Why most people that start playing Warframe leave the next day.

[KillerXDIZ]

Recently i've got some friends to play Warframe, some even invested money in the game for platinum, but most of them left the game barely after starting. From 4 people only 1 stayed. All of them liked the core aspects of the game but the problems faced early made em leave the game. This sounds like a really big deal, a good introduction is very important.

I'm here to mention their biggest complaints about why they left the game.

The first one is that they felt completely lost after defeating Vor. They didn't know what to do or where to go. They didn't know how to do things. They didn't know why do things.

The biggest problem was with the mods. Most of the mods recieved during Vor tutorial missions are broken, but nowhere it's mentioned to the new player that broken mods are weakened versions of the original mods. Also the information about upgrading and interacting with mods is very limited or no-existant within the game. The only way to acquire knowledge about mods is either by acquiring it externally from the core game (Community, Wikipedia etc) or by experience (Test and Trial).

This feels absurdly ridiculous that even though mods are such a huge part of the game, there's not a single tutorial early on talking about them. This tutorial talking about Mods should already exist. The codex tutorial is awful, that small pieces of text barely teach players anything.

To keep people in the game, the tutorial needs more information and after defeating vor, more orientation. There needs to be a heavier movement tutorial also, most of them didn't know how to make most special moves, like bullet jump or air glide. The tutorial in Warframe in it's current state is lacking some very important content that players use constantly in every run.

Edit:

I'm not saying that the game needs to tell people everything they have to do, but that there's barely any information about mods in any moment in the tutorials even though it's a huge part of Warframe. The game shouldn't tell you where to go but to where you could go, because until Vor, you will be constantly sent in a straight sequence of missions and suddenly a star chart is in your face. This could be prevented if the Star Chart was used more directly from the beggining.

Edited September 28, 2017 by KillerXDIZ

[Teshin_Dax]

i agree on everything except the part about movement

[(PSN)CrimsonAxure]

Yeah, my friend only plays when i play

[Spartan336]

Movement is fine, but yeah. There really needs to be a better system in place. I only know how to use mods now because I looked it up online. I didn't know what most mods did, or how important they were in my early days because I didn't talk to people and played solo. 

[peger]

It's not only WF. People start playing "new" game, and after day or two they lose interest.

The first one is that they felt completely lost after defeating Vor. They didn't know what to do or where to go. They didn't know how to do things. They didn't know why do things.

Because today's players are too stupid (yes i said it, you can now lynch me) and expect the game will lead them by hand.

[Fiftycentis]

as above, the movement tutorial in the codex is nicely done, it teaches you what you need to move. All the other tutorials in the codex are a bit lackuster. But i also like warframe because it doesn't tell you everything, but you have to discover it by yourself (or read on the wiki for faster learning).
I'm not saying that the current system is fine, because it's not, but when i started i learne everything by myself with time and no problems, and we didn't had a tutorial like vor's prize, just a simple mission to select your starting waframe and weapons; so leaving for that reason imo it's wrong

Edited September 28, 2017 by Fiftycentis

[(XBOX)SgtFunBun]

1 minute ago, peger said:

Because today's players are too stupid (yes i said it, you can now lynch me) and expect the game will lead them by hand.

found the souls player

 

[KillerXDIZ]

7 minutes ago, Fiftycentis said:

as above, the movement tutorial in the codex is nicely done, it teaches you what you need to move. All the other tutorials in the codex are a bit lackuster. But i also like warframe because it doesn't tell you everything, but you have to discover it by yourself (or read on the wiki for faster learning).
I'm not saying that the current system is fine, because it's not, but when i started i learne everything by myself with time and no problems, and we didn't had a tutorial like vor's prize, just a simple mission to select your starting waframe and weapons; so leaving for that reason imo it's wrong

But that's also part of the problem, they need to go to the codex to get that tutorial and for that, they need to know that there's a tutorial there. That's why even if the movement tutorial in the codex is nicely done, it won't help because it's not mentioned it exists.

