Crafting the Akbolto

[Kyuzo]

crafting the akbolto now :D

[Volume]

Back to the top for a dev response.

What do you really expect them to say?

I'm curious because we don't even get patch notes 90% of the time, and log in to find out our stuff has been nerfed or is completely different with no real explanation of the new mechanics, so why would you think they'd respond to this thread, let alone telling you what you already know? It's considered a different weapon, and crafting materials are consumed upon a build being started.

Yeah, it sucks. I guess we "should" buy two SEPARATE boltos, and craft it with those. Too bad I can't because I have no weapon slots, because I can't get more without plat.

That said, it should warn you, but with how cryptic/buggy the interface already is, I'm surprised there are even prices next to half the stuff.

[lohntron39]

What do you really expect them to say?

I'm curious because we don't even get patch notes 90% of the time, and log in to find out our stuff has been nerfed or is completely different with no real explanation of the new mechanics, so why would you think they'd respond to this thread, let alone telling you what you already know? It's considered a different weapon, and crafting materials are consumed upon a build being started.

Yeah, it sucks. I guess we "should" buy two SEPARATE boltos, and craft it with those. Too bad I can't because I have no weapon slots, because I can't get more without plat.

That said, it should warn you, but with how cryptic/buggy the interface already is, I'm surprised there are even prices next to half the stuff.

Your statements about the devs are pretty accurate, nothing to say against that. What I'm wanting them to say is "We see that this is an unexpected issue that some players are concerned about, and we will address it accordingly in a future patch/hotfix, or we'll refund you a potato if you use it up to craft a weapon like this."

I am currently stuck because of weapons slots. I have one free slot. I have my 30 potato'd bolto, a bolto waiting to be claimed in the foundry, and 5 other weapons waiting to be claimed as well. I can't even consider using one of those other weapons because I have to keep a slot open for the ten seconds it would take to have two boltos to make the akbolto, and I've already sold everything that had a similar weapon of lower stats (i.e. sold my 24 cronus and 17 jaw sword to keep my heat sword, sold braton and kept gorgon), and every weapon I DO have is level 30.

For kicks, go ask that tuna guy what he expects them to say in regards to all this. According to him, DE would have told us if someone asked weeks ago if they had plans for a dual bolto, so getting a response about a current issue should be cake!

[lohntron39]

Few things are more annoying than losing something you worked for because nobody told you grabbing another gun with your left hand would reset the one on your right hand.

Back to the top for a dev response.

[lohntron39]

Few things are more annoying than losing something you worked for because nobody told you grabbing another gun with your left hand would reset the one on your right hand.

Back to the top for a dev response.

[lohntron39]

Few things are more annoying than losing something you worked for because nobody told you grabbing another gun with your left hand would reset the one on your right hand.

Back to the top for a dev response.

[TheRealTuna]

975 RP is actually a little under $7.00 if you buy the least amount of RP possible...if we are on the subject of chain yanking :D

[lohntron39]

Few things are more annoying than losing something you worked for because nobody told you grabbing another gun with your left hand would reset the one on your right hand.

Back to the top for a dev response.

[lohntron39]

Few things are more annoying than losing something you worked for because nobody told you grabbing another gun with your left hand would reset the one on your right hand.

Back to the top for a dev response.

[lohntron39]

Few things are more annoying than losing something you worked for because nobody told you grabbing another gun with your left hand would reset the one on your right hand.

Back to the top for a dev response.

This game felt much more promising when the devs actively posted in threads, even small ones, just to say things were being considered. I don't feel I'm alone when I say the game feels like it's spiraling down into the same place all other "but it has potential!" games go.

[Volume]

Back to the top for a dev response.

This game felt much more promising when the devs actively posted in threads, even small ones, just to say things were being considered. I don't feel I'm alone when I say the game feels like it's spiraling down into the same place all other "but it has potential!" games go.

Devs still post in the forums, just not topics like this, I guess.

Again, what you want them to say is much different than what I expect them to say, but good luck!

[[DE]Rebecca]

Still hoping to get a response on this.

Sorry it took us so long to get in here! I think I feel embarassed that it took me so long to see this, despite your continuous bumps!

