Can we talk about Trinity? [Trinity ideas discussion]

[Angelid]

TL;DR: I am talking about ideas for changes to make Trinity feel better to play and feel more rewarding to use. Please leave any ideas/feedback in comments. I will take some good ones and add them to this post, if the idea seems fun or highly rated, giving credit to those who say it (and possibly adding my own bits to it for the sake of clairity or otherwise readability. TL;DR's will be emboldened from here on out.


I have been playing this game since the beta days. Since then, I have played almost every warframe a decent amount, to the point that I can understand how well their kits work. And throughout all of the warframes, there's still one that doesn't work as well as all the others, even with augments. (I still have the base Trinity as my most used frame at 14.3% currently as per my profile in game, even though I haven't had base Trin since the day of her Prime release (yes, I paid 140 bucks for her prime access)).

Now, before you get on my case about how useful Trinity still is (I agree she is still useful in some most cases), I feel like there is a number of issues with her that holds her back for most of the game, having two basic builds for her currently:

1.) Blessing / Link: High Power Strength and Duration, giving up to 75% damage reduction to your team (Based on healing amount? Not sure if this is still true, as my own testing proves this false and gives the damage reduc based on Pow Str) and up to 92.5% to herself with the added (multiplicitavely?) 75% Damage Reduc from her Link. (Bonus points for the Link augment reducing enemy armor to those she's linked to)

2.) Energy Vampire: Her EV build is usually based around her Augment for it (That gives shields to her allies and over-shields if it's full), as well as giving everyone in range a huge amount of energy. This is fine and dandy, except those who used to benefit from it no longer gets it (most people with toggles, IE Mesa's 4, Banshee's 4, Valkyr's 4) except after they run out and/or turn off the toggle.

There are also some good niche builds, such as Health Conversion/Augment for her 1, which gives her a ton of (flat) armor for a limited time.

TL;DR: Trinity is still useful and pretty powerful... Just bear with me as I rant for a moment about the issues I have as a Trinity main for a looooong time.

Now that that's out of the way:
(Long paragraphs, skip this spoiler for the TL;DR)

Spoiler

 

1.) Trinity isn't rewarding to play. Even the ability for her to get a 'stronger' Damage Reduction based on amount healed for allies has been removed for some time now (meaning regardless of how much she heals, they always get the max damage reduction up to a hard camp of 75% dictated by her power strength of 150% or more). She just spams her abilities and hopes for the best, without a good way to actually shed damage that she used to have long ago. Her link gives her 75% damage reduction to herself, damage going to enemies around her. With both of those at max, she herself has a 92.5% damage reduction. That sounds pretty good, until you remember that she has almost no armor (15 base, even as a prime she has 15, the ONLY PRIME with that low of armor (in fact the only prime with only one stat modified over their original, which is +50 shields)), unless you are running a Health Conversion build. To put this into respect to other frames: Nyx's ult (with augment can move around) gives her complete damage mitigation (see: Invulnerability), and can use that to deal a damaging burst when she releases it. Mind you, Nyx has 15 armor at base because she's a castor. Not a big deal, but the prime has 50-- more than triple the armor value. (this isn't the only case either. There are tanks that can have much higher armor values and can heal others perhaps not all at once, but are far more efficient at it, those being Oberon, Nidus, and Inaros. Other castor frames, at least as primes, have at least 50 armor-- but no, not Trinity).
(TL;DR: She isn't rewarded for being played well, instead being punished for being played poorly.)

2.) She isn't fun to play. Going back to the Damage reduction on her ult, she no longer has a 'skill' of timing her ult to get the best possible damage reduction. The flavor-text in the game still says it does, but this is incredibly untrue. The augments are the only things that gives SOME of the rewards (killing an enemy with her Well of Life on them with the augment gives health orbs and a chance for an energy orb, Link gives armor reduction to up to three enemies, and her Energy Vamp augment gives her and her allies over-shields). But the rewards are lost due to how nearly useless it is to have these, especially in a highly mobile run and gun shooter game on a frame that is meant to support and heal her team. Sure, she can kill the three enemies she's tethered to with Link more easily, but it's a short range and standing in a group of enemies with high amount of armor (see: Grineer) can kill her very quickly if she's all alone. Even if she uses her 4 to save herself, her damage reduction only goes from 75% to 92.5%. It isn't that great of a leap when the levels of enemies get over 100+, as well as the number of enemies escalating the longer you play in a mission (not to mention her 'terrific' base armor again). Not to mention the EV trin playstyle is spamming her 2 and 4 and it becomes both boring and tiresome. healbot.exe? No thanks.
(TL;DR: Spamming skills isn't usually considered 'Fun'.)

