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Coming Soon: Weapon Balance Pass.


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Just now, Death_Master_ said:

To keep power balance if something powerful disappears there should appear other as powerful thing to replace the loss. 

wrong direction mate. why?

let's see: 1 powerful thing removed then another powerful thing must appear. Or 2 not too powerful things. Or 4 really not powerful things. Or 10 absolutely stupid things got a very low buffed. You know that I mean...

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Just a Soma?  The red-crit machinegun?  The one actually HIGHER in usage than the Tonkor?

Since we're dealing with a language barrier, I'll repeat:  I have NO vids recorded.  For that matter I don't use the Soma much.2017-03-23_0751.png

#Somaischeatinganyway

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DE

I think you decided to nerf them because many people have screamed the nerf and you accepted it. And you may think you will pacify the screaming people by this. I think it will never happen.
 They will find another target and start screaming again regardless the actual need.

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1 minute ago, Cytobel said:

Just a Soma?  The red-crit machinegun?  The one actually HIGHER in usage than the Tonkor?

Since we're dealing with a language barrier, I'll repeat:  I have NO vids recorded.  For that matter I don't use the Soma much

Yes, just a Soma, nothing else.

This that I'm tried to show u - that kind of weapons just bad for high lvl content because of bad game design. Not matter that buffs they would got - they would still bad.

Sure u do not have that kind of videos - coz noone has. Noone in his mind would bring a knife to the gun fight - the same thing with Miter, Panthera, Soma etc and high lvl content.

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3 minutes ago, Ta10S said:

I think you decided to nerf them because many people have screamed the nerf and you accepted it.

nah, you are wrong here - there is nothing about whiners. Only platinum, mate, only this.

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2 hours ago, rngd444 said:

You can find certain information - *cough* exact Riven disposition values *cough* - somewhere on the net which is inversely proportional related to weapon usage, so you can see Simulor and Soma at the top and Tonkor soon after.


Tonkor:

  Reveal hidden contents

Now, regarding its changes: I never understood all the subjective hate (and the need to express it in an unconstructive one-liner as if one's life depended on it :D), probably partly because I frequently used it myself in my early days, but mainly because its aoe is simply way too small to actively restrict other players. It doesn't decimate everything on the whole screen like certain Frames (or some melees) do all at once, so yeah, whatever. It's also nowhere near as strong as it used to be but hey, it's not as if facts matter. Also, there are still a lot of other explosives that don't deal self-damage.

 

Self-damage:

  Reveal hidden contents

The main reason why (almost) no self-damage is good is because of the borked aiming system Warframe has. You simply can't reliably use explosive weapons if you can't jump or run (or rather change directions) and shoot at the same time because your Sentinel ('works' with all kinds of other things as well, e.g. enemies or allies) might end up in the direct aiming path the moment you shoot - despite maybe being behind you - and you will hit it instead of shooting where you actually aimed. This will always lead to some risk that the player can't control because it's by design and not by being careless and it's stupid to be punished for it.

One can argue if self-damage has a place in a game like this. Personally, I say it hasn't and all explosive weapons would be much nicer to play with if it was gone (or rather reduced to a fixed value); just look at the Penta's 'new' Augment and how much more popular it got (purely anecdotal but I see the weapon way more often now) because of, guess what, no self-damage (and admittedly other cool mechanics).

 

Buffed weapons:

  Reveal hidden contents

In regards to the buffed weapons: stuff like reducing Glaxion's range and Ogris' projectile damage are really weird - their respective buffs aren't enough to make them any more viable. Glaxion suffers from the same problem other continuous weapons do, namely status per second not working properly due to some ancient 'fix' for this weapon category (from own tests I can say that e.g. an advertised 212.5% status per second on the Ignis only does about 1.16 procs per second in reality which obviously is a huge disparity). Fixing the underlying mechanics rather than merely increasing base damage would make more sense, so the weapon might be able to perform its purpose.

Also, adding a 10% crit chance on a weapon like Miter is kind of .. strange? It'll still not be viable to mod for crit, so it's essentially a 10% average damage buff (assuming a standard 2x multiplier); a flat damage increase would've been more helpful. The reduced charge time is very nice, though.

