The Temporary Future of Warframe Trials

[emblema]

4 minutes ago, Firetempest said:

The last one created was 1 1/2 years ago now.

 

and?

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

13 hours ago, (Xbox One)ExoSin said:

I think the current form of the game excludes combat. How many kills do you get in the average capture mission? The average Sabatoge? People stop to kill when they need to. In mobile defense, you kill when you get to the terminal, people don't often clean house all the way to the terminal. Trials throw more enemies at you and have you linger in said areas with the enemies. A mobile defense is very easy until you get to the part where you need to actually defend. At this point, the enemies catch you, and you have to fight them. In LoR, the enemies catch you at four injectors, and during the Simon says puzzle. Since there is no where to run, people took to the next laziest route: CC.

I play as the Trinity in my raid group. I can safely say that I get more kills in the sabatoge mission of LoR than I do in any sortie sabotage. My least favorite part of all three raids is the area where you must do a round of infested salvage in JV. People claim that the raids aren't in the same spirit as the rest of warframe, and I'm willing to bet the part of JV that is literally a mission on Eris is not anybody's favorite part.

In a Grineer sortie Hijack I would play as Inaros and literally sit emote on the core. My friends often join me, sometimes they smash boxes, sometimes they emote to shake my hand. In NM LoR every member of my team is busy doing something. Mission failure is at stake, the tension is high, and everybody is busy with something to do. NM LoR Tram section is objectively more engaging than a sortie 3 hijack, even at 20 levels lower.

I would also, on any day of the week, do the third phase of vay hek 5 times in a row before even considering the normal vay hek assassination. I think section for section LoR is a more engaging version of it's normal mission counterpart. I'm obviously biased, I've heard the argument that the entire raids is "go here and stand on a button". You can distill any part of warframe down to the mundane monotony if you want to. Shooting enemies is putting your cursor on them and clicking.

 

I think the raids succeeded in designing an environment that pushed players towards conflict and engaged them far more than the average warframe mission, and I don't understand how people feel that it's not in the spirit of the game. I would love some light shed on this from the other side, because all I usually hear is that they are "boring" without any further information. Most missions in warframe are boring. It's the gameplay itself that's fun.

I have to disagree here. I, myself, as well as quite a few of my viewers on my stream AND in my clan, all LOVE going to town -throughout- the missions. Obviously some missions you could be there all damn day if you just kill every enemy as they constantly spawn until you accomplish said task, but honestly, I LOVE fighting enemies in any mission type. Anywhere.
NOT just when I "need" to.

I did not, however, find the "combat" areas in LoR enjoyable in the least.  Too many "No! Don't do that! Do THIS! Stand HERE!  You have to use your x skill!  You're not allowed to fight!"  etc.....I'm not here to be someone else's battery or tool.  I'm happy to contribute, but I find little to no satisfaction in just taking orders and mindlessly running the same mission.

[emblema]

24 minutes ago, Firetempest said:

 

Because every single one of them is a coding developer.

they are not ...but they have plenty to take care the BUGS!!

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

10 hours ago, dimo145 said:

**First, they came for the Raiders, and I did not speak out - Because I did not raid at all. Then they came for Conclave players, and I did not speak out - Because I did not do Conclaves. Then they came for the Kuva Nodes, and I did not speak out - Because I was not invested in Riven market. Then they came for me - And there was no one else left to speak for me.**

y'all are nuts.  DE isn't out to get anyone.  "Noone loves cattle more than Burger King."  That's a quote from an episode of Doctor Who, but I find it makes the point well here.  DE is a business. It RELIES on its customers for income.  Mind you, they don't even charge you to play the game!  Why would they purposely sabotage something you love?

...Unless maybe, just MAYBE, they know some things you all DONT know about what IS coming in the future....and you just need to friggin' trust them a bit that it MIGHT be something youll enjoy!  Jeez...

[AzureTerra]

1 hour ago, emblema said:

Well --Q--Captian the voice of the community counts a lot spread the voice.... 

The "voice of the Community" is known for Whine and not a lot else

[(XBOX)ExoSin]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

I did not, however, find the "combat" areas in LoR enjoyable in the least.  Too many "No! Don't do that! Do THIS! Stand HERE!  You have to use your x skill!  You're not allowed to fight!"  etc.....I'm not here to be someone else's battery or tool.  I'm happy to contribute, but I find little to no satisfaction in just taking orders and mindlessly running the same mission.

