Dev Workshop: Warframes Revisited

[NinthAria]

Speaking as somebody who dearly loves Ember and still plays her more than any other frame out there: I don't play Warframe to do nothing. I can do nothing any time I want. I understand that sometimes people just want to get things done with a minimum of effort--hell, I've been there before--but I don't think it's too much to ask that the minimum effort path(s) doesn't rob the rest of the squad (or the player him-/herself) of their shot at engaging with enemies.

[paixdamien]

10 minutes ago, SordidDreams said:

Then don't play that way? That seems like a simple enough solution to me that doesn't require ruining the game for people who do find that fun.

i dont

[IDontKnowAName]

2 minutes ago, NinthAria said:

Speaking as somebody who dearly loves Ember and still plays her more than any other frame out there: I don't play Warframe to do nothing. I can do nothing any time I want. I understand that sometimes people just want to get things done with a minimum of effort--hell, I've been there before--but I don't think it's too much to ask that the minimum effort path(s) doesn't rob the rest of the squad (or the player him-/herself) of their shot at engaging with enemies.

With this idea, solo play is an option. If you want to run through a mission as fast as possible, play solo so you don't ruin other people's enjoyment. Truth be told, Ember is one of my most played Warframes because she was the first one I got, but I've tried other Warframes and learned, there are far more fun Warframes then the "press 4 to win" Warframes.

[BL4CKN0ISE]

My main problem with Mag is she just doesn't feel like a magnetic frame. When I first got her, I was so excited to get a female Magneto, but she just doesn't feel like that at all.

Why can't she just use her magnetic powers to manipulate metal? She should be one of the best frames against bullets/projectiles. Against beams, maybe not so much, but she definitely shouldn't be afraid of bullets. I don't want to pull enemies. I want to pull their bullets. I would love a defensive/offensive ability that lets Mag attract bullets/projectiles. Then she could turn it into a projectile she could throw at enemies. Something like the "Return to Sender" Vigor in Bioshock Infinite. I want to take the guns out of enemies hands, flip them around and shoot them. I want to pull explosive barrels and send them flying at enemies. 

I still love Mag's 2nd ability, but I think she should be able to just cast it anywhere. She doesn't need to be OP, but please make her more viable and fun to use. Just think "Magneto" and get creative. I NEVER see her in games, so I don't see a problem with doing a full rework. It's not just about making her abilities better. Some of them need to be completely different IMO.

 

[Misjah]

Must admit, i don't like the current Ember changes.

1. Equinox and partly Saryn can do the same, i don't see a problem with this.

2. I have a feeling that ember might become too squishy against ranged mobs when the ranged CC is removed, maybe consider a buff for this.

3 Again, i don't see this as a problem and i think this is a bad approach!

[AXCrusnik]

7 hours ago, [DE]Connor said:

Tornado - Tornado damage type now determined by largest amount of elemental damage absorbed, instead of last type absorbed.

So... does this mean elemental hierarchies are gone for Tornado? (please be so)

Currently if you want heat to be the primary damage of your tornadoes well... good luck it's the lowest priority. Literally any other element will wipe it from the tornado until the end of it's durration. Here's the list:  Corrosive,  Viral,  Magnetic,  Gas,  Radiation,  Blast,  Toxin,  Electricity,  Cold, and  Heat (ranked from highest to lowest).

[PraetorGix]

Press 4 to win is NOT THE PROBLEM. You can rework all you want but the root issue here is the insane amount of grind. You take away the tools to counter the grind but leave grinding time untouched. These changes are not making the game more fun for the other 3 players not using the cheese ability, it's making the game even grindier and more boring for everyone.

[Foberon]

They also said they will look to her augments (divebomb and tornadoes) espcecially divebomb since this power will no longer exist

[mkoo33]

Just now, paixdamien said:

Just now, SordidDreams said:

Then don't play that way? That seems like a simple enough solution to me that doesn't require ruining the game for people who do find that fun.

i dont

He doesn't play Ember. He's just whining about people who does.

[Lancars]

44 minutes ago, PsiWarp said:

I think Reb mentioned the animations aren't all in yet, she said sorry to somebody for showing this without them.

Oh thats good. Still if you jump with spectral scream you should instead flap your wings instead. use them more atleast instead of them only being active when you leave your pelt behind.

[Lith]

Please don't nerf chroma, this frame is great when you put 6 formas + 2 arcanes in to it, it is not op out of the box, why shouldn't a frame be strong after such big amount of investment? 

And even then the amount of energy it needs to be played is hard to deal with,  this makes chroma to a "veteran's" jem. 

