Is kohm really useless, compare with other shotguns

[(PSN)ARIES-WY]

If I got a riven ，what stats should I roll for ? Multishot  ? Statue ??

[Djego27]

5 hours ago, (PS4)ARIES-WY said:

Wow tysm , seems it's hard for roll for exactly on top . But ty I'll try for damage and multishot . Btw do u think kohm really weaker than other shotguns??

The issue with the kohm is ammo, even with primed shotgun ammo mutation you still want to add carrier or shotgun scavager for longer runs. I would also take the simicarium vids with a fair grain of salt, given using nearly 200 shotgun rounds for 3 targets should speak volumes how feasible builds like this are for doing actual 1h+ survivals or other stuff.

In general the Kohm is a very solid shotgun and used to be even the top tier shotgun before they renerfed the ammo economy again(when it first came it was so bad that you could not even do a exterminate without running out of ammo, then it got fixed to values where it worked very good with normal ammo mutation or non for non endless missions and then nerfed again). Tigris and Hek are for the most part more practical because of the ammo use, while the damage of the kohm is not really worse. Also the Tigris and Hek work great against all factions, while the kohm is kind of limited to anti armor after putting in the forma, similar to my boar prime what rips through infinite armor targets like they would be made out of paper(after finaly being able to fix it 1.5 years since the shotgun changes with a riven) but the poor ammo economy make it very impractical against corpus and infested in endless missions.

What a good riven for you is depends mostly on what you want to do with the gun. If you want to use it as a status shotgun multishot and 120% status(seams to be rare, the best roll I have is 116% on my boar prime) are the best if you want to utilize it as status shotgun. I for myself mostly use it on Necros in a status heavy fire/slash build for CC and extra loot during solo farming, the reason I use the kohm for that is that you do not have to reload that often what was a problem on the frame before the rework since you could not use desecrate during reloads and made otherwise awesome slash shotguns like the Tigris not really good on the frame because you nearly reload ever 1-2 seconds.

Edited March 16, 2017 by Djego27

[ChuckMaverick]

41 minutes ago, Rolunde said:

This build would cover that then-
 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

No fancy Rivens required. Just a few mods swaps and still easy to move those elements around for different combos. ;-)

That build doesn't even have 100% status with Hell's Chamber, the magic number is 100% before any multishot mods are added.

And it has to be 100%, even 99% is nowhere near as good.

[Rolunde]

14 minutes ago, ChuckMaverick said:

That build doesn't even have 100% status with Hell's Chamber, the magic number is 100% before any multishot mods are added.

And it has to be 100%, even 99% is nowhere near as good.

 

 

IF you use a power/ability then Nano-Applicator kicks in and should give it over 100% (about 107% if I didn't derp the math) not counting Multishot.

It's pretty easy to pair the weapon with a Frame that makes frequent use of a power to keep that active.

Link with numbers on Warframe builder, for whatever that is worth.

Cheers!
~R~

Edited March 16, 2017 by Rolunde
added link

[CherryPauper]

Distant Observer has a good video on a Kohm build on YouTube. Check it out. 

Overall, it's not a bad shotgun, but it's not my first choice. I'd rather go with Tigris Prime, Sancti Tigris, Vaykor Hek, or Sobek.

[Rolunde]

26 minutes ago, CherryPauper said:

Overall, it's not a bad shotgun, but it's not my first choice. I'd rather go with Tigris Prime, Sancti Tigris, Vaykor Hek, or Sobek.

rgr that, Sancti/Tigris/Prime is my bae. ;-)

To the point that I even have to remind myself just how good the Kohm really is, heh!

[ThorienKELL]

Forum experts hit again!

Kohm was always powerful but wonky mechanics, spool up time, and ammo consumption made it unpopular, also we throngs of other interesting powerful shotguns that didn't have those issues, therefore kohm got strong disposition riven. 

