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[DE]Aidan

PSA: [PC] Upcoming Changes to Gara's "Mass Vitrify" (Bonus Volt Info)

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4 hours ago, [DE]Aidan said:

Hey Tenno,

Just wanted to drop in here and give a little update on some upcoming changes to Gara’s fourth ability: Mass Vitrify. Coming in the next update, this ability will no longer be invulnerable to damage. It will eventually break apart in sections when enough damage has been dealt to that specific section of the glass wall.

The wall’s health is determined by both your ability power strength and armor mods, just like Frost’s Snow Globe. This will give your enemies a few extra options for dealing with Mass Vitrify, leading to some more dynamic encounters when using the wall defensively. 

Please use this thread to discuss any questions or feedback. 

Thanks, Tenno!

Edit: Apologies Tenno, I have moved the Topic to the general news board to allow all users to contribute to the thread.

 

 

I will not be using Gara any longer assuming this nerf goes through.  Frost is a vastly superior option now for Defense missions, and... well, pretty much everything you could want a barrier for. 

 

Frost had the advantage of infinite duration and multiple bubbles / stacking HP, plus full top coverage as well as the ability to stack more strength in a single bubble with multiple casts.  The disadvantage is that they are breakable, and extremely vulnerable in high end content, not to mention they fall from Nullifiers. 

Gara had the advantage of short-ish duration on her 4, but high wall strength. That said, her 4's cost is extremely high, her 1 requires a WELL built melee weapon (stat stick) to be viable, and her 3 is of limited use in most scenarios.   Her 2 is... nice, but if I want durability, there are better buff-based-durability oriented frames to select without her 4 adding potency to her overall kit.

Frost and Gara were well balanced with one another, with clearly defined advantages and disadvantages.  If this change goes through, that will no longer be the case.  The cornerstone of Gara's skill lineup is her wall's current durability - if you remove that, you break her kit's viability in high end content especially.  Put simply, she will no longer scale well.  (This assumes that her 2 will receive attention as well, since currently the scaling is infinite, if you need to kill part of her kit, why not the multi-million damage AOE she can build up instead of the one frame that has been able to compete with frost's defensive capabilities?  )

My primary purpose for Gara was mobile protection that I could re-deploy for great affect in high demand missions. If targets can just... break through easily, there's no reason for me to use her for the niche she appears to have been intended for.  If they CAN'T break through easily, whats the point of allowing them to do so at all over the short duration the wall exists? Mod capacity is extremely limited these days, so building yet another frame completely around defensive capabilities will further reduce her effectiveness compared to frost - her 4 simply won't be able to compare in the slightest. 

 

Do you really want Frost to remain the exclusive barrier oriented frame? I've been seriously enjoying Gara since her release, but for pretty much every purpose she has, this nerf will break her entire purpose.  Frost's barriers are nearly instant to deploy, and have full coverage... Gara's are expensive, limited in duration, take a long time to deploy, and leave the top fully exposed.   She has enough drawbacks without eliminating the one major advantage her entire skill-set has.  

 

Please, please reconsider this course of action. 

 

Thanks. 

 

Edited by Emberglow3412
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3 hours ago, Zeclem said:

so she wont make frost irrelevant anymore? wonderful.

I think you messed with the grammar there. Frost has way more CC than Gara after this change, and globe is a straight upgrade that costs less energy. This whole change will turn Gara into the Titania of team utility.

Edited by --Q--Voltage
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4 hours ago, [DE]Aidan said:

It will eventually break apart in sections when enough damage has been dealt to that specific section of the glass wall.

 

Something like this should also be applied to other forms of Glass as well then: Like the Ship Windows' Reinforced Glass that instantly shatter when a crumbled up paper ball hits it.

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! out of 2 of her useful abilities getting nerfed?

At least address her 3 first.

