Umbra warframes [Discussion & Appreciation][*spoilers*]

[Vlada91]

I accidentally ran into his video, either way every part of the clipe is a puzzle that whole thing looks like that umbra is coming on tennocon...

[(XBOX)EternalDrk Mako]

17 minutes ago, Zortyx said:

He connects the Clip of mogamu saying "where is umbra? where the heck is umbra?" then xenegelion's clip says "metaphors are some of the greatest tools we have for explaining things", then himself humming "rhythm of the night"
He says these 3 clips are part of a coded message to say umbra is going to be at tennocon

Then grates saying "never gonna give you up, never gonna let you down", and brozime saying "which way did he go which way would he go off to"
these next 2 clips are about not giving up on something and trying to find it ie. umbra

At the end he says that DE could have chosen any clips but chose these ones specifically
 

  Reveal hidden contents

also i understand why you didn't watch this, i didn't either for similar reasons but umbra compelled me to

 

ah makes sense then de does like code fun here and there 

Spoiler

  gratsi ! 

 

[mythicsful]

4 hours ago, SilvaDreams said:

We have no clue what they are because they were never originally going to be a thing. But upon community outcry for it DE said they would add it and so now they have to figure out what it is themselves, how to wedge it into the lore somewhere ext....

Hell it was only last May (2016) that we found out there would be an official quest and that they would be their own separate frame and not just a skin.

Prove that you got that information (the outcry for it to be a thing) from DE and I'll respect it. Otherwise, you're making your own false ideas up.

[mythicsful]

1 hour ago, xXx_mtv_xXx said:

I guess we'll get a quest that will let us transform normal frames into umbra frames with different visuals and stats. It would be a nightmare for the devs to come up with 4 different umbra powers for all 33 frames. Maybe they can at least rethink the passives.

Honestly with the wait we've had, I would expect a few of the kits to have a twist on the original at the very least. If it's just an emo reskin, I've no interest getting them.

[Thalahssalyst]

9 hours ago, arch111 said:

Anyone else see a pattern emerging?

1) Hunhow uses fragments, parts of himself as soldiers or indeed surrogates for his control.

2) Tenno can move part of their mind to a surrogate body as an extention of themselves. 

3) Harrow now showed us a Tenno can split itself into fragments;  in Rells case they were his emotions.

4) Stalkers Accolytes and his weapons are named after emotions and dark ones at that.

5) Ballas said about Valkyr Prime that the warframes burn with passion that the Orokin have forgotten and lost. Again,  emotions and the lack of them.

6) Margulis, Lotus and Ordis show compassion and Love and the Orokin and Sentients show indifference and hate.

7) Allignement is Yin and Yang, Light and dark. Two opposites.

8) Void and Dust, emptiness and Earth. Again two opposites.

 

Seems like emotions and fragments are the two themes.  

In that theme,  where do Umbra fir in?

BALLAS "Miracles require sacrifice. What are you willing to give?"

GUARDIAN "Anything."

BALLAS "Even your soul?"

GUARDIAN "Anything for the Orokin."

* flick switch. The ghost of a human sitting in a Transference chair moves into a warframe sitting in another Transference chair. 

Ballas turns on the second chair,  the warframe comes to life. It rises, looks at its hands,  looks over at the limp human opposite. 

It rises, walks over and thrust a sword through both body and machines. 

It backs away, turning to Ballas who smiles and says:

"Welcome Shadow,  Guardian of the Orokin."

Is that some leaked spoiler?

[(XBOX)EternalDrk Mako]

6 minutes ago, Grimlock- said:

Is that some leaked spoiler?

think its a concept idea 

im still of mind orokin just did a lot of brainwashing/conditioning .... 

[arch111]

8 minutes ago, Grimlock- said:

Is that some leaked spoiler?

No, this is headcanon I started theorising long ago, originally I thought this is how Stalker came to be and why he went insane when he realized his body is lost forever and Hunhows line "You used to be like them. "

The sacrifice-part is from the Water-day into night teaser.