Result is that you can easily turn it into most powerful shotgun in a game, since I've got great riven for it this is my most used shotgun. On riven you basically want damage, MS +status, although you won't see the difference in status till very late endgame. Lvl 100 gunners /Bombards die equally well if you swap a status roll with damage roll but 145 corrupted h. gunner (highest i could test) takes 50% more ammo to die if you don't have 100% status. 

[(PSN)lhbuch]

Kohm is powerful without a riven and godly with the right riven.

[OvAeons]

kohm (i think) still holds the highest DPS capability of all gunss, only problem: shotgun, gotta be nearly point blank. Kohm is still my most used wep from when it was really good, and fun...aaaand skill based... BRING BACK OLD KOHM.

[(PSN)ARIES-WY]

15 minutes ago, OvAeons said:

kohm (i think) still holds the highest DPS capability of all gunss, only problem: shotgun, gotta be nearly point blank. Kohm is still my most used wep from when it was really good, and fun...aaaand skill based... BRING BACK OLD KOHM.

I rolled the riven of kohm , got a negative flight speed . Does it bad use on kohm??

[OvAeons]

Just now, (PS4)ARIES-WY said:

I rolled the riven of kohm , got a negative flight speed . Does it bad use on kohm??

it is hitscan now sooo not sure how negative flight speed effects it, can try in simulacrum or a low level mission unless previous roll is better to keep.

but if i would have to guess i would assume it would not impact it since it does not have visible projectiles.

[(PSN)ARIES-WY]

3 minutes ago, OvAeons said:

it is hitscan now sooo not sure how negative flight speed effects it, can try in simulacrum or a low level mission unless previous roll is better to keep.

but if i would have to guess i would assume it would not impact it since it does not have visible projectiles.

I just checked , flight speed does nothing for hitscan guns . Tysm  ， I got multishot , fire rate , and ammo maximum . Is it good enough? 

[OvAeons]

Just now, (PS4)ARIES-WY said:

I just checked , flight speed does nothing for hitscan guns . Tysm  ， I got multishot , fire rate , and ammo maximum . Is it good enough? 

that is REALLY good in my standards, i like the thing with lots of FR, spools fast, multishot will add some nutty damage at max spool (~ up to 26 pellets at full spool with just hell's chamber) and ammo max will help with some of its issues.

Grats! ;D

[(PSN)ARIES-WY]

2 hours ago, Djego27 said:

The issue with the kohm is ammo, even with primed shotgun ammo mutation you still want to add carrier or shotgun scavager for longer runs. I would also take the simicarium vids with a fair grain of salt, given using nearly 200 shotgun rounds for 3 targets should speak volumes how feasible builds like this are for doing actual 1h+ survivals or other stuff.

In general the Kohm is a very solid shotgun and used to be even the top tier shotgun before they renerfed the ammo economy again(when it first came it was so bad that you could not even do a exterminate without running out of ammo, then it got fixed to values where it worked very good with normal ammo mutation or non for non endless missions and then nerfed again). Tigris and Hek are for the most part more practical because of the ammo use, while the damage of the kohm is not really worse. Also the Tigris and Hek work great against all factions, while the kohm is kind of limited to anti armor after putting in the forma, similar to my boar prime what rips through infinite armor targets like they would be made out of paper(after finaly being able to fix it 1.5 years since the shotgun changes with a riven) but the poor ammo economy make it very impractical against corpus and infested in endless missions.

What a good riven for you is depends mostly on what you want to do with the gun. If you want to use it as a status shotgun multishot and 120% status(seams to be rare, the best roll I have is 116% on my boar prime) are the best if you want to utilize it as status shotgun. I for myself mostly use it on Necros in a status heavy fire/slash build for CC and extra loot during solo farming, the reason I use the kohm for that is that you do not have to reload that often what was a problem on the frame before the rework since you could not use desecrate during reloads and made otherwise awesome slash shotguns like the Tigris not really good on the frame because you nearly reload ever 1-2 seconds.

Ty for details . Just rolled the riven , got multishot, fire rate and ammo maximum , is that good ?? Do I still need to reroll for statue chance?

