The issue of Defense trolling seriously needs to be addressed.

[Alphas]

I think we've all run into this issue more than a few times in our Warframe days.  We're running some Defense missions on Public and things are going great.  You're leveling up weapons and frames, and right when it comes time to either extract or keep going and everyone votes to go.  You jump back in because "eh, why not?"  Just before the timer hits 0, everyone else but you leaves because it just so happened that the squad you joined in on colluded to troll you into playing either an extra 5 rounds of a defense mission, or fail/abort and lose everything you got.  It's horribly scummy and makes everyone on the losing end feel like crap.  Why is there no fix for this?  Why is there no lock where once you choose to extract, you NEED to extract, or if you choose to say you HAVE to stay, no trolling.  

[YUNoJump]

1 minute ago, WhiteMarker said:

Then don't be too greedy, extract and join another match.
And if you are ranking up stuff, bring a frame able to solo defenses.
Come on guys, it's not that hard...

People can troll you at any point in a defence mission, you could go for 200 waves and then get ditched at wave 205 when you thought everyone else was still in. There is no specific point at which you could 100% expect people to extract at, and if someone is trolling then they'd probably aim to do the trolling at an unexpected time anyway. Unless you're just advocating that nobody should ever play past wave 5.

The whole point of a coop squad is to work together and synergise, if everyone just brought their own Frost then 3 of them are basically superfluous. We should never be discouraging proper team synergy, that's a great way to just dissolve the playerbase into a toxic mess of distrust.

[YUNoJump]

6 minutes ago, WhiteMarker said:

And you know what? All the missions in Warframe are made for a somewhat specific rank of equipment. If the OP's equipment wasn't strong enough to deal with the situation, he should not have played the mission...

Defence is endless, it is always possible to get to the point where 5 more rounds is the difference between surviving and defeat, and a team will always be able to go further than an individual. If you think your team can go a bit further but then they troll you, it's very possible to be left in an unwinnable situation. 

[Magnar21]

6 minutes ago, WhiteMarker said:

Did I ever say it's fine? I said the OP is not all that smart on how to prevent losing his progress.
And you know what? All the missions in Warframe are made for a somewhat specific rank of equipment. If the OP's equipment wasn't strong enough to deal with the situation, he should not have played the mission...

You imply that OP has a problem. The OP made  a hypothetical scenario, in order to point out a problem. And regardless of the guilt on the part of OP, whether he chose to bring underpowered gear or not, is irrelevant. I've done Akkid to 15 waves, then have all 3 others ditch at the last second, forcing me to solo the next 5 waves. You are attacking the OP as if that somehow invalidates his point, but the state of OP's gear has absolutely zero bearing on the validity of his claim: that defense trolling is a problem, and is a problem that needs fixing.

 

[Mk.1]

EZ way to solve this:

When all 4 players are in the "Extract" section, extract immediately.

When all 4 players are in the "Fight" section, start next wave immediately. 

When players are on both sides (or neither), put up a 30 second timer.

[CoffeeMonster42]

Or give the player the option to extract after the vote if left solo

[eraze93]

or give extraction point like in exterminate mission or other fast mission.This should help ppl that wana play short wave vs longer wave, if wana play short-fast wave just go to extraction point wait 30sec your ship will extract you individually. I will be super happy if individual extraction can be made into reality specially with survivial mission, wana play only 5 mins? just go to extraction point, you will be extracted shortly and individually soon after.

Edited March 16, 2017 by eraze93

[1tsyB1tsyN1nj4]

Or know your limit and play within it? This is a co-op game, but that still means you end up relying more on yourself than anything

[-Temp0-]

1 hour ago, WhiteMarker said:

If you have only unranked items with you and the others rank you up, you, more or less, deserve to get trolled. If the others do all the work, you have no saying in what to do and what not.

That's outright stupid.

First off, you can kill enemies with your abilities, second most unranked weapons nowdays aren't that much different from fully ranked if you mod them since that mr thing exist and third, lots of frames like frost or trinity contribute to defense missions without actually killing anything. It' warframe. You don't need 4 people actively killing to complete a starchat mission but there's a big difference between 4 people in defense and 1.

Quote

 

EZ way to solve this:

When all 4 players are in the "Extract" section, extract immediately.

When all 4 players are in the "Fight" section, start next wave immediately. 

When players are on both sides (or neither), put up a 30 second timer.

 

Pretty much this. There should be an option extract solo from missions like survivals too. It's annoying on both sides whne someobe wants to leave but others keep going.

[(XBOX)Slimm qp ReapeR]

41 minutes ago, Mk_1 said:

EZ way to solve this:

When all 4 players are in the "Extract" section, extract immediately.

When all 4 players are in the "Fight" section, start next wave immediately. 

When players are on both sides (or neither), put up a 30 second timer.

