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The Second Stream Podcast #16 - TennoLive Speculation, Devstream 94, Sorties, and more! ft. M.C. I.K


[DE]Taylor
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Want more details on what was teased during Devstream 94? We dropped some hints during this episode of the Second Stream Podcast.

Tune in to the last recording before TennoCon 2017, as M.C. I.K and [DE]Rebecca discuss TennoLive speculation, our Design Council questions, and more! 

GUESTS:
M.C. I.K - YouTube | Twitter

For reference, here is the video and image that was discussed in this podcast:

Spoiler

 

Spoiler

concept.jpg

Huge thanks to @NightmareT12 and @AdunSaveMe for their awesome questions!

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NightmareT12 here, so I'd like to bring up a small thing I've always kept wondering: How can DE keep interest on using lower level planets/nodes so more advanced players go there beyond a quest or new update thing? I mean, Earth remaster is going to hit us soon, but once we're done with Harrow, we'll have little use for that tileset.
 
Could Fissure tileset selector be completely random? Should Dark Sector nodes be rethinked so they're not always Infested and use the other factions around, with a possibility at higher level enemies? Maybe a couple of rotating of non existing nodes everyday (like the original Starchart 3.0 idea had) you can play in with MUCH higher level enemies and better rewards? (so it's not exactly Nightmare mode).
 
I'm asking this because, for example, Ceres looks great but beyond a Sortie, I'll rarely set foot on it. So I am pretty sure something can be done here.

Quote

AdunSaveMe
I would be interested to hear what people think of the current iteration of sorties, and what you would do to make them more fun. Stuff like:
-the modifiers (do they provide enough of a 'true' challenge?)
-the variety (does it feel like you're repeating the same missions?)
-the rewards (does it feel like you're getting enough for the time spent?)
 
What modifiers would you create, if you could? Are sorties the way to a real endgame?

What are your answers to their questions? What do you think the mysterious tease was about? What are your thoughts on Nox?

Let us know below!

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I see a mention and... Wait, Taylor, there's a double post of the topic! Quickly, destroy one before the votes and posts go to waste! :P Double topic? What double topic? :o

Heh, I'll edit this post with answers once I finish listening to the stream :D

Edited by NightmareT12
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2. What new Sortie Conditions would you like to see?

  • No HUD only waypoints.
  • No ammo to start with on mission.
  • Split damage among allies.

3. What new rewards would you like to see from Sorties?

  • Tokens.
  • Normal versions of prime accessories. Normal Acanthus & Normal Targis.

4. What do you think the watery teaser was about?

  • Umbra.
Edited by Navarchus
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About the watery teaser, I dont think it's Hydroid prime because it would be to early and what Ballas says dont really define Hydroid.

It's probably about a new important cinematic quest like the Second Dream and the War Within.
Since we see water, it's probably related to the new weird grineer in a bag called "ghouls", how we see on the Top Crow Productions comic preview :
Warframe_7_edit.jpg

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2. Floor is lava, we already have fire hazard sorties. pointless. Tho I am interested in the randomized weapons. Hopefully, it doesn't just pull from least used catergory everytime.

3. This is downright silly. Last thing we need is more useless junk added to sorties. Cosmetics/Glyphs, utter garbage. When people already complain about getting lenses/endo/sculptures even boosters.

3a. Rare resources? DE we know how pitiful you can be with giving out rewards. Why would we want rare resources as a reward for completing sorties? What you plan on giving, 50+ neurodes/neural sensors/orokin cells? you mean 5-10, most likely.

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1. Very Rarely. Don't like Rivens, anything else I can get anywhere else even if slower, except lenses, but market has better lenses for much much less effort and zero rng. Armor scaling isn't a challenge it's a bandaid for Tenno being too powerful.

2. Randomized equipment will just be launch, everyone quits, repeat.

3. Tokens

4. No opinion

5. Fissures, trace farming, really liked the Gaia interception maps for leveling new gear before MR increased capacity. Relics.

Edited by Kinetos
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3. What new rewards would you like to see from Sorties?

Me personally I would like to see cosmetics even if they were seasonal themed; spring, summer, fall, and winter. And maybe a bit random but what about a reputation booster? (with a limit of 3 that a player can own at a give time)

4. What do you think the watery teaser was about?

Earth 2.0 be it new lighting Weather events aka Storms on Earth.