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4 hours ago, [DE]Aidan said:

Hey Tenno,

Just wanted to drop in here and give a little update on some upcoming changes to Gara’s fourth ability: Mass Vitrify. Coming in the next update, this ability will no longer be invulnerable to damage. It will eventually break apart in sections when enough damage has been dealt to that specific section of the glass wall.

The wall’s health is determined by both your ability power strength and armor mods, just like Frost’s Snow Globe. This will give your enemies a few extra options for dealing with Mass Vitrify, leading to some more dynamic encounters when using the wall defensively. 

Please use this thread to discuss any questions or feedback. 

Thanks, Tenno!

Edit: Apologies Tenno, I have moved the Topic to the general news board to allow all users to contribute to the thread.

if u give mass vitrify a health pool, then please take away its finite duration. have both a health pool and a timer restricting it just makes it inferior to frosts 3, and yet this is gara's Ultimate

Edited by Ragingwasabi

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Will mass vitrify be stackable like snow globe? 

Will it cast quickly like snow globe?

Will it become her 3 and she gain a powerful cc 4?

Why not just keep her exactly as she is... Change snow globe and iron skin back to duration abilities, and quit breakin frames?

If not... RIP gara.

Edited by (PS4)big_eviljak
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Got a feeling this has all come about cuz of troll Gara's stacking max range and glassing a whole area at the expense of all their energy and being utterly usless. Cuz other then the wall being unbreakable it's has to many other downsides to balance that out. Duration based, high energy cost, open on top for drones, hellions (which really hurt at high lvls), any ship in PoE and any AI that chose to climb to higher ground.

 

Other idea for fixing gara's wall set it to a fixed height undo that growing vertically that you did and makes it follow terrain like a fence.

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Just now, (PS4)big_eviljak said:

Will mass vitrify be stackable like snow globe? 

If not... RIP gara.

Already confirmed not.

 

They screwed it.

Edited by Amontadillo

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4 hours ago, [DE]Aidan said:

Hey Tenno,

Just wanted to drop in here and give a little update on some upcoming changes to Gara’s fourth ability: Mass Vitrify. Coming in the next update, this ability will no longer be invulnerable to damage. It will eventually break apart in sections when enough damage has been dealt to that specific section of the glass wall.

The wall’s health is determined by both your ability power strength and armor mods, just like Frost’s Snow Globe. This will give your enemies a few extra options for dealing with Mass Vitrify, leading to some more dynamic encounters when using the wall defensively. 

Please use this thread to discuss any questions or feedback. 

Thanks, Tenno!

Edit: Apologies Tenno, I have moved the Topic to the general news board to allow all users to contribute to the thread.

Nooooooooooooooooooooo

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I get the feeling that everyone complaining about Gara's usefulness against aerial attacks are forgetting that you can bullet jump into the air, tap 4, let it spread downward, and then you have a giant tube to sit inside of that's completely invulnerable to all but the flying enemies on PoE.

The change is fine. Just make it build health from damage absorbed while growing. Maybe remove duration, maybe not-- I'd have to see how it was affected by that.

As it stands using Gara, defensively, right now leads to nothing being able to touch you if you're using her to her full potential. All of the enemies sit a short distance away while completely unable to damage your already 90% damage resistant team and the few enemies that do make it through your impenetrable glass tube are unable to fight back due to you throwing mirrors at them which distract them. The change is not only reasonable but it should have been expected ever since they updated it to grow downward.

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9 minutes ago, (Xbox One)FISTO ROBOT0 said:

I know man! She was perfect!

Yep - she was what I've been recently pointing to as an example of a well designed frame, with the possible exception of her 3.  If this changes goes through as-is, she'll go from a S-rank powerhouse to a D-rank slightly polished shard of poo.  Gara's 4 is her cornerstone, without that potency, she's just... lackluster. Pun intended.

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If enemies just end up poking out the .5 meter triangles that they strike directly (ignoring splash damage would be required)? That might look cool, and should still obstruct movement and severely restrict aim--as long as melee units get popped before they hit the wall.

