Coming Soon: Weapon Balance Pass.

[MokutoBunshi]

THANK, YOU.

 

]\'[

[StinkyPygmy]

18 minutes ago, Pohren99 said:

Seriously?! Well... instead of buffing other weapons to Tonkor level (which is be normal for enemy sponges), or just a damage nerf, you decided to make it complete trash...

Tonkor was only the one thing that works properly in this game. Now it's another "self kill damage" weapon.

DE like: Hey looks like you using this gun. But we have a lot of bad guns, than why are you not using them. What do you mean saying "game balance is broken"? Ok then, i just add this weapon to the my poop category. (this "DE like" stuff is only a satire. You cant punch me with your new "1b) DEVELOPER BASHING" players shield)

It's not about only Tonkor, its about all guns in game.

Seriously, instead of rivens powrer %, just buff all guns and make it more like TPS than RPG bullet sponging!

I'm just going to take daily bonuses and wait till this game to became someting normal again. I'm really "DEisappointed"

Not how balance works. You cannot buff everything exponentially. Otherwise you end up with a constant and completely pointless eternally increasing cycle of doing nothing but increasing the numbers and scale used, for literally no reason. Thus, you never actually achieve anything. Things would remain just as unbalanced, but with larger numbers.

Edited March 23, 2017 by StinkyPygmy

[Larval_Angel]

OK so... I always liked the hind, and it would be great to try it with the changes, but since I have to play with a controller (calm down everyone, I have wrist problems and can't use m+k) I won't be able to use an alt-fire of this sort unless it is toggle-able. It's not gonna kill me if this is not something you can do, but it would be awesome if possible:)

[Ethermie]

13 minutes ago, StinkyPygmy said:

Not if you learn how to avoid that. I've had zero issues with literally every other explosive weapon prior to Tonkor. Its only a problem if you shoot without considering your environment and what you're shooting at. Hot tip: Don't point blank a lancer in the face. Kind of similar to how you wouldn't do that with an Ogris or explosive hikou.

TL;DR people gotta git gud.

Please provide any valid point, why tonkor should have self damage.

 

there are 3 explosive weapons that arnt considered totally useless..

1.zarr= because it has moderate range . has secondary fire for close range.deals damage as soon as it hits a surface no the self damage is somewhat avoidable.

2.penta(S. penta)= you can detonate the grenades at will so you have time to get away. and the tethered grenades mod disables the self damage.

3 is tonkor. highly inaccurate, grenades only blasts in contact with enemy, friendly, granades bounses all around uncontrollably, impossible to hit/aim properly beyond low mid range. now add self damage to it.. it will be worse explosive weapon. atleast ogris got its accuracy going for him. tonkor has nothing to redeem the self damage.

 

now stop your bullS#&$ "GiT Gud". and "GiT Smart" and analyze the data you have.

 

[tojo01]

Oh yes to harpak and paracyst =D! I was about to delete my harpak but now it's a keeper.

I now regret deleting my 5 forma attica =(.With the upcoming changes to it, the Zhuge will become the status option while the Attica will be the crit specialist for auto crossbows. I guess I know where I'll be investing the forma from my nerfed weapons - and gaddemmit, I'll miss my Zephyr + "Tonkor shotgun" and synoid simulor, albeit the Tonkor still seems like a very viable weapon.

That's also a very  welcome change to the Panthera but with the ammo requirement change, does that mean that it'll only fire 2 shots before reloading -similar to the tigris shotguns? The upcoming changes to the Buzlok, too, just made it more interesting, except the beacon no longer sticks to surfaces, and this nerfs it since it lessens the weapon's utility as a door sweeper.

Lastly, and it's OT, please revert Nyx's Assimilate. The drawback that came with that ability pre-nerf (fix =P) balanced it out.

Edited March 23, 2017 by tojo01

[(PSN)AtomicEyekon]

Warframe is a team based Game i will agree all day but people who ask for a nurf for these nice weapons didn't make sents Mr gives better weapons shows your time and skill in the game, volt away most and Nerf the rest? is the way payers and DE want?NOT ME

[-_-xTheLegend-_-]

11 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

 

Synoid Simulor:

• On an orb stacking event (when orbs combine), damage range decreased to 1-3 from 3-8
• On an orb stacking event, damage decreased from from 150-250 to 20-50

 these tow options it will make the weapon .. bad really bad 

Edited March 23, 2017 by silnucalesti

[Vaskadar]

I'm genuinely excited to see an increase in weapons usage diversity.

P.S.

These changes have needed to happen for years. The Mirage/Simulor combo and the Tonkor were incredibly discouraging for players wanting to feel like they were participating in the game instead of being sidelined by excessive AOE spam.

[maumastoks]

@[DE]Rebecca

Yea, perfect decision. Game had no veteran content to begin with and now make it complete crap - makes it easier to decide to leave Warframe for Mass Effect Andromeda. Thanks, I got your point!