My group has been speedrunning LoR.  We just shaved a full minute off of LoR and the biggest difference made was kills. We had almost DOUBLE the kill count of when we only tried relying on CC like a normal raid group. You wouldn't enjoy a normal mission if the group you were in was yelling at you to only cc, so I understand why you would not enjoy a raid under the same circumstances. Don't play with groups who don't understand the raid enough to run it properly, play with your group on your style and you may enjoy it more.

Most people have played in a survival with that one particular min-maxer who tries to order the entire group into a closet to camp out. Most people don't even bother listening to him, but when somebody in a raid tells people to play a certain way, they decide to begrudgingly do it, and then it sours their experience.

8 minutes ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

I, myself, as well as quite a few of my viewers on my stream AND in my clan, all LOVE going to town -throughout- the missions.

I'm not bashing this playstyle, but I feel you are in the minority. By all means, play however you have fun, but warframe is well known for having players who min-max everything. Min-maxing missions means usually running past everything.

[Captain]

33 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Sinister Hawk 2 said:

Also on another note, if they do get rid of the raids despite the protests. They should at least give the Vets that have completed it more than a dozen times something special. Anyone could do the raid once and get carried through without understanding anything that was happening.

The “special” thing they get is a head start  on the arcane grind. Since they also buffed a few arcanes recently too, the people who have sets for those arcanes can now profit off of them.

[_Vortus_]

1 hour ago, emblema said:

Well --Q--Captian the voice of the community counts a lot spread the voice.... 

What counts are the stats showing how many players play that aspect of the game.   Its been a while, but when DE last posted them, raids were about as popular as Conclave and Lunaro.   Conclave is still here, and they removed raids.   Raids less popular than Conclave?   No, bury the current incarnation of raids, and bring back one that is better where more people want to play it.

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

4 hours ago, Sean said:

 

That... doesn't make sense.

It would be understandable for them to remove JV and leave LoR due to the plethora of bugs that come with JV and Steve saying "fixing the millionth JV bug".

 

They could work on something behind-the-scenes, then when it is ready to just take out out the current trials and then replace them with the new. There's no reason that they would have to remove code in order to work on it.

You don't tell the plumber how to fix the pipes.....Maybe we shouldn't tell DE, professional game developers, how to fix bugs and deal with coding issues? Just a thought.

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

3 hours ago, Naesqr said:

You can't have fun with eight people in the squad anywhere else.

Yes you can.  PSN Party Chat.  Streams.  Clans can have multiple people in room at once, as can relays and Cetus.   8 in squad at once though?  Oh, what will my poor ears do without all that noise? :(

[Sean]

Just now, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

You don't tell the plumber how to fix the pipes.....Maybe we shouldn't tell DE, professional game developers, how to fix bugs and deal with coding issues? Just a thought.

 

Please stop spamming this topic, beyond your incessant need to try and bait people, it doesn't actually add anything to the conversation.

The majority of this page and the last is filled with your posts that can't seem to fathom that DE may in fact not be 100% trustworthy when considering their past track record.

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

2 hours ago, Xzorn said:

 

First off I don't care how easy something is to get. In fact the longer something takes the more play time I get. My issue is how those vaulted Relics are attained. I don't want to play PoE. I'm done with it. I finished everything and nothing in PoE interests me. I find it repulsive that DE continues to try and carrot-on-a-stick players into mediocre game play that got old in a week.

Second. I never complained about Focus costs. Not once. Do not include me in a group of self-entitled casuals who want everything for free. By the way, calling me a tryhard then claiming I'm part of said group who'd complain about a long term grind is pretty short sighted.

If an Artist tells me their going to paint something to the likes of XYZ then I watch it progress to X-- then XY- and suddenly it comes out TQW then you're damn right I can be upset at that artist and I can also not pay them. The fact you even think this is about creativity amuses me. This is about money. It's a Business first. This is about opening the game to the widest audience of brain dead candy-crush whales they can for profit while minimizing the influence Veterans can undermine those profits.

You said it yourself " Vaulted Relics are easier than ever to get " You think I as a 5 year player care about easy? I want engagement and fun.

...And yet they've never charged you a dime to play any of it. Ever.   

Also, you complained about your 9 million focus you have nothing to spend on.  That is what I was referring to.

[Hypernaut1]

No. Break up raids and turn them into separate levels. 