Focusing on your main question:

So I have a question about this. I have an upgraded level 30 Bolto already, and am building a second one in the foundry. If I use these two to make the AKbolto, how do I get the orokin catalyst back, and do any of the affinity levels carry over to the new gun, i.e. an average between the two used?

The Catalyst will indeed be destroyed, but from where this thread went I think this has already become known.

[Ced23Ric]

This game felt much more promising when the devs actively posted in threads, even small ones, just to say things were being considered. I don't feel I'm alone when I say the game feels like it's spiraling down into the same place all other "but it has potential!" games go.

In all honesty, your question has been answered with the first post. You received the same answer from Rebecca just now, but that did not change anything, really. If you had a demand for an official response because you have a problem that needs official addressing, you had the link to Warframe Support available the entire time. Donning the cardboard sandwhich sign of the apocalypse because you did not receive a developer's answer to an already answered thread is a little bit princess-y.

If you subsequently felt bummed out or cheapened out on because of the consequences of that answer, a properly worded feedback thread would have been in order. You are raising a valid issue, but the way you are behaving about it is detrimental to your cause. If you don't feel alone with this spiraling sentiment, you might be mistaken. But then again, your perception may already be skewed if you expect a development team to respond to every minuscule thread. You received a valid answer. Developers read, note and work on the player input. Their answers or posts are often brief, because they have to develop a game.

DE is running overtime and nightshifts to pound out content and bugfixes, if they'd spend most of their time on the forums, they would get nothing done. I am not critisizing your point, because it is a quite valid one - why does the Orokin reactor disappear? - but ultimately, you hid it inside a neglectable thread. I suggest you take your findings and spell out some proper feedback on the matter at hand instead.

Edited February 6, 2013 by Ced23Ric

[lohntron39]

Sorry it took us so long to get in here! I think I feel embarassed that it took me so long to see this, despite your continuous bumps!

Focusing on your main question:

The Catalyst will indeed be destroyed, but from where this thread went I think this has already become known.

Right, the catalyst is destroyed in the process currently. We already were aware of this. My question was not, "What happens to the catalyst if the weapon is used in this manner?" but rather, "How do I get the catalyst back/use it in the newly crafted weapon?"

[Zythi]

Right, the catalyst is destroyed in the process currently. We already were aware of this. My question was not, "What happens to the catalyst if the weapon is used in this manner?" but rather, "How do I get the catalyst back/use it in the newly crafted weapon?"

Her answer was that it is destroyed. You do not get it back and you may not use it in the newly crafted weapon sans buying or earning a new one.

[lohntron39]

In all honesty, your question has been answered with the first post. You received the same answer from Rebecca just now, but that did not change anything, really. If you had a demand for an official response because you have a problem that needs official addressing, you had the link to Warframe Support available the entire time.

I used the support tickets back when I had a game-breaking bug that prevented being able to log in for 5 days in a row; it took over 6 days for the devs to respond to that 'urgent ticket'. In addition, I did not receive an answer to my question from DERebecca; she answered something I did not ask, and did not answer what I did ask.

Donning the cardboard sandwhich sign of the apocalypse because you did not receive a developer's answer to an already answered thread is a little bit princess-y.

Being needlessly melodramatic and overly judgmental is pretty princess-y as well, your rotundness.

If you subsequently felt bummed out or cheapened out on because of the consequences of that answer, a properly worded feedback thread would have been in order. You are raising a valid issue, but the way you are behaving about it is detrimental to your cause. If you don't feel alone with this spiraling sentiment, you might be mistaken. But then again, your perception may already be skewed if you expect a development team to respond to every minuscule thread. You received a valid answer. Developers read, note and work on the player input. Their answers or posts are often brief, because they have to develop a game.

Feel free to start a poll and ask people if you disagree with my statement; otherwise it's just your solitary opinion, while I've been reading threads by others who do indeed share my feelings on the issue. Considering that this IS a closed beta, and that the point of these forums is to bring issues to the attention of the developers, I suppose it IS pretty weird to believe that they might read threads that had persisted for a week or more. As you can see, they did indeed finally read the thread, and even apologized for it taking so long, which implies that they do try to read every thread, more or less. Your perception may be skewed as you paid two hundred and fifty dollars to vote in a couple of polls.