 

[(PSN)AtomicEyekon]

1 minute ago, silnucalesti said:

11 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

 

Synoid Simulor:

• On an orb stacking event (when orbs combine), damage range decreased to 1-3 from 3-8
• On an orb stacking event, damage decreased from from 150-250 to 20-50

these tow options it will make the weapon

bad really bad

Yet people asked for this apparently i know i know doesn't make sents

[Riot_Inducer]

The buzlok changes! I'm so glad I stuck with the old zf-1 for so long. Can't wait to see what it can do with that crit mechanic. 

[StinkyPygmy]

23 minutes ago, Ethermie said:

Please provide any valid point, why tonkor should have self damage.

 

there are 3 explosive weapons that arnt considered totally useless..

1.zarr= because it has moderate range . has secondary fire for close range.deals damage as soon as it hits a surface no the self damage is somewhat avoidable.

2.penta(S. penta)= you can detonate the grenades at will so you have time to get away. and the tethered grenades mod disables the self damage.

3 is tonkor. highly inaccurate, grenades only blasts in contact with enemy, friendly, granades bounses all around uncontrollably, impossible to hit/aim properly beyond low mid range. now add self damage to it.. it will be worse explosive weapon. atleast ogris got its accuracy going for him. tonkor has nothing to redeem the self damage.

 

now stop your bullS#&$ "GiT Gud". and "GiT Smart" and analyze the data you have.

 

Because the only reason its lack of self damage was a thing was because of its pointless, impractical and now outdated gimmik. Self damage is a huge part of the risk Vs reward of launchers. Also, most launchers in the game are perfectly fine and usable.

There isn't any data to anaylise, just calm down for a second. The git gud comment was more of a joke (because not blowing yourself up is VERY easy to "git gud" at. If you pay attention to your environment its "inaccuracy" (its actually very accurate, just the post shot-bounce is harder to predict) then its no big deal. It adds onto the risk vs reward that all the explosive launchers have. Its NOT a shotgun, ergo, treating it like on is on the player. Point being, why shouldn't it function like every other launcher to somewhat justify its power? You wouldn't shoot a bombard in your face with an ogris? So why do it with a tonkor? Its literally no harder to avoid blowing yourself up with either.

The issue here is simple. this is change, whats more its change to a lazy mechanic that is obsolete. People don't like this, because it takes away A major reason people use the tonkor. That being: its easier to mindlessly spam.

Note: Don't take things so personally, hombre.

Edited March 23, 2017 by StinkyPygmy

[Venalicium]

I wouldn't mind having a limit to the number of Synoid Simulor/Simulor vortexes that are out in addition to the changes, similar to how the Secura Penta/Penta work. 

[Cytobel]

12 minutes ago, StinkyPygmy said:

No, you misunderstand. I was making fun of the forums for being so salty. Especially over inane things. The self damage is literally a non-issue if you stop point blanking enemies in the face. Its really not that hard. Been doing it pre-tonkor days with literally every other explosive weapon and I'll continue to do so with the Tonkor. The reason people hate this (as its pretty much the only notable tonkor change, everything else is negligible) is because they got comfortable in being able to shoot where ever and however they please with a tonkor. Its really not going to be that hard to adjust.

Sorry, but anyone unhappy with this because of the self damage has 0 sympathy from me. Its really not that hard to not blow yourself up.

Feels like you didn't read my post at all.

My issues with self damage have nothing to do with controllable situations and nearly everything to do with those fringe situations where WE SCREW UP.  Also I mentioned that these weapons quickly (though I didn't use that term) become lethal to us, but foes can basically just ignore the damage and face hump.  This makes the situation even worse for the weapon's utility.

The reason players use guns that DON'T have self damage over those that do is because the ones that do lack a beneficial trade-off.  I am looking forward to the Ogris becoming an AoE status weapon tho.

[Eyori]

DE could at least increase a lil bit of flight speed of tonkor, to compensate this nerf.

[StinkyPygmy]

5 minutes ago, maumastoks said:

@[DE]Rebecca

Yea, perfect decision. Game had no veteran content to begin with and now make it complete crap - makes it easier to decide to leave Warframe for Mass Effect Andromeda. Thanks, I got your point!

 

None if this is "veteran" content to begin with. So not seeing your point.

Enjoy your kooky and hilariously poorly animated space shooty fun! I know I will when it comes out.

[Ethermie]

2 minutes ago, StinkyPygmy said:

Because the only reason its lack of self damage was a thing was because of its pointless, impractical and now outdated gimmik. Self damage is a huge part of the risk Vs reward of launchers. Also, most launchers in the game are perfectly fine and usable.

There isn't any data to anaylise, just calm down for a second. The git gud comment was more of a joke (because not blowing yourself up is VERY easy to "git gud" at. If you pay attention to your environment its "inaccuracy" (its actually very accurate, just the post shot-bounce is harder to predict) then its no big deal. It adds onto the risk vs reward that all the explosive launchers have. Its NOT a shotgun, ergo, treating it like on is on the player. Point being, why shouldn't it function like every other launcher to somewhat justify its power? You wouldn't shoot a bombard in your face with an ogris? So why do it with a tonkor? Its literally no harder to avoid blowing yourself up with either.

