My clan just recently finished Hema research, and it wasn't that bad.

[(XBOX)Solargeo]

10 hours ago, JalakBali said:

If you killed every oxium osprey you come across in a mission, you'd net AT LEAST 50 oxium in a run, without booster. Running a mid-level Corpus defense mission will net at least 200 oxium. Oxium is only a problem if:

1. You just started so you don't have the kill count.

2. You don't play Corpus map at all and spent your entire game time in Akkad or one of those places.

3. You play other game modes by sprinting towards objective and ignoring enemies you come across.

 

I'm not saying 7,000 is not a lot. But it's an amount that will accumulate by itself in a reasonable time provided you actually run Corpus missions and actually spent the time to kill oxium ospreys instead of ignoring them as they'd suicide and not drop any oxium.  It's not as silly as mutagen samples as those need you to play in maps that require keys.

it is a bit of two. but mainly three.

[Gamma745]

12 hours ago, blackheartstar_pc said:

Never really payed attention to them till Hema and I had several thousand on both my pc and ps4 accounts. Those just came with playing the game for the enjoyment of killing stuff. No farming required.

You must really enjoy the Derelict, don't you? That's the biggest reason I think you can get that many.

 

Aside, I think this thread will be merged with the Megathread.

[blackheartstar_pc]

8 hours ago, Gamma745 said:

You must really enjoy the Derelict, don't you?

I love all survival nodes including the one in the Derelict.

[Arniox]

On 5/1/2017 at 5:50 AM, Tesseract7777 said:

Hema outrage was totally justified. For a small clan it is a lot easier, even as an over time goal. For larger clans, even as an "over time" goal, it is quite frankly absurd. And why are you so intent on defending what they did? Even DE admitted at the time that the costs were too much, and that if they had been in the office to change things before too many people had already done it, that they would indeed have changed it. Outrage was justifed, the cost was too much, and far too many clans are still struggling to get the research done. 

I don't expect them to change anything at this point, but going along with threads like this encourages them to do what they did again in the future. And we cannot let them think it was okay. Even they admitted at the time it was a mistake, like I said earlier, and we should make sure they don't forget that it was a mistake. A long term goal is one thing, the HEMA was far worse than simply being a long term goal. 

dude.... I'm in a moon clan. We finished the requirements within one or two weeks of the weapons release :P

It really isn't that bad.

[Arniox]

On 5/1/2017 at 5:51 AM, Praxxor said:

My mountain clan hasn't got even 50% of the resources yet, just because we're a noob-friendly clan. Me and the other Warlords pretty much agreed that we'd not kick people out just because they're unable to contribute. Screw Hema... if it's a choice between research or my clanmates, imma choose them every time. But that doesn't change the fact that the numbers are ridiculous for casual clans. I'm all for long-term objectives, just not ones that last for over half a year in a non-competitive environment (at this pace it'll probably take us over a year to finish Hema).

SUPER long term objectives :P

[(PSN)Teflonkatalogen1]

Seeing as this thread (mostly) relates to the Hema research, I thought it'd be fitting to chime in with my own experience of the whole farming ordeal: 

I'm a member of a Shadow Clan with ~25 members. To me the research didn't initially matter as I outright bought the Nidus Collection thingy on the day of his release, however I still wanted to contribute towards the research as it would not only benefit my clan mates but the clan itself as well. On release day I contributed the 550 Mutagen Samples I'd accumulated since I started playing Warframe and felt perfectly content with myself. Right there and then. 

To make a long story short(er), I continued farming Mutagen Samples alongside a handful of patient and strong-willed clan mates until we eventually completed the Hema research on our own (just last week as of this post actually). While I'm sure they originally intended for the Hema costs to be more lenient, it ended up being a rather harrowing experience overall - Being stuck in the same derelict corridors for hours, with the feeling of making progress slowly dwindling away into something more sinister. I felt no relief upon its completion, instead I was left feeling bitter at those clannies who contributed little to no Mutagen Samples for the past months. 

 

Summa summarum: The Hema research may very well indeed be a fun farming experience for those clans who maintain their ranks and favor active players, but for everyone else it's bound to become a grind in some form or capacity. I don't really think this pertains to impatience per se (says the guy who bought the Hema as soon as it was released), but rather how annoying it can be to have that one research remain incomplete indefinitely. I hope that DE releases another weapon with similar requirements in the near future, albeit requiring a more forgiving (and not nearly as limiting) material. 

[(PSN)CL_Poloboyzz93]

QQ lol

[kaliazane]

Nice, good job.

I remember finishing it on first day by randomly pressing 121212 to add max required amount of all resources like I always do, without even noticing how much it was lol.