Yes, because Riven percentages automatically equate to raw percentages of how often something gets used. I like your thinking on that particular point. #Sarcasm

Seriously though, I've personally taken a subjective slant because of the current objective qualities of the Tonkor: it does not have an AoE the size of the ****ing Telos Boltace and the damage of a Blood Rush 5x combo Galatine with Buzz Kill, Primed PP and everything else. It can still be ineffectual against high level enemies or those with some ability that can counter the Tonkor - read: level 100+ mobs, Nullies with full field, Ancient Healers, Sentients, Shadow Stalker, Vay Hek, assassination sorties with elemental resistance, and more.

I've used the Tonkor for a good year now because I happen to enjoy doing trick shots with my grenades and hitting that pesky Ancient in the back of the crowd, and because I love the Tonkor. Is it OP? Well, it's not Spamulor or Telos Boltace or Ember P; it is limited, because the projectiles have travel time and they spread at long range, and that makes hitting long shots all the more satisfying to me.


And another thing, since when is it that it's not acceptable for us, the players, to b**** and moan and gripe about "noskill Spamulors" or Embers or Boltaces or anything else that's OP in PUBLIC MATCHES...
 

Spoiler

 


...but DE is allowed to hit them with the nerf-bat because they aren't conducive to a good co-op experience.

20 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

At its core, Warframe is a co-operative game; having powerful tools is a boon to a team rather than a disadvantage. However, there are a few weapons that have such a dominating effect in missions that co-operative missions essentially become solo.

We have taken a look at our Arsenal and adjusted many weapons - mostly Primaries at this time. Everything below is subject to change. This is our current plan and gives you a general idea of what is coming in the next big Update!

We have nerfed 3 weapons (plus 1 variant) that we feel disrupts the co-op setting and pace of gameplay for most groups:

Regarding any Rivens you may have or are looking to pick up for any of the listed weapons: you can expect small changes to stats. Stay tuned for more information in the Update notes!
 

So DE doesn't allow us to rage at Spamulors and Embers, but when DE nerfs them, we're expected to sit idly by and take it because they feel that those combos disrupt "the co-op setting and pace of gameplay"? I bet you my Vauban Prime, my Paris Prime, my Akstiletto Prime, and my Galatine Prime that the vast majority of players cheering on the Tonkor/Spamulor/Boltace nerf are playing pub matches and are salty little snowflakes that just want to get kills.

 

Yes, I'm defending the Spamulors; go ahead and shoot me. Just don't shoot me with your crappy little Bolto, I'd like the death to be quick and painless, not agonizingly long. Just like some of my missions in Warframe.

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The smell of fresh salty tears from the aoe-spamming babies is simply glorious... Thanks for this DE <3

AoE weapons with fire-and-forget mechanics should be as unrewarding as they are effortless to use. Yes, even in this frantic horde game. Why should some ez-mode players have their cake and eat it too, while snipers and bows are still useless in comparison? These changes are long overdue. 

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20 hours ago, KubrowTamer said:

Then maby the true way to fix balance would be to remove all dmg mods and have a static base dmg, then remove enemy levels and have difficulty based one variation and the amount of enemies.

I'm only on page 12 of 38, but THIS is the most intelligent thing you've said up to this page, which I would LOVE to see in the game. Add status, remove pure damage, add variation and weapon mods that actually MODIFY the weapon, rather than just increasing the numbers.

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As a side effect Warframe might cause GRINDMANIA in some people. But this side effect should not cause NERFMANIA in DE. 

I really wonder how many of these grindmanics perform high level missions (>level100)?

Somebody may prefer grinding with nerfed weapons but NOBODY (including DE) has right to enforce others to grind with nerfed weapons. We spend resources, TIME and effort for these weapons and warframes.

No need to talk about how much money i spent for warframe and have around 2000 hours playing time. I do because I suppose farming and grinding will not be wasted with new release of the game (e.g. nba2k16, nba2k17, etc). Everybody deserves some nice warframes and weapons after so much grinding. If DE will nerf in the end, why will we put effort in this game? 

I did not say anything for previous nerfs,  but this policy begins to be a punishment on our ALL efforts in the game. I decide to nerf/quit warframe, if these weapons will be nerfed and this policy will not change.

As a last word to DE: Will u wait thx for the forma and affinity booster, I hope u won't? It is the top point of disrespect against us. If u can, give us our efforts and time back.... 

Please, do not take as an offensive post. This is a warning from a patient Warframe fan, because I think u r in the wrong way....