Only thing I would change about this is decreasing that 30 second timer to 12-15 sec timer because sadly some ppl will troll and make everyone wait 29 seconds just to either leave or stay. Other than that it's a great idea. I was actually gonna post pretty much a very similar suggestion, lol

Edited March 16, 2017 by (XB1)Slimm qp ReapeR

[Sengsara]

Things like this are going to happen, bringing a problem to light is one step, the next is suggesting a reasonable solution, being locked into extracting can end up doing more damage then the trolling thing people are doing. Personally I've been caught in that a few times during defense missions, my solution? Be quick to click.

[(XBOX)Slimm qp ReapeR]

1 hour ago, WhiteMarker said:

If you have only unranked items with you and the others rank you up, you, more or less, deserve to get trolled. If the others do all the work, you have no saying in what to do and what not.

Wait what?.. no.. just no, lol

[-Temp0-]

1 minute ago, Sengsara said:

Things like this are going to happen, bringing a problem to light is one step, the next is suggesting a reasonable solution, being locked into extracting can end up doing more damage then the trolling thing people are doing. Personally I've been caught in that a few times during defense missions, my solution? Be quick to click.

The real solution is to stop the time once others left like it happens in fissure missions whne you select the relics and start another timer once there's one person left.

[BoomyGordo]

1 hour ago, WhiteMarker said:

Then don't be too greedy, extract and join another match.
And if you are ranking up stuff, bring a frame able to solo defenses.
Come on guys, it's not that hard...

1 hour ago, WhiteMarker said:

If you have only unranked items with you and the others rank you up, you, more or less, deserve to get trolled. If the others do all the work, you have no saying in what to do and what not.

54 minutes ago, WhiteMarker said:

Did I ever say it's fine? I said the OP is not all that smart on how to prevent losing his progress.
And you know what? All the missions in Warframe are made for a somewhat specific rank of equipment. If the OP's equipment wasn't strong enough to deal with the situation, he should not have played the mission...

18 minutes ago, 1tsyB1tsyN1nj4 said:

Or know your limit and play within it? This is a co-op game, but that still means you end up relying more on yourself than anything

The situation OP is talking about is when everyone in the other 3 people switch to stay, so you do to because you know it will be easy with the 4 of you staying. then at the very last second before(or due to lag right as) the timer hits 0, in an obviously coordinated effort, the other 3 people simultaneously vote to extract. This leaves you in a very bad position especially if you were not able to solo the level you had gone to. You either leave and loose all drops and bonus exp, or you loose, and loose all bonus exp and drop..... or you waste your time trying to get through 5 more levels so you can extract.

 

a good example: before sortie defense changes were implimented, when level 3 sortie defenses would have 20 waves. there was a grineer level 3 sortie defense with eximus stronghold. I was Titania with a razor wing build that used viral procs to help my damage out. every single wave took us over 3 minutes to finish and even though i did ~75% of the damage, there is no way i could have done that mission, or even 5 waves of that mission, without the limbo keeping the objective safe, the volt stun locking everything around the objective, and the  trinity healing all of us for the few shots that made it through. so if they had all suddenly left without warning. id have had to leave despite being well equiped for it.

another time my friend and i were on akkad wave 15. the other 2 guys voted to stay, so we also voted to stay and at the last second they two guys left. we lost because neither me or my freind had ways to deal with the hoards as we were both leveling snipers at the time.

 

35 minutes ago, Mk_1 said:

EZ way to solve this:

When all 4 players are in the "Extract" section, extract immediately.

When all 4 players are in the "Fight" section, start next wave immediately. 

When players are on both sides (or neither), put up a 30 second timer.

i dont know why they didnt make it like this originally, seems like such a huge oversite on their part

 

31 minutes ago, PrwnStar42 said:

Or give the player the option to extract after the vote if left solo

this would be a great fix

[(PSN)OmegaSlayer]

1 hour ago, WhiteMarker said:

Then don't be too greedy, extract and join another match.
And if you are ranking up stuff, bring a frame able to solo defenses.
Come on guys, it's not that hard...

Jesus Christ you're a founder.

I'm MR18, if I bring unranked Kesheg I can still do much better than a MR7 with a Dual Skana.

But quality of playing is not the point, sometimes you're just not willing to challenge yourself but just play and level up your stuff.

DE should just implement some sort of "gate" system in which, when at least half people leaves the cell, who remains is guaranteed to receive the stuff collected up to the point when the others left, even if who remains fails the upcoming rounds.

[taiiat]

any possible solutions just causes other types of problems that are just as bad.
so not really any point in changing anything then, if you just end up with people complaining that they got trolled 1/100 Missions just the same. not worth putting time into it if it's going to end up different, but the same.

or, forces the game to basically automate itself even more so that it doesn't matter what people choose because you'll always win anyways.

[(PSN)OmegaSlayer]

You know what would be fun? If people changing their mind at last second get a penalty (as being unfriendly players) and lose the last reward they got, be it a relic or a prime part.

That would be fun.

