Oberon Feedback 20.3.1 and beyond

[Kjahla81]

18 minutes ago, Ordosan said:

 otherwise we will just get to the point were soma is considered a trash weapon and the only gun you can use is the neo armstrong cyclone jet armstrong cannon.

Hit the nail on the head.

Edited April 27, 2017 by Kjahla81
More content.

[shut]

The most frustrating thing that I'm noticing is how short all of the ability ranges are.

15m on his shag carpet and his ult is practically nothing considering how much STR he needs to do any sort of rapid healing (let alone add a noticeable amount of Armor). The removal of infinite-ranged Renewal makes this even worse.

 

But yeah, his base stats are dreadful considering that he's meant to be a "paladin"-type frame. His total EHP is barely above Excalibur's, which means that he falls apart like wet tissue paper if a Sortie-leveled enemy even breathes on him (which proved true during today's Corpus Interception/Rescue sorties).
Excal at least has mobility, CC, and invul frames to reliably survive at high levels; Oberon has none of these.

Oberon's kit seems built around receiving damage and then quickly healing it, but it's a bit hard to use it like that if you can't receive damage without dying.

Edited April 27, 2017 by SortaRandom

[CGs_Knackie]

Love the rework but the range of Renewal needs to be slighty increased.

Second, the cost should be reduced because this is greedy.

[PsiWarp]

I would be in favor of pure toggle, since Renewal already has a cap on how much healing it can do per ally, you will still need to recast occasionally.

The energy drain per second only triggers when a player is damaged, so think of it as when Renewal does heal something, it will cost Oberon energy. This is a pretty good change, as now when no one is damaged but does have Renewal on them, they will get healed when damaged then cost Oberon some energy.

Also, now with Renewal active but no one being healed, Oberon can passively regenerate energy from Energy Siphon, Rift Plane, Inspiration (Octavia's passive) and Energy Overflow. Kinda like Equinox's Pacify.

However, it seems the Bleedout slow is now bugged after the rework. I can't get it to trigger on downed allies, at least the bleedout timer is not visibly increased to me.

Edited April 27, 2017 by PsiWarp

[Zefat]

I cannot see hallowed grounds when its active

 

[LokiTheCondom]

6 minutes ago, Kjahla81 said:

I think the base stats will be buffed on his Prime version. Having a higher energy pool, imo, is something he can benefit from.

Prime should be considered something more of a plus for players, not a reason to leave its normal variant inferior.

1 minute ago, SortaRandom said:

The most frustrating thing that I'm noticing is how short all of the ability ranges are.

15m on his shag carpet and his ult is practically nothing considering how much STR he needs to do any sort of rapid healing (let alone add a noticeable amount of Armor). The removal of infinite-ranged Renewal makes this even worse.

Indeed, Reckoning could definitely use more range. The heal per second of Renewal ain't all that bad if you have Phoenix Renewal, which is pretty much of a band aid. As for Renewal's range, they essentially turned it into a lesser version of Blessing. On the bright side, it continues healing even after full health (although the duration oughta be higher).

2 minutes ago, CGs_Knackie said:

Love the rework but the range of Renewal needs to be slighty increased.

Second, the cost should be reduced because this is greedy.

Don't forget it needs more total duration for the healing process.

[LokiTheCondom]

11 minutes ago, Zefat said:

I cannot see hallowed grounds when its active

 

Rebecca said in Prime Time the visuals aren't finalized, so we have to stick with the semen-stain placeholder appearance for now.

Edit: Whoops nvm, misunderstood your comment

Edited April 27, 2017 by LokiTheCondom

[Urlan]

1 minute ago, Zefat said:

I cannot see hallowed grounds when its active

 

I am also getting this, a fellow player said that this seems to be due to there not being anything to display for low particle effect display settings and that it might be a glitch. Maybe the old visual should have been retained in such a case.

[LokiTheCondom]

8 minutes ago, Urlan said:

I am also getting this, a fellow player said that this seems to be due to there not being anything to display for low particle effect display settings and that it might be a glitch. Maybe the old visual should have been retained in such a case.