[arch111]

2 minutes ago, (Xbox One)EternalDrk Mako said:

think its a concept idea 

im still of mind orokin just did a lot of brainwashing/conditioning .... 

Yup. And sure, the Orokin even lost themselves at the price of eternal life. 

[Xaero]

2 hours ago, (Xbox One)EternalDrk Mako said:

the umrbas are gettign their own way of implementation, could be quest or even raid or dark sector based to grind to get the frame, dont know 

But right before War Within it was confirmed to be a part of the next cinematic quest.

[Blakrana]

7 hours ago, arch111 said:

Yes, another shared concept. Are you suggesting Transference worked so well because of how the Infestation works?

Sort of a Reverse Transferance? 

In RPC they do say proto rhino knows what they are doing to it and its brothers because of "ancestral memory". Litteral inherited and shared memories.

That's something I guess.

I'd say it's a technical "Nature inspires science" sort of scenario: the Infested ability to operate on a macro scale with a singular will, yet across many particulars, could have been the inspiration Margulis needed to begin Transference, though one mind into one other body. From there utilising some elements of Infested biology as a medium to test the theory or the like isn't a far leap.

Leading to a kind of perfect storm: if Margulis' research had been using Infested derived materials in some form, the hijacking of the RPC entity isn't that out of the ordinary if the Tenno had been used to just utilising whatever came nearby of that form...which could also explain why they were kept in separate locations to some degree. Not just secrecy, but Margulis being cautious about things perhaps.

Granted...that is of course theory on my part. Don't take as confirmed until we get actual information saying as such down the line.

33 minutes ago, (Xbox One)EternalDrk Mako said:

im still of mind orokin just did a lot of brainwashing/conditioning .... 

Most certainly. Ordis' scenario alone shows they were clearly willing to utilise whatever means they had to punish or penalise, and screwing with the mind is what the Neural Sentry seems explicitly meant to do.

2 minutes ago, Ksaero said:

But right before War Within it was confirmed to be a part of the next cinematic quest.

The concept can be introduced in a quest, whilst the broader mechanical nature of it after the quest, without being a contradiction of some form or other.

[(XBOX)EternalDrk Mako]

18 minutes ago, Blakrana said:

I'd say it's a technical "Nature inspires science" sort of scenario: the Infested ability to operate on a macro scale with a singular will, yet across many particulars, could have been the inspiration Margulis needed to begin Transference, though one mind into one other body. From there utilising some elements of Infested biology as a medium to test the theory or the like isn't a far leap.

Leading to a kind of perfect storm: if Margulis' research had been using Infested derived materials in some form, the hijacking of the RPC entity isn't that out of the ordinary if the Tenno had been used to just utilising whatever came nearby of that form...which could also explain why they were kept in separate locations to some degree. Not just secrecy, but Margulis being cautious about things perhaps.

Granted...that is of course theory on my part. Don't take as confirmed until we get actual information saying as such down the line.

Most certainly. Ordis' scenario alone shows they were clearly willing to utilise whatever means they had to punish or penalise, and screwing with the mind is what the Neural Sentry seems explicitly meant to do.

The concept can be introduced in a quest, whilst the broader mechanical nature of it after the quest, without being a contradiction of some form or other.

agreed on the transference concept, as it seems orokin took to that like gas + fire, using the transference tech in a variety of ways, from body jumping, to cephalons, to possibly stalker types 

the second part on the tissue makes sense, when factoring rhino primes lore,  if we were dreaming but, configured/trained to utilize the infested  mass/golems of some simple design , then when the "creature" got near ...one of us just naturally connected and took control.

if you reflect that you can condition the unconscious psyche pretty easily as a state of suggestion, then it makes sense, i think though that with teshins help we now can perform greater transference distances while being cognitively aware, as before the dreamer state/transference was induced artificially ..while the now we simply use a natural state. though im of mind to think this natural transference we have can be wielded to do some interesting things when focus is reworked 

