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[DE]Megan

The Temporary Future of Warframe Trials

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I'd love to see them come back in a more fun and engaging format... But I think its best they go away for awhile.

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PoE is a Proof of Concept.  That's it.  It was something fun they added to see how it would play out, and it seems more is in the works.  

And I'm saying that they may have gotten the ad not because they COULD spare the money but rather because they needed to take the chance to MAKE more.  You gotta spend money to make it.  I run a business, so yes, I do have valid experience in such matters and can speak on it. 

And I was clarifying my comment to Sean, not to you.  I already said I'm not gonna split hairs with you all night.  I've got more important things to do, thanks.

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Now, I'll be the first one to day that raids were a mess and were obviously in need of some reworking, but the ideas shown behind their removal and them being substituted with eidolons fight as an equal replacement- honestly kinda scares me.

 

"Taking down a Teralyst mirrors the tactics of a Trial in terms of teamwork and communication"

No it doesn't, you need 0 communication to take down a teralyst, you just need to know that you have to bring shields down with operators. And that's it.

Not to mention that they're easily soloable, although that takes longer.

You'd expect in a team-based multiplayer game to have missions that actually require you to have a team...

 

"but can also be done as a lower-level player if properly prepared."

Now THAT is what scares me. You always like to brag about how you listen to your community, well I don't know for how much longer you can cover your eyes: since Void 2.0 the players unanimously asked for one thing: endgame.

If the only endgame-ish rewards that there ever were was arcanes, how comes that they'll be soon available to lower-level players.

Why can't we still have a challengening-ish mod, just one, that rewards the players for actually taking care of their equipment.

 

Also not to mention that there's no way arcanes will not lose their value, even if you make them all 10x as powerful as they're now.

the reason? You just wrote it yourself: lower-leveled players have access to them aswell without needing a particulary good equipment or skillset.

 

Now I just want to point something out: if the players have no reason to acquire powerful gear/improve and polish the one they have, why would they keep aimlessly grind for stuff they're not going to need? They won't. They'll just quit. This is what I'm scared about, and the devs in my eyes clearly don't see it.

 

Well, that said, take it as you will. I'm not bashing devs or anything, but if you're fine with spammers saying that everything is perfect and adding 0 value to conversations, but not with veteran players pointing out constructively the flaws in your grand scheme, or ignoring their feedback, let it be so.

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Welp - there goes about a hundred of us. Can't help but salt, I will keep it low sodium. **would bite my tongue if we were told straight. It's clear that only a handful of us are particularly attached to raids...what incentive is there to sugarcoat this?** pls no sycophants ty.

How lovely to be recognized for our loyalty and repeated completion of the trials!  In...the post where you are announcing their removal.  Conclave events once a year (even one is too many - I know, it's different. But salt), finally when we managed to get players interested in the game, the mode will be removed. At least we won't waste our time testing and failing the alleged "fixes" every time there is an update or hotfix. Out of ~10 error reports I was replied to once. One time. Response was to complain on the forums instead (kind of don't feel comfortable posting my ee.logs here but different strokes, eh?).

I suppose that is all I can say. Would have much more respect for a company and game that so many of us devote time to if you gave us more clarity/honesty than a few sentences about the fact that these are being removed because the future's so bright! How many times have y'all been honest about the countless failures and erroneous patch notes on fixes? It's understandable that this game, company, and situation would resolve in such a way - yet all we get are sparkly soundbytes :D thanks for caring about us so much and saying so many lovely things. We're so enamored we forgot that in about ~3 years of failed fixes (NOTE: I completely understand that mistakes are made ^^ This is the only dev I have ever seen repeatedly post erroneous patch notes and refrain from any sort of apology. A simple "our bad" would have done...wait I don't even need that, it would have been fine if half of us received.

Enjoy the revenue from new players ^^ makes sense that the small percentage of us who actually expend effort to attain items, to attain platinum, to complement our gaming experiences - become expendable when kids acquire steam gift cards for Christmas. How will I be compensated for the 150+ raid keys I have built? Looking forward to swift delivery of whatever that reimbursement will be. I'd inquire to support but as I said, I've received one reply telling me to come here.  Oh well.  It was a good run, bois. Note to self: file Warframe with the rest of the open world sandbox flowery nonsense. Guys, guys! At least we have infested salvage, defection, and whatever else that causes us to lose brain cells ^^ Cheers.