3.) Her abilities (and passive) have little to no synergy anymore. Her 1 and 2 used to synergize, meaning she could kill something cast with her 1 by casting her 2 at the end of it. But clearly, she's not supposed to be a kill frame (as far as DE seems to make it). Lotus forbid the healer can kill one enemy at a time over the duration of her 1 and 2. On a slightly less sarcastic note, Trinity is all about keeping her allies from going down, right? SO WHY ON EARTH IS IT SHE'S GOT A PASSIVE THAT PICKS THEM UP SLIGHTLY MORE QUICKLY??? It's only by a second. a whole second. Mind the fact she can't CC anything for real without the use of her weapons, other than one or two enemies at a time (with her 1 or 2) she is only ever going to have 15 armor and a low-moderate amount of HP at any given time (Shields are in a bad spot, being that they are literal damage mitigation walls that doesn't take into account armor and takes 3 seconds to begin to recharge (though damage reduction does work, they are in a poor place compared to the massive armor values possible as well as HP regen and recovery methods in game), not limited to Trinity).
(TL;DR: She has to force synergy instead of working 'out of the box' like some other, newer 'support' frames. Harrow, for instance.)

4.) Many frames can do her job more efficiently or, for lack of a better word, 'better' (and most of the time more fun), mainly because she has to usually spam her abilities to be 'useful'. Nekros can pick people up instantly with his augment, why pick people up with trinity? Nidus and Inaros have far more efficient heals, and depending on which one it is can either deal a stalker-ton of damage (Nidus) or CC enemies as well as heal at the same time (Inaros). Harrow can give energy, though slightly less directly, and can aid in killing enemies and also give a 10+ second invulnerability. Nezha can give his armor to allies and remove debuffs. Even Octavia has giving increased energy regen to the team when she casts spells. What can Trinity do better than any of them? Burst heal. Over. and over. and over. That's the only consistency she has. And that is assuming she's using her EV well enough (IE not casting it outside of it's pulse range, even though her cast range is FOUR TIMES LARGER than it's pulse range. What the Harrow, DE?! (Yes, I know it's nice to give energy to allies a mile away, but if they aren't close enough to be ulted, then why are you trying to give them energy from THAT far??))
(TL;DR: Her efficiency is lacking due to her inability to be synergistic and sometimes it is more counter-intuitive than it is helpful.)

TL;DR for the in-spoiler wall of text: Trinity is a heal-bot/energy-bot and nothing else. She's not fun to play, takes no/almost no skill, and has no synergy (Or has to force it with augments and/or selfish play-styles) with anything but for herself with her 3 and 4 (her 92.5% max damage reduction). Many frames can do her job better (or at least more efficiently), and at the very least are more fun / better rewarded for healing and supporting their team.

I will put ideas down below, categorizing and organizing by ability changed/fixed, what kind of fix it is (Complete rework, Quality of life change, or slight tweak), and what kinds of interactions it could do. If they were someone else's idea, I will credit them as a Quote/Spoiler. The numbers and letters I have are just to reference the other skills of ideas I had.

Inserted letters to act as flexible numbers to the skill ideas. just use them with context.

 

 

Passive ideas:

Spoiler

 

My own ideas:
P:1A. ) Passive; Complete rework (Aura around Self)
----- A radius (B) around Trinity raises the strength of heals and regeneracy effects to health (and energy?) by 15% (Is not effected / affected by Coaction Drift)

 

 

 

 

Spell 1 ideas:

Spoiler

 

1:1A. ) Well of Life; Complete rework (Self target)
-----  Casting Well of Life puts Trinity in a stasis (invulnerable, unable to cast, move, or fire (Can be cast in the air, can switch weapons)). She gives off up to B number of pulses (based on level, 3 -5?), healing a (B [100-300?] + X)  + X% (minimum ([B + 0] + 0%), cannot go down from negative strength past B). Range modified by range mods, Strength of X modified by Strength mods, Duration modified inversely by duration mods (Higher duration = the quicker the pulses and the lower the stasis timer).
TL;DR: Well of Life is based on Trinity giving HP to nearby allies, not an enemy being attacked by allies, making it less the team's job to get hp and trinity more of an active role in giving it.

1:2A. ) Well of Life; Slight tweak (Enemy target)
----- Castling well of life on an enemy gives pulses of health, much like Energy Vampire currently does, removing the need for allies to target the WoL'd enemy.
(by Ada_Wong_SG)

1:3A. ) Well of Life; Complete rework (Ground target that drops an entity; can be used in the air)
----- Casting well of life will place an un-targetable, un-damageable entity that gives pulses of health to allies around it (think like a health pizza/pancake restore pad) lasting a duration. Can be used in tandem with a re-worked blessing that allows one to 'use up' the remaining heal to be added to Blessing's burst heal, as well as a reworked link in a way extending the heal to allies (See rework 3:3A.)
(by Lavren)

 

 

 

Spell 2 Ideas:
 

Spoiler

 

2:1A. ) Energy Vampire; Complete rework (Ally target)
----- Casting Energy Vampire on an ally gives them the ability to steal energy from a nearby enemy (Think a duration and range-based Ivara prowl steal, except over time energy instead of looting and no stealth) over time for their hp, with B + X per second (cannot go below B+0 from negative strength mods). Range modified by range mods, Strength of X modified by Strength mods, Duration modified by duration mods.
TL;DR: Change how energy gain works, casting on an ally instead of enemies, allowing them to draw the energy from the health of enemies.