 

 

[Gravitus123]

Im still pissed off at that damn Hema research.My clan requires 150 000 mutagens to finish that damn thing and after all this time we are still missing 64k.I cant believe De actually admitted they were wrong with the research amount and they still didnt change it and that excuse that some clans have already finished it so that somehow makes the cost okay is stupid.Lower the damn research cost and give the clans that already have it the extra mutagen back into their clan vaults

[GKDK]

Hema as end game? LMAO. God what a sad ambition and reality if this what Warframe has to offer as endgame. Not even a weapon that's worth the effort. 

[LycanPT]

There are 2 types of WF players: the ones that completed the Hema research and the ones that whine on forums about Hema research. As time goes on and more and more clans complete it all your salt is in vain, you could've man up long ago and farmed for it instead of waiting for a DE "fix". Also DE didn't made your clan, didn't invited casuals and didn't asked you to go moon with 1000 members and 90% that doesn't log for 30 days+. Let this sink in once and for all

[-Temp0-]

Quote

Too many posters on the forum need to have things right away. IMO this is how certain clan goals should feel. 

Get out.

I run solo ghost clan and it was awful. I had to spend ~15 hours in Derelict in the span of 3 days. In the old moon clan when I left it it was needed another 300k m samples and I left it for this along with other reasons as well. Clan is just a place where you can get weapons and stuff, majority of them aren't competitive or anything so people won't spend hours farming for one sh*tty weapon and they won't empty their resource bin for a clan. That's not to mention that even if the weapon was 'ok' (which hema is not) by the time an average clan would slowly get it it will be outdated at best. 

[SilvaDreams]

31 minutes ago, -Temp0- said:

Get out.

I run solo ghost clan and it was awful. I had to spend ~15 hours in Derelict in the span of 3 days. In the old moon clan when I left it it was needed another 300k m samples and I left it for this along with other reasons as well. Clan is just a place where you can get weapons and stuff, majority of them aren't competitive or anything so people won't spend hours farming for one sh*tty weapon and they won't empty their resource bin for a clan. That's not to mention that even if the weapon was 'ok' (which hema is not) by the time an average clan would slowly get it it will be outdated at best. 

You are running a solo clan... You shot yourself in the foot to start with so you are just lucky DE doesn't fix how dirt cheap the other research is.

 

And what is your point? You apparently suck at farming or have no life to sit in ODD/ODS for 15 hours a day?

I donated over 5,000 to my clan spending less than an hour a day for about a month.

Edited May 4, 2017 by SilvaDreams

[Hypernaut1]

1 hour ago, -Temp0- said:

Get out.

I run solo ghost clan and it was awful. I had to spend ~15 hours in Derelict in the span of 3 days. In the old moon clan when I left it it was needed another 300k m samples and I left it for this along with other reasons as well. Clan is just a place where you can get weapons and stuff, majority of them aren't competitive or anything so people won't spend hours farming for one sh*tty weapon and they won't empty their resource bin for a clan. That's not to mention that even if the weapon was 'ok' (which hema is not) by the time an average clan would slowly get it it will be outdated at best. 

Hema is not some awesome meta weapon that would make me sit hours a day in ODD.

My clan casually went after it. We would do a mission here and there. There was no reason to burn yourself out for it.

1 hour ago, GKDK said:

Hema as end game? LMAO. God what a sad ambition and reality if this what Warframe has to offer as endgame. Not even a weapon that's worth the effort. 

No one called this "end game" it's simply a goal. 

[-Temp0-]

1 hour ago, SilvaDreams said:

You are running a solo clan... You shot yourself in the foot to start with so you are just lucky DE doesn't fix how dirt cheap the other research is.

I did exactly the opposite, I can farm 5000 samples even if it will take time and grind, I can't farm 300 000 for a clan that isn't interested in it. Changing clans just because they don't grind as much isn't only a waste of time it's also pretty low.

Once again, if it's not some competitve clan it's full of leeches that never donate or do anything since they farm resources for themselves first and foremost+you got no refund if you leave a clan, so for people that actually work for it running a solo clan is better.

Quote

Hema is not some awesome meta weapon that would make me sit hours a day in ODD.

My clan casually went after it. We would do a mission here and there. There was no reason to burn yourself out for it.

You can't 'casually' go after it because the drop rate of m samples is low as f, with a full farming party but no boosters on average I've been getting only 90 in ~30 minutes.

By doing it alone but with both boosters I was able to get up to 200 per run while not being held down by anything, doing it whenever I like and no need to recruiting random people nor waiting on clanmates (if I had them). I had to do it in 3 days because that's how long a booster lasts, simple - and actually that's the point because boosters that you can get for example in prime access are useless af, no one needs credit booster and affinity booster is only somewhat useful so you have to buy them even if you laready paid >50$ if you bought p access. It's not like I was gonna spend 160p or more for longer lasted boosters since it's more than a half cost of the Hema. And I got one of the boosters as a sortie reward. So that's what you have to do if you don't plan on finsihing that research in 10 years or pay more than 40-80p.

