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Pvp - It's Required For The Long Term Survival Of Warframe

Asphyxiationism

By Asphyxiationism,
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Asphyxiationism

Asphyxiationism

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Posted (edited)
[Try to stay on topic when commenting on this post, also, if you read this entire blog post I will congratulate you.]

 

"IT'S A PVE GAME!!!" - Foreseen commentator

 

I am fully aware that this is a PvE game, there is no need to get your panties up in a bunch here, hear me out alright? Read through this, agree or disagree but don't do it before you've read what I've had to say; 

 

First of all... What is the point of a F2P game? Well... It's to rack in money through a in game economy with, for example, platinum. What makes F2P such a attractive way of making a game for developers? Well, because people will pay more then just one cash wad of 60 bucks. So... Will Warframe be able to do that in its current state? I'll say no. I've spent about 10 bucks on this game so far, there is no further need for me to spend more money on this game. I've bought the colors and item slots, that is all that you actually need to buy, the rest you can get yourself, there isn't enough unique content to get me to spend money on it. 

 

So you all know that this game focuses on a PvE style of gameplay where you don't fight against your fellow Tenno but instead are up against the Grineer, Corpus and infested. There are small PvP elements in the game in form of duels (Which are frankly so unbalanced that they were just a waste to put in there in the first place.), to say the least this wasn't a good move. The developers have stated on several occasions that they will be focusing completely on the PvE experience of the game and I can understand why. However, as a Gamer and a game critic overall I would say that the PvE experience in this game is... Sub par. Here are a few reasons why;

 

* Stupid AI

 

'Yes, they are as stupid as bricks... They run in lines letting you put headshots and headshots into them. They do not use any particular strategies and they are very ludicrously easy to take out, even in the 100+ lvl's.'

 

* Health+ Attack+

 

'As the enemies become higher level there is no visible degree in their difficulty, they merely get tougher and hit harder. This is bad design, especially in a game that is focused on PvE. '

 

* Repetetive missions

 

I shouldn't even need to explain this but every mission is a version of "destroy this", "Fetch this" or "Defend this" or the ye olde "Kill all dem that ain't like yus!" We need more variaty, more engaging missions that actually makes us thing instead of just run n' gun. 

 

* Skinner Box Gaming

 

It's a Skinner box game, many games are, but this is the only sole mechanic of the game which has made it work so far... You are rewarded with new shiny objects! Instead of rewarding us for skill or tactic, it rewards us by doing the same thing over and over again... Aka, farming. (Google Skinner box if you do not know what it means.) 

 

* Stupid Bosses

 

This everyone knows is true. Why is it that these, which are supposed to be the most interesting encounters in the PvE experience is brought down to a "Got a lotta health n' armor, with a heavy hitting weapon!" ... They're just like the other mobs, they just have more health and special attacks and that is it! 

 

Disclaimer: 

 

So, before you go and make any hasty comments like "Duh, go play nudder games den if you dun like it!" I want you to take into consideration that... I really like this game! It's basic concept is awesome! Space ninjas! It has a mysterious lore around it and for once it makes you actually feel like you're being spoken to as a individual. You feel like you're in a community in this game, fellow Tenno, I am with you! However, this doesn't make me less critical of this games flaws! One of these one is it's longevity... When someone has played all frames and tested most of its weapons, they will leave the game. That will take maybe 4-5 months of game play, this being a F2P title, it needs to keep players on for at least double, or triple amount of that time to make them spend enough money to make the game worth producing. I can't see myself playing the game for longer then after I've gotten my favorite weapons (The one I'm interested in using.) and the same with Frames, after I've potatoed and Forma'd... Then what else is there to do...? Of course they can fix it with some REALLY interesting PvE missions, however, considering all the cliche ones we've seen so far I highly doubt it... In this game you're more rewarded for doing the same thing over and over again then actually possessing skill which is... Well, lets just say, VERY odd considering we're playing as Space Ninjas.

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Suggestion for a Warframe PvP System (I need to emphasize on this... A suggestion, not a demand.)

 

The basic premise about this idea is very similar to that of a MOBA. We've got two different bases and with three paths that connect them two. A serious of "injectors" (That being the Towers, in LoL for example.) that are needed to be destroyed to clear the path to the enemy encampment. These Injectors, instead of being Towers, they could be enemy Bosses that need to be killed and with each succesive Injector it gets stronger. 1 being on the weak side, the second medium and the last strong. 