DE is running overtime and nightshifts to pound out content and bugfixes, if they'd spend most of their time on the forums, they would get nothing done. I am not critisizing your point, because it is a quite valid one - why does the Orokin reactor disappear? - but ultimately, you hid it inside a neglectable thread. I suggest you take your findings and spell out some proper feedback on the matter at hand instead.

It is entirely possible to have employees whose job it is to monitor the forums, identify issues raised by the playerbase, and bring those issues to the attention of the correct person/department, without having actual coders sitting on the forums 24/7. This is called specialization. It allows one person to focus in one area, say community relations and feedback, and the rest on their own areas, like engine development, database tweaking, item balancing, etc.

It really feels like you're very disconnected from reality here, which may be a symptom of your nearly two thousand posts that you paid to be able to make, but if you take a step back and relax for a moment I'm sure you'll see how unnecessarily antagonistic your post was for not really accomplishing anything.

[lohntron39]

Her answer was that it is destroyed. You do not get it back and you may not use it in the newly crafted weapon sans buying or earning a new one.

And as has been asked back on the first page, why? Also, her answer did not go into this detail or expound upon DE's stance on the matter, she simply stated what currently happens, which we all already knew.

[Zythi]

And as has been asked back on the first page, why? Also, her answer did not go into this detail or expound upon DE's stance on the matter, she simply stated what currently happens, which we all already knew.

Ah. Well your question, which you helpfully italicized was asking "How do you get it [Orokin Reactors] back/transfer it to the new weapon." the answer to which is there is no how, because you can't. As far as why, it's probably because there are relatively few weapons that eat other weapons and they are direct upgrades. If everyone just upgrades to their dual wielder of choice then after you get your first 4-5 reactors, they become useless trash.

Edited February 7, 2013 by Zythi

[lohntron39]

Ah. Well your question, which you helpfully italicized was asking "How do you get it [Orokin Reactors] back/transfer it to the new weapon." the answer to which is there is no how, because you can't. As far as why, it's probably because there are relatively few weapons that eat other weapons and they are direct upgrades. If everyone just upgrades to their dual wielder of choice then after you get your first 4-5 reactors, they become useless trash.

Right, currently you can't. I don't know if that was an oversight or an intended effect, which was part of my motivation to make the question seen by developers in the first place; then we'd know if that was what was intended all along or if it was going to be changed and if we should, say, make support tickets in the meantime if we were affected by it. Given that there's about 25+ weapons, and only two that are built from combining other weapons (akbolto/aklato), I don't feel like we would run into that specific situation; it's also rare enough that making it a "gimme" has the potential to be allowable.

[Zythi]

Right, currently you can't. I don't know if that was an oversight or an intended effect, which was part of my motivation to make the question seen by developers in the first place; then we'd know if that was what was intended all along or if it was going to be changed and if we should, say, make support tickets in the meantime if we were affected by it. Given that there's about 25+ weapons, and only two that are built from combining other weapons (akbolto/aklato), I don't feel like we would run into that specific situation; it's also rare enough that making it a "gimme" has the potential to be allowable.

I'm saying that her response indicated that this was intended behaviour.

As far as it being a gimme, lets be honest. There's 25 weapons, sure. But how many are people going to actually use? Probably about 9. Most people will have: Hek, Gorgon, Boltor, Akbolto, Aklato, Lex, Snipetron, Scindo, and Fragor. There may be an extra weapon in there for flavor, but most people will keep a stable of these weapons. Of these weapons, two of them are upgrades from previous weapons and under this system would pass on their orokins. So you have 9 orokins, 2 of which you can potentially buy with starter plat. This leaves you needing 7 orokins. If you cannot directly add the orokin reactors to your created weapons this leaves you needing 9 orokins.

So then the question is why does it matter? Well, first it controls progress. It means you can't just say "Oh look, I have 40k credits. I'm going to upgrade straight to an akbolto". Instead, the current system increase the time it take to swap to an akbolto by the average time it takes to get another orokin. It's a tactic to increase your game play time and to slow down how long it takes to max out your character.

This is assuming you have the "upgrade inherits orokin". It's much worse if you can just remove them, because then you would never need more than three. Just pull one out of your current weapon to slot in to whatever weapon you want to use for that mission.

Edited February 7, 2013 by Zythi

[lohntron39]

I'm saying that her response indicated that this was intended behaviour.