[(PSN)ARIES-WY]

4 minutes ago, OvAeons said:

that is REALLY good in my standards, i like the thing with lots of FR, spools fast, multishot will add some nutty damage at max spool (~ up to 26 pellets at full spool with just hell's chamber) and ammo max will help with some of its issues.

Grats! ;D

Ty , got over 2000 bullets when required it . Do I still need roll for statue chance?

[OvAeons]

Just now, (PS4)ARIES-WY said:

Ty , got over 2000 bullets when required it . Do I still need roll for statue chance?

it already has high innate status, i have never needed extra status on my build. I preferred to go for other QoL mods like FR(in a way increases status as well). What good is additional raw status if the thing kills well enough :P

[(PSN)ARIES-WY]

7 minutes ago, OvAeons said:

it already has high innate status, i have never needed extra status on my build. I preferred to go for other QoL mods like FR(in a way increases status as well). What good is additional raw status if the thing kills well enough :P

I put the riven on a rank 5 kohm , killed stalker in a solo mission . But I also used ability to lock the stalker

[Djego27]

16 minutes ago, (PS4)ARIES-WY said:

Ty for details . Just rolled the riven , got multishot, fire rate and ammo maximum , is that good ?? Do I still need to reroll for statue chance?

Well multi shot and fire rate is very good since you need a fire rate mod anyway and the ammo maximum helps with ammo management but is not really that necessary, given the gun relays highly on massive pick ups by mutation and other means then working against pool that it eventually depletes over time.

I would keep it and still try to reroll it for status in the long run, since it is the highest scaling riven on it, but it depends on how much you play very high levels against armor. The value of that is mostly depended on your own needs.

I for example got a electric + status for my boar prime(re rolled it 20 times since and even got 200%+ damage, multi shot and 113% ice damage with minus zoom, what is unfortunately useless as status weapon that I mostly use on Ember because would be kind of a god like roll on a dps weapon) and honestly I most likely will get a 2. one and experiment with that. While the mod limits the maximum damage you can do after armor depletion to a target a lot compared to what the boar prime was capable 1.5 years ago before the rework on a blind rage ember(where 2k more fire damage per shot did mean over 80k more dps against armored targets after the armor was down), the quicker armor strip(since corrosive is the by far highest damage type with the mod) also has it's benefits in raising the corrosive proc rate to archive full armor depletion with less rounds and you very rarely shoot stuff that are HP bricks under her armor(like eximus bombards/heavy gunners far  beyond L100). Also the gun is not that great if you have to relay on it's actual damage against infested and corpus, even with a mod that would more then double it's output as straight up dps weapon it would be still worse then my sancti tigris or vaykor Hek with a lot more ammo issues on top of it.

[Rolunde]

Just something to keep in mind-

IF you're able to run 4xCp (or 3xCp+3xCoaction Drift) or have Seeking Shuriken Ash/Sonic Fracture Banshee stripping Armor then status chance becomes much less of a factor.

Because the weapon has ample stats to kill whatever is normally buried under all that armor.

[(PSN)ARIES-WY]

6 hours ago, Djego27 said:

Well multi shot and fire rate is very good since you need a fire rate mod anyway and the ammo maximum helps with ammo management but is not really that necessary, given the gun relays highly on massive pick ups by mutation and other means then working against pool that it eventually depletes over time.

I would keep it and still try to reroll it for status in the long run, since it is the highest scaling riven on it, but it depends on how much you play very high levels against armor. The value of that is mostly depended on your own needs.