2:2A. ) Energy Vampire; Slight tweak (enemy target)
----- Casting energy vampire gives the energy to allies around it as per usual; however, add a mechanic that allows an 'overheal' to HP, much like the augment does to Shields.
(by Ada_Wong_SG)
(My note about this one: Perhaps make it an alternative augment)

2:3A. ) Energy Vampire; Complete rework (Ally target)
----- Casting on an ally (perhaps with a 'wheel' selection like Ivara's 1, one for each squad member, and as I understand it selecting only one at a time) allows the ally to become a 'conduit' for damage and CC, with a maximum damage cap (probably based on Strength). At the end of the duration, or if the ally rolls (or otherwise 'shrugs it off in some way'), the damage dealt with that conduit turns into a proportional pulse of energy to nearby allies and trinity herself in either a burst or perhaps 'leeched' over time to allies.
(My note about this one: Alternatively, have it cast-able on allies and make it work like Ivara's prowl, without the stealth and instead of rolls for loot it steals energy and deals damage proportionally to a maximum for each enemy unit, IE a literal Energy Vampire)
(by Lavren)

 

 

 

Spell 3 ideas:
 

Spoiler

 

3:1A. ) Link: QoL change (Self target)
----- Casting Link gives trinity a link that connects to B (based on level, 3 - 5?) number of enemies. Depending on the amount of enemies linked to gives Trinity a buff. 1 - 5 gives a buff of 75% Damage reduction for herself. 3 - 5 linked gives her status proc and knockdown immunity. Being connected to a full amount of 5 enemies gives her an additional damage reduction of +20% more, up to a total of 95% and begins to steal B + X (X cannot go below 0 from negative strength) health from enemies over time (bypasses shields, but is mitigated by enemy damage reduction (IE Ancient healers) and armor). Link cannot link to enemies unable to be knocked down. Can be used with Well of Life in tandem to give the life-steal of linking to 5 enemies to allies within the range of Well of Life's range for a short duration (10 or so seconds? Augment maybe?), removing the life-steal from herself for that duration. Range modified by range mods, Strength of X modified by Strength mods, Duration modified by duration mods.
Tl;DR: Link gets stronger and can link to more than 3, up to 5 enemies at max level; also gives a few different buffs based on number of linked targets.

3:3A. ) Link: Complete Rework (Self target, linking to allies and enemies)
----- Casting Link allows damage reduction to Trinity, linking to enemies and dealing damage to them as she is damaged (as per Live). Allow linking, at a greater range, to allies, allowing them to benefit from the heal 'station' from 1:3A.'s Well of Life.
Another idea for this one is to link to allies with her 2:3A.'s Energy vampire Conduit, allowing other warframe's abilities to have an increased efficiency for their abilities(not outright getting energy for channeling abilities but giving them increased up-time for it).
(by Lavren)

 

Spell 4 (Ult) ideas:
 

Spoiler

 

4:1A. ) Blessing: Slight tweak (Affinity range allied targets)
----- Casting blessing gives Trinity and all allied units (exceptions being un-moving defense targets) a burst of health and shields by 40%-80% + X% (same as live) and a damage reduction (Tweaks start here) of 25% +X% + Z% (Z based on the total HP and Shields recovered for the entire party, including allies (warframes AND operators (whichever happens to be active at the time, not both)(X% cannot go below 0% from negative strength mods), companions, and specters (Suggestion to have each weighted differently as a part of this tweak, perhaps 70%/20%/10% for each respective type of allied unit)); max damage reduction of any one cast stops at 95% (Live value). Range modified by range mods, Strength of X modified by Strength mods, Duration modified by duration mods (As per live for all three).
TL;DR: Bring back the change of max damage reduction based on heal values, though with some numerical tweaks and weighting it different places.