Getting less than 100 m samples per run while in the need to wait on people constantly or getting ~20 alone despite running nekros does not encourage to farm for it at all. Whenever you see those numbers in the end of a mission you don't want to return to Derelict, ever, especially since you have no other business being there the only other resource that drops there is nanospores that everyone got millions of. By doing it 'slowly' you spend even more time total but in a span of weeks or months. By doing it solo you would need around 100 hours. That's 100 days farming for an hour a day. By organazing a party while it increases the gain but you will need to add to it a waiting time until you will find people for the job - and like I said, the more time goes on the fewer people would want to farm m samples because Hema will be outdated. Items' worth decay over time. If you didn't manage to get something or sell during the hype you will most likely struggle to get it even more if it's something farmable. So no, as much as doing it for 15 or so hours sucked it would suck only more other way.

 

Quote

No one called this "end game" it's simply a goal. 

Someone did on the first page.

Edited May 4, 2017 by -Temp0-

[Zeclem]

reading all these replies, i understand that having a long term goal to work as a clan is being competitive now to you people. sorry, forming up a a few farming parties to farm for like 20 rounds or so at the weekends isnt being competitive, its called proper co-operating as a clan. if youre a big clan, this shouldnt be difficult. if it is, then you either have way too many inactives that dont play, or youre simply in a clan for the sake of being in a clan.

clans are supposed to make people work together, and thats what you need to do for hema. costs were too high yeah, but that doesnt change the fact that de is trying to get clans working together for a common goal, which isnt a bad thing. hema did gave a lot of clans a goal to work for. and if your clan is actually willing to cooperate, its not a problem to deal with it at all. even with these high costs. and no, its not being "super competitive" like these forums often like to cry about.

[-Temp0-]

Quote

reading all these replies, i understand that having a long term goal to work as a clan is being competitive now to you people. sorry, forming up a a few farming parties to farm for like 20 rounds or so at the weekends isnt being competitive, its called proper co-operating as a clan.

No one needs that in this game.

And yes, it's called being competitive. If you will go into recruiting for clans section you will see that any clan that has Hema+Ignis will ask of you to be "active" if you want to join, join their discord or teamspeak and use it and often there's a mr requirement as well. That's not 'casual' pve experience at all for a game where there's a solo option to anything (except raids basically).

Being in a clan is suposed to make your life and farming easier, it's not supposed to be a requirement to have active af clanmates willing to do whatever just in order to get clan stuff. If you can't see the difference you're hopeless.

Quote

clans are supposed to make people work together, and thats what you need to do for hema.

It might come as a surprise for you, but people don't want to work together, you will notice that playing any pvp coop game. In warframe they often want to rest and chill out either from other games or just in general.

Many play WF because you can play it solo 99,9% of the time and without the need of communication whatsoever. Pushing new agendas will only push people away from this game just like it was with forced pvp events. You can't make people enjoy doing what they don't enjoy, simple.

Edited May 4, 2017 by -Temp0-

[Zeclem]

19 minutes ago, -Temp0- said:

No one needs that in this game.

And yes, it's called being competitive. If you will go into recruiting for clans section you will see that any clan that has Hema+Ignis will ask of you to be "active" if you want to join, join their discord or teamspeak and use it and often there's a mr requirement as well. That's not 'casual' pve experience at all for a game where there's a solo option to anything (except raids basically).

Being in a clan is suposed to make your life and farming easier, it's not supposed to be a requirement to have active af clanmates willing to do whatever just in order to get clan stuff. If you can't see the difference you're hopeless.

It might come as a surprise for you, but people don't want to work together, you will notice that playing any pvp coop game.

Many play WF because you can play it solo 99,9% of the time and without the need of communication whatsoever. Pushing new agendas will only push people away from this game just like it was with forced pvp events. You can't make people enjoy doing what they don't enjoy, simple.

lol what? asking for active members with some experience in game is by no means exclusive to clans with hema+ignis thats just a stupid assumption. oh and ignis research is being handed out for free by a lot of those "competitive" clans as well. my clan has hema research complete and we have no requirements for anybody to join but to chat with us in discord here and then. yeah for sure were competitive.

oh nice using insults to prove a point. but jokes on you, clans are requirement to a lot of things in this game. and no, you dont need to have a clan playing literally 7/24 to get hema like you imply. we got it while running odd as a two squads every weekends for like half an hour. thats not "active af".

thats not the games problem if you dont want to work together in a CO-OP game, its yours. and that not working together in pvp games only happen in crap tier elos. where people actually know what theyre doing, thats not an issue. so just git gud. if you want to play solo, dont play a co-op game.