It would be even cooler if the glass in vertically adjacent triangles could melt and re-form over the gaps, causing a visual droop in the upper lips where the wall is under attack.

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1 minute ago, Emberglow3412 said:

Yep - she was what I've been recently pointing to as an example of a well designed frame, with the possible exception of her 3.  If this changes goes through as-is, she'll go from a S-rank powerhouse to a D-rank slightly polished shard of poo.  Gara's 4 is her cornerstone, without that potency, she's just... lackluster. Pun intended.

I was having so much fun she's become my new main. I can't remember the last time a frame was this fun. This one hurts lol a little too much. It's too bad people have to abuse things and then ruin something fun and interesting and functional.

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Just now, (Xbox One)FISTO ROBOT0 said:

I was having so much fun she's become my new main. I can't remember the last time a frame was this fun. This one hurts lol a little too much. It's too bad people have to abuse things and then ruin something fun and interesting and functional.

Same here - I just got back to the game after a year or so on break about 6 weeks ago.  I bought her with plat specifically to support the game, as I liked the direction things had been going, and now this...

I really can't comprehend why they think this would be necessary.  They designed a masterpiece, and now they want to take a sledgehammer to her?!   The only thing that really needed attention is the infinite scaling of her 2, and the lack of functionality of her 3... and she would have been the most well designed frame in the entire game, easily. 

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Sounds detrimental, not constructive. She's not used much as-is, and there are no proposals being made to improve her other abilities in kit to compensate. This may obsolete her altogether.

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1 minute ago, MartinVole said:

Sounds detrimental, not constructive. She's not used much as-is, and there are no proposals being made to improve her other abilities in kit to compensate. This may obsolete her altogether.

Agreed completely - as I mentioned further up, this blows away the cornerstone of her entire kit - there's now simply no point in using her.  She had a niche, this pounds it into a fine, squishy paste. 

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1 minute ago, Lizardmens said:

What does DE eat for lunch that makes them come with such awful changes

Whoever is hogging the universal vacuum from live must really suck.  :P

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18 minutes ago, Amontadillo said:

Already confirmed not.

 

They screwed it.

Keepin it duration based but not invincible is moronic. How can they think this is a good idea?

Edited by (PS4)big_eviljak
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Woah woah woah. You guys fix THIS and not the infinitely scaling Glass storm exploit? What the heck? The weakness of the wall is that its duration based instead of HP based like frost. Balance the duration if you dont like the invincibility. Also I've seen enemies walk right through the supposedly impenetrable wall rather often.

Between this and the recent volt fuckups, the Plague Star mission design and reward layout, etc, etc over the years, whoever is in charge of game design needs to be @(*()$ fired.

Edited by ADirtyMonk
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4 hours ago, Phatose said:

How, exactly, is Gara's 4 going to be better then Frost's 3?

It's different from Frost's Snow Globe, not necessarily better or worse in every circumstance. Mass Vitrify blocks enemies from moving through it once it hardens; Globe does not. Vitrify will break apart in sections, not all-or-nothing like Globe. Vitrify's range/size can be dynamically controlled by how long you let it expand; Globe has a static size that can only be altered by changing mods. Vitrify deals area damage outside the wall when shattered with Gara's first ability, while Globe deals area damage inside the the globe when shattered with Frost's first ability. Vitrify does not block friendly fire at all, while Globe does block friendly fire from the outside.

Also, there's the synergy with Splinter Storm to consider. If you think Mass Vitrify is terrible, you aren't using it right. (By the way, you can end the expansion of the wall early by pressing the power button again.) Overall, I think that even after the change, Mass Vitrify will still be exceptionally powerful, more so than Snow Globe in most situations.

I'm not denying that the change is a nerf, but it's not an unwarranted one, nor does it break the ability. I agree with the idea that it shouldn't have both health and a duration limit, though. That was the same problem with Snow Globe for a while.

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Question to the Devs: With this change, will nullifiers only dispel MV one segment at a time, or will one touch from a nullifier still bring down the whole ring?

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