4:2A. ) Blessing: Slight? tweak (Affinity range allied targets)
----- Casting Blessing works as per Live, but also removes debuffs and negative procs, and can revive fallen allies (Such as Kubrows and downed tenno). The original idea also had Sentinels coming back to life as well.
(by Ada_Wong_SG)

4:3A. ) Blessing: Complete Rework (Affinity Range allied targets)
----- Casting Blessing gives a burst of a heal to all surrounding allied units, giving the usual damage reduction as per live. This heal can consume the remaining amount of healing from 1:3A, adding to the burst, and gives special, unique buffs to all who were healed (In tandem with damage reduction, there could be buffs along the lines of giving stat bonuses (flat or percentage) for the duration of the blessing damage reduction). Also in the idea, was the thought that using Blessing alongside either EV or WoL would give different buffs or set of buffs when blessing was used, 'consuming' ability to do so. As the end of the day, just wanting to give some synergy to Trinity that most WarFrames seem to actually have.
(by Lavren)

 

List of Other's ideas and concepts ("My thoughts:" are my own thoughts on the ideas and may be opinions, usually added at the bottom of the quotes I list them in):

Spoiler

Lavren:
I am just going to link to it, or you can scroll down to the wall of text  on this page for what he said.
https://forums.warframe.com/topic/885127-can-we-talk-about-trinity-trinity-ideas-discussion/?do=findComment&comment=9237177

 

VampirePirate:

Quote

Split trinity into two or three [sic] warframes-- with respect to the meaning of the word Trinity, either that or have her do all three things -- damage, tank, and healing, splitting .

My thoughts: This sounds like it could work out very interestingly, I understand this statement like this: equinox currently has a day/night form, Trinity could have multiple forms she could either choose to switch to or rotate through.

(PS4)psychofang:

On 11/25/2017 at 1:33 AM, (PS4)psycofang said:

Her 1 has a very niche use thats now out done by a lot of new toys, maybe adjust it to a more unavoidable means of helping?
Rather than lift an enemy into the air why not place a stationary healing aura on the ground, stationary as not to encroach on Oberons mobile healing, that cuts status affect timers in half.
It could be a sustained aura that drains energy or an okish aura that is a pop and forget.
Only 1 or 2 can be up at one time.

Her 2 could still function the same but a few changes
-the ability now has an echo effect which every pulse from the primary target now causes up to X number of mobs to also emit a weaker pulse and take damage.
-primary target pulse is weaker
-primary target pulse does NOT give trinity energy
-weaker echoed pulses DO affect trinity and think of it more as a slight refund than a full net positive +.
-killing the target WILL give trinity energy equal to half the remaining pulses
-the pulses cannot be sped up or slowed down
-the enemies that emit an echo pulse cannot be affected by a new echo
This will encourage trinity to cast it in crowds to give everyone the best energy return and wipe them out so she can also fight instead of mashing a single button over and over.

My thoughts: The Energy Vamp idea sounds interesting! A CC chain into a bunch of energy over time would be fun to at least toy around with.

Ada_Wong_SG:

On 11/25/2017 at 12:40 AM, Ada_Wong_SG said:

1) Well of Life pulses out HP like EV pulses out energy to nearby teammates.

2) Vampire Leech Augment allow overheal of HP from WOL up to +1200 HP for everyone.

3) Bless cure all teammates of all Status Proc and instantly revive fallen teammates, kubrows and revives dead sentinels.

My thoughts: idea #3 seems a bit strong, but I wouldn't mind a removal to negative debuffs and status procs on her ult to her allies! perhaps an augment that allows her to single-target her ult on an ally could make a 'revival' Trinity? Anyone? 

 

 

I value any and all constructive feedback, including negative. Constructive meaning if you think it's bad, tell me why and I will try to fix it. Don't just say its bad for the sake of it being bad (unless you really can't figure out why; if this is the case, direct me to where you feel it is bad and I will try to figure it out). Thanks for your time!!
 

 

Edited February 24, 2018 by Angelid
Constantly editing x'D

[CreamedSoda]

I would love to talk about how the entire energy system is balanced around her, which shouldn't be the case anymore.

[Angelid]

Just now, Whitestrake0 said:

I would love to talk about how the entire energy system is balanced around her, which shouldn't be the case anymore.

I agree completely! As well as what used to be the whole damage mitigation meta; her's is literally the weakest in the game right now too. -Sigh- it hurts me to play trinity x'D

[CreamedSoda]

3 minutes ago, Angelid said:

I agree completely! As well as what used to be the whole damage mitigation meta; her's is literally the weakest in the game right now too. -Sigh- it hurts me to play trinity x'D

Well. During these times the energy system had to be balanced around her cause there was at the time a very very small chance of you not having at least 1 trin in your squad, now if we just say nobody does multiple frames in one squad. You have less than a 3% chance of her being in your squad.

Honestly how little DE has done to fix old problems just comes off as laziness. That's why I propose they do minimal content this upcoming year and just focus down on problems, balancing etc. I'd be happy with one year without content as long as they fixed these things it would help in the long run when they DO make content so. Spend a year working on troubles get a few years worth of enjoyment out of it.