 

 

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22 minutes ago, Sigmas71 said:

The smell of fresh salty tears from the aoe-spamming babies is simply glorious... Thanks for this DE <3

AoE weapons with fire-and-forget mechanics should be as unrewarding as they are effortless to use. Yes, even in this frantic horde game. Why should some ez-mode players have their cake and eat it too, while snipers and bows are still useless in comparison? These changes are long overdue. 

So when your favorite weapon gets nerfed into the ground like others who loves these weapons, you'll be 100% ok with losing the catalyst and multiple forma you've sunken into it?

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23 minutes ago, SPARTANXG117 said:

Yes, because Riven percentages automatically equate to raw percentages of how often something gets used. I like your thinking on that particular point. #Sarcasm

Huh? Dispositions in itself (with some minor exceptions/tweaks) were solely based on the weapon usage data when they were introduced. For example, take the Sonicor: considered by most people to be a good and solid weapon but certainly not 'op' by any means, yet it is at the very bottom of the dispositions just like Lex, Marelok and Akstiletto. I didn't specify that they're not dynamically changing over time but that's kind of self-explanatory since Riven mod stats haven't changed unless explicitly stated. I also assumed that the most used weapons are still as popular as they were then but I think it's safe to say they are.

There's definitely no balancing going on in regards to dispositions; they took the easiest route possible. Just like they'll do with the Tonkor.

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1 hour ago, djdnqn said:

2DE.png
 

the lenses that invested in them I will be returned? the time invested in them? level what one already made? Thank DE!
do not answer offensive comments of this great community ;)
good weekend in Hidron xD
 
 

Well if they did go so far as to give back lenses and "time" I suppose they'd also need to take back all the Focus and Affinity already earned using them too, right?!

Since that's the whole point of installing Lenses and spending Time farming... 

kek

And just to make it clear if this does actually affect my own time spent and lenses installed, yeah it does. 

So I'm not just talking as someone unaffected here. =p

Spoiler

3532E5E6EBF3EB4D69CB2016210D80C6E72290D4 (1680×1050)7AC6C454653AC444B956D9F7E1CB96E9E701F5DD (1680×1050)

 

6 forma on the Tonkor and 2 on the Telos Brokefest.

And a lens on each.

First lens I got (from the 2nd Dream) went into the Tonkor.

Image result for rocket raccoon boo hoo

Long expected nerfs.

Edited by Rolunde
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21 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Weapon Balance Pass.

Buzlok

The Buzlok and its homing mechanism has been used for many creative moments - but ultimately this weapon has been overlooked.

  • The Ammo Requirement for the Secondary Homing has been reduced to 2.
  • Physical Damage distribution has been adjusted to 50% Impact, 40% Puncture, and 10% Slash.
  • Damage has been increased to 60 from 45.
  • Critical Chance increased to 15%
  • Critical Damage increased to 2.5x
  • The flight speed of the Homing Beacon has been increased.
  • The Homing Beacon will now only stick to NPC & Characters.
  • Critical Chance increased by 50% on targets with Homing Beacon attached to them.
  • Clip size reduced to 50.
  • Mastery Rank increased to 9.



 

 

Awesome news on the Buzlok!  Always loved the sound effects to this gun, can't wait to dust this one off the shelve.  And thx DE for nerfing Simulor and Telos Boltace too!!!

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26 minutes ago, Sigmas71 said:

The smell of fresh salty tears from the aoe-spamming babies is simply glorious... Thanks for this DE <3

AoE weapons with fire-and-forget mechanics should be as unrewarding as they are effortless to use. Yes, even in this frantic horde game. Why should some ez-mode players have their cake and eat it too, while snipers and bows are still useless in comparison? These changes are long overdue. 

That weapons are useless not in comparison but by it's own nature and the nature of this game!

Just a repeat of my own post from the 32th page:

Just to show of WHAT weapons they are buffed. This is Panthera (4-forma + reaven mod!) against 145 lvl monsters

https://youtu.be/OYBG44oZROI?t=4m56s

And here is Miter

https://youtu.be/7ygAiPFShQg?t=5m30s

Pretty cool, huh? It barely scratches them, so what the heck they are buffing here? Increasing damage in 100 times? No.

Also, there is only ONE motser, but in the real mission there will be 1 bombard, 2 heavy gunners and 5-7 weaker enemies and probably buffed with ancient healer. WHAT the heck you would do against them with your damn Miter or Attica at your lovely Oberon?

While you would happy sniping one of that pack, all another would just oneshot you.

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