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Making Mag useful?


scndSON
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Hi, I am about 1.3k hours into this game now and I just try to find nice synergies and mechanics on unpopular Warframes and weapons to keep myself from getting burnt out (ya know, cause I love the game). Yesterday I looked through the frames to decide on which one I should do next. I took a closer look at Mag, her Augments, and there it was, Fracturing Crush. I had the idea to build her with just enough power strength to remove 100% armor and fill the rest with range mods and maybe a little duration. Pull enemies in, crush them to remove armor (like Banshee's 1 with her Augment, but in a 360 degree AoE) and CC them a bit; then nuke the whole group with an AoE weapon (I had the Lenz in mind).

Before I start building stuff I usually read the wiki article on the topic just to avoid complications due to bugs or weird interactions. I went through the article for Fracturing Crush and there it hit me:

  • The armor reduction is affected by Power Strength and cannot exceed 80% per cast.

I was wondering what could possibly be the reason for this limit. I couldn't find one. DE doesn't seem to have a problem with a whole squad running 4 CPs or armor removal from other abilities/augments (Ash's 1, Frost's 4, Banshee's 1, Oberon's 4 and probably a few more). So please, DE, leave the Augment as it is, but remove the 80% limit. I usually  don't see Mag being played outside of DPSing on Berehynia. This buff would make her useful in again, both in Solo and in Squads.

Thanks for reading :)

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To be honest deciding if a frame is useful or not just considering Berehynia is stupid, can we get rid of that mission?

Also, if her 3 can already remove armor, why not make that part of her scale better and get rid of the augment.

Edited by giovanniluca
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3 minutes ago, scndSON said:

she isn't really useful

She is good but her kit has fake functions, like the drop of orbs on kill on pull, which never happen because pull does not do enough damage and De does not want it to mark for death for some reasons, together with greedy pull it may fix mag energy problems so she does not have to rely on trinity or zenurik, also zenurik is getting changed.

The horrible passive Greedy &#!.

The bits generated by the 3 that you can't control in any way, why her 3 was nerfed like Nova 4 anyway, I just don't get it, we got this wave expansion for some reason and now that skill is not even lethal in most cases.

Crush is just unfitting.

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I've been using Mag a lot recently. The small changes they did to her (making her 3 castable while walking included) did a bit of increase in quality of life.

She is definetely good. However, I think that she lacks a few things, and that's my opinion on what needs to be improved:

  • She is too squishy and her mobility is bad. I'd prefer to have a high move speed like Nova has and keep it squishy. I need to run a running speed mod to keep alive, bullet jumping around.
  • Her passive is weird. I'd rather replace it or make it also suck in mobs with Bullet Jumps for knockdowns.
  • Her 1. It's really annoying to use right now, because mobs will be pulled to random directions and completely disturb you partners (yourself included). I would prefer it much more if the mobs landed at her front, as if they landed in an invisible wall at the palm of her hand. Alternatively, it could be a press and hold (something similar to how Hydroid works now), where mobs got attracted at the front of her with a cost over time. A Magnetic proc wouldn't be bad as well since, you know, the Warframe herself is called Mag.
  • Her 2 is fine. It is a lot strong and the AoE interaction is also good. I feel like the 2 + 4 interaction is somewhat weird tho.
  • Her 3 is good. However, she does need a bit more of scale on it to remove Shield and Armor at higher levels, since it barely scratches level 100+ mobs. A % based part in the calculator with Power Strength modulating it would solve the issue.
  • Her 4 is good as it is. As I said, the 2 + 4 interaction is weird tho.


And that's basically it. I don't feel like Mag needs a complete overhaul, just those changes to be more useful and easier to stay alive.

Edited by Karmaworks
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I play Mag as a nuke-buffer. The Magnetize is amazing Gunners, Techs, Bombard, Napalms and other extremely powerful enemies because they will usually kill themselves with their own weapons because of the Magnetize debuff/buff. Natural Talent isn't must but if you ever use the 4th Ability, Crush, you will need it because of how great CC-nuke it is combined with Magnetize. Do not copy this build unless you plan on using the Magnetize as your main Ability. This is no CC build really as it doesn't have more range and bad duration but it will deal a lot of damage and is capable for Solo Survival and Boss hunting.

c36130bd2f.jpg

This is my Mag Prime build. Yes, I know, I still don't have maxed out Redirection... or Primed Flow... There still are a few Warframes I need to Forma in order to max them out.

This is my usual build I run with because of the higher Shield capacity. The other two builds I have are just variations of this same build. The Strength has more Strength and less shields and the LoR has Range, Effiency and Strength. I use it only in Law of Retribution, as you have probably already guessed it.

Edited by Da_Atte
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I

On 8/19/2017 at 6:44 PM, scndSON said:

I have played this game for way too long... and post rework and outside of Berehynia I have probably seen her about 2 times. idk why it would, but it might be different on PS4

Semi-casual players on PS4 around 4300hrs in but I see Vanilla Mag in about 3/10 Random Mission Queues/Sorties when I do log on to play.