As far as it being a gimme, lets be honest. There's 25 weapons, sure. But how many are people going to actually use? Probably about 9. Most people will have: Hek, Gorgon, Boltor, Akbolto, Aklato, Lex, Snipetron, Scindo, and Fragor. There may be an extra weapon in there for flavor, but most people will keep a stable of these weapons. Of these weapons, two of them are upgrades from previous weapons and under this system would pass on their orokins. So you have 9 orokins, 2 of which you can potentially buy with starter plat. This leaves you needing 7 orokins. If you cannot directly add the orokin reactors to your created weapons this leaves you needing 9 orokins.

So then the question is why does it matter? Well, first it controls progress. It means you can't just say "Oh look, I have 40k credits. I'm going to upgrade straight to an akbolto". Instead, the current system increase the time it take to swap to an akbolto by the average time it takes to get another orokin. It's a tactic to increase your game play time and to slow down how long it takes to max out your character.

This is assuming you have the "upgrade inherits orokin". It's much worse if you can just remove them, because then you would never need more than three. Just pull one out of your current weapon to slot in to whatever weapon you want to use for that mission.

Right, I wouldn't be in favor of letting you just pull a potato out of your weapon when you felt like it; the only instance in which I feel it would be applicable is this one, where you're using the weapon itself to make a new one, and making the potato apply to the newly crafted weapon. Also I was mistaken in that post, there's three weapons of this type; akbolto, aklato, and afuris. You also left out the heat sword, plasma sword, furax, any daggers, and braton, just to name some weapons that are varied enough to warrant at least one of in everyone's collection.

I don't feel that's what her response indicated; from the way it is worded, she really seems to just be saying what happens to the catalyst if the weapon it is installed on is used to craft something new. Anything beyond that is speculation and I would really like it clarified, or for my actual question(s) to the devs to be answered.

And yes, it does control progress. It throws a hard-cap on your progress and says "Dollar eighty, please." If that is what DE's stance on the matter actually is, it comes across as a short-sighted grab at a little bit of cash that would turn me off from buying plat altogether

[Zythi]

Right, I wouldn't be in favor of letting you just pull a potato out of your weapon when you felt like it; the only instance in which I feel it would be applicable is this one, where you're using the weapon itself to make a new one, and making the potato apply to the newly crafted weapon. Also I was mistaken in that post, there's three weapons of this type; akbolto, aklato, and afuris. You also left out the heat sword, plasma sword, furax, any daggers, and braton, just to name some weapons that are varied enough to warrant at least one of in everyone's collection.

I don't feel that's what her response indicated; from the way it is worded, she really seems to just be saying what happens to the catalyst if the weapon it is installed on is used to craft something new. Anything beyond that is speculation and I would really like it clarified, or for my actual question(s) to the devs to be answered.

And yes, it does control progress. It throws a hard-cap on your progress and says "Dollar eighty, please." If that is what DE's stance on the matter actually is, it comes across as a short-sighted grab at a little bit of cash that would turn me off from buying plat altogether

Most of the items you listed would replace items on the list. A heat sword or plasma sword would replace the Fragor (You would have enough cleave from the Scindo), the braton is completely outclassed by the boltor if you know how to aim. Adding a Furax or a Dagger would be nice, but requires purchasing slots (you're already pushing it assuming 9 slots) which the f2p player will be loathe to do.

If the behaviour was unintended she would have said it was unintended. When brought to the developers attention they aren't going to be intentionally obtuse and tell you exactly what currently happens without indicating that it is unintended. It's actually surprising that you would think that.

It controls progress by slowing down how quickly you can level because you are dependant on orokin missions spawning. I agree that they need to spawn more frequently but that is beyond the scope of your question.

[lohntron39]

Most of the items you listed would replace items on the list. A heat sword or plasma sword would replace the Fragor (You would have enough cleave from the Scindo), the braton is completely outclassed by the boltor if you know how to aim. Adding a Furax or a Dagger would be nice, but requires purchasing slots (you're already pushing it assuming 9 slots) which the f2p player will be loathe to do.

If the behaviour was unintended she would have said it was unintended. When brought to the developers attention they aren't going to be intentionally obtuse and tell you exactly what currently happens without indicating that it is unintended. It's actually surprising that you would think that.

It controls progress by slowing down how quickly you can level because you are dependant on orokin missions spawning. I agree that they need to spawn more frequently but that is beyond the scope of your question.