23 minutes ago, Ksaero said:

But right before War Within it was confirmed to be a part of the next cinematic quest.

umbra excalibur is going to be apart of the next main quest -8th will clear up name... hopefully..-  and hopefully drop form it 

while the other umbra frames are still a mystery. as we know focus will get a hammer rework soon, it comes to mind that the umbra system will be introduced in that quest, and how we get umbra frames will follow by using the system in daily tasks , like kuva siphons rivens , ect 

 

 

[Xaero]

32 minutes ago, Blakrana said:

The concept can be introduced in a quest, whilst the broader mechanical nature of it after the quest, without being a contradiction of some form or other.

After all those delays they just have to roll it out complete.

[(XBOX)EternalDrk Mako]

2 minutes ago, Ksaero said:

After all those delays they just have to roll it out complete.

look at focus system, it was a beta when deployed and will be reworked soon 

its all in how the system for obtaining works, if its sortie like or maybe a raid system , or sacrifice deployment system 

[Corial]

1 minute ago, (Xbox One)EternalDrk Mako said:

look at focus system, it was a beta when deployed and will be reworked soon 

its all in how the system for obtaining works, if its sortie like or maybe a raid system , or sacrifice deployment system 

5 days till tennocon

 

[Blakrana]

8 minutes ago, (Xbox One)EternalDrk Mako said:

if you reflect that you can condition the unconscious psyche pretty easily as a state of suggestion, then it makes sense, i think though that with teshins help we now can perform greater transference distances while being cognitively aware, as before the dreamer state/transference was induced artificially ..while the now we simply use a natural state. though im of mind to think this natural transference we have can be wielded to do some interesting things when focus is

It's possible. After all...War Within allowed us to hijack a Golden Maw for a time.

Though as for conditioning whilst unconscious...I'm sure I mentioned this elsewhere...but considering the Orokin knew how to digitise, reprogram and modify the human mind, then it's possible Warframes affect the mind in some way to fit the 'mould' as the Orokin see it for that class of frame. Again, much like Morphs in Eclipse Phase.

Of course...again, that's theory on my part.

[(XBOX)EternalDrk Mako]

1 minute ago, Blakrana said:

It's possible. After all...War Within allowed us to hijack a Golden Maw for a time.

Though as for conditioning whilst unconscious...I'm sure I mentioned this elsewhere...but considering the Orokin knew how to digitise, reprogram and modify the human mind, then it's possible Warframes affect the mind in some way to fit the 'mould' as the Orokin see it for that class of frame. Again, much like Morphs in Eclipse Phase.

Of course...again, that's theory on my part.

it makes sense, and fits with how the orokin utilized people. 

though the mold could simply be obediant soldiers ot the orokin,

though im still unclear on weather primes were made to suit a specific operators powers originally and then remade and then made in mass to be wielded by groups of operators force to fit that mold ... 

[(XBOX)Tanta Cinta]

I imagine us having to track down a rogue Excalibur Umbra in the quest and try to tame it.

[Blakrana]

1 minute ago, (Xbox One)EternalDrk Mako said:

it makes sense, and fits with how the orokin utilized people. 

though the mold could simply be obediant soldiers ot the orokin,

though im still unclear on weather primes were made to suit a specific operators powers originally and then remade and then made in mass to be wielded by groups of operators force to fit that mold ... 

Admittedly my instincts say that the Primes would be the first "official Orokin approved" models, but logically R&D would require testing and assessment long before then; you don't slap gold and frills onto something untested and proven to work, else it's a waste of resources. Primes can still be Officially First but necessarily the culmination of R&D, essentially.

As for where the idea came from...I wager that it's likely experimentation and testing around a 'need'. So far, Ballas' narrations have suggested a given Prime has a designated purpose on average, and it is born out of some Orokin need or aim. Once that and testing were out of the way, I guess systems that ensure that a Tenno can utilise that Frame's abilities to that end would come first. From there, I guess it depends how effective their control systems could be without Kuva or Cephalonisation; Dax are bound by a Kuva based "Geas" of some form, whilst Cephalons are not only programmed to their new state in some form, but can also be monitored by neural sentries, perhaps.