Not really true, my settings' on medium.

Edit: Whoops nvm, misunderstood your comment and Zefat's.

Edited April 27, 2017 by LokiTheCondom

[Zefat]

7 minutes ago, LokiTheCondom said:

Rebecca said in Prime Time the visuals aren't finalized, so we have to stick with the semen-stain placeholder appearance for now.

ok, raised the quality just a bit, and i can see it, ty 

[LokiTheCondom]

1 minute ago, Zefat said:

ok, raised the quality just a bit, and i can see it, ty 

Sorry, misunderstood your previous comment. Lowered my particle setting and also see that the Hallowed Ground is missing.

[Darkvramp]

the thing would be to remove that cap on regenerating hp and make it so you covert energy to health for yourself and allies

[Darkvramp]

i would rather have an aura for him as his 2 that would move with him, that way we can stay mobile, and everywhere he walks is blessed so is thematic

[redeyedtreefrog]

22 minutes ago, CGs_Knackie said:

Love the rework but the range of Renewal needs to be slighty increased.

Second, the cost should be reduced because this is greedy.

slightly? No. It was infinite, and I fail to see a reason as to why it was nerfed from that infinite state. I want either a good reason for the change, or for renewal to be put back.

Every other part of the rework works marvelously (the smite damage scaling doesn't seem to be all that noticeable except at very high strengths, high level enemies, or large enemies, but then again, I suppose that's maybe the point). The synergies seem a bit finnicky, but then again, oberon has always been that way. I'd really like to see renewal simplified, into an infinite range heal, with a regenerating effect (and keep the armor buff). Allow the regenerating effect to work exactly like players might expect it to: No weird channeling cost, and no inverse duration. The channeled drain causes a ton of problems that bog down the flow of casting renewal repeatedly, which, in a frame who is incredibly energy hungry, and seemingly directed towards taking damage as a legitimate strategy, is a fairly bad mechanic.

As for the passive, I haven't yet done much testing on it, but I like that pets are getting some love. I would love to see the day that sentinels are dethroned, despite the hordes of lazy players who literally cannot be bothered to walk 12 meters in order to pick up their loot.

[Leonix13]

Ugh, this rework is trash... They turned him into a full area frame like Frost, but worse.

[Leonix13]

2 minutes ago, redeyedtreefrog said:

slightly? No. It was infinite, and I fail to see a reason as to why it was nerfed from that infinite state. I want either a good reason for the change, or for renewal to be put back.

Every other part of the rework works marvelously (the smite damage scaling doesn't seem to be all that noticeable except at very high strengths, high level enemies, or large enemies, but then again, I suppose that's maybe the point). The synergies seem a bit finnicky, but then again, oberon has always been that way. I'd really like to see renewal simplified, into an infinite range heal, with a regenerating effect (and keep the armor buff). Allow the regenerating effect to work exactly like players might expect it to: No weird channeling cost, and no inverse duration. The channeled drain causes a ton of problems that bog down the flow of casting renewal repeatedly, which, in a frame who is incredibly energy hungry, and seemingly directed towards taking damage as a legitimate strategy, is a fairly bad mechanic.

As for the passive, I haven't yet done much testing on it, but I like that pets are getting some love. I would love to see the day that sentinels are dethroned, despite the hordes of lazy players who literally cannot be bothered to walk 12 meters in order to pick up their loot.

Agreed, I was in a defense mission and was not hitting players because the range was so short. Renewal is now even more worthless of a support spell.

[Ceadeus]

5 hours ago, maj.death said:

I like to believe people will one day use nerf correctly. Stuff like this really kills me. Also you're complaining about an ability that can now strip 50% of armor ontop of knockdown and rad proc... because it can't one shot... seriously?

 

The point is more that even with max strength it can't even do competitive damage compared to a single shot of my primary.  The CC is mediocre at best and the radiation proc only helps if A. there are other enemies around and B. your target doesn't just decide to attack you anyway since radiation makes them just attack everything and isn't particularly reliable.