Edited May 4, 2017 by Zeclem

[Hypernaut1]

45 minutes ago, -Temp0- said:

No one needs that in this game.

Many play WF because you can play it solo 99,9% of the time and without the need of communication whatsoever. Pushing new agendas will only push people away from this game just like it was with forced pvp events. You can't make people enjoy doing what they don't enjoy, simple.

I wouldn't call one niche weapon as pushing an agenda. It's easily ignorable if it's that much of an issue to you. People are acting like DE is planning on releasing ALL clan weapons with insane requirements. It's clearly just a rare thing. They've released several easy to research weapons since then. Weapons that I funded by myself within moments of it being available. If they were leaning towards making all requirements more difficult, they would've started doing so already. 

It was a positive experience for my clan. We didn't feel forced to do it, yet it still provided enough motivation to team up and go after it. No one bought boosters, or burned out on farming for it. It was cool to see the mutagen sample dwindle by a few hundred here and there every week. 

We need more mutually beneficial items to build as a clan. 

Edited May 4, 2017 by Hypernaut1

[FairyTael]

The cost has already been said by DE to be 'too high'. They just didn't change it because they felt too many people had already pushed through the absurd cost and finished the research anyways. Personally, I disagree with their decision and they could have offered free things to people who pushed through while lowering the cost and probably appeased most people.

My clan used to be a Moon Clan, and while we had around 700 members, only about 150 or so were 'active'. Of those active only about 50 were contributors. It was more about just having a nice pool of people together for chatting and teaming than being "competitive" in any regards.

Some of the members were pretty dedicated and we completed all research except Hema at the increased costs of Moon. Hema was just not doable so we ended up just purging down to Storm. The Hema research materials at that level were financed within the first day by the same contributors.



Yes, Hema costs scale poorly for the research. Yes, it does encourage the community to downsize their clans and/or more strictly enforce "contribution".

What can we really do about it? Not much.

[Gamma745]

13 hours ago, Zeclem said:

we got it while running odd as a two squads every weekends for like half an hour. thats not "active af".

were you using double boosters and meta-farming squads? Because I think that's how you can get it that quick.

[Gamma745]

16 hours ago, LycanPT said:

There are 2 types of WF players: the ones that completed the Hema research and the ones that whine on forums about Hema research. As time goes on and more and more clans complete it all your salt is in vain, you could've man up long ago and farmed for it instead of waiting for a DE "fix". Also DE didn't made your clan, didn't invited casuals

 

15 hours ago, SilvaDreams said:

You are running a solo clan... You shot yourself in the foot to start with so you are just lucky DE doesn't fix how dirt cheap the other research is.

So what you are saying is casuals should never be allowed to join a clan if it want to progress anywhere? Only hardcore-everyday farmers are allowed in a clan?

[Jeoxz]

The cost is a really high jump from normal prices and does lock the Hema for new clans. The complain was justified, but the outrage was not.

[SharkPot]

On 30/4/2017 at 11:07 PM, Hypernaut1 said:

My ghost clan just got enough mutagen to finally finish Hema research. I don't think it was that unreasonable a wait for a niche clan weapon. It was actually fun to have a clan goal that we all slowly contributed to. 

Too many posters on the forum need to have things right away. IMO this is how certain clan goals should feel. They should give us long term objectives. 

Hema outrage was really all about nothing.

The hema gate isn't really a big deal for small clans, as most players can fund that by themselves ( atleast I somehow had 3.5 mutagen samples, so if people play more than me I wouldn't be surprised if a single person contributed alone). And many players solo farmed 5k mutagen for their solo clans.

The problem is for larger scale clans, due to extreme scaling factor used, even a small number snowballs to a pretty huge number, On top the bigger the clan, the higher the number of inactive people, the more the active people need to farm to pick up the slack.

[SilvaDreams]

11 minutes ago, SharkPot said:

The hema gate isn't really a big deal for small clans, as most players can fund that by themselves ( atleast I somehow had 3.5 mutagen samples, so if people play more than me I wouldn't be surprised if a single person contributed alone). And many players solo farmed 5k mutagen for their solo clans.

The problem is for larger scale clans, due to extreme scaling factor used, even a small number snowballs to a pretty huge number, On top the bigger the clan, the higher the number of inactive people, the more the active people need to farm to pick up the slack.

Not really the cost per person is exactly the same for each tier of clan approximately 500ish (slightly over), just the larger clans had a lot of freeloaders or dead weight from inactive players to which they then blamed DE for exorbitant Costs because they refused to not keep active players.