Focus is still 'meh' at the best

[Terrornaut]

9 hours ago, Ardhanarishvara said:

Naramon is less for channeling builds and more for melee-focused builds, especially with Weeping Wounds or Blood Rush, though you can still do Life Strike shenanigans with it - I do on Saryn with Primed Flow, Quick Thinking, Rage and Vitality. If you wanna go full channel, that's Zenurik since it'll let you scrape off an extra efficiency mod, or make up for the efficiency loss of channel bonus mods like Life Strike. Note that Zaws also have Exodias that give energy regain on channel kills (not much, but enough to help recoup the cost of channeling). Naramon's dash, by the way, opens enemies up to repeated finishers permanently. Cloned Flesh is weak to heat damage. Flash Accelerant to stun and gain heat damage, force the finisher, then start using furax of all weapons and just enjoy the glorious pain you inflict on heavies.

Vaz's shielding is... iffy. Wouldn't recommend. You lose your energy instantly. Vaz is for maintenance - you can hop out and dash through your own 'frame to heal it while it's invulnerable or otherwise protected by 90% damage reduction.

Thanks for the info.  And yeah, I was going Unairu for the armor stripping but now I'm wondering whether stripping about 90% armor off under 2 sec and then melting enemies with Ember will be more efficient than just using naramon finishers, being invuln while doing them, and going ahead while getting melee focus xp boost.

So Naramon's dash will put enemies into finisher states permanently? They are basically just turned into statue dummies? It doesn't wear off? o_o

Zen's energy boost I have, though its not always enough to kill at a good pace even with 200% channeling damage and channeling down to 1e/hit.  Majority of non specialty channel mods (ie Dispatch Overdrive) are just bad. Even if I was working a channeling build at some point, there's no way I'd use life strike now between Healing Return or Magus Elevate (don't have it yet but woooweee).

Good to know about Vaz. Wasn't planning on it but it sounded cool.  It sounds just like channel blocking which is meh.

I generally can't justify PF/QT/R/V because its just so many mods that take away from utility/staying alive by killing fast and all around.  The setup works, but, its just too hungry.

14 minutes ago, Ardhanarishvara said:

Personally, I feel that y'all are confusing Warrior-Operator with Focus. The two mingle, sure, but they're not the same thing. The Plains of Eidolon and Eidolon Hunting to improve amps, provide armour and add arcanes is not the same thing as Focus, although it surely does synergize with it.

It makes sense that hunting Eidolons would primarily give content that is most useful for hunting Eidolons. It makes Operator do better at the rest of the game but they're not going to just steamroll everything immediately; just because it doesn't right away do particularly well against the game's toughest faction's toughest members doesn't mean it's not still decent. There's ways to combat that. Heck, a video came out showing a pure operator team against Law of Retribution, the Grineer raid.

Focus 2.0, when looked at separately from the Warrior-Operator, is good. Every school has something. Multiple somethings in some cases, which couldn't really be said before. Not to the same degree. It gives a lot more reasons to use the Operator in every day gameplay, not because it's forced, but because it's useful. A few examples have already been cited in this thread.

Can you post a link to that? It'd be cool to see and I have no doubt its possible. 

New Focus system is good for the most part (well a hell of a lot better than before), just the grind time is horrid.  I'm going to have to farm for plat/get a good riven to trade just to afford a 30 day affinity boost so I can hit the daily focus cap and still actually have some time to play the game.

[DeltaPangaea]

The fact that the only way-bounds are operator only means there's little use in using the system beyond two nodes for people who hate Operators.

And some of those nodes vary WILDLY in usefulness.

Still nothing to make Void Spines less garbage, DE? It's a known problem.

[(PSN)Deadlinked]

Just quit Warframe due to focus 2 .0, the old focus tree is better, you can't release a gaming mechanic, then scrap it and force players to play a certain way, i will buck and quit playing your game at all.In all they need to give players the option to use the old focus system or the new, in all i refuse to be forced into playing a operator at all period. Give me my energy regain focus tree back stick that gimpy operator permanently on your ship for good. Its useless

[AbstractLemons]

I think if they use focus as having a 'second class' ingame ypu can swap to at the pish of a button wpuld make opwrators more beneficial in general play.

 

Or at least thats what i thought the concept of 2.0 was going to be.

