Orvius vs Glaive Prime charged throw

[Ovenface]

Can anyone suggest which throwing weapon would be best in this case?

i’m a nidus player using mutalist cernos and my intention with the throwing weapon is to suppliment my aoe damage. I will not be swapping to my melee weapon but throwing it into my larve clump to assist my aoe damage via nidus’s number 1 ability and my status clouds from mutalist cernos. 

I think Power Throw is needed in this case if i’m not mistaking? Orvius has better base damage for slash status but isn’t a 100% chance to proc like Glaive Prime. Will this type of charged throw proc slash status on everyone in my larve with Power Throw equiped to Glaive Prime? Which mods will not benefit from using throwing weapons in this fashion? Which will? What weapon and mods would be you recommend? Why? 

Thank you for taking the time to read this!

[Mepheri]

i'd say go with the glaive prime, since whirlwind is kinda bugged and the Orvius has a really slow flight speed

[DatDarkOne]

On ‎1‎/‎22‎/‎2018 at 11:27 PM, Ovenface said:

Can anyone suggest which throwing weapon would be best in this case?

i’m a nidus player using mutalist cernos and my intention with the throwing weapon is to suppliment my aoe damage. I will not be swapping to my melee weapon but throwing it into my larve clump to assist my aoe damage via nidus’s number 1 ability and my status clouds from mutalist cernos. 

I think Power Throw is needed in this case if i’m not mistaking? Orvius has better base damage for slash status but isn’t a 100% chance to proc like Glaive Prime. Will this type of charged throw proc slash status on everyone in my larve with Power Throw equiped to Glaive Prime? Which mods will not benefit from using throwing weapons in this fashion? Which will? What weapon and mods would be you recommend? Why? 

Thank you for taking the time to read this!

I've used both quite a bit and here's what I found.  Both weapons are very similar with slight differences.  Glaive P has a faster melee attack speed making it better for general melee usage over the Orvius.  The Orvius has a much more powerful Charged Throw and has additional effects that the Glaive P doesn't have.  For example, the Orvius has the ability to completely wipe out a group of enemies with it's charged throw while the Glaive P can't do this.  

Because of these differences, I tend to use the Glaive P more for melee combat and the Orvius for when I plan to do more throws.  

[Ovenface]

1 hour ago, DatDarkOne said:

I've used both quite a bit and here's what I found.  Both weapons are very similar with slight differences.  Glaive P has a faster melee attack speed making it better for general melee usage over the Orvius.  The Orvius has a much more powerful Charged Throw and has additional effects that the Glaive P doesn't have.  For example, the Orvius has the ability to completely wipe out a group of enemies with it's charged throw while the Glaive P can't do this.  

Because of these differences, I tend to use the Glaive P more for melee combat and the Orvius for when I plan to do more throws.  

Thank yooooou! I still have to level up my Orvius but I think i’ll do that tonight after work. Any specific mods you recommend on the Orvius?

[(PSN)Crixus044]

Both are really good, but for Nidus, Orvius is better. Due to larva clumping up enemies, Orvius can be built for consistent gas procs, whose AoE can decimate entire groups, mainly due to the fact that the channel/charge throw headshots automatically. Since it hovers fordamage over time, this means you can use it as remote dps, while you fire with another weapon, thus it can be like you're using 2 weapons at once, stacking the dps. This is very good for higher level missions. The good thing about Glaive Prime is that it has slash, can also be built with gas (or more slash), and can use power throw, so it will work pretty well in groups, but overall, it's a better single target weapon while Orvius is better for groups. Both work amazingly well in higher levels, but since Glaive Prime is much harder to get, I say Orvius.

Edited January 24, 2018 by (PS4)Crixus044

[DatDarkOne]

1 hour ago, Ovenface said:

Thank yooooou! I still have to level up my Orvius but I think i’ll do that tonight after work. Any specific mods you recommend on the Orvius?