 

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Not going to comment on sorties since I don't ever play them, but just on the revisiting low-level tilesets like Earth:

I go to Earth, Mars, Venus,and Ceres often, but because I just want to run around and kill Grineer and Corpus. And I'm always bored at the end because there's nothing more to the gameplay. As long as the only goal of the game is to collect rewards, there will never be a lasting reason to go to any tileset, because players will always end up getting all the reward items there are to get. If you'd make the gameplay more involved, with more features and things in the environment (like vehicles in MGSV, GRW, or SWBF), and add multiple objectives to missions so that missions require different steps to complete (like Medal of Honor Airborne, for example), and if you'd allow all in-game actions (kills, headshots, slide kills, wall kills, parkour kills, ability kills, companion kills, console hacks, etc) to award mastery points, then you'd always have a reason to go back to any tileset, because the core focus of the game would be gameplay, not reward items. So, you'd go to tilesets based on the gameplay experience, not based solely on the rewards and resources that tileset offered.

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1. How often do you complete Sorties?
once every 2 week, when I have nothing else to do. Simply because the reward system is awful.

2. What new Sortie Conditions would you like to see?
Anything but NOT randomized equipment. Having low tier weapons like MK1 furis would be awful and far from fun and challenging. ALSO, players would just exit > restart until they have a playable set of weapons.

3. What new rewards would you like to see from Sorties?
Nothing as long as we don't have a better reward system (like token that was suggested so many times, even by YOU devs). Whatever the reward list is, there is always a lot of rewards a player won't care about.

4. What do you think the watery teaser was about?

No opinion... Don't really care about lore stuff and tentatives to create hype

5. How often do you visit low-level planets like Earth?

Only when a new prime requires a lith relic. Otherwise never. If you guys released that feature allowing us to increase the starting level of the mission, maybe people would run earth for lvl 80+ enemies. (oh and when there is an excavation fissure for trace farming...)

 

31 minutes ago, [DE]Taylor said:

AdunSaveMe
I would be interested to hear what people think of the current iteration of sorties, and what you would do to make them more fun. Stuff like:
-the modifiers (do they provide enough of a 'true' challenge?)
-the variety (does it feel like you're repeating the same missions?)
-the rewards (does it feel like you're getting enough for the time spent?)
 
What modifiers would you create, if you could? Are sorties the way to a real endgame?

  • Modifiers would be interesting if the game were balanced. The game isn't balanced, therefore modifiers are useless.
  • Since the aim of the game is on "short missions that are rushed", yeah it feels repetitive. A bit less but still.
  • Not at all. It feels more like a kick in the nuts of my free time.
  • Modifiers "the game is balanced", is that a thing ? That should be a thing. And no sorties aren't and won't ever be endgame, there won't be anything close to "endgame" with a game so unbalanced.
Edited by Trichouette
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The only worry I have about cosmetics/glyphs is that they are a bit 'one and done' and don't add a long term reason to do Sorties (unless we were able to cash in duplicates) and please don't put in anything that's already been available for plat, that spare Pyra Syandana I have is still annoying me.

Regarding rare resources as rewards, I think they are available through other means too easily to make a good Sortie reward.  They would be seen as something not worth the effort and would just have people disappointed after 3 high level missions with extra conditions, hence the complaints when 3 Nitain was added as a drop too rare to help those who need it and annoying to those who didn't.

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29 minutes ago, [DE]Taylor said:

What modifiers would you create, if you could?

There are a bunch of threads dedicated solely to making sorties "better" and with ideas on new conditions.  They are in the feedback section of your forums.  Feel free to take a look at those.

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1) got tired of doing sorties since I'm mostly getting lenses, sculptures, and 4K endo on a daily basis, while the legendary core carrot has never appeared (to me) and the "common" riven mod one is a lottery ticket with more chances of being a grind fest and a let down than an actual reward.

3) cosmetics hidden behind RNG? I wouldn't like to see DE start going that way, i'd prefer cosmetics being tied to achievents of any type, so whenever a player appears using it we know what he did (like those wearing thr quantum badge, for example) instead of saying "he had luck and got it on day 1 while many players haven't been able to get it months after release just because rng isn't kind with them", like some of the stalker weapons ir the latter times when the rift sigil appeared.

Rare resources are easy to farm and would create a huge pushback, remember nitain as sortie reward? It's the rarest thing and it still caused a lot of rage in the community.

4) Imo, it's too early to think of the next prime (hoping for Hydroid), so my expectations are put on 2 things that have been stated to happen but haven't been done yet:

snmxASw.jpg

I guess it's the next cinematic quest, which should be bringing Umbra and focus system revamp with the inclusion of the Karma meter thing to impact gameplay while giving more freedom to move it depending on what each player expects from it.

