Frame and weapon slots

[kingdomeTHEMADcthulhu]

This is simple and short bps for the slots we need to expand the arsenal that all you may now proceed to lose your minds

[(PSN)s3d_sas]

2 minutes ago, kingdomeTHEMADcthulhu said:

This is simple and short bps for the slots we need to expand the arsenal that all you may now proceed to lose your minds

Wait wait can u please try to tell me what do u want again I didn't recall tbh

[Umbrasi]

English please. i didnt get your point

[artemisfortune]

Just now, Igni said:

English please. i didnt get your point

he wants a blueprint for slots. basically he wants to be able to earn slots without having to trade.

it's not the worst idea i've seen, but it's not plausible at all.

[(PSN)s3d_sas]

Just now, JSharpie said:

he wants a blueprint for slots. basically he wants to be able to earn slots without having to trade.

it's not the worst idea i've seen, but it's not plausible at all.

Ooh yeah I don't think it will happen because it's ez to get weapon and warframe slots 

[Umbrasi]

without wasting real $ i have been able to earn the plat i needed. And i dont think DE will remove that as it gives them $ cause even if you buy it from traded plat, at some point someone actually spent real $ for it. 
so basicaly DE gets $ for your slots while letting you get them for free f you want. 
This is perfect for them and really good for us to. its not extremely hard to get plat for slots

i wouldnt expect any changes if i was in your place

[More-L]

Why do people keep saying you can get slots for free? Unless you get an event weapon or redeem a code for a weapon you don't get any free slots what-so-ever. 

If, hypothetically, all trade-able platinum was used on slots how exactly would a player get a slot for "free"? They couldn't. Weapons and frames are always being added, being able to earn (without trading) a total of 4-5 frame slots and maybe 10-15 weapon slots wouldn't make DE go bankrupt.

Edited December 13, 2017 by More-L

[Snib]

1 hour ago, More-L said:

being able to earn (without trading) a total of 4-5 frame slots and maybe 10-15 weapon slots wouldn't make DE go bankrupt.

Nor would it make you go bankrupt to throw a few bucks DE's way for all the free entertainment they provide to you.

[More-L]

10 hours ago, Snib said:

Nor would it make you go bankrupt to throw a few bucks DE's way for all the free entertainment they provide to you.

My point was against people trying to argue that you can get slots for "free" and that the game is completely "free to play" when the only way to get slots is to use trade-able plat.

I have no issues with the current system (I have loads of slots personally) I have issues with people saying they are free.

[Snib]

5 minutes ago, More-L said:

My point was against people trying to argue that you can get slots for "free" and that the game is completely "free to play" when the only way to get slots is to use trade-able plat.

I have no issues with the current system (I have loads of slots personally) I have issues with people saying they are free.

You are splitting hairs and you know it. What they mean by "free" and what everyone else understands is that you can play the game without ever putting any real money into it. 

Obviously free to play economies depend on not everybody playing for free, someone has to pay the bills. So your hypothetical example there being no plat in the market to trade for is basically a scenario of the game having failed. And to ensure it won't fail we can't give out everything for free. Go figure.

Edited December 13, 2017 by Snib

[More-L]

Just now, Snib said:

You are splitting hairs and you know it. What they mean by "free" and what everyone else understands is that you can play the game without ever putting any real money into it. 

Obviously free to play economies depend on not everybody playing for free, someone has to pay the bills. So you hypothetical example there being no plat in the market to trade for is basically one of the game having failed and thus irrelevant for the discussion at hand.

Say whatever you want, regardless of whether you think I'm "splitting hairs" anytime I see someone say warframe is "f2p" I always want to say 'aside from slots' because they are not free unless you get a plat drop from watching a stream, please tell me under what description is something free that you have to trade for? That is my opinion on the matter and I genuinely think "this game is f2p, if you ignore slots" because absolutely anything else (not cosmetics) can be farmed for.

You need to understand what a hypothetical situation is, and in my hypothetical situation I was 100% correct. It's not irrelevant because it is true and relates to the discussion about slots.

[DiabolusUrsus]

The only change we need with regards to slots is the ability to craft weapons requiring other weapons without needing to claim those weapons first. That way we can actually use the slots we buy instead of needing to keep several free to accept weapons used for crafting.

