Update 22.12.0: Warframe Changes Feedback Megathread

[Mr.Snipersmiley]

13 minutes ago, (Xbox One)AntiCaesar said:

Preach

Not sure how to interpret this sooooo...thanks?

[--RV--ChaosStar]

Well about Chroma and his changes.

" Vex Armor 

- Fixed a longstanding issue with number calculation being multiplicative. Boosts now apply before upgrades instead of after, making the ability consistent with all other damage boosting abilities. Overshields are now considered for Vex Armor. Chroma's Vex Armor remains one of the top performing damage-multipliers in the game - and it's now an aura! Instead of just being focused on Chroma, it can now benefit allies in range."

This all sound like good changes, and the damage buff from a fully charged vex armor is still nice. The thing I don't understand and I'm a bit pissed right now is: why is my former 200% power strength Chroma 10 times more tanky than my current 269% power strength one? No where in the update and build notes did I read anything about the numbers for Scorn being changed. To begin with, I was never much into eidolon hunts, my pc is too slow for me to enjoy them. Chroma on the other hand is my most played frame, and I'm a player nearing 2,5k hours in mission. Right now Inaros can face tank better than Chroma, while also being immune to status effects. Chroma was indeed tanky but he had a high risk factor to him and all his tankines meant nothing once enemies were stacking toxin on yoy for the infected or any other faction would hit you with a slash proc( both at high enough level if course). I don't know if this is because of both scorn and fury being part of the same ability, but since they are buffs for different aspects of the frame( armor value and weapon damage multiplier), let scorn utilize the old calculation system and keep the new one for fury.

[Agente_GentlePhoenix]

I would prefer to look at the clients discussion feedback too

Edited February 15, 2018 by Agente_GentlePhoenix

[johnnymish]

Now how about adding quest BPs to the market or quest screen after completion of their respective quests?

[Princess_Lilly]

only feed back i have is drop the rank restriction on items that people can buy with silver and drop rank all together its dumb 

[djpotatobread]

Been playing a lot more Atlas since the rework and he seems so much better than before. 

The rubble mechanic is a nice touch, however the duration on the armor buff seems way too short, wearing off just before the Bombard rocket lands. 

Petrify is amazing now, all the props to whoever redesigned that. 

Overall the new changes make Atlas an interesting CC/summoner with his new set. Landslide is as good as ever, but I can just kick back and petrify people before a rumbler takes them out.

[N64Gamefreak]

It's a little ridiculous when you're in full sprint using an archwing (even with Hyperion Thrusters equipped), and other players using Zephyr's Tail Wind leave you in the dust.

[DarkRuler2500]

Ok, I've tested all the frames that have been changed.

Ash: Nice tweak it certainly has some good quality of life. The old bladestorm 2.0 and (the bladestorm 1.0) was making me feel sick because of the movement jumping. This one has some good quality and if you feel like it you can boost it by jumping in it. All that is left is the tedious "marking" time which could use some improvement. Rating: 8/10

Atlas: Is probably jump from an unused frame to one of my mains. I love his new mechanics. I love to petrify an enemy troup in their tracks, curshing them and increasing my armor. Rating: 9/10

Banshee: I be honest,I used her Resonating Quake. The changes now are mediocre. Sadly Banshee is squishy, although she has nice CC and nice stuns. I'd love it if the quake would not just stun but ragdoll enemies sometimes. Sometimes the effect seems to be missing although being clearly in range. Rating: 5/10

Chroma: Got Vex armor recastable and a bug and tweak to his 1st. Although the first skill still is only mediocre it can CC with every element besides toxin. But with the Vex armor recastable and affecting allies as well, Chroma, has gone from ego to a teamplayer. Chroma might not deal insane damages but when buffing the team , the damage might be even higher combined. Rating: 8/10

Ember: Got her fourth nerfed in range. I liked Ember for being a nice passive CC and being a little less squishy because of firequake. Now I'd need lots of more range to have an efficient CC range but then I would loose so much strength my skills 1-3 would become totally useless! I am very disappointed and sad that my frame (that I even bought TennoGen cosmetics for) was that nerfed down. 2/10

Gara: The Glass shield gets more health when glassing more enemies? Nice mechanic for higher content. 8/10

Hydroid: Well that seems to be no more than a bug-fix in my eyes. So no rating here.

Mirage: Well small quality of life choice. Also no rating because incredibly minor change.

Rhino: Again, this seems to be no more than a bug-fix in my eyes. So no rating here.