The Orvius is some what in a strange place.  You can mod it like the Glaive P, but because of how it's Charged Throw works means that you mod in possibly strange ways.  If you were to focus on the throw aspects, then things like modding for finisher damage and gas make it very powerful when using the Charged Throw.  This is something that most wouldn't do with the Glaive P.  

Also how you mod it will also depend on who you plan to use it and the frame you use with it.  For example, Saryn, Loki, Ash, and Ivara can make great use of the Gas build, while other frames might benefit from another elemental combo. 

Should you get lucky and get a riven for it, then you could do a Hybrid melee/throw build like I have below.  I built this one for melee combat, but the riven powers up the throw aspects.  This build is just evil for high level play as the mods synergize with each other.  This is just an example and doesn't dictate what or how you should build or play. 

Edit:  I forgot to mention that you also might want to avoid using punch through mods on the Orvius.  It has a tendency to behave weirdly when it has punch through.

Edited January 24, 2018 by DatDarkOne

[(PSN)Crixus044]

2 hours ago, Ovenface said:

Thank yooooou! I still have to level up my Orvius but I think i’ll do that tonight after work. Any specific mods you recommend on the Orvius?

http://warframe-builder.com/Melee_Weapons/Builder/Orvius/t_30_230000003_224-2-5-231-6-5-238-4-3-239-3-5-241-1-5-247-5-5-327-7-3-490-8-3-793-0-5_793-8-241-6-224-9-239-9-238-7-247-9-231-9-327-7-490-10/en/4-0-122/

This is the build I run with great proficiency. Don't mind the numbers you see, they are not exactly correct, meaning not correct at all lol. This build takes no forma, and I've put regular variants of Pressure Point and Fever Strike, but when you can, upgrade to the primed variants of those mods. Reason for the focus on toxin is because Gas procs scale their damage off of the toxin in the build, so heat is just there as an enabler and status buffer. Due to the crit potential being so high, true steel and Organ shatter are amazing options, but if you use something like an Arcane Avenger, or you have a harrow on your team, swap it out for a riven or Spoiled Strike.

Smite mod is there because even though it only looks like a small increase, the actual buff with gas is a 2.2x damage buff on gas procs. The reason for this is in the math, which is more complex, but if you would like, I can PM you to details. This is a strictly throwing build, for which if you would like a build to use with regular melee as well, this works just fine, though adding attack speed may be necessary.

Enjoy 

Edited January 24, 2018 by (PS4)Crixus044

[Ovenface]

Wow. Great detailed informations guys. I love this community. Thank you. I will level up my Orvius when i get home from work tonight. I’ll following these as i put the weapon together

[Ovenface]

@(PS4)Crixus044 @DatDarkOne

I've been trying to mess with the Orvius.... will this work for my purpose?  Should I be dual wielding to make the Orvius do its special mechanic or keep my primary equipped and toss it into my larve?  Also... can the special mechanic hit more than one target?

[Ovenface]

17 hours ago, DatDarkOne said:

 If you were to focus on the throw aspects, then things like modding for finisher damage and gas make it very powerful when using the Charged Throw. 

Could you please tell me where the glaive gets finisher damage from?  I'm trying to narrow down what kind of riven i'd like and if this is something I need to go after.... then i'll head that direction.

[DatDarkOne]

The Orvius charged throw is special in that it goes directly above the enemy and causes it to float in the air helpless while taking damage.  Because it is a melee weapon, it's attacks can gain the stealth melee multiplier as well as finisher damage and headshots.  Gas allows it to kill multiple enemies surrounding the initial target.  The gas damage would also benefit from all those additional multipliers as well.  

[Ovenface]

Ok I see. With Nidus and large/AOE spamming I don't think I'll get to perform any finisher damage too often. Great tip on the multiplier effecting the gas. That'll get my gears turning on other warframes

[(PSN)Crixus044]

9 hours ago, Ovenface said:

@(PS4)Crixus044 @DatDarkOne

I've been trying to mess with the Orvius.... will this work for my purpose?  Should I be dual wielding to make the Orvius do its special mechanic or keep my primary equipped and toss it into my larve?  Also... can the special mechanic hit more than one target?