[Snib]

6 minutes ago, More-L said:

please tell me under what description is something free that you have to trade for? 

Whether you grind or trade, in both cases all it costs you is your time.

In the hypothetical case that I thought this conversation was going anywhere I'd keep responding, but since for me only reality matters I'll take my leave from you here. 

[kingdomeTHEMADcthulhu]

You do realize if the made as rare as orokin reactors bp  they would still be fine i am forever haveing to throw the il plat i have to those 

 

[Drasiel]

1 hour ago, kingdomeTHEMADcthulhu said:

You do realize if the made as rare as orokin reactors bp  they would still be fine i am forever haveing to throw the il plat i have to those 

 

No it wouldn't be fine,  I'm  sitting on like 70 reactor bps from alerts, invasions, events and weekly livestreams

[ACULonSeer]

I addressed this issue in my "main issues" thread. To me it's not that the slots cost plat, it's that the way you are introduced to the limited slots feels like a huge paywall. 2 frames is not enough for people to decide if they wanna spend money, and it creates a bad first impression, hence the thread.

[Maganar]

On 12/13/2017 at 5:26 PM, More-L said:

My point was against people trying to argue that you can get slots for "free" and that the game is completely "free to play" when the only way to get slots is to use trade-able plat.

I have no issues with the current system (I have loads of slots personally) I have issues with people saying they are free.

I'm sorry, but based on this definition there simply is no such thing as a free-to-play game.  Every F2P game is ultimately supported by people who do pay, it just may not be as obvious as in the case of Warframe where there are necessary (or so necessary for the sake of convenience we might as well just call them "necessary") things like slots that must be purchased with currency that someone, somewhere bought.

I get your point.  I get that no player can progress reasonably far without SOMEBODY supporting them by spending money on platinum that player uses for the slots.  But this argument could ultimately be extended to F2P games where all purchases are pure cosmetics that no player needs in the same way: "But if someone didn't buy that completely unnecessary cosmetic, they couldn't rent the servers to run the game or raise the capital to hire their staff."  If you want to follow the argument of whether the game is F2P or not to its ULTIMATE conclusion (It's not F2P because somewhere somewhere MUST spend some money!) then you can take that argument to its ultimate conclusion for any F2P game and conclude it is, indeed, not F2P.

If you want to argue that the term F2P is deceptive, that is another matter entirely and good luck changing a term that has become ingrained into the industry.  However, so long as the term persists, Warframe epitomizes what that term is meant to describe.

[Mewvg2]

15 minutes ago, Maganar said:

But this argument could ultimately be extended to F2P games where all purchases are pure cosmetics that no player needs in the same way

Not exactly. That's a far more fair f2p model, whereas DE double dips in necessary and unnecessary bits of premium currency cost. One could argue that inventory slots disqualify Warframe as a f2p game.

DE makes plenty off of deluxe skin bundles, color palates (which are far more expensive than one might expect), Prime Access, etc. At this point they don't really need the inventory slot plat sink any more than they needed the revive plat sink.

[_Vortus_]

Its a bad idea unless you can provide DE an optional platinum sink to replace it, one we do not currently have already, that people will need/want.    If you have spent plat on anything except slots while still needing slots, that's all on you.    Slots are the only reason to learn to trade for plat in the first place.  And as far as potatoes go, as long as you are patient, the game will give you more than you will ever need.  

People saying it isn't free and has a paywall....  if you are going to be technical, nothing is free.   It costs electricity to power the pc you play on, food to fuel yourself to play, time to play..... everything is a resource if you are being irritating.   In the sense of do you have to pay actual cash money to buy anything in warframe to play the game, which is no, you don't, this is a f2p game.

[Shalath]

9 hours ago, Mewvg2 said:

One could argue that inventory slots disqualify Warframe as a f2p game.

Wrong. You can play the game and enjoy almost every bit of gear and content without paying anything or trading for plat. You just have to do it with limited slots. You have to pay for convenience, nothing more.

9 hours ago, Mewvg2 said:

DE makes plenty off of deluxe skin bundles, color palates (which are far more expensive than one might expect), Prime Access, etc. At this point they don't really need the inventory slot plat sink any more than they needed the revive plat sink.