Edited November 25, 2017 by Whitestrake0

[Angelid]

I agree, we have plenty to do with Plains now.

5 minutes ago, Whitestrake0 said:

That's why I propose they do minimal content this year and just focus down on problems, balancing etc.

This would be awsome if they did that, especially for trin's sake.

[Tokens210]

This all just saddens me cause i dont play as her often or as often as id like but im all about support frames like trinity for the energy health shield everything and being as shes the only character in that specific regards, youd think shed be shown more love to keep people wanting to use her but instead you get

 

LF EV Trin no others need apply

[VampirePirate]

Trinity.   Again?

[Angelid]

4 minutes ago, Tokens210 said:

This all just saddens me cause i dont play as her often or as often as id like but im all about support frames like trinity for the energy health shield everything and being as shes the only character in that specific regards, youd think shed be shown more love to keep people wanting to use her but instead you get

 

LF EV Trin no others need apply

The thing is, I am not asking to change much, and really the ideas are just to open the discussion. I want there to  be more rewards for playing her, and the meta just doesn't support having her around unless it is EV trin. Other warframes that are supportive at least have some kind of reward system; Harrow gets buffs for mitigating damage, Octavia gets more damage and range when using her ult, and gives buffs, and Oberon gives a huge amount of regen which helps with his armor-buffs. Everything works in tandem with these guys. Even some of the oldest frames work well together now, with some tweaks and reworks.

And then there's trinity, Energy and Heal bot, spamming worse than Old Nekros (If you dont know what I am talking about, old nekros used to have to recast his 3 to reroll drops, and now it's just turn it on and let it roll).

[Angelid]

1 minute ago, VampirePirate said:

Trinity.   Again?

What do you mean? You mean that tiny 'rework' she got years ago that nurfed her ult? or are you giving a roll of the eyes over the fact that I am bringing up what I feel is a problem with the frame, as a long time player of WarFrame in general? More information, please. :)

[Tokens210]

1 minute ago, Angelid said:

The thing is, I am not asking to change much, and really the ideas are just to open the discussion. I want there to  be more rewards for playing her, and the meta just doesn't support having her around unless it is EV trin. Other warframes that are supportive at least have some kind of reward system; Harrow gets buffs for mitigating damage, Octavia gets more damage and range when using her ult, and gives buffs, and Oberon gives a huge amount of regen which helps with his armor-buffs. Everything works in tandem with these guys. Even some of the oldest frames work well together now, with some tweaks and reworks.

And then there's trinity, Energy and Heal bot, spamming worse than Old Nekros (If you dont know what I am talking about, old nekros used to have to recast his 3 to reroll drops, and now it's just turn it on and let it roll).

oh im totally agreeing, if i dont see people asking for EV trin and only and EV trin theyll simply want a harrow or someone who mitigates damage and they bring out the energy pizzas

 

and yes i also do remember nekros being like that, im actually back from being away for a long while and i cannot stop myself from recasting it every time i see fresh bodies hit the ground when i play nekros lol

[Angelid]

Just now, Tokens210 said:

oh im totally agreeing, if i dont see people asking for EV trin and only and EV trin theyll simply want a harrow or someone who mitigates damage and they bring out the energy pizzas

 

and yes i also do remember nekros being like that, im actually back from being away for a long while and i cannot stop myself from recasting it every time i see fresh bodies hit the ground when i play nekros lol

LUL I know the feeling. xD I at least kept with the updates, so I know of most of the major changes. They even just gave Mirage a little bit of love, and quite frankly the fact that Trinity has changed so little is either because of her small playerbase or the fact she has only a few people who look at her frequently.

[VampirePirate]

1 minute ago, Angelid said:

What do you mean? You mean that tiny 'rework' she got years ago that nurfed her ult? or are you giving a roll of the eyes over the fact that I am bringing up what I feel is a problem with the frame, as a long time player of WarFrame in general? More information, please. :)

Since you asked so kindly.

Trinity has been an ongoing problem for years.  She is constantly mentioned on the forums without end.  She completely trivializes the game in the hands of abusive players.  She is a total failure in the hands of inexperienced players.  Devs don't know what to do with her.  They keep changing this or that and she is still a problem.  Almost all of recruit chat spam is never without the mentioning of her name.  She's a curse and a blessing, no pun intended.

I did a facepalm.  Not rolling my eyes.   It's just easier to forget Trinity even exists.  Of course that will never happen.

[Angelid]

1 minute ago, VampirePirate said:

Since you asked so kindly.

Trinity has been an ongoing problem for years.  She is constantly mentioned on the forums without end.  She completely trivializes the game in the hands of abusive players.  She is a total failure in the hands of inexperienced players.  Devs don't know what to do with her.  They keep changing this or that and she is still a problem.  Almost all of recruit chat spam is never without the mentioning of her name.  She's a curse and a blessing, no pun intended.