The heat sword is a completely different type of weapon from the fragor, a fast sword vs. a slow hammer. DESteve has posted that he recommends new players use their plat to buy slots; this can give you 12 total weapon slots and 3 warframe slots.

As a simple counter, if the behavior was intended she would have said it was intended. Again, assuming anything about what she said past exactly what she said is speculation. She stated what happens, which was not what was asked. If you think these devs specifically aren't going to be obtuse, I would point you to all kinds of threads where the responses were, "Hmm, maybe!" or, "It may happen in the future!" and, "We're looking into it." It's more surprising that you think simple miscommunications can't occur; DERebecca may have thought she was answering the questions that were brought up, but she quite simply didn't.

Controlling progress may be beyond the scope of my question, but you were the one who brought it up, so pointing that out is silly.

[Zythi]

The heat sword is a completely different type of weapon from the fragor, a fast sword vs. a slow hammer. DESteve has posted that he recommends new players use their plat to buy slots; this can give you 12 total weapon slots and 3 warframe slots.

As a simple counter, if the behavior was intended she would have said it was intended. Again, assuming anything about what she said past exactly what she said is speculation. She stated what happens, which was not what was asked. If you think these devs specifically aren't going to be obtuse, I would point you to all kinds of threads where the responses were, "Hmm, maybe!" or, "It may happen in the future!" and, "We're looking into it." It's more surprising that you think simple miscommunications can't occur; DERebecca may have thought she was answering the questions that were brought up, but she quite simply didn't.

Controlling progress may be beyond the scope of my question, but you were the one who brought it up, so pointing that out is silly.

I get that they're different weapons. But if you're looking for a slow, high damage weapon that cleaves a Scindo is just as good as a Fragor, so if you're going to get a heat sword you might as well replace one of the slow cleavers. 12 total weapon slots still leaves you needing another slot, according to the weapon loadout you're talking about.

Saying "Maybe", "We're looking in to it" and "It may happen in the future!" are not obtuse answers. It very clearly indicates that the feedback is heard, but they don't have anything to announce yet. If there is a simple miscommunication, it would be because your question is very obtuse and sideways. Asking how to do something that the game doesn't allow you to do is not going to get you the answer you want. Your question should be, "Is this intended behaviour"? Given that a fair portion of posts that you don't correct with asking "Why?" give you the same answer she did, you should revisit your question.

I brought it up because you asked why. When you continued with the thought I was simply pointing out that if you want to continue that line of thought there are other threads asking that very question and it will simply distract the point of your thread if pursued too far.

Edited February 7, 2013 by Zythi

[lohntron39]

I get that they're different weapons. But if you're looking for a slow, high damage weapon that cleaves a Scindo is just as good as a Fragor, so if you're going to get a heat sword you might as well replace one of the slow cleavers. 12 total weapon slots still leaves you needing another slot, according to the weapon loadout you're talking about.

Saying "Maybe", "We're looking in to it" and "It may happen in the future!" are not obtuse answers. It very clearly indicates that the feedback is heard, but they don't have anything to announce yet. If there is a simple miscommunication, it would be because your question is very obtuse and sideways. Asking how to do something that the game doesn't allow you to do is not going to get you the answer you want. Your question should be, "Is this intended behaviour"? Given that a fair portion of posts that you don't correct with asking "Why?" give you the same answer she did, you should revisit your question.

I brought it up because you asked why. When you continued with the thought I was simply pointing out that if you want to continue that line of thought there are other threads asking that very question and it will simply distract the point of your thread if pursued too far.

"How can I do x?" 'You can't.' "Why?" 'Because x doesn't happen.' This is not a useful answer, and the question is not sideways. Here's an answer that is useful, "Because we don't want players to recycle their potatos" or, "Because we didn't consider that potatos would be lost in this manner, but since it's been brought up, we need to look into it more and decide on a policy for these." It really doesn't matter how many posts say one thing or another, the key thing was a developer response to the questions asked. Plenty of people in this thread understood exactly what and why I was asking what I did.

The point to asking why was to get clarification from DE. You expanded upon that, and then called it going beyond the scope after going beyond the scope yourself. It really is silly, and if you feel it's going to detract from the thread, I invite you to join me in not especially caring so we can move on.