Volt: Nice damage buff of Discharge and a (reasonable) nerf for enemy stuns far away. I like it because it prevents CC-locking enemies two rooms further ahead. Rating: 8/10

Zephyr: Miss "Why-is-she-even-in-the-game". This was what Zephyr had been for me. I disliked everythign about her and although the tweaks certainly did her better, she's still far away for me to be considered good! Her 1st now combines 3 abilities (Jumping up, Flying forward, Crashing Down) but the angle between crushing and flying is sometimes very unreliable. Sometimes i want to crush into an enemy but I am just flying over him and other way round. The 2nd is ok, does nice CC but is terribly slow, it should really be affected in projectile speed by the augment 'Jet Stream'. The shooting of the 2nd in the tornados perhaps could not just make the tornadoes faster but also make the tornados shoot air-bullets onto nearby enemies upon hitting it. The 3rd remained largely intact and that's good because that's one of Zephyr's constantly good skills. Her fourth still remains a huge mess. The tornadoes might follow your aim and might even increase in size with air-bullets but sadly the CC is unreliable and even when shooting it with weapons, the damage remains low. The changes I rate with 7/10 but the overall state of Zephyr is still 3-4/10.

[TyrianMollusk]

On 2/9/2018 at 6:45 PM, [DE]Danielle said:

Warframe Changes Feedback Megathread!

This thread will house all of your feedback on the Warframe changes Update 22.12.0 brought! We believe these changes make our wide Warframe roster more diverse and fun to play. We will be listening to your responses, so please keep feedback respectful and constructive. 
 

My partner and I were trying out the new Atlas, and besides general disappointment at how the rubble mechanics are working (ie, transient, weak, and generally irritating), it quickly became obvious that running two of Atlas does not work at all.  Atlas's powers seem completely individual and disjoint between players.  Eg, if I petrify something, my partner gets nothing from shattering it.  Is this intended?  It seems, well, awful.

[KenthNisshoku]

Make Effigy scale from Vex Armor and have it follow us 

[Dragazer]

My thoughts on the issue of the new vex armor formula: https://www.reddit.com/r/Warframe/comments/7wsrsn/chromas_vex_armor_calculation_seriously_needs/

Plus additional calculations someone else did to showcase the issue: 

16 hours ago, (PS4)Crixus044 said:

First off, these tests are not optimized and have inaccurate formulas. I urge you to read back in my previous comments and read Xzorn's.

Fir your armor calculations, you're purposely leaving out Elemental Ward, which taints your results.

Let's clear up your scenario first. The actual formula is Armor = Base x (1+Base Armor Mods+Base Armor Abilities), So for you, it would be 350*(1+1.1+5.07) = 2509.5

Previously, it would've been (350*(1+1.1))*5.07 = 3726.45

This difference in EHp is 6930.1 to 9932. It's a 30% loss in EHp, and that's without counting Elemental Ward, which you'd be incorrect to not consider

Now let's do this correctly and include an actual tank build with decent power strength of 200% far under optimized builds but over your 145% PS build, which is not really strong, and use Elemental Ward. In the olden days, you'd have (350*(1+1.1+1.5*2))*(3.5*2) = 12495. Now, you'll have 350*(1+1.5*2+3.5*2) = 3850.

The difference in DR is vastly different when this is considered. Let's go by EHp. Using Vitality alone, your EHp would be 31,561 before, but now, it's 10,237. This is a 3rd of our EHp and less than every single tank in game.

About Fury, the fact that it's a base damage buff means that not only is it less effective with other chroma's but with other weapons. Most weapons have serration or something of equal strength (+165% base) on their weapon. Others though have rivens or more popularly Heavy Caliber, which I bet 90% of people use on most their weapons. Hornet Strike has a +220% Base Damage buff and Shotguns have the very popularly used Blaze to add on +60% damage. Now let's go to the extremes and compare 299% Power Strength Chroma vs 299% Power Strength Rhino just to favor Chroma as much as possible since Roar doesn't scale well with strength.

299% PS Fury with Serration/Primed Pressure Point: <2.975x buff.
299% PS Fury with Serration and Heavy Caliber: <2.22x
299% PS Fury with Hornet Strike: >2.635x
299% PS Fury with Primed Point Blank and Blaze: 2.61x
299% PS Roar with anything: 2.495x.

So at first, Fury is a slightly better buff with anything except Serration and Heavy Caliber/Rivens. Let's talk about what it doesn't do though. IT doesn't buff abilities, it has a lower duration, requires you to remain with the chroma, and requires chroma to take damage, which with his reduced EHp is more dangerous than before (Unless you run self-damage, which has never been a valid argument for any warframe and was usually changed for all other frames, chroma may soon follow). Now here's where things get weird. You say chroma is good because he stacks and thus he can survive in a team. But here's the thing. let's add another 299% PS Fury in it's best situation ,which is with serration only.