[emblema]

17 minutes ago, AzureTerra said:

The "voice of the Community" is known for Whine and not a lot else

For the Whiners that cry all day they want to make the game easy 1.2.3 done only! and envy members that can achieve clan/alliance DS  and Raids ...please 

[emblema]

17 minutes ago, _Vortus_ said:

What counts are the stats showing how many players play that aspect of the game.   Its been a while, but when DE last posted them, raids were about as popular as Conclave and Lunaro.   Conclave is still here, and they removed raids.   Raids less popular than Conclave?   No, bury the current incarnation of raids, and bring back one that is better where more people want to play it.

i hate the new Conclaves i loved the old conclave Lunaro is Junk! but i need to respect people that likes them ...Amen.

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

13 minutes ago, (Xbox One)ExoSin said:

My group has been speedrunning LoR.  We just shaved a full minute off of LoR and the biggest difference made was kills. We had almost DOUBLE the kill count of when we only tried relying on CC like a normal raid group. You wouldn't enjoy a normal mission if the group you were in was yelling at you to only cc, so I understand why you would not enjoy a raid under the same circumstances. Don't play with groups who don't understand the raid enough to run it properly, play with your group on your style and you may enjoy it more.

Most people have played in a survival with that one particular min-maxer who tries to order the entire group into a closet to camp out. Most people don't even bother listening to him, but when somebody in a raid tells people to play a certain way, they decide to begrudgingly do it, and then it sours their experience.

I'm not bashing this playstyle, but I feel you are in the minority. By all means, play however you have fun, but warframe is well known for having players who min-max everything. Min-maxing missions means usually running past everything.

Whether I agree 100% or not, I appreciate your civil response ^_^  I gotta say, you're right about there being alot of Minmaxers, and I feel that might be one of the issues facing, not just Warframe, but gaming in general today.   It's all about numbers and efficiency vs artists trying to tell a story and create an experience.

I'm a magician, that's my full-time career, and I fancy myself a storyteller when I perform.  I do not just spit out tricks, one after another.  I take my time and tell a story, giving what im doing -PURPOSE-.   However, there are times that I come across audience members who want to rush me through my story because they feel it "gets in the way of the trick".  When they say that, I realize that they didn't get what I was about to begin with..

And that's something I think alot of players (not @ you, just saying in general) need to come to terms with.  IF you find DE is "doing so much wrong" with how they run -their- game....it might not be DE.  After all, an artist cannot paint a picture "wrongly".  It is art, after all, an is an expression of their vision, however that comes to fruition.  But if you find consistently you do not like that artist's paintings, it is by no fault of the artist, but rather likely you simply have fallen out of love with their style of storytelling.

For every audience member I deal with who doesnt like my stories, I do not apologize, and I certainly do NOT change my act...I might, however, refer them to another magician who IS fast & furious with their tricks.  

Different =/= wrong   ... so we need to stop telling DE they're "messing up" and start asking OURSELVES what we love about Warframe and what else we might want to do with our time.  It's ok not to play sometimes, ya know lol

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

14 minutes ago, Sean said:

 

Please stop spamming this topic, beyond your incessant need to try and bait people, it doesn't actually add anything to the conversation.

The majority of this page and the last is filled with your posts that can't seem to fathom that DE may in fact not be 100% trustworthy when considering their past track record.

Not baiting, just joining in the discussion.  Sorry if you disagree with me, but I'm as entitled to my opinion as you are to yours. 

Speaking of...what track record of DE's are you talking about?  The 5 years and still going record?  Or the award nominee record?  I lose track, there are so many....

[(XBOX)ExoSin]

3 minutes ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

For every audience member I deal with who doesnt like my stories, I do not apologize, and I certainly do NOT change my act...I might, however, refer them to another magician who IS fast & furious with their tricks.  

This is all we want. We found the stories we like. We want DE to not change them. As the consumer, using a product given to us, and as a community thousands strong, we just want to keep raiding.

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

1 minute ago, (Xbox One)ExoSin said:

This is all we want. We found the stories we like. We want DE to not change them. As the consumer, using a product given to us, and as a community thousands strong, we just want to keep raiding.

The metaphor here was comparing the other magician to another game, not to another mission type xD

 

[(PSN)thowed]

Yeah because recruitement chat is full of raiders wanting to help new people and aren't constantly spamming "must have experience" or "so and so frame".  I couldn't care less one way or another but just thought that part was kinda BS.  Also I'm sure alot of people that want it to stay is just because it's a plat flow with arcanes, which nothing wrong but just say that.

[(XBOX)ExoSin]

3 minutes ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

5 minutes ago, (Xbox One)ExoSin said:

 

The metaphor here was comparing the other magician to another game, not to another mission type xD

Yes, and the stories would be the missions. You said you wouldn't change them because people aren't suited to them.

I.E. D.E. Shouldn't change a trick because it's ill-received by some.