EDIT: 2+ years = temporary...// my full sodium was outed ^^

Edited by h0tsp4ce
pointed out contradiction in the title of the OP :) + max salt :p
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17 минут назад, h0tsp4ce сказал:

 low sodium

Don't promise what you can't keep, it's whole point of this thread.

Also I probably should say to my grown friend he is Steam card kid, with his decades of gaming expierence, 12-hour working day and wish for game to be more accessible (it's =/= easy ffs).

Edited by ThousandLights
typos

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2 hours ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

Yes you can.  PSN Party Chat.  Streams.  Clans can have multiple people in room at once, as can relays and Cetus.   8 in squad at once though?  Oh, what will my poor ears do without all that noise? :(

Yes, let me just go and buy a Playstation 4 right now to hang out with 8 friends. Let me go to my clan, a relay, or Cetus with 7 others to kill Grineer enemies and Infested monstrosities while solving complex puzzles. You can't queue into a mission with 7 other people anywhere else in the game.

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Raids have such a knowledge barrier to entry which is harder to overcome on console and a required squad of at least 4 killed any hope of me ever getting arcanes since i have only a couple friends and get nervous talking with people. I'm at mr 23 for reference. So i'm glad for this change even if temporary i can possibly get arcanes without someone trying to gouge my eyes out over them.

And raids as a whole as the devs said have outdated mechanics that haven't updated with the game  and in some cases they feel goes against it like just standing on buttons so they want to rebuild raids to be better and more accessible to players but they currently can't devote the time WHILE ALSO every update consistently borks something in the raids drawing more manpower to something so rarely played frankly i feel conclave beats it out or at least conclave won't literally break every update.

  So i see nothing wrong with getting priorities straight for now and taking them out cause we know next update they'll be uncompleteable again and "vets" who love raiding can just take a break if that's all that keeps them here because Warframe isn't going anywhere.

Edited by (PS4)Yes-Man-Kablaam
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6 hours ago, emblema said:

Let's Keep The RAIDS! Warframe Community step-UP!! 

Hello everyone! i saw on devstream that DE was thinking to remove the Raids and this upset all my Clan/ Alliance and warframe members , i absolutely think that DE is doing a big mistake! RAIDs  kept high end player busy on helping newbies  (Like the Dark Sectors) playing as a teamwork and help growing  the warframe community, i think the reason is not because no one is playing raids ( big lie that was made-up please look at links  https://wf.christx.tw/  https://wf.christx.tw/JordasRecords.php?type=all) because DE is diverging all player on playing EDILON !

Like i say before when DE Developers created the Raids kept all players busy and still today me and members  love raiding i wish they would come-up with new maps like the Corpus Raid and other maps, i understand that they are running  out of ideas for price loot ( DE please ask for any ideas/suggestion on forum ) like with new Arcanes but i think that other alternatives   can be like adding  Riven Mods Weapons and more stuff, they can also create Cetus/Edilon Raids (but please 8+ players so it looks more like a real open world) make the game more challenging , create clan raids , Alliance Raids yes why not on Cetus/Edilon ,Developers use more imagination keep your clients busy make them happy.

Please leave a positive feed back lets fight for our Raids!

QODqnPp.jpg

giphy.gif 

Vay Hek's classic statement which never gets old. :highfive:

Edited by IIWingSaberII

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sorry, but I do agree with DE - sometimes we need to get rid of old trash stuff to get something new and useful

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17 minutes ago, Atekron said:

sorry, but I do agree with DE - sometimes we need to get rid of old trash stuff to get something new and useful

That's a pretty bold statement for someone with no trials completions or attempts.

But that seems to be a common theme around here. 

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1 hour ago, .chcesz.piwo. said:

That's a pretty bold statement for someone with no trials completions or attempts.

But that seems to be a common theme around here. 

so now you see where is a problem? I had played this game more than 1000 hours and have no interest in such "raids" whatsoever

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7 hours ago, Darkvramp said:

and the fact that there is no connection with some the mechanics in the raid and the rest of the game. i cant take information from the base game and say oh  i know this and use that base knowledge on a wider scale with greater complexity.  while LoR teaches you the mechanics, there are all these barriers to entry, and JV is just terrible because everything was new (until the glast gambit), and it requires a gear item, management of a third stat bar that's nowhere else in the game, JV is bad at this

There is no connection between raids and base game because the base game is shallow that there are no mechanics that can be used in a proper raid. Furthermore, that uniqueness is the whole point of raids. In most games, raid content is specifically made with unique mechanics to stand out from other content. You are supposed to learn different mechanics for different raids, that is the entire point.