Edited September 28, 2017 by KillerXDIZ

[_Chizuru_]

I felt "kinda" lost, too, when I started, but then I noticed there's tutorial 8and enough of them) for all that stuff in the "Codex" right to the left in your ship. Most players never even notice this, but there's in fact a tutorial to each important aspect. Maybe you should recommend them to go back to WF (I mean, they even spent money on it without discounts, I'd assume) and just try all the Codex tutorials.

Best thing DE could do would be a message after Vor's Prize that pops up and tells you to check the Codex or that opens the Codex and brings you right away to the tutorial selection screen.

[Raskol]

What might be hard at begging is imo fun later on. I mean nobody's telling u what to do, where to go, u can do pretty much anything u want so here comes the aspect of exploring - its like i spent half or 1/3 my time with warframe on WF wiki to get to know the universe better, to check build, stats on weapons and so on and so on.

After all its pure blood MMO so hard begginings is like what its supposed to be...

Edited September 28, 2017 by Raskolnikow

[(XBOX)Spaztic Magic]

While WF does struggle with the tutorial experience, overall, I do not feel it is completely broken. I look at things a little differently, I suppose. Perhaps the lack of spoon-fed knowledge is by design? Think of it from an immersion standpoint: you just woke up from a hyper-sleep into a world of chaos and people trying to shoot you and odd voices telling you what to do and where to go and being limited in even that. So perhaps that lack of direct information from the very beginning is to help immerse the player in the "lost" feeling that the freshly awoken Warframe would feel in that situation.

If you were in that position how would you find out more about what was going on? You would talk to others that have been awake longer. You would consult sources of knowledge that have been compiled. You would also wander about learning by personal experience.

I admit that WF is not the most user friendly game out there. It does leave almost an absurd amount of information out of the game that is vital to playing effectively and depends far too heavily on more experienced players sharing said information effectively. However, I can't help but question if it isn't by design rather than ignorance or laziness.

[_Chizuru_]

There are still people who might need something they can start with as an orientation to approach the game they want. And a prompt (message) opening after completing Vor's Prize could be the best idea to guide them to their first lead or thing to guide them in the end.

[(PSN)JaysInc_]

The only reason why I've stayed so long for Warframe was probably due to my friend teaching me about the game mechanics, like modding.

[Fiftycentis]

at least warframe doesn't have a tutorial that teach you the wrong things watch lol tutorial

[StinkyPygmy]

I agree more or less, but DE has always been abysmal when it comes to explaining anything in WF. It's only in the last few years that we even got a tutorial type of introduction for new players and even then its mostly a case of "Here's a bit of hand holding. Now run along go killy killy for the lotus". It also sucks that even if new players manage to find the mod tutorials etc in game, they aren't very in depth and the most comprehensive guide and information comes from the community or the wiki.

The wiki is great, but you shouldn't HAVE to go there for any kind of detail on mostly basic information. That wasn't a big issue 4 years ago when WF had even less information about how things worked, but there was also no where near as much scope and complexity to the game.

All that being said, I do feel like sometimes people are expected to be spoon fed a little bit too much. I've run into plenty of cases where people have just been plain oblivious and acted like they never played a game in their life.

Edited September 28, 2017 by StinkyPygmy

[Sloan441]

23 minutes ago, KillerXDIZ said:

stuff

At a certain point, you can't hold peoples' hands anymore. They have to get out and do stuff on their own and learn how the game works.

This was my experience 4+ years ago. In my first week, the most glaringly apparent thing to me was I was going to need to get in a clan. This opens up a lot of resources, not least of which is finding some people that have an interest in helping their new members out--at least up to the point of them getting to know where to go to find stuff out and to field questions with obscure or complicated answers.

After this, well, you play and deal with problems as they occur. The primary motivator is to kill more and bigger things to get more and better stuff. I've played MMORPGs for over 15 years at this point and this is a given. It's expected. If you don't know or can't figure out something in particular, you can bet someone else had the same issue and the internet is best resource to find out what others in your position have done.  

