

The different mission types feature different level of punishment for failure (lose everything/not getting max efficiency) Is there a sweet spot or just different kinds of likes/dislikes when we look at challenge/failure punishment? Or is the threat of losing everything you collected/your key the greater threat in your book?

 

[Dizzle22]

I've long felt that instant failure states are very ill suited to this type of game. Especially, if one person can fail the mission for everyone.

Yes, Sortie Spy is quintessential example of this, and is why most players solo it. I don't want others to screw the mission up for me, and also, on the rare chance I totally drop the ball on a vault, I don't want to be the guy that fails the mission for others.

So, Spy missions, or any other mission with a single instant failure state are a bad idea for Warframe, which is designed to be a coop game. I personally deeply dislike Spy missions. I've gotten quite good at them, but I don't like that they are basically always a solo slog. 

That's not to say that missions should be un-failable by any means. Though there are several mission types that are essentially just that, unless the squad gets wiped or something, but how often is that happening? At least when you fail a high level Defense or Survival, it's generally because the whole team dropped the ball at some point, or just stayed to long and got in over their heads.

[ChuckMaverick]

15 hours ago, Ciaus said:

You can even get TRAPPED in a room with no console on Corpus rescue lockdown.

Liset Air Support.

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Air_Support_Charges

[(PSN)forChristsake]

I find it only mildly annoying,  but you should hear my clan leader rant,ha ha.  She hates the losses on the clan stats. If me and clanmates fail there's a quiet moment followed by "we must never speak of this" and then laughter. It just happens sometimes. What fun is a game if there isn't a chance to fail?

[Sar.K.Asmus]

It's possible to fail a non sortie spy mission in Warframe?

How?

No seriously how?

Even with no mods in your frame and just some dmg mods in your weapon It's impossible to fail.

[rudman88]

Failure is not an option when your sortie left 1 Hr.

It is acceptable if i still have 5 mroe hours

 

Failure at normal mission is acceptable provided i got a heads up and i know he is a noob

 

it is acceptable ( except when it have limited time ) and that guy is being polite and apologize

If no,

I shall ignore that person

[DrXenonBloom]

On 1/11/2017 at 1:41 PM, Jakorak said:

:/ When to your understanding, you have the knowledge and the power to complete a mission without difficulty.. and someone else causes a mission failure, it can feel like someone else is wasting your time

it can also be frustrating to observe public teammates display a glaring absence of knowledge of gamemode fundamentals. For example: i'm half convinced 80% of the playerbase doesn't know that the enemy efforts to capture a point on interception is centered on the computer terminals, as i frequently see interception pubs rush to an interception point being captured with ample time to stop the process, then proceed to kill a large number of enemies in the vicinity and the point is still captured by the enemy because they didn't target the 1 or 2 enemies that were actually taking the point.

I see this lack of knowledge reguarly even in syndicate missions and sortie mission from Mastery rank 22's, so experience isn't the issue, it's attention to detail.

I had to comment on this, couldn't help it. Your example about some players with interception missions...seeing that gets me going. I figured that out early on when I was merrily standing on the point, having captured it and up waltzes an enemy, behind my back, didn't attack, just proceeded to take the point. I learned awful quick, ohhhh, they can totally capture the point while I'm standing on it, especially if I'm not paying attention. I completely agree. Too much of the populous plays without attention to detail.