I did a facepalm.  Not rolling my eyes.   It's just easier to forget Trinity even exists.  Of course that will never happen.

Then help me. Start a discussion. I am hoping that they can figure out something, just looking at the ideas we have. If you want to be pessimistic, fine, I ask you to take it elsewhere. All I ask is that if the conversation comes up elsewhere, tell them there's someone who wants a change. Please.

[Lavren]

My thoughts on the subject of Trinity, of course an opinion. (OH GOD I'M SORRY FOR THE WALL OF TEXT)

She feels very dull to play, no risk for reward factor whatsoever. Or any abilities that feel great and synergize with each other. I was tossing out ideas, spit-balling them really to some friends to bounce ideas back and forth to one another and came up with a few things that of course may or may not be good to some people, but here's what I thought up.

Well of Life would be an ability you can place down either in a target area (where you're aiming), or would spawn underneath Trinity. (can be used in the air as well) Would have a duration timer and pulse health to allies, or allow for the Well of Life healing to be carried over to allied Linked targets per enemy kill or enemy on hit. (Yes I know but what about Harrow with his mechanics? Those are similar) The idea is just to spark creativity for others to possibly make something better, whether or not it might use some of my ideas as an example. 

Energy Vampire (Also being able to use in the air) is a tricky one to me, some ideas I came up with were strange ideas with being able to target an ally in your party window (something similar to cycling between abilities, but instead it will be with Player 2-4) and targeting them to becoming a different entity altogether, to CC targets, and deal x amount of damage to build up into a particular cap, upon releasing that form, would disperse that total damage cap into energy for allies. Another idea being just targeting someone to have the ability to have a lifesteal effect but for energy instead of health, while Trinity is able to provide healing via Well of Life. Yet another ability effect could be maybe similar to Well of Life, but for rapid energy regeneration perhaps, or just the usual pulses of energy, but without the need of targeting an enemy, it would just be similar to my Well of Life idea.

Link is where things get interesting (at least to what I was thinking up, by this point I was getting pretty giddy and excited thinking of the possibilities of combining abilities). Link would still target enemies as it does currently, but also target allies. The idea behind this is to allow healing the party without having to stack on the Well of Life all the time and hunkering down in one spot, no particular camping for the entire party, but more so for Trinity focusing things around her, staying in her Well, providing healing while killing enemies. One of the options I was thinking up would be to make Link a toggle/drain ability instead of duration, but of course I wouldn't know how I'd feel myself if I couldn't test it, but it's still an idea. Other ideas regarding Link would be something like Energy Vampire (or if the ability name is changed considering if the effects change entirely) would be able to instead of giving energy while Link is active (because frames aren't supposed to receive energy during channeled abilities of course) would instead provide an efficiency bonus to make the energy drain weaker from Link while it's active. (The idea I was thinking of was something more Neural, linking to your teammates' minds, allowing them to receive benefits from you, while you're also doing your part) The way Link would work in terms of how to be "linked" to Trinity could either be something similar to how Chroma's augment allows players to receive the buffs from him and run off, keeping the buff until the duration runs off (or drain in this case if toggle), or if need be for balance purposes, just stay by Trinity, but of course range would effect how far you can run off, but going close to her again would just re-link you to her, essentially. Another idea for Link to work with her first 2 abilities would be possibly making an EV target, sit in the Well of Life fountain you create, and still provide CC and do the usual pulses or maybe energy regen that's roughly the same potency as what the pulses would be currently. 

Blessing is also another strange ability to me, if I were to want Blessing to be similar to what we have now, I'd want to make it where you'd have to do a bit more than just press 4, even if it's combining abilities together to create the healing effect. The idea I had for Blessing was, you could still use Blessing as it is, press 4, receive effect, but instead of pressing 4 alone and healing, it would give you unique buffs. By itself would have certain buffs, in addition to damage reduction, but if you had Well of Life active, and you're standing in it, and then use Blessing afterward, it would "consume" Well of Life, and transfer that healing effect, into the usual affinity-wide heal, WITH additional and/or more potent buffs with that heal, plus the damage reduction. The reason behind this only came to me when I realized she's technically punching the ground to bless her allies, which is why I thought "Why not make her healing ability work in tandem with her current Blessing animation, and provide the current effect we have, or provide stronger buffs, new buffs, in addition to the damage reduction? Might be cool" This would also work with the change to Energy Vampire (if the ability name was changed along with the ability itself of course as mentioned above). Maybe using Blessing while "EV" was active could provide different buffs/effects, or stronger buffs, who knows, but this is what I could think up when wondering how to sort of combine her abilities together to at least kind of work a bit more for your insane potency, more or less. The other idea with Blessing working with EV (if it was still using an enemy as a target while it sits in Well of Life) would be that the enemy dies once you use Blessing, sacrificing it to finish it off, while providing buffs. Which could technically also apply multiple buffs per enemy type, similar to how Titania receives buffs, but instead for Trinity's buff, it would effect the party, not just her. Also being Linked with her party + the enemy could also provide additional bonuses too when she uses Blessing.

