Plains of Eidolon: Facts & Fundamentals of Focus 2.0

[(XBOX)Thraxiss]

23 minutes ago, Kaotyke said:

It doesnt mean anything at all on frames with 65 or 15 Armor.

Well think about it if you add 350 armored to the smallest armored frame that would mean you'd also had the same to the biggest armored frame. Still have the same result. Especially when you start stacking mods and arcanes. people will still play the bigger ones they just become more overpowered. What it needs to be is based off of the base stats if it's weaker and goes up by higher percent, where if it is stronger a lower one. Like it changes the warframes base armor to go to 400 regardless of what Warframe is being used.

[Kinetos]

41 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Thraxiss said:

Well think about it if you add 350 armored to the smallest armored frame that would mean you'd also had the same to the biggest armored frame. Still have the same result. Especially when you start stacking mods and arcanes. people will still play the bigger ones they just become more overpowered. What it needs to be is based off of the base stats if it's weaker and goes up by higher percent, where if it is stronger a lower one. Like it changes the warframes base armor to go to 400 regardless of what Warframe is being used.

Which is why he said 300 armor, not 300% armor. 

[Kamijisaca]

Focus 2.0 is for me a prime example of bad game design.

1) Raising the power and utility of the operator is nice (it seems only a marginal upgrade, but cant really comment without playing) but it doesn't address the biggest criticisms of operator game play: being clunky and breaking the flow of the game.

2) Making you go through hops and lops to get a timed bonus is just absurd. Can any one tell me why pushing a combination of buttons every 20-30 sec to do something in itself useless that breaks the flow of the game to get a bonus is a good thing? It seems to me if using the operator abilities was useful or fun people would use it without the need for the bonus to the warframe. The power level of this bonus would be pretty much the same if it where a passive and wouldn't impact the enjoyment of the game of any one.

3) Madurai school is another example poorly thought changes, you can get 25% increase to all damage, which is worst than the 90% extra damage divided by all basic damage types, but this isn't the real problem, Madurai was a great enabler of status builds, you could make it a 100% increase to damage and the game would still be poorer because its just a damage buff and not an ability that opens game-play options.

 

I can't forget the atrocious HUD and UI changes, the same bugs year after year, that the tile sets aren't revisited so you don't get stuck on ridiculous places, the needless nerfs on a PVE game that most of the time lead to less diversity, the hema research cost, the systematic increase in grind, RNGivens that are just a cash grab and not a fix, not having a proper tutorial so new players don't go away, etc, etc... and now focus 2.0.

Is this something that will make me or the vast majority of player leave the game, NO. But it is at least for me one less straw till the camel back brakes.

 

DE has a lot of talent, does amazing things, and created and maintain a great that is Warframe, It's a pity they make so many questionable design decisions.

At the end of the day it's there game and money maker, and its up to them to do what they think is best, and to us to react as we see fit. 

 

These are my 2 cents on the matter, can only hope they aren't totally worthless.

[(XBOX)Thraxiss]

1 hour ago, Kinetos said:

Which is why he said 300 armor, not 300% armor. 

I did not say 300%. Add 300 armor to anything, and your mods will increase that regardless of the frame

[Kaotyke]

5 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Thraxiss said:

I did not say 300%. Add 300 armor to anything, and your mods will increase that regardless of the frame

I see.

But I still believe DR would be better, because it effects shields as well.

[Kinetos]

14 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Thraxiss said:

I did not say 300%. Add 300 armor to anything, and your mods will increase that regardless of the frame

Oh it's before mods? I had been thinking after. 

11 minutes ago, Kaotyke said:

But I still believe DR would be better, because it effects shields as well.

This. All the armor buffs ever don't help shield frames. 

[El_Chino]

13 hours ago, Kaotyke said:

Considering the recent Naramon changes... I can actually see this working.

Channeling consumes energy when its active instead of per hit... but that would be good to have in general instead of just a school. But its a nice idea.

Oh yeah, I was talking in general! and add another bonnus to that school, or keep it I don't know... Having the passive will free you of one mod slot on the weapon afterall. But yeah, hope channeling becomes something viable someday... Looks cool.

[El_Chino]

9 hours ago, saradonin said:

but forgive me for not being excited in utilizing Operator mode. Is it still WarFrame?

It is, lol... You start the game knowing about nothing of the guy you play as. You wonder how different frames suit you, or if there's actually somebody/something inside those... You progress and discover you were sleeping all along, and that those frames are just your tools of war. Sure after that more is revealed and added to the tenno lore, but warframes aren't left behind! In many points, on many quests, entities imply stuff about the warframes, makes you want to know more about them at the same time you wanna know more about the tenno. And the next quest, the one revealing Umbra, will be focused on warframes rather than tenno, for all we know till now. So, yeah... Warframes are still the main theme of the game, operators are there just to fundament em. You won't ever play a mission as only your operator, but as you progress, your operator becomes less of a child and more of a warrior, capable of using his own power to aid and add to their own warframe in battle, but just that, support. You play with the warframes you choose to bring to each particular mission! They are the ones carrying the real weaponery to battle.