And...that's it. If new players can't field the intestinal fortitude to go out and find what they need to progress, well, see yah. Others don't want to play your game for you. You should have enough motivation to explore and figure stuff out, or at least do a Google search. If you can't do that, then maybe this game isn't for you.

 

[Hemmo67]

young gamers have grown too used to been pandered to every little aspect they cannot function without tutorial on everything game has

kinda sad isn't it?

[tarfeef101]

37 minutes ago, KillerXDIZ said:

Recently i've got some friends to play Warframe, some even invested money in the game for platinum, but most of them left the game barely after starting. From 4 people only 1 stayed. All of them liked the core aspects of the game but the problems faced early made em leave the game. This sounds like a really big deal, a good introduction is very important.

I'm here to mention their biggest complaints about why they left the game.

The first one is that they felt completely lost after defeating Vor. They didn't know what to do or where to go. They didn't know how to do things. They didn't know why do things.

The biggest problem was with the mods. Most of the mods recieved during Vor tutorial missions are broken, but nowhere it's mentioned to the new player that broken mods are weakened versions of the original mods. Also the information about upgrading and interacting with mods is very limited or no-existant within the game. The only way to acquire knowledge about mods is either by acquiring it externally from the core game (Community, Wikipedia etc) or by experience (Test and Trial).

This feels absurdly ridiculous that even though mods are such a huge part of the game, there's not a single tutorial early on talking about them. This tutorial talking about Mods should already exist. The codex tutorial is awful, that small pieces of text barely teach players anything.

To keep people in the game, the tutorial needs more information and after defeating vor, more orientation. There needs to be a heavier movement tutorial also, most of them didn't know how to make most special moves, like bullet jump or air glide. The tutorial in Warframe in it's current state is lacking some very important content that players use constantly in every run.

1. Okay, that kinda makes sense. I mean, you have a star chart. naturally, you would think to progress through it. Guess not??? but sure, add some more direction here. 
2. Um... are your friends not very literate? what do they think broken means???  but yes, the codex should explain the modding system better. 
3. yeah, the tutorial quest should be a bit longer and detailed. better than people just going around being useless or just spamming questions as vets. cause while googling really isn't hard, it shouldn't be necessary for basic gameplay. 

[KillerXDIZ]

10 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Spaztic Magic said:

While WF does struggle with the tutorial experience, overall, I do not feel it is completely broken. I look at things a little differently, I suppose. Perhaps the lack of spoon-fed knowledge is by design? Think of it from an immersion standpoint: you just woke up from a hyper-sleep into a world of chaos and people trying to shoot you and odd voices telling you what to do and where to go and being limited in even that. So perhaps that lack of direct information from the very beginning is to help immerse the player in the "lost" feeling that the freshly awoken Warframe would feel in that situation.

If you were in that position how would you find out more about what was going on? You would talk to others that have been awake longer. You would consult sources of knowledge that have been compiled. You would also wander about learning by personal experience.

I admit that WF is not the most user friendly game out there. It does leave almost an absurd amount of information out of the game that is vital to playing effectively and depends far too heavily on more experienced players sharing said information effectively. However, I can't help but question if it isn't by design rather than ignorance or laziness.

I agree that the freedom Warframe gives is pretty nice, but the lack of information is punishing for new players. Some of them may invest their limited resources for bad weapons or broken mods or worse. That's one of the reasons i believe it's so important.

However i have to disagree when you mention that the lack of knowledge grants a better immersion, in-game the character that upgrades/craft/recycle mods is Ordis. Your Warframe (or Operator) never actually forges or reforges anything, Ordis does all the job in the ship. The only person that doesn't know how to these stuff is the actual player.

[xXRampantXx]

25 minutes ago, peger said:

Because today's players are too stupid (yes i said it, you can now lynch me) and expect the game will lead them by hand.

2 minutes ago, Hemmo67 said:

young gamers have grown too used to been pandered to every little aspect they cannot function without tutorial on everything game has

kinda sad isn't it?