[Sasuda]

On 11/10/2017 at 10:06 AM, Tangent-Valley said:

Focus 2.0's problem is simply this:

It wants to be "What's after MR 30?" End-game level Grind and Reward......It's got the Grind part down, but not the Reward.
 

But if it gives the Reward, then it's unfair for Newer Players/ Pre-Second Dream + War Within Players.

 

But if it removes the Grind it's no longer "What's after MR 30" End-Game content.

 

It wants its Cake, and to eat it too. But it can't. So it's in a Tug-of-War with itself, and is an unbalanced mess of "Inbetween-ness".

 

EDIT just in case: I love Operators, and I want to see them grow and become better.....but for the most part, Focus 2.0 is just too painful sometimes to deal with. (I deal with it anyway, when I feel up to it, so to better my little star-child....but those moments are starting to come more rarely, and I'm starting to feel that I should just be content with my +30% running Speed on all Schools and stop trying past that for the time being)

This is why Warframe needs a new, smarter lobby system more than anything. Then vets can be vets and beginners can be beginners. It's been screwing every new system the devs introduce for so long. Then they also don't have to give a crap about having new stuff be stronger, because they can just make more content to bring stronger stuff to and make the game have some linear progression while retaining a mostly open-ended solar map.

[(PSN)mahoshonenfox]

I prefer the operators have more abilities that directly support Warframes instead of just dealing damage. Executing Dash permanently opens enemies to melee finishers. I can also quickly pop the operator out and do a void blast that CCs enemies and permanently disarms them. The other operator abilities either don't scale very well or can be simulated with consumables like restore pads or whatever. I wish DE would make the other abilities have decent scaling too.

[(PSN)MrNishi]

My take as playing with MrNishi MR24 4470hrs and enough Focus to have 2 Waybounds added 

and FRAGORPRlME (MR14 about 160hrs)

 

The Grind with Focus 2.0 is still crazy.

At least let base Focus cap be 250,000 and then let each MR Level increase daily Cap by 50,000.

•Doing the above and doubling the  affinity modifiers would go work greatly as to alleviate grinding?

(Current focus grinding with Affinity Booster feels like the proper amount progression)

 

I would have liked a 3rd Default Way (Focus) that allowed some of the Focus 1.0 hold for Transferrable buff. 

•I think that this would allow new players that do not have access to quill and players that dislike Operator play to be able to have a fixed Cooldown Focus Buff ability that applied buffs like in Focus 1.0

Making that non-Quill related will let players that are new have a better Focus reward as they are still progressing through the game.

Cross loadout shared affinity needs a long over due tweak, although I'm not sure how DE would balance affinity.

•AW affinity in Submerisble/PoE missions is atrocious and now Operator Amp affinity is the same

•Would be nice if even a 10th of normal affinity would splash over to AW/AMP. Alleviating players from needing to be in Operator or AW to actually gain useful affinity. (Spy hacking as the Operator isn't too bad)*

 

Lastly, 2nd Dream and War Within portrayed my Operator as extremely powerful:

•Able to still move Warframe while not being linked or inside it.

•No longer needing Transference Amplification to link with Warframe.

•Ability to leave Warframe in another Tileset/Mission/Planet and return back to the Orbiter (I wish I could go back and check Foundry mid-mission)(Wondering if we will have the opportunity to leave certain Warframes in missions like Zanuka hunt. Where that loadout is locked until that mission is completed.)

Definitely felt the Operator was more powerful than Warframe due to Quest Cutscenes.

If all Way points could be unbound: I would definitely feel OP as Operator after the lengthy grinding. Since Focus seems like our Operator/Amp Mod system. (I'm guessing more Unbound Ways will come as the game progresses)

 

Edited November 16, 2017 by (PS4)MrNishi

[Terrornaut]

7 hours ago, (PS4)mahoshonenfox said:

I prefer the operators have more abilities that directly support Warframes instead of just dealing damage. Executing Dash permanently opens enemies to melee finishers. I can also quickly pop the operator out and do a void blast that CCs enemies and permanently disarms them. The other operator abilities either don't scale very well or can be simulated with consumables like restore pads or whatever. I wish DE would make the other abilities have decent scaling too.

Ty for this. Been looking forward to seeing it and honestly wondering if its going to be more useful than stripping 90% armor on targets.  So much grind required to test a damn build that may be either cataclysmically destructive, or ineffective vs other options.