 

Of course, since the game is already a PvE game, adding the mobs that rush the Towers would be easy indeed, they do not need AI improvments either due to the simplicity that is requiered of AI in MOBA style games. '''''The MOBA style Warframe PvP would NOT be top down and a strategy game!!! You would control your character just like in PvE!!! Just the map and the game objective would be the same as a MOBA!!!''

 

Wouldn't there be balancing issues?

 

Of course it would, if your gear, lvl and so forth was moved from PvE over to PvP. However, the balancing would be easy in my idea because... There would be a difference between PvE xp and PvP xp! Just like in Guild Wars two, the PvP and PvE are sepperate, your gear, level and so forth isn't the same depending on game mode. 

 

What would be the issentive of the Tenno to fight eachother, what is the lore behind these skirmishes?

 

Good question, this would be very much like the Halo 4 multiplayer campaign... It's to train the Tenno, in simulated battles to hone their skills! Lotus already does it in her "Mastery rank tests" so why couldn't she simulate an entire arena with several Tenno in it?

 

How would the Gear/Mod/Weapon system work? Wouldn't there be balancing issues?

 

No, everyone would start at equal footing at the beginning of the battle. Their frames would be at unranked level from the beginning of the match and as it progresses they gain xp and levels and gaining their abilities depending on how many mob/PvP kills they gain. 

 

Mod's would be purchased for some kind of battle currency, like the gold in LoL, maybe Mobs and players would drop credits? The mods are bought in game and equipped to your warframe, giving you strength, ability duration, extra shield or abilities. (These would not transfer from game to game, however, you gain PvP mastery rank.) 

 

Weapons is the difficult one, one cannot have them transfer from game to game because one might be running with an ogris early game at all times then... I've not completely figured this one out, help me out! 

 

Keep in mind: '''This is my own idea for a PvP system to show that it would work without impeding on the PvE crowd. I would personally love to see this kind of game... Third person space ninja MOBA shooter? Sound @(*()$ great and quite original! But it doesn't mean I would try and require the dev's to use it, I merely wanted to show that it can be done and would SURELY give the 200+ hours or 300+ hour player crowd with something much more engaging then another Defense Mission.

 

( I'll make edits if I feel the need to, this was one huge Blog post to type out.)

 

Common arguments against this post:

 

*The dev's have confirmed that there won't be a PvP system.

 

Yet, they added the dojo duels? I never said that they will, don't put words in my mouth. I'm aware that they have said so, doesn't stop me from arguing for a PvP system.

 

*New PvE expansions is coming!!! They will make the PvE experience better!

 

The last three major updates provided nothing as such, don't claim something you have no evidence for. ( I have evidence of the opposite, look back at the three major updates... Nothing but aesthetic, new weapons, a few new more bosses and missions... Nothing game changing. )

 

*Your MOBA idea sucks!!!

 

Yeah, it was an IDEA not a demand, to show that it can be done without interfering with the PvE crowd.

 

*You will alienate all of the PvE players by adding a PvP system!!!

 

So... Just because you have more options to choose from, you will be a spoiled brat and exclaim "I will not play this anymore before it is loosely affiliated with something I do not agree with!!!" ...'' Also, didn't I JUST show you that the PvE and PvP would be separate? The game wouldn't force you to play the PvP, it would merely give you an option to do so... It's like saying "Allowing PvP players to have their thing is infringing on my right to not have PvP!" ... You don't need to have it, it would merely be there... As an option. 

 

* If you don't like the game, go play something else!

 

I love the game, I merely want it to improve. This isn't even an argument, it's an argument from ignorance/Strawman argument... Also, I do play other games for a PvP experience, still doesn't stop me from thinking that an PvP in Warframe would be amazing.

 

* So, your solution to the PvE problem is to add PvP? Isn't that stupid?

 

I never said it was to solve the PvE problem! I said that it was to provide more content so people will have more to come back to, more content to spend cash on, instead of doing the same defense mission over and over and over again. You want me to make a blog post on how to fix the PvE problem? Sure, just ask me and I will. 

 

----

 

A Gamespot review that targets the same issues I've been pointing out:

 


Edited by Asphyxiationism
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MetalGerbil

MetalGerbil

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Posted

"let me tell you why the core of this game isnt enough for its survuval"

yeah, we know, its called ..... a BETA!

and no. pvp requires design and development time. it takes TIME to make a good pvp system and in this game its NOWHERE to be found.

id likely take months just to creating one, as they would have to start from scratch. and thats months of NO UPDATES. specially considering its a small team.

this has been talked about to death. game is doing fine. dueling will be refined and if we are ALL lucky thats the most you will see. there are countless pvp games. i play many alongside warframe. but you do not see games like this.

stop trying to ruin it.