Dual Wielding makes the special effect very easy to get and a whole lot more powerful, also since mods like Condition Overload stack on more status effects, having another weapon bringing in a whole other group of statuses means a bunch more damage.

 

8 hours ago, Ovenface said:

Could you please tell me where the glaive gets finisher damage from?  I'm trying to narrow down what kind of riven i'd like and if this is something I need to go after.... then i'll head that direction.

Finisher Damage comes from finisher attacks and slash procs,whose DoT is finisher damage. Unfortunately, this is not affected by Finisher Damage mods, but since the glaive has a guaranteed slash proc, it has guaranteed finisher damage. Again, this is primarily single target effective, but very effective nonetheless.

[Ovenface]

@(PS4)Crixus044 very cool. If you could recommend a couple of secondary weapons for dual wield, what would you suggest? Would weapons with Blight gain xp and activate the effect if i kill enemies with Orvius and Nidus’ number 1 ability? I put gas damage on my Orvius, if that helps narrow it down. 

Edited January 25, 2018 by Ovenface

[(PSN)Crixus044]

3 hours ago, Ovenface said:

@(PS4)Crixus044 very cool. If you could recommend a couple of secondary weapons for dual wield, what would you suggest? Would weapons with Blight gain xp and activate the effect if i kill enemies with Orvius and Nidus’ number 1 ability? I put gas damage on my Orvius, if that helps narrow it down. 

Depends on your mastery rank, but typically, weapons with unique effects make for the best synergies. Zakti is a prime choice since it has a lot of status and staggers enemies, opening them up to stealth multipliers, which give you 8x damage. Euphona Prime built for the shotgun mode is amazing since it's like a pocket Tigris Prime, unloading up to 5 status effects at once. I prefer Corrosive with Blast, but radiation with viral works great too. Due to the effect of 100% status shotguns, the blast of status can proc a whole bunch of corrosive, stripping armor by the shlong. For using with Nidus, usually, you'll need aoe or shotgun styles. To this extent, your choice of weapons is small but effective.
Zakti, Cycron, Kulstar, Angstrum (Prisma), Mara Detron, Euphona Prime, Sonicor, Syndicate Secondaries, Bronco Prime, or Brakk.
Any one of those will do you fine.

[Ovenface]

Thank you. I’ve been reading up on secondary weapons to see what will work in my specific case.  Does zatki’s gas effect leave a cloud that can continue to proc other status effects? 

[DatDarkOne]

4 minutes ago, Ovenface said:

Thank you. I’ve been reading up on secondary weapons to see what will work in my specific case.  Does zatki’s gas effect leave a cloud that can continue to proc other status effects? 

That one depends on the elemental combo you choose.  Not all of them have continuous effects.  I know Gas and somewhat Toxin does this, but not too sure about the others doing a proc more than just once.

Edited January 26, 2018 by DatDarkOne

[Ovenface]

With all of this and leveling up Orvius.... it won’t home in on targets in my larva

[DatDarkOne]

It won't?  That's interesting. You are using the charged throw right?

 

[Ovenface]

Yes. Positive its charged throw. The moment they get out of larva, it works fine

[DatDarkOne]

I guess it has trouble targeting a single enemy while they are caught in larva.  Interesting.  Thanks for the heads up on that.  

[(PSN)Crixus044]

14 hours ago, Ovenface said:

With all of this and leveling up Orvius.... it won’t home in on targets in my larva

Have you tried throwing it then casting larva? That might work better

[Ovenface]

I have not. I’ll try it tonight after i get off work. Thank you for the idea. I was so bummed out to find it worked this way.