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5 hours ago, ElGuirrix said:

They can just leave the raids here and replace them when the new ones are done, just like any other update, but they should put time and effort into that so that we don't need to wait years for that to happen.

I think that was mentioned on the stream. Their coders have to look at the Trials when a bug appears there. Taking the time where they could be working at something else.

 

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Since some of you only value input from people who have done raids, I've done them.
https://wf.christx.tw/search.php?id=Navarchus

I'm very glad to see trials get removed to get reworked - they're a waste of resources right now. There's an absurdly low amount of people doing trials - and of those who have trials most don't do it again. It's not the end-game they had in mind, it's not executed the way they wanted it to be and they have to work on it every single patch.
The game has since evolved a lot and they're able to make something much more enjoyable if they take them away and rework them.
7lnYEm0.png 

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2 hours ago, .chcesz.piwo. said:

But that sems to be a common theme around here. 

Yeah might mean it's time to get out of that hug box and come into the real world. Where people disagree and raids get removed so they can be reworked.

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2 hours ago, .chcesz.piwo. said:

That's a pretty bold statement for someone with no trials completions or attempts.

But that seems to be a common theme around here. 

Not nearly as common as the 'elitist' theme though.

:clem:

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My issue with people posing an opinion about raids when they haven’t done any is that they don’t know anything. If you’ve never done raids, you don’t know anything about them.

Of course, everyone is allowed to voice their opinion about raids, but I don’t see the point of people saying “remove raids” if they’ve never done them. How come “raids are dead” and then when DE says they’re going to remove them suddenly all of these haters of raids suddenly show up. When did raids ever affect you? If you’ve never done raids why are you so hell bent on supporting DE and getting the game mode removed? 

We are the playerbase, we are the community that DE makes content for. Instead of supporting the decision of DE, I suggest trying the raid or even just supporting your fellow players. We are all in this together, the update changes the game for everyone.

It’s like the prime accessories pack they talked about on the last stream: the community asked for it and they responded. There’s no reason for anyone to say no to it because it doesn’t affect anyone negatively, so people should support them being added.

If you’ve never done a raid, I respect your opinion, but I don’t see why you won’t/can’t support other players in trying to get raids back if you have never tried a raid. If you don’t do them then there’s no way they can have a negative impact on you.

Once again, I respect all opinions and appreciate all responses.

Edited by --Q--Captain
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2 hours ago, Navarchus said:

Since some of you only value input from people who have done raids, I've done them.
https://wf.christx.tw/search.php?id=Navarchus

I'm very glad to see trials get removed to get reworked - they're a waste of resources right now. There's an absurdly low amount of people doing trials - and of those who have trials most don't do it again. It's not the end-game they had in mind, it's not executed the way they wanted it to be and they have to work on it every single patch.
The game has since evolved a lot and they're able to make something much more enjoyable if they take them away and rework them.
7lnYEm0.png 

I 100% agree, raids are in bad shape and have been in need of a full blown rework for quite some time now. If anyone questions my credentials on raids here are my runs:

https://wf.christx.tw/search.php?id=S0V3REiGN

 

note that in am missing close to 30 - 40 Jordan raids because bugs didn’t count them.

Edited by S0V3REiGN
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People bring up the Dark Sectors Argument of raids being out of commission as long as they were, I don't see it. Unless they do some crazy super overhaul like they did for Dark Sectors, cause remember the old Dark Sectors was PvP, and we all know how  the general player base responds to PvP related content. Autistic rage is a phrase that comes to mind.

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11 hours ago, trst said:

They're not leaving permanently

Yes they are. In the devstream they said that ther is a high chance that they will be gone forever in the state as we know it ( 8 players, puzzle gamplay...). I will also point uot that they've said they will come back soon but they've said the same thing 3 years ago for the dark sector, and look at them now. Tehy are bad and i tell you why: they will add more repetitive gamplay on top of another (why don't they add new maps insted of recicling old ones); you are forcing a type of gamplay insted of another becoouse you need to play with a certain setup to go faster in the dungeon while with the raid you can play with litterally anything (zanagoth videos are an example of that); their idea of competion is pve and based on a leaderbord is completly orrible compared to what dark sector where; i lso remind all that after 3 years this is all they've come up with; an excuse they've made was "the rials don't rapresent the fast paste gamplay of warframe" bulook at the new dark sector, really DE?