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Fate_6

Fate_6

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PvP is necessary unless we get a readily available challenge in terms of gameplay. Right now even the more challenging bosses are easy to beat with a simple gimmick (Raptor can be switch-teleported, Lech Kril can be Trinity tanked, etc). It's too time consuming to get to the higher waves of defense, and even then it's easy to beat it with Vaub+Frost(T3 Defense)+Nyx+Nova, and it's simply a matter of having high level weapons.

 

PvP makes mobility an actual requirement because you have to avoid attacks. You have to look around while shooting and running and dodging, instead of basically being an immobile turret shooting rockets.

 

If we don't get PvP, then give us a real reason to have all this gear at high level. Give us a reason to want to go fast besides rushing. At least D3 Inferno was crazy intense if you didn't have the literal best gear available, and you had to use still to kite/dodge enemies. There's too much mindlessness in this game right now.

Edited by Fate_6
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Chris9428

Chris9428

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Posted (edited)

PvP wouldn't make that game better. No. It would throw it down into a deep endless descent.

If you want proper PvP, you'd need to balance every @(*()$ Warframe, so there aren't any unfair things anymore.

That means.. R.I.P PvE.

This game is made to be PvE, and that's it.

 

No PvP.

No.

Definitely not.

 

/edit/

 

Oh, and inb4 lock.

 

/edit2/

 

Oh, I forgot to mention this..

The PvP community often contains of immature children who can't do anything but flaming.

I seriously don't want this community to be run down by a horde of children.

Edited by Chris9428
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KvotheTheArcane1

KvotheTheArcane1

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Posted

For the 1,000,000th time.

 

No.

this. Enough with the damn PvP threads, does no one use the search feature before making ANOTHER PvP thread?

 

PvP wouldn't make that game better. No. It would throw it down into a deep endless descent.

If you want proper PvP, you'd need to balance every @(*()$ Warframe, so there aren't any unfair things anymore.

That means.. R.I.P PvE.

This game is made to be PvE, and that's it.

 

No PvP.

No.

Definitely not.

 

/edit/

 

Oh, and inb4 lock.

+1 to this too.

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Vilemyre

Vilemyre

Posted
Posted

Last thing I want is this game ruined by a pvp community. I have seen pvp communities and they are some of the nastiest pieces of work I could ever meet.

 

Making a few people happy isn't worth corrupting this games fanbase with that kind of communities crap no offense I'm sure you aren't one of those but understand I don't like pvp communities and most of them are jackasses.

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Kalenath

Kalenath

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Posted (edited)

PvP centric game from a PvE centric game?

 

Nope.

 

Not going to work no matter how many times people spam threads like this.

 

I have a thought:

 

If you want PvP so badly, go find another game. There is no shortage of PvP games out there, some F2P and many quite good.

 

There IS a shortage of good PvE titles out there.

 

Don't try to ruin this one. Please?

Edited by Kalenath
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Asphyxiationism

Asphyxiationism

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Posted

PvP wouldn't make that game better. No. It would throw it down into a deep endless descent.

If you want proper PvP, you'd need to balance every @(*()$ Warframe, so there aren't any unfair things anymore.

That means.. R.I.P PvE.

This game is made to be PvE, and that's it.

 

No PvP.

No.

Definitely not.

 

/edit/

 

Oh, and inb4 lock.

 

/edit2/

 

Oh, I forgot to mention this..

The PvP community often contains of immature children who can't do anything but flaming.

I seriously don't want this community to be run down by a horde of children.

Didn't read the post, I already confronted that issue.

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LordMidnightX

LordMidnightX

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Posted

hmm one of the better suggestions for PVP

 

but you covered a big point about why not to add pvp in the OP

 

PVE STILL NEEDS TONS OF WORK

 

are you crazy adding pvp at a time like this would be awful. it would end up taking away resources from the PVE part. so suggest pvp in a few years and I might consider it but now no 

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Vilemyre

Vilemyre

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Posted

Why don't you make a clan about it.

Is that supposed to be a running joke here now or something?

 

 

Lol.... Gamespot. Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't they about as bad as IGN?

 

Oh don't get me started on how bad Gamespot is...

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