299% PS Fury with Serration and another 299% PS Fury: <1.664x
299% PS Roar with Serration and Another 299% PS Fury: 2.495x

So there's the actual math. Yes chroma is better for damage (Barely) and not always, but it's far from a swing vote for the tankiness loss. 

 

Edited February 15, 2018 by Dragazer

[Parvikistan]

I would like to address the topic of Ash's changes. I've been having a couple of ideas harbored in my head since his first rework. 

Now then, the issue here is Bladestorm, an ability that used to be a press 4 to win in many people's view and redundant because of it's time to kill to other people. After the rework it feels, at least to me, not that great. In the time it would take to mark an enemy, with a decent gun that enemy would be dead without having to first mark and then execute the target. Love the idea of synergy with his Smoke Screen and the visual effect of activating Bladestorm. So with that in mind, let's get to my opinions for his 4th ability.

First off, I would like Bladestorm to be more interactive. To that end I propose transforming it into an Exalted-Blade like weapon,with a couple of unique mechanics to it. First, love the wrist blades, would love to see more of them. Second, custom stance with slash and/or finisher combos (custom finishers, for the extra style xD ), bit more single target focused than EB. Third, love the smoke effect of the Bs activation, keep that in; to keep it in tone to the stealth element maybe give it the passive of the Rakta Dark Dagger, reduced detection range. Finally the enemies turning to ash when killed should be an option reserved for channeling energy into melee, actually having to make a choice and spending energy for stealthier gameplay. 

Of course, these are just my thoughts and opinions, but I'd like to see other fellow Tenno impressions or critiques xD

[xXJohnSmithXx]

Ember's 4 nerf is useless: with an efficiency build, you just have to spam WoF every 15 sec, it's annoying, but it let's you ignore the changes.
Then that means you can still farm the hell out of low level ennemies.

However, her CC (with her WoF augment) is now, imo, pretty useless at high level: you can't easily kill enemies thanks to scaling, so you don't have the energy to spare in both spamming her 4 or maintaining at 100%, and the halved range just force you to turn into a kamikaze, having to run into enemies to CC them (and only at a small range).
 

Since I believe you wanted to nerf the range to prevent Ember to just farm everything, I find this nerf quite useless

[XaoGarrent]

I just want to say I have *no* idea what people are talking about with Volt. I've done everything with him from bog standard endless relic farms to sorties, top level bounties and kuva floods. Not only does he consistently DPS the whole freaking map but he's got great tools in the form of a party speed buff and his shield.

I think people need more time with this one.

Or maybe not, maybe everyone should just forget about Volt. I'd rather they not Ember him.

[UjaAca]

About Atlas' Rubble mechanic:

Why is Rubble mechanic introduced?

On 2/10/2018 at 12:45 AM, [DE]Danielle said:

Rubble (new mechanic)
 - Comes from killing petrified enemies. Atlas collects rubble to restore his health, or temporarily increase armor if already at max health. Rubble has a singular decay. Picking up more rubble delays the decay for a brief time.

By this, the only way to obtain Rubble is to kill a Petrified enemy. So instead of gaining bonus armor by just killing petrified enemies, you have to look at the floor.

On 2/10/2018 at 12:45 AM, [DE]Danielle said:

Landslide
 - Killing petrified enemies with Landslide generates bonus rubble. We have also increased the contact radius at max rank from 1.5m to 2m.

This could be: Killing petrified enemies with Landslide generates more armor per kill.

On 2/10/2018 at 12:45 AM, [DE]Danielle said:

Rumblers 
- While casting, creates an AoE around Atlas that will petrify any enemy that comes close.
- Rumblers create rubble when they expire, based on how much health they had

Again, Rumblers don't interact in any way with Rubble (e.g. Rubles gain strength/more duration/do AOE blast explosion/petrify nearby enemies... when they/you pick up Rubble)
This way, it can just be: Rumblers add armor to Atlas once they expire, based on remaining health.

The same goes for Tectonics. It doesn't interact with Rubbles, it interacts with Petrify. Since we don't have something in the lines of: Rolling picks up Rubbles and makes it stronger - this is not a synergy, it's a gimmick.

