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Coming Soon: Weapon Balance Pass.


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13 hours ago, sulusdacor said:

- players not wanting the zenistar to be used couse of the visual when aiming with certain energy colors

If throw the disc above the visual, is not annoying...

 

Anyway, when this changes will hit the game? Console will get changes in the same period as PC users?

Edited by (PS4)ghinellil
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As a tonkor fan without brain damage (which is somehow possible) I should probably say something at least.

Overall: good, think the crit chance reduction is too much though, bumping it down to 30% would be fine.  

 

Self damage is fine I guess, but I'd like to see self-damage from explosive weapons just be nerfed and made more consistent, something like "self-damage radius decreased to 50% of the weapon's AoE and damage reduced by X%."  At the very least make the self-damage radius be equivalent/close to the VISIBLE explosion, that's one of the biggest reasons it feels so wonky.  I can't count the number of times I got downed/killed because I was a couple meters away from the explosion effect, namely with Hikou Prime/Concealed Explosives.

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7 minutes ago, (PS4)ghinellil said:

Do you have a Zenistar?

Not and having Zenistars in my party always ruin my fun and makes me feel like unneeded there. This is coop game and everyone must take equal parts in the mission.

Edited by SilverWF
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I have another solution

- tonkor : reduce more accuracy for harder to hit.........................problem solved

- simulor : so many complain when it used by mirage, nerf the mirage then. rework hall of mirror by add negative effect like reduce 70% fire rate............problem solved. 

- telos boltace : spam to much? ban player who use macro................. problem solved

some player complain this is coop game that everyone should take part to the game. I think they forget so many AFK player in public joined.

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I can pull my beloved Ogris out of storage now. Cool. 

Deep down, I have always despised my Ogris' better simply because it was better, was awkward to use when it wasn't easy-mode, everyone used it as soon as it came out, and it eventually forced me to use it since my favored options (the Ogris and Penta) sucked donkey gonads in comparison. Again, these all applied to my own internal logic and hatred for the launcher that will not be named. Other people could use it and I didn't care. I disliked using it (But use it I did!).

Thanks. Only two weapons I cared about on the list, and I'm pretty sure I don't even own the others yet (just the launchers). Casual for life.

Edited by Rhekemi
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45 minutes ago, SilverWF said:

Not and having Zenistars in my party always ruin my fun and makes me feel like unneeded there. This is coop game and everyone must take equal parts in the mission.

Only with infested defences (Akkad) is convenient use a Zenistar, for all the rest is nothing of special. Is a 300 login days, not even common in the game.

 

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17 minutes ago, Omega-Phoenix said:

nerf the mirage then

Go nerf yourself.

17 minutes ago, Omega-Phoenix said:

some player complain this is coop game that everyone should take part to the game

Yeah, one of them: (DE)Rebecca.

4 minutes ago, (PS4)ghinellil said:

Only with infested defences (Akkad) is convenient use a Zenistar

I can say the same about Simulor - why nerf it? Can't see any reason.

Edited by SilverWF
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I seriously don't get this attitude that just because someone is using a Tonkor (or any other weapong for that matter) it somehow takes away from someone elses gameplay. I mean I can understand the concern that you might feel that you are not contributing as much but it still has NEVER entered into my mind that I would want those weapons changed just because of that. I have around 1010h gameplay (according to Steam) with Warframe and I have been in countless groups where there has been a player thats setup is simply so powerfull for that particular mission that the rest of the team barely register in the stats. Somehow I fail to see this as a problem. I have seen groups with 3 Tonkor and 1 Synoid Simulor and I could not care less. Most of the time It has just meant that we got the firepower to make through this mission (typically Excavation) more easily.

 

If I were to take the Excavations as an example I am more annoyed of the people that join a public group and go to the extraction zone after the first excavator just because they are there for the easy money. It annoys me that some peoples contribution to the excavation is to stand next to the excavator idle when they notice there a good defence there and we have no real (to my understanding) mechanism to remove these players from the game while remaining 3 of group are pulling all the weight. It also annoys me that a lot of people come there with unleveled frames and weapons and basically make it harder for others (even though this does not bother me nearly as much as people just idling, if you put the effort even with lvling your gear its fine by me)

 

But somehow the people using the Tonkor are the problem?

 

I played a long time before I even considered Tonkor. Its my go to weapon farming relics in Hieracon Excavation mission.

Its a great weapon (for me) to

  • Take out groups of enemies
  • Its a great weapon to get the excavator area clear as you can just shoot at the excavator and blow up the enemies next to it
  • Its Explosion/Blast status also knocks down enemies that dont get instantly killed by the shot

 

For me personally I see huge problems in using this weapon where I currently use it the most (Excavation / Hieracon). Lately I have been just using my Frost on these runs to make sure that there is at least one Warframe in the group that provides some kind of protections for the Excavator. Considering the self damage change to Tonkor and using the Globe I am not sure how am I supposed to kill any mob that gets inside the globe (which they will surely do). Basically I assume that htis will mean that I wont be able to use the Tonkor inside that Globe anymore DEPENDING on how far I actually have to be from the target when I shoot it?