[Music4Therapy]

4 hours ago, Chipputer said:

Oberon is literally 100% more effective than he was before.

If you don't think he is then you're just another person jumping on the bandwagon because you, "totally always loved him, I swear," before his rework.

The thing is, Oberon's abilities don't fulfill their purpose.

You know why his 4 has the seemingly random effect of generating health orbs, right? Kubrows/Kavats are revived instantly upon picking one up. The fact that Reckoning requires to deal the killing blow in order to HAVE A CHANCE at creating the orb makes it not fulfill it's purpose. The correct way to buff this ability would have been forcing enemies hit by it for a set duration to have a chance to drop the orb.

The armor buff is okay at best considering flat armor falls off CONSIDERABLY after 300 armor. A frame with 300 armor has 50% DR. A frame with 600 has 66%.

His 1 and 3 changes were nothing spectacular,  either. Buffs? Sure. Meaningful? No.

All this "rework" did was give him a few % more damage reduction and create synergy that contradicts who he is as a frame.

How SHOULD the rework have been? Instead of flat armor, they should have made it flat DR % similar to Trinity, Mirage, Mesa, etc... and they should have made the health orb generation from his 4 on hit rather than on kill.

[Music4Therapy]

The thing is, Oberon's abilities don't fulfill their purpose.

You know why his 4 has the seemingly random effect of generating health orbs, right? Kubrows/Kavats are revived instantly upon picking one up. The fact that Reckoning requires that you deal the killing blow in order to HAVE A CHANCE at creating the orb makes it not fulfill it's purpose and is unreliable. The correct way to buff this ability would have been forcing enemies hit by it for a set duration to have a chance to drop the orb.

The armor buff is okay at best considering flat armor falls off CONSIDERABLY after 300 armor. A frame with 300 armor has 50% DR. A frame with 600 has 66%.

His 1 and 3 changes were nothing spectacular,  either. Buffs? Sure, though there have been complaints about the range of his 3. Meaningful? No.

All this "rework" did was give him a few % more damage reduction and create synergy that contradicts who he is as a frame.

How SHOULD the rework have been? Instead of flat armor, how about a flat DR % similar to Trinity, Mirage, Mesa, etc... and what if they made the health orb generation from his 4 on hit rather than on kill, similar to Nezha's 2. Enemies hit by Reckoning have a % chance to drop health orbs upon being killed. The issue with his kit is that it lacked scaling and consistency, this helps solve both issues and make him competitive with other frames within his niche.

 

EDIT: From a later post, "I agree that Oberon has a great kit, that was never the problem though. The problem was his scaling, and I feel that what they did to change that wasn't enough and that the changes weren't in the right places. A flat % of DR would be better for scaling purposes, and so would having more consistant health orb drops so that our Kubrows/Kavats are viable in any situation that a sentinel would be in."

Edited April 27, 2017 by Music4Therapy

[Music4Therapy]

5 minutes ago, Neo_182 said:

* In your opinion.

My opinion? So you believe the rework was a success and these changes were enough to make you consider playing Oberon much more often?

Edited April 27, 2017 by Music4Therapy

[StarCommanderVong]

Yes.

[(XBOX)Bortis Badtouch]

5 minutes ago, Music4Therapy said:

My opinion? So you believe the rework was a success and these changes were enough to make you consider playing Oberon much more often?

you do have a point, i still think of him as a crazy homeless person trying to bum a cigarette off of you lol

[Leonix13]

4 hours ago, Xhyros said:

Welp, one can tell you definitely don't play Oberon.  How can his 1st ability not be worth the casting time when you can use it while firing/reloading?

True, but as far as the rework goes the buff to that power is pretty much unnoticeable.

[KotoKuraken]

Did some testing in various missions today with the Broberon, here are some of my notes and thoughts:

1st Ability: Not that much damage. Flat 20% that can't be modded higher or lower, but doesn't seem like it does 20% of the enemy's health. Perhaps armor blocks some of it?