Don't take it from us. Please. 

 

It is like in a mmorpg, your lvl 90 paladin shouldn't be as strong as someone's lvl 5 mage. It is ok that it is strong at lvl 90 as you have spent so much to make it this way.. 

Please people who have a chroma like me and feels the same upvote this. 

Have a great weekend guys, and thanks De for the amount of love and effort you put in to this game. Hope my thoughts will be heard... 

Edited February 3, 2018 by Lith

[DiabolusUrsus]

17 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

not always... just look at the number of threads about people complaining about leeches etc...

Didn't say always, I said "as many as."

Also, the existence of a separate problem does not justify the continued existence of its counterpart.

17 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

Also hydron (and similar) is a place where people go for a specific reasons, focus, levelling etc so most people want it done quickly and efficiently not take all day. 

Not everyone... and that's what pre-made groups are for. Recruiting chat, clans, and alliances exist. Use them, or talk to your team ahead of time and see what they are okay with. Simple courtesy would cut complaints about this playstyle more than in half.

17 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

As has always been said, if you do or don't want a specific frame in your team you have recruit chat...public groups leave you at the mercy of the other players and it's not their fault if you don't like their way of playing. 

Nope. If you want to farm efficiently, you go to recruit chat and find a group with other players whose priorities align with your own. DE has come down hard on this issue before and they're doing it again. Are you surprised?

17 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

edit: and for comparison, I spent a lot of time at hydron during the xp booster weekend, I can't even remember seeing a single banshee or ember....

Interesting, because they have >50% appearance rate when I go there. You might also consider that the double-affinity weekend made farming Hydron less important and players took the opportunity to visit other parts of the game with less of an efficiency penalty.

17 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

Oh and just to make it clear, I'm not saying ember wof is perfect but it is efficient in what players use it for which is clearing enemies quickly so we don't have to spend any longer than needed doing the 'boring' grind things. 

Again, just because it's boring for you doesn't mean it's boring for everyone else... so wouldn't you say it's kinda messed up to make it that way for them?

Seriously, if players using Quake Banshee or WoF Ember collaborated with their teammates instead of saying "well, you just have to deal with me; I'm in Public" these types of nerfs wouldn't be happening. Refusing to show consideration generates the complaints that lead to nerfs, so nobody should really be surprised at this point.

Novel idea, right? Not ruining someone else's game experience just because you can = less complaints = less nerfs.

[Lancars]

4 hours ago, Sajochi said:

They said on the workshop stream that she's getting a buff to her energy. One Primed Flow will have her at 700 for prime. I say prime because that's what was showcased. They also said they may change polarize aug since it is now redundant with the crush change. These details could have been put in the workshop. 

No! Unless crush gives over-shields that augment is not redundant since it gives over-shields. Even then to even get shields from crush feels Silly. It's a very clunky ability unless it grants max over-shields in one shot.

Edited February 3, 2018 by Lancars

[(PSN)shmittem]

Definitely exciting to see an old frame be made like new, cant wait

[MoscowDaniil]

I do not understand why to do such processing. Cut the radius and increase power consumption. This is such idiocy. She's a contact fighter, right? Right? She does not need your strength at all. It is important to the frequency of damage. And, I recall, her 4 ability is called the WORLD IN FIRE, and so she will have what? Feet in the smoke? Do so, by pressing 4, all around take off into the air, receiving tons of fire and explosive damage, and an augment leaving fire puddles after an explosion of enemies. This is still good. But not the nonsense that you are going to do. Do you have everything in order with the game design? Do people play the game to understand what is happening here?

 

Yes, i know, that my eng is no good.

[BL4CKN0ISE]

Nuker frames are just so good for grinding fissures and farming focus. That part of Warframe isn't about fun, so I never understand why people complain. It's all about efficiency. If you want players to crack open relics at a slower rate, you're the problem. The nuker frame is doing what they're supposed to do when we're grinding. You can play solo or play harder missions if you don't want to deal with one player getting all the kills as fast as possible. 

I guess people just enjoy different things. If I want to have fun in Warframe, I play the type of missions that nuker frames don't even work on. Sorties, T4 Survival, etc. 

Edited February 3, 2018 by BL4CKN0ISE

[Lancars]

Please don't change it and don't make crush the only way to get over-shields. Crush you have to stand there and cast it like a sitting duck to get shields? No. I like polarize the way it is with the augment. Don't make Mag clunky. Please!