I personally have to agree with these guys.  One of the main reasons I liked Warframe so much when I first started playing is because the tutorial was so bare-bones.  I had gotten sick of being treated like a moron by pretty much every other game I played that felt the need to explain every little detail of gameplay to me.  Go back and play almost any game before the mid-2000s and you'll fine that letting players figure things out for themselves used to be the standard, and personally I think it was better that way.

Now I will admit, in Warframe's case some more tutorials probably would be a good idea, but we don't need the level of "all gamers are stupid so we must shove every bit of information that exists in their faces" tutorial that many modern games use.

[KillerXDIZ]

29 minutes ago, Sloan441 said:

At a certain point, you can't hold peoples' hands anymore. They have to get out and do stuff on their own and learn how the game works.

This was my experience 4+ years ago. In my first week, the most glaringly apparent thing to me was I was going to need to get in a clan. This opens up a lot of resources, not least of which is finding some people that have an interest in helping their new members out--at least up to the point of them getting to know where to go to find stuff out and to field questions with obscure or complicated answers.

After this, well, you play and deal with problems as they occur. The primary motivator is to kill more and bigger things to get more and better stuff. I've played MMORPGs for over 15 years at this point and this is a given. It's expected. If you don't know or can't figure out something in particular, you can bet someone else had the same issue and the internet is best resource to find out what others in your position have done.  

And...that's it. If new players can't field the intestinal fortitude to go out and find what they need to progress, well, see yah. Others don't want to play your game for you. You should have enough motivation to explore and figure stuff out, or at least do a Google search. If you can't do that, then maybe this game isn't for you.

 

 

I'm not saying that the game needs to tell people everything they have to do, but that there's barely any information about mods in any moment in the tutorials even though it's a huge part of Warframe. I've never mentioned the game should tell you where to go but to where you could go, because until Vor, you will be constantly sent in a straight sequence of missions and suddenly a star chart is in your face. This could be prevented if the Star Chart was used more directly from the beggining.

Edited September 28, 2017 by KillerXDIZ

[-Temp0-]

51 minutes ago, peger said:

Because today's players are too stupid (yes i said it, you can now lynch me) and expect the game will lead them by hand.

No genius, wiki should not be required to being able to understand how to mod or when to go to progress in the starchat. There I said it. It's norma lto teach basics. Wf is horrible in it. I recently picked up Gigantic and in a short tutorial it explained probably 90% of game's mechanics that you need to know asap to start playing. It takes 5 minutes. Compared to WF it is. so. well . done. holy crp.

Also damaged mods shouldn't be a thing. They're just useless, period. The least you can do is to give new players normal serration and streamline or whatever Vor drops. Seriously it would not kill you DE.

Quote

I had gotten sick of being treated like a moron by pretty much every other game I played

Some developers are bad at making tutorials that's all. It doesn't mean they're useless or hurt anyone. And it's 2017, you can skip most if you want.

Quote

While WF does struggle with the tutorial experience, overall, I do not feel it is completely broken. I look at things a little differently, I suppose. Perhaps the lack of spoon-fed knowledge is by design?

Yeah and it's called crp design.

Considering that to this day even veteran players at times not sure does ability x do y or not because DE didn't bother to tell anything. I still remember all the arguing about if Frost's snowglobe stacks or not or if desecrate gives more credits. It's simply laziness and the lack of transparency.

Edited September 28, 2017 by -Temp0-

[ashrah]

they leave cz in general ppl are become very lazy all wish on plate...and without much or any effort to reach high

[Duduminador]

Slide, bullet jump, double jump, air roll, hold air glide and then air slide.

The reason why there is no tutorial explaining how to do the combo is because it's an exploit. Everybody exploits the game. It's not something that should have carried on. But the devs have to pander to the nobodies who think this is some sort of achievement.

Edited September 28, 2017 by Duduminador

[kgabor]

'Looks at sniper nerf rework changes'-that's why