2nd Ability: I was actually surprised by this. With a 200%+ power strength build, it is very effective at killing enemies. However, there are two problems I have with the ability:

                   1) At the time of this post, the carpet for myself and other Oberons I encountered today is invisible. No idea how far its reaching and where I casted it.

                   2) The range doesn't seem that great. If I go for the 200% power strength build, I am pretty much only affecting the enemies close enough to be in the same bed as me. If I go for the 200% range for that glorious 360 degree circle (and maybe extra range? idk, feels like it, can't confirm because I can't see it), then I lose the damage of the carpet, the great healing for Renewal, the decent amount of armor bonus, and whatever damage Reckoning was going to do

3rd Ability: Very solid. I'm actually impressed, because now you can just mod for duration and your buffs will stay after the healing has done its thing. It does require synergy with the carpet for the armor buff to work, but that's fair enough once the carpet gets its range checked out.

4th Ability: Pretty well done. While it does basically nothing for damage until it has been casted on the carpet, it is still effective in knocking enemies down, giving them a small blind window, and removing some enemy armor. Of course, it's even better when used with the carpet, but again, carpet problems.

 

tl;dr Oberon's Rework seems to be very well done, but the carpet has some issues that need to be worked out. It feels like his entire kit relies solely on him laying down that Holy Shag Carpet in order to perform best, but the range is just too small and can end up with players ending up either building extensive range for no buffs, or having decent buffs but not enough reach to do what it needs to do. I want my carpet shag enough to where I can stroke it with my hand and discover an old AA battery under its luscious locks, then frolic through my lush carpet as if it were my own garden of tulips.

 

Edited April 27, 2017 by KotoKuraken
OCD Organization and Tentacles

[thewhitepanda1205]

8 minutes ago, Music4Therapy said:

The armor buff is okay at best considering flat armor falls off CONSIDERABLY after 300 armor. A frame with 300 armor has 50% DR. A frame with 600 has 66%.

This armor buff isn't there to make tanky frames, tankier. It is there to make squishy frames less squishy by giving them over 40% More Damage Reduction.

Oberon is a good armor buffer now.

10 minutes ago, Music4Therapy said:

 

You know why his 4 has the seemingly random effect of generating health orbs, right? Kubrows/Kavats are revived instantly upon picking one up. The fact that Reckoning requires to deal the killing blow in order to HAVE A CHANCE at creating the orb makes it not fulfill it's purpose. The correct way to buff this ability would have been forcing enemies hit by it for a set duration to have a chance to drop the orb.

I understand your frustration with this part though. A better buff than armor stripping would probably have been to make health orbs spawn on hit or what you suggested.

13 minutes ago, Music4Therapy said:

 

The thing is, Oberon's abilities don't fulfill their purpose.

 

They fulfill my own purposes for them.

Smite-CC with Some added Damage Reduction for all squad members

Hallowed Ground-Strips Procs and is good for area denial

Renewal: Great 5 second heal of 840 health along with a 31 second, 320 armor buff with my build

Reckoning: CC Panic Button that like Renewal helps when things get harry. It gives me some breathing room, makes enemies easier to kill with partial armor strip, and makes them less likely to target me because of Rad Proc

13 minutes ago, Music4Therapy said:

His 1 and 3 changes were nothing spectacular,  either. Buffs? Sure. Meaningful? No.

I agree with you about his 1s changes, however, Hallowed Ground's buffs did add some QoL through a lot more range.

7 minutes ago, Music4Therapy said:

So you believe the rework was a success and these changes were enough to make you consider playing Oberon much more often?

Well, I've been part of the #OberonMasterRace for several months so I may be a bit biased, but I would say yes it was a success for at least some people including Oberon mains like me. With the armor buff from Renewal, I can now tank level 90 enemies. I already play Oberon a lot so I'm not sure how much more often that I could use him. I think that this rework was pretty good, but not perfect such as with [DE]'s handling of Reckoning's buff. I would wait before judging Smite and Reckoning to harshly though because they may get tweaked in the future.