Maybe the Orokin could only do so much, if they had to rely on subtle conditioning. After all, a too heavy hand could do more damage than good...and they needed their weapons it seems.

Once again of course...theory.

Apologies. Doing a lot of that, really.

[(XBOX)EternalDrk Mako]

13 minutes ago, Blakrana said:

Admittedly my instincts say that the Primes would be the first "official Orokin approved" models, but logically R&D would require testing and assessment long before then; you don't slap gold and frills onto something untested and proven to work, else it's a waste of resources. Primes can still be Officially First but necessarily the culmination of R&D, essentially.

As for where the idea came from...I wager that it's likely experimentation and testing around a 'need'. So far, Ballas' narrations have suggested a given Prime has a designated purpose on average, and it is born out of some Orokin need or aim. Once that and testing were out of the way, I guess systems that ensure that a Tenno can utilise that Frame's abilities to that end would come first. From there, I guess it depends how effective their control systems could be without Kuva or Cephalonisation; Dax are bound by a Kuva based "Geas" of some form, whilst Cephalons are not only programmed to their new state in some form, but can also be monitored by neural sentries, perhaps.

Maybe the Orokin could only do so much, if they had to rely on subtle conditioning. After all, a too heavy hand could do more damage than good...and they needed their weapons it seems.

Once again of course...theory.

Apologies. Doing a lot of that, really.

its a good theory , but has me wonder if a geas of that type was instilled in more then just the dax , we obviously had some form of it at one point till lotus ..broke it 

teshin still is bound by it (though we have the staff now ) 

stalker seems bound by one on the level of his devotion to the orokin  

makes me wonder if tenno can utilize a geas factor on some things .. 

[Blakrana]

2 minutes ago, (Xbox One)EternalDrk Mako said:

its a good theory , but has me wonder if a geas of that type was instilled in more then just the dax , we obviously had some form of it at one point till lotus ..broke it 

teshin still is bound by it (though we have the staff now ) 

stalker seems bound by one on the level of his devotion to the orokin  

makes me wonder if tenno can utilize a geas factor on some things .. 

Just have to wait and see I guess. Though it certainly stands to reason that the Orokin had more ways to control the empire in some form on a very individual level if needs be.

[(XBOX)EternalDrk Mako]

14 minutes ago, Blakrana said:

Just have to wait and see I guess. Though it certainly stands to reason that the Orokin had more ways to control the empire in some form on a very individual level if needs be.

agreed 

 

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Edited July 3, 2017 by (XB1)EternalDrk Mako

[EndermanBeast]

57 minutes ago, (Xbox One)OTF SERENiTY said:

I imagine us having to track down a rogue Excalibur Umbra in the quest and try to tame it.

if that ever happened.... i already can see the memes coming

 

 

 

a wild Excalibur Umbra .... forgot the rest

Edited July 3, 2017 by EndermanBeast

[StrongMooscles]

Remember the war within? Yes? Well then you probably heard about a choice system (the black and/or white circle on the bottom left at your player profile) I think it has something to do with the Excalibur thing, the white choice could lead to Excalibur prime (not the frame itself, he won't be available) and even other primes, meanwhile the black choices represent the umbra's!

What do you think about this? What's your speculation?

I know what DE said and I know he isn't coming back! This is just speculation.

Edited July 3, 2017 by -Synovity-
Nobody understands my logic :'(

[bluepheonix13]

3 minutes ago, -Synovity- said:

the white choice could lead to Excalibur prime

It won't. And more generally, I don't think they will lock Warframes behind these choices.

[KirukaChan]

My speculation is that this is a thinly veiled "Bring back Excalibur Prime" thread and I'm pretty sure the answer is still no.