I for example got a electric + status for my boar prime(re rolled it 20 times since and even got 200%+ damage, multi shot and 113% ice damage with minus zoom, what is unfortunately useless as status weapon that I mostly use on Ember because would be kind of a god like roll on a dps weapon) and honestly I most likely will get a 2. one and experiment with that. While the mod limits the maximum damage you can do after armor depletion to a target a lot compared to what the boar prime was capable 1.5 years ago before the rework on a blind rage ember(where 2k more fire damage per shot did mean over 80k more dps against armored targets after the armor was down), the quicker armor strip(since corrosive is the by far highest damage type with the mod) also has it's benefits in raising the corrosive proc rate to archive full armor depletion with less rounds and you very rarely shoot stuff that are HP bricks under her armor(like eximus bombards/heavy gunners far  beyond L100). Also the gun is not that great if you have to relay on it's actual damage against infested and corpus, even with a mod that would more then double it's output as straight up dps weapon it would be still worse then my sancti tigris or vaykor Hek with a lot more ammo issues on top of it.

Ill try reroll it and keep the original stats , got a negative flight speed , does it effect kohm much ?? Btw I don't understand people asked to buy god roll riven MENTIONED must have negative stats.

[1tsyB1tsyN1nj4]

It definitely ain't one of the prettiest weapons in game lol

It does a lot of damage though and has a cool unique mechanic. Fire Rate and even more Multishot are two good stats to get, and Punch Through also just because it kills even more stuff beyond what you're shooting at. Further, Status Chance, Reload, even Ammo Capacity can help the Kohm be a blender on a stick. The Grineer are really just good at making blenders and sticking them to chains ((Atterax)) and this.

It's not always about pure damage, good supplemental stats can make a weapon transcend.

Edited March 17, 2017 by 1tsyB1tsyN1nj4

[Djego27]

16 hours ago, (PS4)ARIES-WY said:

Ill try reroll it and keep the original stats , got a negative flight speed , does it effect kohm much ?? Btw I don't understand people asked to buy god roll riven MENTIONED must have negative stats.

Rivens roll as 2 beneficial stats or 3 with a downside, so the most powerful rolls always have a downside, however it depends on the gun how much impact the downside has on a weapon, like zoom has no impact on shotguns in general(maybe with the exception of the vaykor hek, since it reduces spread and the gun benefits a lot from aimed head shots with the crit build) and even far less on a close up personal spread heavy one like the Boar.

As for the negative flight speed, it should not affect hit scan weapons(like the kohm is currently, mostly because of lag produced the old non hit scan projectiles and her bouncing) but I did read several reports that it does affect damage falloff range on shotguns, however I could not test this myself yet since I lack a riven for that.

 

[(PSN)ARIES-WY]

9 minutes ago, Djego27 said:

Rivens roll as 2 beneficial stats or 3 with a downside, so the most powerful rolls always have a downside, however it depends on the gun how much impact the downside has on a weapon, like zoom has no impact on shotguns in general(maybe with the exception of the vaykor hek, since it reduces spread and the gun benefits a lot from aimed head shots with the crit build) and even far less on a close up personal spread heavy one like the Boar.

As for the negative flight speed, it should not affect hit scan weapons(like the kohm is currently, mostly because of lag produced the old non hit scan projectiles and her bouncing) but I did read several reports that it does affect damage falloff range on shotguns, however I could not test this myself yet since I lack a riven for that.

 

May I ask a question , I got a extra kohm riven with 200% multishot 200% statue duration . Compare with 150 multishot , 120 fire rate , 100 ammo maximum , which riven is better

[Djego27]

The status duration is only really useful for toxic and slash procs(stackable dots, that do more damage by the higher duration).

You most likely get more out of the fire rate(since it frees a mod slot and also increases all damage done and proc rate by more hits in the same time as well the spool up time, at the expense of ammo).

[(PSN)ARIES-WY]

8 minutes ago, Djego27 said:

The status duration is only really useful for toxic and slash procs(stackable dots, that do more damage by the higher duration).

You most likely get more out of the fire rate(since it frees a mod slot and also increases all damage done and proc rate by more hits in the same time as well the spool up time, at the expense of ammo).

Ty

[Rolunde]

18 hours ago, 1tsyB1tsyN1nj4 said:

It's not always about pure damage, good supplemental stats can make a weapon transcend.

This!^ is a Diamond amongst weapon modding Gold.

(+1!)