[Foberon]

18 minutes ago, AXCrusnik said:

So... does this mean elemental hierarchies are gone for Tornado? (please be so)

Currently if you want heat to be the primary damage of your tornadoes well... good luck it's the lowest priority. Literally any other element will wipe it from the tornado until the end of it's durration. Here's the list:  Corrosive,  Viral,  Magnetic,  Gas,  Radiation,  Blast,  Toxin,  Electricity,  Cold, and  Heat (ranked from highest to lowest).

They told in the stream that it will do 100% of your weapon damage on everyone inside your tornado just by shooting the tornado

[SnuggleBuckets]

I just posted this on that main topic but I'll quote it here incase anyone happens to be interested in my twist on the ability:

I think Ember should instead always have had a Fire Proc priority and armor stripping with every new explosion, with a fire DoT effect being reliable but not immediately lethal (scaling with the more explosions stripping more armor over time).
This would allow utility in making enemies weaker to yourself and allies, having lots of enemies suffer fire procs in a wide radius to help you and allies in picking them off, and over time perhaps killing them if no one has gotten around to it yet.
No increasing energy cost, no increase in damage, no reduction in radius, just pure CC utility.
World on Fire being an ability that's slowly cooking enemies alive and making them feel really uncomfortable in their little metal suits.

I had in mind something like keeping all of those radius and energy costs at the same level, but change damage dealing on two levels: First, enemies in range lose 1%/2%3%4% of their health every second, and each explosion hitting them does flat 25/50/75/100 (maybe less is more, perhaps just 10/20/30/40?) damage, While stripping 5%/10%/15%/20% of their base armor on each hit, with a 30%/45%/60%/75% status chance. I was thinking that status chance and armor stripping could definitely scale with power strength, and power duration could increase status duration, but maybe the damage% and damage hit per explosion should not scale with power strength, the % damage would still slowly ramp up though.
Just a thought I've had for a long time on how to make Ember fun and useful for herself and all allies.

[AXCrusnik]

4 minutes ago, Foberon said:

They told in the stream that it will do 100% of your weapon damage on everyone inside your tornado just by shooting the tornado

I did not ask about the amount of damage done to enemies or if it is affected by weapon damage. I asked if the game arbitrarily decides which elements are better than other based on some bullS#&$ list someone made instead of what is actually best for the current situation determined by the one who is actually playing the game at the time.

• The damage type of a tornado will not be changed if the new damage type has a lower priority than the current damage type (e.g., changing the default Magnetic damage to Corrosive damage, which has the highest priority, will prevent the tornado's new damage type from being changed by other sources for the ability's duration).

Edited February 3, 2018 by AXCrusnik

[lodoubt]

Salty Chroma mains intensify (I have a 4 forma Chroma which apparently means I am a pathetic scrub. Frankly Chroma felt pretty undefeatable right out of the box as long as you could keep Vex up). If it is, as stated, that this just tunes down Vex damage a touch, I can't see any reason to be upset, I can understand that it is largely impossible to balance the game around it presently. I mean, it is possible for it to be nerfed too far though, obviously. Will be keen for the Vex team buff to have similar range to Ward in order to encourage people to run a little bit of range on Chroma.

The other tune ups look pretty good. A little concerned about Atlas in that Petrify's general awkwardness of use was the reason people were so critical of the ability, and both aspects have really only been halfway fixed, but that might be enough. I'm not sure if the Ember change will really alter behaviour that much either but we'll see I guess.

[Foberon]

8 minutes ago, AXCrusnik said:

I did not ask about the amount of damage done to enemies or if it is affected by weapon damage. I asked if the game arbitrarily decides which elements are better than other based on some bullS#&$ list someone made instead of what is actually best for the current situation determined by the one who is actually playing the game at the time.

i think they said that the element will change based on who did the biggest damage or something like that, it doesnt follow the curent priority system 

i was wrong i dont know

Only this information exist Tornado damage type now determined by largest amount of elemental damage absorbed, instead of last type absorbed

Edited February 3, 2018 by Foberon

[dreadgame]

Warframe filter in matchmaking would've been enough... Meh we'll see how useless she becomes when she dies of every hit from mid range shots in the higher levels. Changes haven't been made yet after all so give it a chance.

[Mkilbride]

Everything about this update makes me not want to keep playing.

[(PSN)big_eviljak]

1 hour ago, ADDgamer45 said:

Seriously they know she is only good at low levels but decide that instead they will make it even more difficult to survive. Plus if you actually play ember you know that 200% damage is literally nothing.

I endgame with my ember all the time. Never understand why people say shes weak in top tier.