5) only on sorties (when I used to do them) and void fissures (IF I'm in the mood to play them)

Edited by Stormdragon
English can be hard sometimes
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Can't wait to listen to the new podcast! Thanks as always!


4. What do you think the watery teaser was about?
  • Since I chose "Other", my speculation is Limbo Prime. I recently saw video from AGGP, who was semi-joking about it, but I don't know....I reeaally want it to happen now lol.
    • On a more serious guess though my Limbo Prime guess is totally serious! since the little teaser's location seemed to be on Earth, it probably has to do with the coming up Earth remaster, maybe adding weather conditions mid-mission or something.
    • Or just overall new higher level Earth Nodes that unlock mid game to end game starchart completion (around level 25 - 35 enemies?). Close or parallel to Lua's difficulty range.
      • If this is the case, I would love to see some newer tilesets for it!

edit: oh yeah, regarding my second guess via higher level Earth Nodes, based on the picture teaser in the OP, it's also likely related to that new boss that was teased in the Oberon Prime trailer! Maybe not him specifically, but some kind of correlation between him and that picture.

Edited by HalfDarkShadow
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At the moment, I suppose my main suspicions for the water trailer is something to do with the Dial, what with water oft being used as meditative aid. A means for self reflection.

Of course, the "But all miracles...require sacrifice" line makes me wonder. The fact it's Ballas implies it's something to do with Warframes in some way. Quite what though...curious, certainly, but I'm working with too little for me personally to make any leaps in that direction, I'm afraid.

Though considering the shoreside audio going on, I wonder if it could be tied to the reclamation of Earth from the Infested, during the Orokin era. More had to be going on than the deployment of Saryn and Oberon class Warframes, and Steve has noted repeatedly there are plants with roles within the terraforming effort that went on.

Sigh. And now I find myself once again wishing New Loka were as nuanced as I'd hoped they were when I first took up the banner; the fact Earth is really as it is because of artificial recovery probably just sets them off in shortsightedness. The spirit of the matter is what counts, you'd think, but alas.

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2. While I don't think sortie modifiers are the direction personally to make them more interesting to players, I would suggest a 'No Prime Modifier' before lava floors, random gear, or other oddities. You for whatever reason wouldn't be able to bring any Primed gear on the sortie, weapons, warframe, or companions. Primed Mods too, if that pleases you.

3. I would feel that with Trials not getting and thus arcane enhancements not getting as much player exposure as desired due to the cyclical nature of low player turn-out due to trial approach-ability not reaching a level to demand resources to tinker with them; I feel the best addition to Sortie rewards would be a new range of arcane enhancements that can be installed (Perhaps on cosmetic armor)

4, The watery teaser seemed to be implying visually an Eclipse while Ballas misappropriated miracles for ritual appeasements in exchange for boons. I figure this might correlate to a tie-in to the Karma system as DE Steve did say the choices would eventually matter. If not, it would work for Harrow as he has been tied to personal sacrifice in his theme. The puddle in this case, might simply be a puddle.

5. I have little reason to visit most starchart missions unless they currently have kuva, an alert, or I am assisting newer allies. There just isn't much reward for doing so, and while I like looking around and opening containers, finding nothing of import more often than not isn't much fun and hidden caches on sabotage missions seem to have such low chances on anything worth the time to run them, that I find a purpose in trying anymore. For doing starchart standard missions, there needs to be a draw, and scanning flowers for a specific grindy specter fight isn't engaging or rewarding for the time spent, though it is neat enough in its own.

@lukinu_u I couldn't say for sure, but those look like Tenno cryopods with distinctly Excalibur shaped silhouettes inside. Don't understand the very red human aligned eyes in the heads honestly - perhaps the comic itself will explain it - since Warframes don't have eyes in a traditional sense. I don't know, maybe Vor takes Grineer parts and attaches them to warframes with parts to confuse the Tenno linked to them? Or simply uses the cast off or unclaimed warframes to do something sinister?

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48 minutes ago, Navarchus said:

 

3. What new rewards would you like to see from Sorties?
Tokens.
Normal versions of prime accessories. Normal Acanthus & Normal Targis.

4. What do you think the watery teaser was about?
Umbra.

YAS. Normal versions of prime accesories are something I wanted for a while now but there's only hoping

The teaser meaning umbra is justified and I saw many people speculate about it

Smart minds think alike? :D

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