[(XBOX)Skullstachio]

Orvius is one of the most Powerful weapons there is, Give it Condition overload & build it for just gas to go with the cold damage & it can do some serious damage.

on a side note: consider pairing it with the Cycron (Cycron Regenerates ammo overtime when not fired) but building Cycron for status chance & Viral Radiation can make a good difference (considering it still procs heat despite only labelling the statistics as dealing viral & radiation only) thus making it possible "Beforehand" to deal flame damage with 100% stat proc but the added viral & radiation go by the status chance statistic which can be increased with pistol pestilence and other such stat increasing mods.

However, when the beam weapon changes come in on console & the Cycron deals radiation damage, I'll be switching up the elements to deal corrosive & blast damage alongside its already awesome capabilities.

back on topic: an Orvius built for cold & gas with Condition Overload & a Cycron with different elements that the Orvius doesn't have can lead to some surprising results when combined.

for more possibilities on condition overload, consider checking out the warframe wiki page for it below.

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Condition_Overload

otherwise, refer to this sheet for details.

(Note that the Bullet attractor effect from mags abilities and the Scourges Alt. Fire count towards the Condition Overload)

Damage Multipliers

Status Effects	Multiplier
0	1x
1	1.6x
2	2.56x
3	4.10x
4	6.55x
5	10.49x
6	16.78x
7	26.84x
8	42.95x
9	68.72x
10	109.95x
11	175.92x
12	281.47x
13	450.36x

 

Spoiler

• The bonus damage gained by this mod is multiplicatively added to your melee damage.
  • It can be described as follows: Total Damage = Modded Damage × 1.6ⁿ (with n being the number of status procs currently affecting the enemy).
• Impact, Puncture, Slash, Cold, Electricity, Heat, Toxin, Blast, Corrosive, Magnetic, Radiation, Viral, and Void procs all apply to this mod for a total possible damage multiplier of up to 450.36x.
  • Blast procs consist of two distinct status effect components – the normal stun on recovering victims which is displayed by the icon and the knockdown which isn't depicted – that can stack for additionally increased damage, up to 720.58x with the procs listed above.^[1]
  • The damage increase from the knockdown lingers briefly longer than the one of the depicted icon.
  • Note that conditions or abilities that prevent knockdowns (e.g. Bastille) will hinder the second component from increasing damage.
• As of Update 21.7, Impact procs last 1 second.^[2]
• Status procs may originate from a source other than the player's melee weapon (i.e. primary and secondary weapons, Warframe abilities, other players, or the environment).
• Works with ability weapons such as Excalibur's Exalted Blade.
• The bonus damage is not applied to a hit which inflicted a new status effect; that means if a melee strike inflicts the first status effect onto a target, then this strike's damage (including its status effect and every DoT tick until the duration ends) will not be amplified by 1.6x. Only subsequent strikes will be amplified. Therefore, if a target already dies from the first strike that inflicts a status effect then Condition Overload is not of any use; it only is if the target survives this first strike.
• You cannot gain additional bonus damage by stacking multiple instances of the same status effect. For example, multiple instances of Slash or Toxin status effects.

Tips

• To achieve a high amount of distinct status procs, it is advised to use melee weapons that feature high attack speed with high base status chance and IPS like the Lesion or Glaive Prime. To achieve a high amount of distinct status procs for ranged weapons, it is advised to use weapons that feature high fire rate or AoE with innate elemental status, such as Staticor or Pox.
• It's also a good idea to use it when running any Warframe that can also inflict status, such as Saryn, Ember, Volt, or Equinox.
• Using in conjunction with the Artax Sentinel weapon is recommended, since it has a guaranteed Cold proc which not only adds damage but also slows enemies down, making them easier to chase and kill. Since Sentinel weapons tend to fall off against higher-level targets, the additional damage and utility from Artax makes up for the loss in Sentinel damage
• Using in conjunction with the Diriga Sentinel due to its chance to give an electric price with the Arc Coil mod equipped is also recommended
• Since Update 20.0, Corrosive (FX and icon) procs permanently linger on enemies which allows them to add bonus damage despite having no actual proc duration.^[3]

 

Edited March 9, 2018 by (XB1)Skullstachio
Added side note regarding the bullet attractor effect. (subject to Change.)