[Sean]

12 minutes ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

Not baiting, just joining in the discussion.  Sorry if you disagree with me, but I'm as entitled to my opinion as you are to yours. 

Speaking of...what track record of DE's are you talking about?  The 5 years and still going record?  Or the award nominee record?  I lose track, there are so many....

Appears like baiting and trying to spam as you are posting back-to-back, you even made one simply to tell a person to stop using commas; you do know you can MULTIQUOTE, right?

 

I can cite their behavior first of all within this very topic, often deleting posts that followed the rules but they did not like.

 

I can cite how they often delay things perpetually

- AW is still in a very unpolished state

- Umbra has been pending for a few years now

- Focus took a few years to even see a rework it needed

- Dark Sectors took 3 years for a mere MENTION of something happening

 

Then there's where DE is muddying words by saying "Temporary Future" then later saying "they won't be returning", but "Trials" will make a return on something not remotely similar.

All of the current eidolans don't require any communication unlike the current trials, and the gameplay within Trials was actually something unique, unlike the new bullet sponges. Also with the eidolans, it will only start forcing people to specific team-setups, where with 8-player Raids, there could be freedom in what people went in with and you could even bring along a newbie to show them the ropes.

[TiGeR-X]

Can DE replace the raid when they finished the rework without remove it? I prefer this. 

[Guest]

19 minutes ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

Not baiting, just joining in the discussion.  Sorry if you disagree with me, but I'm as entitled to my opinion as you are to yours. 

Speaking of...what track record of DE's are you talking about?  The 5 years and still going record?  Or the award nominee record?  I lose track, there are so many....

Actively ignoring community feedback on what could be done to fix the Raids, improve Focus and make it good instead of the grind it still is, setting up a poll for an Augment mod for Ivara and then ignoring the result, outright lying and deleting a vital piece of gameplay that they promised they wouldn't and pushing away the Vets that play it to pander to the new players who can't even fight Eidolons, the fact that "temporary" has been 3 years+ with the Rails only now getting barely a mention, threatening to sue a 17 year old for a misunderstanding and then not acknowledging that it happened at all, deleting posts they don't like in the forums simply because they can, oh and Archwing I guess which is still awful... among other things.

The disconnect between what these "professionals" say they do, I.E. listen to feedback and always count on the community, and what they actually do is pretty big if you actually pay attention. They're actively acting unprofessional and lying. Betraying the trust and love their vets, many of which are founders who gave the game the life and money it would've never gotten in the state it was back in the day, and pushing them away with all this new pandering.

P.S. Getting a few relics in "less than an hour" is not something that's good. The Plains are utterly broken and bounties still fail regularly on their own, or the doors don't open, etc. it was more reliable to try and get relics off normal missions and we got them in bigger numbers even with the more saturated drop pools because those missions actually worked half the time.

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

5 minutes ago, Sean said:

Appears like baiting and trying to spam as you are posting back-to-back, you even made one simply to tell a person to stop using commas; you do know you can MULTIQUOTE, right?

 

I can cite their behavior first of all within this very topic, often deleting posts that followed the rules but they did not like.

 

I can cite how they often delay things perpetually

- AW is still in a very unpolished state

- Umbra has been pending for a few years now

- Focus took a few years to even see a rework it needed

- Dark Sectors took 3 years for a mere MENTION of something happening

 

Then there's where DE is muddying words by saying "Temporary Future" then later saying "they won't be returning", but "Trials" will make a return on something not remotely similar.

All of the current eidolans don't require any communication unlike the current trials, and the gameplay within Trials was actually something unique, unlike the new bullet sponges. Also with the eidolans, it will only start forcing people to specific team-setups, where with 8-player Raids, there could be freedom in what people went in with and you could even bring along a newbie to show them the ropes.

Alright, not that I owe you any explanation for why i do what i do, buuuuut since you asked...

I am simply quoting and replying to posts AS i read them and replies come to me.  That's all.  I'm not trolling. I don't have the time or interest in such childish things.  

As for the things you claim DE is lacking in.  You know these "fixes" do not just -happen- overnight, right?  Those few years you claim it took Dark Sectors to get a mention...it wasn't just sitting on a desk until last thursday...it's BEEN getting worked on.  It's only recently that YOU learned of an update on it.  Not that it happened.

DE doesn't charge us, they don't OWE us.   They create this game FOR FREE and they CHOOSE to SHARE this amazing experience with us.  Why are you all crucifying them for wanting to rework and give you MORE?  Hell, if that's what it means to be a fan, I hope I never have any.  Don't need that negativity