How to end-game with non-stealth?

[(PSN)Ozymandias-13-]

I've mained Ash, primarily, since 2013 through all of his iterations. I'm also melee oriented when playing him because he is build to benefit from that style, but one thing I've learned over these years is that if you want to be a "legendary player" you need to be able to switch to any frame and any weapon needed to get the job done. Melee only will not always be an option. Sometimes you just need to fire that Dread arrow into somethings face from far away.

I have every frame, and play most of them regularly despite having my preferences just to keep things fresh and keep up my skills depending on what the team may need or the Sortie conditions may be. When it comes to survivability, honestly, control is probably more important in high level content than just having the ability to not die. Also, enemy scaling is just as broken as Warframe Invisibility so there will always be the point you'll reach where things just can't go any further. Just pick a Frame you are interested in and practice using it in high level content. Look up decent builds for it if you need to, and use the wiki...It will tell you everything about a Warframe's ability that the game won't tell you and can make a drastic difference in how you play that frame.

[(PSN)Radehx]

2 hours ago, phoenix1992 said:

I am sorry, the case of "can't die if enough stacks" is totally cheese.

Why? You actually have to work for it. 

Saying it's cheese is akin to claiming Equinox's maim is cheese.

[phoenix1992]

1 minute ago, (PS4)Radehx said:

Why? You actually have to work for it. 

Saying it's cheese is akin to claiming Equinox's maim is cheese.

You actually have to work for upkeeping your invisibility or invulnerability with other frames as well.

If you can't spot the cheese in a frame that has HP regen (not tied to Energy), extreme scaling, benefits from Rage and has free continue...

[(PSN)Radehx]

Just now, phoenix1992 said:

You actually have to work for upkeeping your invisibility or invulnerability with other frames as well.

If you can't spot the cheese in a frame that has HP regen (not tied to Energy), extreme scaling, benefits from Rage and has free continue...

You have to do very little work to keep up stealth with Ivara...but yes, other frames make you work for benefits too, just like you have to work to get stacks with Nidus. 

Cheese is something like CL daggers or sitting in a corner teabagging with Octavia...not having to build stacks to get the scaling/tank for Nidus. Both of those things take waaaaaaaaaaaay less effort than building stacks. Hell, slowing stuff with Nova takes less effort too...are you calling that cheese too?

[phoenix1992]

Just now, (PS4)Radehx said:

You have to do very little work to keep up stealth with Ivara...but yes, other frames make you work for benefits too, just like you have to work to get stacks with Nidus. 

Cheese is something like CL daggers or sitting in a corner teabagging with Octavia...not having to build stacks to get the scaling/tank for Nidus. Both of those things take waaaaaaaaaaaay less effort than building stacks. Hell, slowing stuff with Nova takes less effort too...are you calling that cheese too?

"oh no Octavia and Ivara are that doing that one thing, so in comparison nothing else can ever be called cheesing"

 

[Antiphoton]

The only endgame doesn't involve stealth, quite the opposite: purchase a ton of cosmetics, color palletes and animations, stand in the middle of Larunda and start telling everyone how gorgeous you are. You may also want to participate in fashionframe contests, depending on who organizes them.

[(PSN)Radehx]

2 minutes ago, phoenix1992 said:

"oh no Octavia and Ivara are that doing that one thing, so in comparison nothing else can ever be called cheesing"

 

I think it's you missing the point if you believe building stacks is just as low effort as getting perma stealth with Ivara or just sitting in a corner teabagging with Octavia ;)

I run almost nothing but long survival runs, and Ivara/Ash/Octavia are all less effort than Nidus.

Edited November 14, 2017 by (PS4)Radehx

[phoenix1992]

1 minute ago, (PS4)Radehx said:

I think it's you missing the point if you believe building stacks is just as low effort as getting perma stealth with Ivara or just sitting in a corner teabagging with Octavia ;)

I run almost nothing but long survival runs, and Ivara/Ash/Octavia are all less effort than Nidus.

I think you keep on nagging about something that was never the point.
Did I every say that invisible (and invulnerable) set ups are hard or not cheesy? 
Your argument is hard work (as much as can be applied for Nidus) is not equal to cheesing mechanics. Even though the "cheese" was always in the ability to nullify mechanics like the enemy scaling and one shots after a certain point.

Keep up the hard work, forum warrior.

[(PSN)Radehx]

3 minutes ago, phoenix1992 said:

I think you keep on nagging about something that was never the point.
Did I every say that invisible (and invulnerable) set ups are hard or not cheesy? 
Your argument is hard work (as much as can be applied for Nidus) is not equal to cheesing mechanics. Even though the "cheese" was always in the ability to nullify mechanics like the enemy scaling and one shots after a certain point.

Keep up the hard work, forum warrior.

Nothing Nidus does "nullifies" enemy scaling...he simply keeps up a bit longer. It's not like a CL dagger with endless scaling...

As for the forum warrior thing...the irony is strong in your posts, look into a mirror. Also, your condescending tone makes you sound like a massive twat who lives in his mom's basement ;)

Edited November 14, 2017 by (PS4)Radehx

[(PSN)Silverback73]

23 hours ago, FumezSunca said:

Nyx with Chaos Sphere and Assimilate augments?

You can literally face-tank Sentients and other high-level enemies with Assimilate Nyx.

Ice Chroma is quite tough.

Equinox is a secret weapon.

There are lots of options...

It comes down to this:

Don't get hit.

 

 

Edited November 14, 2017 by (PS4)Silverback73

[Ventura_Highway]

Show me your melee builds and I will show you what you can improve.

Edited November 14, 2017 by Ventura_Highway

[phoenix1992]

36 minutes ago, (PS4)Radehx said:

Nothing Nidus does "nullifies" enemy scaling...he simply keeps up a bit longer. It's not like a CL dagger with endless scaling...

As for the forum warrior thing...the irony is strong in your posts, look into a mirror. Also, your condescending tone makes you sound like a massive twat who lives in his mom's basement ;)

Dear forum warrior, 

You have been bestowed this tittle upon successfully committing the following logical fallacies :

1. Misrepresenting arguments :  Original argument of the postings was and still is "a certain Frame has a certain tool kit outside of mods and additional gear that allows for cheesing". The argument was never in the context of action for action (as your remark considering Nova), additional gear and mods. As you are most likely aware, mister forum warrior there is only one frame that has automatic "free revive" cast that is not attached to mods.

2. Confusing opinion for fact : Your personal opinion and how much you interject it does not turn it into truth. "Cheese" is referred using multiple methods that bypass gameplay mechanics. Invisibility is a cheese, invulnerability is one and so is other any mechanic that allows you to bypass game elements. If you are not able to comprehend how the "Nidus" warframe is ignoring mechanics in the survival 1 hour mark (which was the context), you are either showing lack of information, experience or common sense. 

3. Base related fallacy :  Making a probability judgment based on conditional probabilities, example "Ivara with Covert Lethality takes less skills than upkeeping stacks", ignoring the fact that the actions per minute for performing a stealth kill with Ivara (in the context of Mot over 1 hour) and pressing an ability button is entirely subjective when it comes down to the person performing the action -  actions per minute is a thing.  If for you, dear forum warrior landing a skill shot is hard, you have my condolences.

4. Taking arguments out of context : Tied to the "misrepresentation".  If A is 2, B is 1 and C is 0, that does not mean that in comparison B is 0 as well. 

Have a good evening mister Forum Warrior.

PS: My personal occupation (designated as twat) or place of living (designated as my mother's basement) have nothing to do with your failure when it comes down to using arguments in order to defend a statement. Especially when you are the person that initiated the argument to begin with.