[(XBOX)Thraxiss]

Madurai. when D.E says 25% increase to damage, do they mean everything. Not the just the Guns but the powers as well ? Like how Ember has Elemental fire damage. Or like Atlas has physical damage. Does anyone know?

[Nar_Sie]

1 minute ago, (Xbox One)Thraxiss said:

Madurai when D.E says 25% increase to damage do they mean everything. Not the Guns but the powers as well ? Like how Ember has Elemental fire damage. Or like Atlas has physical damage. Does anyone know?

Most likely. We'll find out when it releases.

[FierceDeityLinkMask]

IT'S COMING OUT TODAY! CONFIRMED!

[OniDax]

4 minutes ago, FierceDeityLinkMask said:

IT'S COMING OUT TODAY! CONFIRMED!

Eh... Is that actually true?

 

EDIT: Oh, I see it now! Nice.

[(XBOX)Thraxiss]

Good luck PC. Hope for the best, prepare for the worst. Lol

[BornWithTeeth]

24 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Thraxiss said:

Good luck PC. Hope for the best, prepare for the worst. Lol

We are proud to jump on the glitch grenade for our console brethren.

[phoenix1992]

Just now, BornWithTeeth said:

We are proud to jump on the glitch grenade for our console brethren.

No we are not :D

[GrimR3APER]

On 10/10/2017 at 12:39 PM, letir said:

The only "lame" thing is your thinking process.

Yes, Operators should be strong by default, because it's end-game system for veterans with best weapon and builds. They should be competetive right now, not after hours of grind and some mandatory equpement.

No, definition of "band-aid" are not tied to your definition "COOL ARMOR, WEAPON AND ARCANES". These and that are totally separated things.

Alright I'll ignore the fact that you didn't pay attention to anything that post actually said and get right to the point:

NO to everything you just said, it literally made me feel dumb reading that reply.

If your argument is "operators need to be good now instead of after I do quests and level them!" Then that's just pure stupid laziness. Why on Earth would they just make them good INSTEAD of add quests and other systems to do it? Either add more content or buff them out right, if you knew DE you would know they will always try to add more content, and hopefully in turn more value, to whatever update and system they introduce.

OPERATORS ARE NOT EQUAL TO WARFRAMES. Get it out of your head that they need to compete with them on any level other than raw power, kid, because that's just a hopelessly stupid idea.

And lastly, my definition of "band-aid" was never tied to "COOL ARMOR, WEAPON AND ARCANE". I'm arguing that adding warrior mode, eidolon Hunter operator focused quests/story, and new focus and weapon changes DOES NOT tie in to being a band-aid at all! I'm saying it makes more sense to change operators this way than the way you want! If they just gave operators mod slots and mods to upgrade them, then THAT would be a band-aid, but adding the weapons, armor, and arcanes from cetus quests and eidolon hunting (you know, the stuff this update is focused on) to do it instead is completely different from being a band-aid.

[Tritton51]

You can send the link to the confirmation please?

[GrimR3APER]

Just now, Tritton51 said:

You can send the link to the confirmation please?

 

[FierceDeityLinkMask]

Just now, Tritton51 said:

You can send the link to the confirmation please?

 

[Tritton51]

Thank you people :D

[Kaotyke]

I must do something. I must find something to occupy my mind!

[Azamagon]

On 2017-10-10 at 11:44 PM, Archwizard said:

-snip-

NARAMON

• Yup, it just makes sense.
• No clue of Operator abilities are silent, really. But if not, then I'd still push this idea
• Ah, ok. Well, I don't think it's necessary for the Operator to be able to perform finishers. But benefitting from the stealth-damage-multiplier would be nice at least.

VAZARIN

• Which is why I suggested it should reflect damage + be boosted by Mirror Flare :)
  Vazarin's Magnetic Blast being called Tidal Force sounds good enough for me *shrugs*
• Alrightie.

UNAIRU

• Coolio.
• Yeah, that's a good point. But the asymmetry, even if removing armor from Grineer, is still incredibly vast.
• Glad you like it!
• Eh, depends (as said above). Honestly, I am not all too strongly promoting the swap of them anyway *shrugs*
• "... Unless we decided to add a Rage effect to it."
  Hmmm... now we're talking! I'd definitely consider that. Might be broken with Void Mode itself though, no? Or what did you have in mind?
• Yeah, the Chrysalis "Skin" is like an extra guard so you aren't ONLY safe while in Void Mode, but a bit so outside of it as well. With your Void Flare, it'd actually pair very well, in fact: Get aggro with Void Flare, then also become able to continue to tank that aggro outside Void Mode with the skin built up from Void Chrysalis.

ZENURIK

"The best thing they could do for that would be to improve Operator energy capacity baseline, and reduce the benefit of Zenurik's."
That would help too.