Again this is just me tossing out ideas that come to mind, and could definitely be used to create crazier, better ideas behind any other abilities people could make up themselves, whether in the case of different effects, or adding more risk or other interesting mechanics that I didn't mention that would make Trinity more "active" in general. Of course as it stands she's still not crazy active with her abilities, but the change to combining effects or additional bonuses by using certain abilities in order is at least a start, at least to me when I think of it in that way.

 

[Ada_Wong_SG]

1) Well of Life pulses out HP like EV pulses out energy to nearby teammates.

2) Vampire Leech Augment allow overheal of HP from WOL up to +1200 HP for everyone.

3) Bless cure all teammates of all Status Proc and instantly revive fallen teammates, kubrows and revives dead sentinels.
 

Edited November 25, 2017 by Ada_Wong_SG

[Angelid]

12 minutes ago, Ada_Wong_SG said:

1) Well of Life pulses out HP like EV pulses out energy to nearby teammates.

2) Vampire Leech Augment allow overheal of HP from WOL up to +1200 HP for everyone.

3) Bless cure all teammates of all Status Proc and instantly revive fallen teammates, kubrows and revives dead sentinels.
 

I do like the idea of an overheal mechanic for HP, that's not something that's in warframe currently! though the devs shouldn't have to make a completely new mechanic, it isn't out of the realm of possibility (look to the recent changes to Mirage dropping a crystal, for example, is what I think the level of complexity would be, other than some new UI changes to show overheals for HP).
The changes to Well of Life might be a good idea. On the other hand, it would be just another heal that no one has to worry about but Trinity. I'll put this up there for others to see though, and get the ideas out there. :) Thanks!!

Edited November 25, 2017 by Angelid

[(PSN)psycofang]

I like trinity but i feel like a brush up on her 1 and especially her controversial 2 should be in order.

Her 1 has a very niche use thats now out done by a lot of new toys, maybe adjust it to a more unavoidable means of helping?

Rather than lift an enemy into the air why not place a stationary healing aura on the ground, stationary as not to encroach on Oberons mobile healing, that cuts status affect timers in half. 

It could be a sustained aura that drains energy or an okish aura that is a pop and forget.

Only 1 or 2 can be up at one time.

 

Her 2 could still function the same but a few changes

-the ability now has an echo effect which every pulse from the primary target now causes up to X number of mobs to also emit a weaker pulse and take damage.

-primary target pulse is weaker

-primary target pulse does NOT give trinity energy

-weaker echoed pulses DO affect trinity and think of it more as a slight refund than a full net positive +.

-killing the target WILL give trinity energy equal to half the remaining pulses

-the pulses cannot be sped up or slowed down

-the enemies that emit an echo pulse cannot be affected by a new echo

This will encourage trinity to cast it in crowds to give everyone the best energy return and wipe them out so she can also fight instead of mashing a single button over and over.

[Angelid]

1 minute ago, (PS4)psycofang said:

Rather than lift an enemy into the air why not place a stationary healing aura on the ground, stationary as not to encroach on Oberons mobile healing, that cuts status affect timers in half. 

Lavren has a similar idea of making an area kind of like a sacred healing spot by either targeting the ground or dropping something at her current place.

 

3 minutes ago, (PS4)psycofang said:

Her 2 could still function the same but a few changes

-the ability now has an echo effect which every pulse from the primary target now causes up to X number of mobs to also emit a weaker pulse and take damage.

-primary target pulse is weaker

-primary target pulse does NOT give trinity energy

-weaker echoed pulses DO affect trinity and think of it more as a slight refund than a full net positive +.

-killing the target WILL give trinity energy equal to half the remaining pulses

-the pulses cannot be sped up or slowed down

-the enemies that emit an echo pulse cannot be affected by a new echo

This will encourage trinity to cast it in crowds to give everyone the best energy return and wipe them out so she can also fight instead of mashing a single button over and over.

I like this a lot, it would make her a bit more of a CC frame. Though the idea of it spreading sounds like it would be a lot more particles than needed, I wouldn't mind if it was kind of like a water-ripple effect, where the first one pulses the rest of the enemies around it with strengths dictated by their distance to the target (IE another pulse can be really strong near the original target, but much weaker the further out it goes).

[Biddion]

My two cents as a regular Trinity use:

Take the lockdown effect from Well of Life and combine it with the damage of Energy Vampire. The name needs to change but augment can remain the same.