[RistN]

2 hours ago, Alphas said:

I think we've all run into this issue more than a few times in our Warframe days.  We're running some Defense missions on Public and things are going great.  You're leveling up weapons and frames, and right when it comes time to either extract or keep going and everyone votes to go.  You jump back in because "eh, why not?"  Just before the timer hits 0, everyone else but you leaves because it just so happened that the squad you joined in on colluded to troll you into playing either an extra 5 rounds of a defense mission, or fail/abort and lose everything you got.  It's horribly scummy and makes everyone on the losing end feel like crap.  Why is there no fix for this?  Why is there no lock where once you choose to extract, you NEED to extract, or if you choose to say you HAVE to stay, no trolling.  

People are doing this ,in most cases and far as I know ,because they don't want to lose rewards or xp because of host migrations.So this is a reason why all of a sudden all follow player that chooses to extract right before timer runs out.I don't think someone has bad intentions or is he trolling as you said.It happens because another reason as I explained.

I agree that there should be a way to stop this but I would also propose that players who are hosts are clearly marked so we could know if host migration is going to happen.

[Ragingwasabi]

31 minutes ago, (PS4)OmegaSlayer said:

You know what would be fun? If people changing their mind at last second get a penalty (as being unfriendly players) and lose the last reward they got, be it a relic or a prime part.

That would be fun.

that would be amazing

[(XBOX)Slimm qp ReapeR]

1 hour ago, (PS4)OmegaSlayer said:

You know what would be fun? If people changing their mind at last second get a penalty (as being unfriendly players) and lose the last reward they got, be it a relic or a prime part.

That would be fun.

Eh, i don't think it would happen though because you still have that small percentage of ppl who actually make that last minute choice not to troll but seriously may have to leave soon so they opt out at the last minute to keep what they currently have. There's no 100% real way at the moment to really know if the person really has to leave or just trolling. This is just my opinion though 

[Kuestenjung]

3 hours ago, Mk_1 said:

EZ way to solve this:

When all 4 players are in the "Extract" section, extract immediately.

When all 4 players are in the "Fight" section, start next wave immediately. 

When players are on both sides (or neither), put up a 30 second timer.

Was suggested several times already but DE hasn´t implemented such a simple "feature".

[Daiwulf]

Solution: if someone chooses to extract during the first 10 seconds, the ones who choose to fight get another 5 seconds to choose to keep on or also extract. If someone then decides to also extract, we get another 5 seconds with the remaining ones and repeats until there is only one person in the squad, where the choise is immediate. If at any point everyone aggrees to fight or extract, the choise is also immediate.

This would allow people to also leave after a last sec extraction troll and it would take at most 25s to go through all the process in the worst case scenario (1 leaving each time) and 2 seconds in the best case(everyone agreeing).

[1tsyB1tsyN1nj4]

7 hours ago, --Laughing-Soul-- said:

-snip-

Or know your limit and play within it? Way easier. If you can only go a certain number of waves, then go to that number. If you are using new equipment, go until it gets too hard. Seriously this is only an issue because players make it one. Hell, I leave teams all the time at the 15th wave max because I get bored, or sooner because the team is trash

[Jobistober]

From what I've seen recently, most groups don't even stay in defense past 5 waves. In those cases, if you get abandoned and are competent, you can usually carry yourself to at least next extract pretty easily.

[BoomyGordo]

7 hours ago, 1tsyB1tsyN1nj4 said:

Or know your limit and play within it? Way easier. If you can only go a certain number of waves, then go to that number. If you are using new equipment, go until it gets too hard. Seriously this is only an issue because players make it one. Hell, I leave teams all the time at the 15th wave max because I get bored, or sooner because the team is trash

soooo you ignore my post and just repeat your self, ill venture a guess and say you are one of the trolls op talks about but on the off chance you are not ill repeat my self too. The situation op is talking about is when you join a PUG everyone votes to stay so you do too. let me go into detail with this since you seem to be having touble understanding it

when some one votes to stay that person has moved their mouse cursor to the button that says "stay" and clicked it. this conveys to the other players that this particular player in question has the intention of staying for another 5 rounds. the other players have no reason to assume that this player has the intention to leave because they have voted to stay. this can sway other people to also stay for another 5 rounds. when a group of 3 players are togeather in a group and in a skype/discord/steam/razercoms/vent/teamspeak/googlehangout/talka/etc call and they pick up a 4th person. they then coordinate an effort in where at a vote interval they all vote to stay, which sways the 4th person to stay most of the time. then at the very last second. they switch to extract. this causes the 4th person to be left behind in 5 more waves that they would not have stayed for if the others had not mislead him to believe they had the intention of staying by clicking the vote to stay button.

*deep breath*

this is an issue because players enjoy playing with other players and get tricked by them. by your post i guess that you are the guy who even in multiplayer games treats it like its singleplayer, refusing to revive others and only playing for your self and refusing to even help others.