Just saying, even if an occassional skill would be better balanced if it came with an energycost penalty (like your Shadow Blast), you and I both know that DE is not exactly known for their balancing skills, so I'd rather they simply removed energycost penalties in general to make it more "fair" (I mean, look at at Naramon's two Void Mode upgrades...)

MADURAI

"... Actually come to think of it, what if Madurai gained a damage buff from being hit while in Void Mode, like Vex Armor? It would provide them with some semblance of natural damage scaling. Might overlap a bit with Unairu trying to tank hits for everyone..."

If adding this I would be ok with it. And nah, it doesn't promote tanking (considering Madurai has nothing outside of Void Mode to tank with, unlike Unairu), so it fits well for sure.

[letir]

Just now, GrimR3APER said:

1) If your argument is "operators need to be good now instead of after I do quests and level them!" Then that's just pure stupid laziness. Why on Earth would they just make them good INSTEAD of add quests and other systems to do it? Either add more content or buff them out right, if you knew DE you would know they will always try to add more content, and hopefully in turn more value, to whatever update and system they introduce.

2) OPERATORS ARE NOT EQUAL TO WARFRAMES. Get it out of your head that they need to compete with them on any level other than raw power, kid, because that's just a hopelessly stupid idea.

3) And lastly, my definition of "band-aid" was never tied to "COOL ARMOR, WEAPON AND ARCANE". I'm arguing that adding warrior mode, eidolon Hunter operator focused quests/story, and new focus and weapon changes DOES NOT tie in to being a band-aid at all! I'm saying it makes more sense to change operators this way than the way you want! If they just gave operators mod slots and mods to upgrade them, then THAT would be a band-aid, but adding the weapons, armor, and arcanes from cetus quests and eidolon hunting (you know, the stuff this update is focused on) to do it instead is completely different from being a band-aid.

1) Why on the Earth I should spend so much time and effort to grind my Operator into something playable, when my Warframe and arsenal alredy can deal with any problem? I alredy spend hours on mods, resources, Void Keys, Relics, Sorties etc. to bring my frame to power, now I need grind even more to play as weakling?

2) If they aren't frames power-wise, then they aren't necessary. They are annoying, their development uninteresting, their looks are "decent" at max, their voicelines is complete failure,

3) If they trying to fix core game problems - like energy regeneration - with external solutions, then they making band-aids.

Making Operator's movement and control better is example of good solution.

Making special "something" to boost pitiful health, armor, energy reserves? Band-aid.

[GrimR3APER]

1 hour ago, letir said:

1) Why on the Earth I should spend so much time and effort to grind my Operator into something playable, when my Warframe and arsenal alredy can deal with any problem? I alredy spend hours on mods, resources, Void Keys, Relics, Sorties etc. to bring my frame to power, now I need grind even more to play as weakling?

2) If they aren't frames power-wise, then they aren't necessary. They are annoying, their development uninteresting, their looks are "decent" at max, their voicelines is complete failure,

3) If they trying to fix core game problems - like energy regeneration - with external solutions, then they making band-aids.

Making Operator's movement and control better is example of good solution.

Making special "something" to boost pitiful health, armor, energy reserves? Band-aid.

Unfortunately for you operators were introduced and are here to stay. DE wants them to mean something so they are going to work on developing them. The discussion here isn't whether you like them or not, it's about what DE wants to do with them. They aren't warframes so they have to be developed differently, you can't just slap a mod on them like a Warframe and they won't just buff them because they want to introduce new mechanics to flush them out. Stop complaining about how inconveniencing it is for you to make them powerful, they are suppose to be powerful in ways warframes aren't and if they are weaker in one way doesn't mean they are useless.

Instead of whining about having to go grind for one more thing in THIS game, talk about ways to fix it. And a simple "give buff make gameplay betterer" won't cut it. Unfortunately for you making gameplay mechanics isn't as simple as you want, if the developer just buffed everything that wasn't as strong as something else instead of adding new mechanics nothing would be good and nothing would matter. It's just not how you make a game.

[letir]

Just now, GrimR3APER said:

Unfortunately for you operators were introduced and are here to stay. DE wants them to mean something so they are going to work on developing them. The discussion here isn't whether you like them or not, it's about what DE wants to do with them. They aren't warframes so they have to be developed differently, you can't just slap a mod on them like a Warframe and they won't just buff them because they want to introduce new mechanics to flush them out. Stop complaining about how inconveniencing it is for you to make them powerful, they are suppose to be powerful in ways warframes aren't and if they are weaker in one way or doesn't mean they are useless.

Instead of whining about having to go grind for one more thing in THIS game, talk about ways to fix it. And a simple "give buff make gameplay betterer" won't cut it. Unfortunately for you making gameplay mechanics isn't as simple as you want, if the developer just buffed everything that wasn't as strong as something else instead of adding new mechanics nothing would be good and nothing would matter. It's just not how you make a game.

"DE wants" and "players wants" can be two very different things. Considering that games usually maked for players...

This thread was mostly devoted to ideas about improvement of Focus and Operators. You just cannot see it, because "COOL ARMORS" and "this is not how you fix the game".