 

I fear that the currrent change will do exactly the same to Tonkor that I expirience with Angstrum (if I remembner the secondary weapon name correlty). Even without great mod setup the weapon will simply one shot me most of the time because of the louse accurasy and hitting random objects/npcs too close. I loved the idea of a weapon like that but the self damage on it simply took all of my interest of using it and trying to micromanage my movement and aim with a weapon. I fear that this will eventually or very fast result into the fact that I will just stop using the weapon.

 

Then again I guess I could just keep uising the Tonkor and see if the people that did not like people using Tonkor before now like ressing this Tonkor user all the time when he/she either shoots the weapon in a totally wrong place or someone accidentaly moves into the line of fire.

 

I really hope that DE takes into consideration the already voiced great ideas to Tonkor if the requirement is that self damage is there to stay. And that is to make the self damage something that is still risky (set dmg amount) but does not automatically mean death.

 

With this current planned changes I just can not see it as a good change unless the objective is to stop people from using it.

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Well, some of these changes I like, especially bringing some of the old weapons into the foreground.

However I feel sad that you only touched a small number of them - there are a lot more that need some love.

As for the nerfs, some of them are justified. I personally hated the overuse of Simulor and Boltace, even though I myself sometimes used it. I have no idea if the new Boltace mechanic will be usefull, we will see. I think the idea with the Simulor change is to put the most damage into popping your "bubbles" instead of building stacks. But as the numbers read now, it seems it is a severe nerf. Perhaps some more tuning is needed here, but the general idea I like.

Now the Tonkor change is twofold. The reduced crit change is nothing more than a damage nerf, which i guess is justified considering other launcher weapons. The self damage makes sense I guess, but there is a problem here: The tonkor is more unpredictable than other launcher weapons. The ogris always explodes on impact, whatever it hits and the Penta you detonate yourself, so it is predictable. But with the Tonkor if you slightly miss the target very unpredictable things can happen. I think this will make the Tonkor the less attractive alternative to the other launchers.

And finally a general remark. It seems that now we will see everyone using the Tigris Prime in sorties. It was already popular, but since alternatives are now scarce, we will probably see a lot more of these. In addition "damage" frames such as Mesa or Nydus will probably rise in popularity in endless missions. And finally cc frames will also become even stronger as it may now be necessary to rely on them even earlier if you want to go really far anywhere...but I guess this will affect not very many people.

So overall these changes are good, but may result in player weapon choices that are not any less monotonous...we just have to wait and see.

One thing is for sure - the moment this change hits it will be hilarious to see all the people not reading the forums blowing themselves up with the Tonkor.

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18 hours ago, existingdark said:

That kind of attitude is straight up cancer.

Since when staying afk because of absurd AOE damage is considered cancer?
I personally don't like just walking through the survivals/sorties/trials when i have simulor mirage in my team.

Plus these types of weapons actually ruin some warframe experience: Nidus can't get stacks, Trinity can't find EV target (and is blamed for that additioanally), and so on.
Maybe you will reconsider your thoughts about beign cancer?

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6 minutes ago, Quanlain said:

I personally don't like just walking through the survivals/sorties/trials when i have simulor mirage in my team.

You don't but I do like it ;)

We all have different tastes about everything in game and anyone's opinion should be considered. 

I respect your opinion even if have opposite. So for example if i run(in your squad) with something you dislike you can just ask me to switch to something else and i will do it. 

So those nerfs done to please small but actively writing at forums part of community that dislikes any weapon that can kill mobs fast.

Other part that requests buffs and fix to enemy scaling isn't heard by DE for now. And i personally find it sad. 

To me before nerfing weapons scaling issues should be fixed to let people enjoy the game more than now. 

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6 minutes ago, Death_Master_ said:

You don't but I do like it ;)

We all have different tastes about everything in game and anyone's opinion should be considered. 

I respect your opinion even if have opposite. So for example if i run(in your squad) with something you dislike you can just ask me to switch to something else and i will do it. 

So those nerfs done to please small but actively writing at forums part of community that dislikes any weapon that can kill mobs fast.

Other part that requests buffs and fix to enemy scaling isn't heard by DE for now. And i personally find it sad. 

To me before nerfing weapons scaling issues should be fixed to let people enjoy the game more than now. 

By all means, sometimes even i use simulor. But i'm talking about some extreme cases, about real douches, who are following you around, whriting "git gud" and etc.  These are often complaining the most
And i agree with you that this is a croud game, you need AOE weapons. But these were the easiest, and cheesiest ones. Slight nerf (just a stat shift even) made so many people angry, that they wish harm to each other already. 
There are pleny of AOE weapons, and i'm currently using some of them, and if people can't find an alternative to tonkor or simulor form 300+ weapons, that mean that he's just lazy. 

About scaling: i think that there is more problems with underworked status and synergies rather than scaling. Just spent 70 minutes solo surviving (hema farm).
There are some ways to get past the scaling, but these are very limited options. Literally couple of weapons and frames.

Edited by Quanlain
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14 minutes ago, (PS4)ghinellil said:

Because the Mirage /Simulor in the team is you :crylaugh:

Nope! I very rarely play Mirage at all and Simulor too. But to me its convenient to just desecrate and gather loot rather than fighting my way thru crowds of mobs ^_^

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Attica&Panthera buff? Damn it devs, now we only need removal of status/sec on continuous weapons and we're good.

And well, it's probably first time I'm happy about nerfs. Because there's difference between strong and broken. Tigris Prime is strong but Telos Boltace and Synoid Simulor are broken to hell and back..

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