By the way for the same logic of "it requires too much work to fix things that we have to remove it" they will have to remove archwing, conclave, and many other things. Why don't they leave raid as they are and update when they are reworked? if their blaming players for coplaining about the state of the raids and this made them want to remove trials then why don't ignore complains like what they've done with dark sector and do what is right to do (not killing community). And don't tell me they've listened the community when they've announced dark sectors becouse this has nothing to do with dark sector and competition between clans. Naming somthing drak sector doesn't mean their returned. 

Not to mention that they are already talking about the new tennocon but we still haven't seen or heard about umbra, announced at the last one.

  

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1 hour ago, --Q--Captain said:

My issue with people posing an opinion about raids when they haven’t done any is that they don’t know anything. If you’ve never done raids, you don’t know anything about them.

Of course, everyone is allowed to voice their opinion about raids, but I don’t see the point of people saying “remove raids” if they’ve never done them. How come “raids are dead” and then when DE says they’re going to remove them suddenly all of these haters of raids suddenly show up. When did raids ever affect you? If you’ve never done raids why are you so hell bent on supporting DE and getting the game mode removed? 

We are the playerbase, we are the community that DE makes content for. Instead of supporting the decision of DE, I suggest trying the raid or even just supporting your fellow players. We are all in this together, the update changes the game for everyone.

It’s like the prime accessories pack they talked about on the last stream: the community asked for it and they responded. There’s no reason for anyone to say no to it because it doesn’t affect anyone negatively, so people should support them being added.

If you’ve never done a raid, I respect your opinion, but I don’t see why you won’t/can’t support other players in trying to get raids back if you have never tried a raid. If you don’t do them then there’s no way they can have a negative impact on you.

Once again, I respect all opinions and appreciate all responses.

Great example of closed mindedness, listen to opinions, facts and reason but isn't willing to accept the Truth or change their views even with all the evidence presented in front of them. Raids in their current state are objectively bad for the game, they break with almost every major update, mechanically detached from the rest of the game more so than POE (Which should be impossible considering how old LOR is.), having more in common with World of Warcraft than anything else in Warframe and required constant patching just to barely keep it playable.  

Time and energy spent yet they are still a steaming hot mess, such effort wasted could be used else where finishing content that actually add more to the game improving the experience for the approximate 20+ million (registered, not concurrent) players instead of capturing to the rough 15K "dedicated"  minority.  I personally would like to see Raids improve and be something great, but keeping them in means they would need to be supported, making changes everytime DE updates lighting system, sounds systems, physics, damage types, armor types, enemy scaling, new warframes launch, weapons launch just for a mode less than 5% even plays. It simply needs to go back to the drawing board.

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38 minutes ago, PR1D3 said:

People bring up the Dark Sectors Argument of raids being out of commission as long as they were, I don't see it. Unless they do some crazy super overhaul like they did for Dark Sectors, cause remember the old Dark Sectors was PvP, and we all know how  the general player base responds to PvP related content. Autistic rage is a phrase that comes to mind.

Dark Sectors didn't receive a crazy overhaul. They just scrapped the original concept entirely and made a fairly basic rendition of rift system. It didn't take long because of how complex the new Dark Sectors are, it took long because they didn't work on them until recently.

The comparison is apt, not least because DE has compared the two themselves. But also because they were asked about the future of Trials on devstream, and they weren't able to give any info at all. Just some vague "Uh, we want trials to return at some point, be more accessible" that clearly shows that they have exactly zero idea what they are doing with Trials. They just want to remove them, and bringing them back is the problem of future-DE.

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A quick reminder here to keep things civil.

Everyone has an opinion about the trails and raids, and all of them have some merit. However, reverting to abusive behavior and threats does not put these points across well. Have a discussion and try to empathize with the people taking with you.

If you want things to change, the best way to do so is to bring up valuable points with your reasoning for why you dislike a change, and what you would do differently to create a compromise. Insulting, flaming and baiting do nothing but get your opinions relegated to the trashcan, and potentially, warnings from the mod team.

Please remember to keep it clean and keep it civil, folks.

GAME ON.

Edited by SilverBones
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