By that logic you can take a voluntary 20% pay cut as you don't actually need that other 20% do you? Didn't think so. DE is a business and their job is to make money.

[Mewvg2]

10 hours ago, Shalath said:

You have to pay for convenience, nothing more.

When the strength of the game is its massive amount of variety, I'm callin' BS.

10 hours ago, Shalath said:

DE is a business and their job is to make money.

Your point? By your logic they should've never changed revives. DE has cut systems like this before, they can do so again for the new player experience. Improving that will actually increase their profits by keeping more new players in the game.

[Gandergear]

4 minutes ago, Mewvg2 said:

When the strength of the game is its massive amount of variety, I'm callin' BS.

Your point? By your logic they should've never changed revives. DE has cut systems like this before, they can do so again for the new player experience. Improving that will actually increase their profits by keeping more new players in the game.

I lived with the base number of slots till i earned the plat to buy more, wasting your starter plat is all on you. You can always rebuild frames and prime frames are a convenient stepping stone to recovering sold frames.

By his logic its obvious that paid revives hurt the community more than it profited DE. Now you get players complaining about running out of 5 revives.

You can get free weapon slots from the anniversery weapons, the recent streaming event, FREESWORD are the ones that come to mind. The only places id accept to see slot blueprints given away were

A. Council challenge alert

B. Sortie reward

Note how none of these are reliably accessible to new players, anywhere else invites a sytem to abuse.

[Mewvg2]

2 minutes ago, Gandergear said:

paid revives hurt the community more than it profited DE

I'd argue slots do the same, especially since that's why my friends won't play Warframe. It sets a precedent in their mind, they expect the game to nickel 'n dime them from then on out.

It's the last strictly necessary plat cost in the game, getting rid of that would certainly make the game's monetization model better.

[Maganar]

On 1/1/2018 at 2:32 PM, Mewvg2 said:

I'd argue slots do the same, especially since that's why my friends won't play Warframe. It sets a precedent in their mind, they expect the game to nickel 'n dime them from then on out.

It's the last strictly necessary plat cost in the game, getting rid of that would certainly make the game's monetization model better.

Whether or not it is better is debatable and I don't have an answer to that.  The only answer I have is that it works for me and a lot of other people who find it fair, but not everyone may find the same things fair.  Whether is outright disqualifies the game from being considered F2P... I'm still not convinced, but I don't think this conversation won't go any further even with additional reiteration.

In any event, I don't expect it to change any time soon whether we hem and haw about the game being better without them or not.  Platinum revives were removed a very long time ago and well before my experience, slots have persisted despite.  If I had begun playing during that day and age I would not be here today; I can say with confidence I would have quit permanently and not returned even if I heard it was removed.  Slots I have found completely reasonable on the other hand.  After how long they have persisted, slots are a clear part of their business model with which they are satisfied and it's hardly worth discussing.  It's funny you say your friends won't play Warframe because they expected to be microtransaction-murdered by it, because I have friends I've met who said Warframe was the first F2P game they didn't find themselves sucked into that very same spree of microtransactions your friends feared and that they were really impressed by that.

We can all bring up anecdotes, but I promise you they go both ways because we all have different hot-buttons, turn-offs, and breaking points.  Mine are different from those of players during the Founder's period (I would have never put up with platinum revives on a daily counter), and your friends have different ones from mine and many other players.  DE had to choose a population to target, and they chose a long time back to target the population that will not dish out for revives, but that will dish out for slots and that is going to be very hard to change this far down the road because the game has grown around that choice that DE made during the early stages of this game.

[Mewvg2]

1 hour ago, Maganar said:

DE had to choose a population to target, and they chose a long time back to target the population that will not dish out for revives, but that will dish out for slots and that is going to be very hard to change this far down the road because the game has grown around that choice that DE made during the early stages of this game.

The original intent of slots was good, limiting the server space that the players' inventories took up. Now that's no longer an issue, so there's little reason for slots to stick around except that DE hasn't bothered to look at them again. It wouldn't be terribly hard for them to change it, they changed revives easy enough. I don't recall them refunding any plat spent on revives, I don't expect they'd refund anything for slots either.