The issue here is simple. this is change, whats more its change to a lazy mechanic that is obsolete. People don;t like this, because it takes away a major reason people use the tonkor. That being: its easier to mindlessly spam.

Note: Don't take things so personally, hombre.

then they should just delete the weapon coz it will just become a dumbed down zarr with even less going for it.

 

if you take away the only uniqueness a weapon have just to generalize it with others.. theres no point having it.

[StinkyPygmy]

1 minute ago, Cytobel said:

Feels like you didn't read my post at all.

My issues with self damage have nothing to do with controllable situations and nearly everything to do with those fringe situations where WE SCREW UP.  Also I mentioned that these weapons quickly (though I didn't use that term) become lethal to us, but foes can basically just ignore the damage and face hump.  This makes the situation even worse for the weapon's utility.

The reason players use guns that DON'T have self damage over those that do is because the ones that do lack a beneficial trade-off.  I am looking forward to the Ogris becoming an AoE status weapon tho.

Well thats a scaling issue, not a tonkor issue isn't it? Completely different problems. Also, if you've started to hit a point where even a tonkor is only tickling enemies, well, thats kinda a you problem isn't it? Its certainly not utility related or self damage related. WF scales almost infinity, so bringing up the tankiness of lvl200 mobs etc is kinda a moot point when it comes to balance. I'd argue the main reason people use the tonkor was that it was arguably the most powerful launcher in terms of pure min/maxing. The lack of self damage was icing on the cake that people grew too used to. Now that its going away, they realise they might have to stop and think for half a second before shooting again.  

[StinkyPygmy]

4 minutes ago, Ethermie said:

then they should just delete the weapon coz it will just become a dumbed down zarr with even less going for it.

 

if you take away the only uniqueness a weapon have just to generalize it with others.. theres no point having it.

Ok, so lets remove 90% of our primaries that are just simple full and semi auto rifles with no variation except in stats (kinda), shall we?

Also, the tonkor still has bouncing and timed grenades, which comes in handy for shooting around corners etc. So I would consider that unique.

Edited March 23, 2017 by StinkyPygmy

[TB-awesome]

OMG ! harpak ,panthera ,ogris ; 3 of my favorite gun is getting a buff !

good bye tonkor ,(synoid) simulor and telos botace .your time is going to be over soon .                    P.S :i have never like u ,telos and simulor

[Ethermie]

1 minute ago, StinkyPygmy said:

Ok, so lets remove 90% of our primaries that are just simple full and semi auto rifles with no variation except in stats (kinda), shall we?

Also, the tonkor still has bouncing and timed grenades, which comes in handy for shooting around corners etc. So I would consider that unique.

you have problem shooting around corner with a AOE weapon?. and the bouncing isnt rly a positive thing about tonkor. Its actually a negative point, as it makes the weapon uncontrollable. and with that in mind a uncontrollable weapon with self damage.. where a graze can kill you.. good luck Getting good with that. so what you consider unique is actually a downside to the weapon.. i have no idea what you are defending and with what.

 

[StinkyPygmy]

13 minutes ago, Ethermie said:

you have problem shooting around corner with a AOE weapon?. and the bouncing isnt rly a positive thing about tonkor. Its actually a negative point, as it makes the weapon uncontrollable. and with that in mind a uncontrollable weapon with self damage.. where a graze can kill you.. good luck Getting good with that. so what you consider unique is actually a downside to the weapon.. i have no idea what you are defending and with what.

 

Well, unless you can make Ogris rockets do a 90 degree turn at a corner, then ya, I'd argue most people can't shoot around corners with a weapon. You GOTTA trade me this mod you have man! I'll give ya 1000 plat for it.

Jokes aside: The bouncing can be a negative, but seeing as its pretty damn easy to predict where a grenade will bounce to if you have a basic understanding of physics and how angles work (which pretty much everyone does as its something you deal with every day) then it isn't really an issue. Especially when we have a literal trajectory indicator inbuilt with the tonkor. Couldn't be much easier to not mess up angles and grenade bounces with that.

I wont need to get good with it. I've always treated the tonkor like it did have self damage because I absolutely hated being launched uncontrollably up into the air because I was too close to a grenade. So I've always avoided my own shots regardless. I've always treated the tonkor no different to other launcher weapons in that regard.

Edit: You thought I was talking about shooting around corners as if I'm poking my head around it didn't you? Now why the hek would I struggle with that you silly? I was talking about bouncing grenades around corners you aren't poking your head around and possibly further away from.

Edited March 23, 2017 by StinkyPygmy

[Antiphoton]

I love these changes, thank you.

 

Any chance you might consider buffing the Tiberon a bit?

[AndIWin]

Opticor needs a buff too!

[TPtv]

I HATE NERFRAME.