I see Mag more often than Nezha, WuKong, Atlas, Valkyr, Inaros, & Zephyr.(Funny but I believe I see Octavia the same amount as Mag from random groupings)

Thankfully for my preferred Melee gameplay, Mag doesn't make enemies unable to be pulled by Prolonged Paralysis or limit my attack range like Frost/Limbo/Hydroid.

 

That said: I strongly concur that there should not be an 80% Armor Cap on Fracturing Crush

 

Edited by (PS4)MrNishi
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Mag is one of the frames that everyone says is good, but I rarely see people using.

I wouldn't say she is strong, but she is mostly fine. She could use some survivability boost tho.

1st ability: it's ok. But I hope enemy don't fly around randomly when pulled.

2nd ability: my favorite one. A good way to prevent enemy from firing.

3rd and 4th  abilities: could use some tweaking in speed and scaling

Edited by yles9056
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6 hours ago, Windy_Wind said:

one of the big reason why many don't use her is her 3 and 4th ability do not scale or do anything interesting.

I believe her fracturing crush augment should just replace her current crush ability. Then she will have more scale ability with her 4. Her 3 is a beast and scales infinitely. 

Edited by (XB1)FCastle74
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4 hours ago, (PS4)RenovaKunumaru said:

I don't think Mag needs to 100% strip armor. 

Even with all of the enemies armor May can destroy them with Magnetize. Also, doesn't polarize stop armor as well?

These posts requesting mag buffs don't even make sense.

The opening post in this thread makes sense in regards to just asking Fracturing Crush augment to be limited to 80% with Powerstrength (Augment is 50% at base 100% Powerstrength).

That seems very reasonable in and of itself.

Currently I don't use the Augment because it doesn't scale well with Powerstrength and thus not worth the slot as I can slot something that further improves Polarized & Magentize.

This change to remove 80% cap on Augment would definitely make Mag easier to solo inside Void: since Polarize will not strip Armor unless Shields are depleted. Thus allowing Fracturing Crush to be a consistent Armor Strip against both Corrupted enemies that are both Shielded and Armored.

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16 minutes ago, (PS4)MrNishi said:

The opening post in this thread makes sense in regards to just asking Fracturing Crush augment to be limited to 80% with Powerstrength (Augment is 50% at base 100% Powerstrength).

That seems very reasonable in and of itself.

Currently I don't use the Augment because it doesn't scale well with Powerstrength and thus not worth the slot as I can slot something that further improves Polarized & Magentize.

This change to remove 80% cap on Augment would definitely make Mag easier to solo inside Void: since Polarize will not strip Armor unless Shields are depleted. Thus allowing Fracturing Crush to be a consistent Armor Strip against both Corrupted enemies that are both Shielded and Armored.

I don't think it's a bad thing that every Warframe isn't strong against every situation.

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Just now, (PS4)RenovaKunumaru said:

I don't think it's a bad thing that every Warframe isn't strong against every situation.

She still wouldn't be good for Solo defection, or against Infested. So she would still remain niche.

Just seems like a bias move by DE to limit her Armor removal on Augment.

Yet they buffed Abating Link Augment to be able to completely strip armor. Oberon can multi cast Reckoning for Armor removal.(Oberon is much better suited for Defection and dare I say more all-around than Mag). Then Frost Avalanche Armor Removal, or Ash Seeking Shuriken Armor removal.

Nekros Terrify  armor removal is limited by available Powerstrength, but not hard-capped like Fracturing Crush.

 

I understand it comes across like he is asking for a straight buff ability or augment buff, but I see it as asking for it to be balanced like other abilities in not having some arbitrary hard-capped implemented.

 

(Some could argue Enemy slow is unblanced where Nekros Creeping Terrify, Nova Molecular Prime, and Valkyr WarCry are limited to 75%, but Peaceful Provocation is 80%. Not to mention Frost/Atlas/Limbo/Stomp all exceeding 75% enemy slow to the degree of straight 100% animation lock)*

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Can we get one thing straight about Fracturing Crush? It isn't armour removal, at all. It's armor reduction, which is completely different. It reduces current armor like how viral reduces current health. It's still an overall boost to dps because it scales hard when enemies have more armor. Then you cast polarize which removes armor. 

And what does it matter which frames can do things? It's all the same result, what does it matter how it's done? That's why comparison arguments never work, they all achieve the same thing so it doesn't matter. 

Mag has loads of utility in her kit, but because she can't one shot a room anymore with her old cookie clicker builds, everyone dismisses her not realizing she can bring more than a damn bubble. 

You know what her real issues are?

- No shield gating

- Low energy pool

- A stupid meme that needs to end already.

Get informed and learn how mag works before you instantly dismiss her or just put her in a bubble build. She is a CC frame that just so happens to have some damage in her kit. Damage is not everything, utility has a place too. 

Edited by Sajochi
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