Energy Vampire should get the levitation effect from Well of Life, grant energy to nearby allies, no damage would be applied to the target, but if the target is killed prematurely, no more energy is dispensed, but Trinity is refunded the initial cast energy.

Link and Bless seem fine to me, but if changes are needed, Link could be a toggle, while Bless' effect could diminish over distance.

Alternatively, instead of granting energy, EV could just raise a squad's efficiency, or Trinity's passive could be to raise efficiency by so much.

 

[Angelid]

Another idea that I came up with earlier today would be to make her 2 (Energy Vampire) one of either three things:

1. )  Make EV inversely affected by duration mods. IE 250% duration would make her EV pulse faster and be shorter overall in time by 2.5x; this would remove the need for both builds [EV and Link/Blessing] only to work independently, and have both worlds at once.

2. ) Make EV affected by duration mods as per live, but also give more pulses of energy, one for each additional 25% duration on her from mods. IE 200% duration would give 8 pulses instead of the usual 4. (currently, 200% duration gives her 4 pulses over 18 seconds, unless the target is killed; then it releases all of the rest of the pulses at once)

3. ) Make EV unaffected by duration at all, and make it an even duration, currently 9 seconds at max rank, and make duration cause more pulses in that same time frame (IE 200% would make her pulse 8 times over the usual duration, instead of 4).

[Angelid]

On 11/25/2017 at 2:28 AM, Biddion said:

My two cents as a regular Trinity use:

Take the lockdown effect from Well of Life and combine it with the damage of Energy Vampire. The name needs to change but augment can remain the same.

Energy Vampire should get the levitation effect from Well of Life, grant energy to nearby allies, no damage would be applied to the target, but if the target is killed prematurely, no more energy is dispensed, but Trinity is refunded the initial cast energy.

Link and Bless seem fine to me, but if changes are needed, Link could be a toggle, while Bless' effect could diminish over distance.

Alternatively, instead of granting energy, EV could just raise a squad's efficiency, or Trinity's passive could be to raise efficiency by so much.

 

I like the idea of Well of Life and Energy Vampire becoming one ability, though I wonder if it could be toggled between two (or even three, for her namesake) modes; it would free up a slot for a completely new spell / ability!

[hygbun]

First of all I would to get this out of the way. They need to make her one useful for pretty much any rework because it isn't. 

Secondher two is a big problem since it is just free energy with no real consequences. She gains energy with her allies and spams it to her hearts content.

I personally like the way her three is for survivability but it probably needs a change too.

Finally everyone's biggest pet peeve her fourth ability being able to heal entire squads with a push of a button and giving 75% damage reduction.

I would like to see her have a play style more based around timing and giving single players buffs and rewarding them if timed correctly. 

1st ability

I think it would be pretty cool if her first ability actually created a little pool that either did a burst of healing when it came up or small amount of healing over time when an ally is in it.

2nd ability

Forinstance how Harrow's 4 works *you gain invincibility for a few seconds and gain crit based of the damage allies have taken*. 

I would like something like this but with damage reduction to a single Ally and gives them energy for the damage they take. Maybe for her second or even fourth ability.

3rd ability

I honestly like the way her link is but it most likely needs a rework too. For her third ability I would like to see either a link that also links to allies and heals them based of the damage taken from enemies or a link that gives her back energy based on the damage it deals to enemies. (Like really only deals about 8 damage when at lvl 40.) Also reducing the time it lasts so you only get energy back in a small window would be optimal. (Since it is 8 damage time like 50 a second.)

4th ability 

I like the idea of changing it to where it is more rewarding instead of just spamming 4. So I think an ult that gives damage reduction and turns that damage into healing would be nice. (Obviously with a time delay to prevent spamming.)

Obviously not everyone will think this is a good idea but after all this is just my opinion.

Edited December 18, 2017 by hygbun

[Etomb]

I've always thought Trinity was fine; maybe in need of EV being reworked.

1- Shoot bad guy for health. It's a hp fill up station. I see no problems there.

2-Meant to be balanced by its limited range, however really isn't. Especially with range mods on. Maybe make it so that the enemy directly feeds energy only to those who have directly hurt it. Like ability one, except in bursts.

3- Keeps Trinity on her feet, since there aren't any powerful offensive abilities to help kill stuff before it hits you too hard.

4- Meant to save lives; its main function is not damage resistance. That is there to keep your heal from being meaningless; granting a buffer while people remove themselves from whatever situation they got caught in.

Edited December 13, 2017 by Etomb

[Redspace0095]

Or change her 1 so that the target explodes in a shower of health orbs. 

[Autongnosis]

I read a lot of good ideas in this topic, o don't really have any specific input to add so i'll just leave a token of support here. If anything comes to mind I'll post it here :)