 

So to sum up:
1. Remove Rubble mechanic.
2. Adjust Atlas' passive: "Becomes immune to knockdown effects while on the ground. Regenerates health and generates additional armor by killing petrified enemies."
3. Killing petrified enemies with abilities generates 60 armor, killing petrified enemies with weapons generates 40 armor, ally killing petrified enemies generates 20 armor.
Ooor:
Make a synergy between all abilities to have a way to use Rubbles, not to only generate them, since Petrify is the only real usecase when player will generate Rubbles consistently.

Edited February 16, 2018 by UjaAca

[Cryone]

12 hours ago, XaoGarrent said:

I just want to say I have *no* idea what people are talking about with Volt. I've done everything with him from bog standard endless relic farms to sorties, top level bounties and kuva floods. Not only does he consistently DPS the whole freaking map but he's got great tools in the form of a party speed buff and his shield.

I think people need more time with this one.

Or maybe not, maybe everyone should just forget about Volt. I'd rather they not Ember him.

The questions are: For how long you've played him? Have you ever had a shot with him in 40+ survival AXI missions? Do you know what it is consistent DPS? According to [DE]Scott tweet Volt's is something else, but not CC warframe, but he's still Electricity elemental damage type warframe, that as much as i know, has a CC status effect, Volt's not Chroma, so the only use of his damage type is crowd control, there's no way he can melt down enemies, for example like all time TOP DPS Mesa (maybe until damage 3.0), next thing - Volt lacks of survivability, he has low based armor, he has low based hp, but high energy pool and shields (Capacitance build), still dies in about a second if not covered with Electric Shield, so in this case he's not a tank (until Shield Gating, maybe not). He has Speed, yes, useful support skill, that everybody hates, because of two things: if you use high strenght build on Volt, you can barelly see anything what's going on running aroung the map (for squadmates, personally have medium/good reflexes) if Volt press the button, second option - w/o strenght build it's useless for Volt (because of low base sprint speed) and for squadmates, Speed affected players also have 17% (max level) reload speed...Harrow Penance....i'll just leave Harrow and Penance... (Speed is not good Support ability in this case) What about Discharge: almost same thing, it's quite good for clusters of unarmored enemies, but the ability has a very very bad disposition for damaging armor units, also to be mentioned it has 4 second damage delay, duration/range damage/cc reduction, and last but not least Tesla coiling that prevents damage for lonely enemies, aaand...just to add you can be easilly killed during animation of Discharge if you are not covered with Electric Shield.  

ALTERNATIVE FOR GUNPLAY - This is what (Volt) he is!

Hope that my little description will help in some way to understand that Volts kit not perfect, because there's already perfect version of Volt, Nezha, that has speed, has tanking ability, has mobility and very very good CC (w/o any efforts to modding/building). So, probably you are right, but only in one thing - we probably should forget him (VOLT).

 

P.S. Sorry for my saltyness, but i'm still waiting for something consistent since U18.13.

TL;DR Volt has alot of problems.

 

SCOTT's Tweet

Spoiler

 

 

Edited February 16, 2018 by Cryone

[Mover-NeRo]

From my point of view Ember and Banshee reworks failed in delivering needed change.

Embers abused build can still run thru coridors killing low-mid tier enemies without stoping. Only diference is its not two rooms ahead but only one. 

Embers CC build suffered alot. What was not point of this nerf.

Banshee dps build is changed..some say the dmg is weak some say its better but you just dont stand still. Anyway the augment change didnt do anything to real camping build which is max range, high efficiency, no dmg CC build. Which can sit and CC map for really long time.

So i really dont get it.

[Derethevil]

According on how everyone reacts if you try to make clear that DE tinkered with something that was fine usually... And just one thing broken. Instead of fixing the bug they just changed the whole ability itself. Lazy it is. Tho i guess DE won't revert the armor rating so  you at least aren't made of cardboard.. 

Oh who am i talking to? Those who go beyond lvl 20 enemies know exactly that the nerf was too hard.
And those others who are never go past that will of course be fine with the changes and not even try to understand that we aren't talking about the damage.

The problem was the double dipping or triple dipping if it came to Vex Armors fury buff. Instead of fixing it, they completely changed it.
That was the only real issue with him.

But wait! There is more! Now they also changed the Scorn armor value. Something nearly no one ever mentioned to begin with. Most were crying around because of the high damage numbers he were dishing out. 

Eh...
I'm gonna take a big break from Warframe now. 
I spend an awful lot of time on Chroma and now have to shelf him. And this wasn't the first time this happened.
Now i just wait till Rhino and other tanky frames get nerfed to the ground, since... this is what we are going for now?

There is no reason to play, if every little thing you achieve or gain will be changed soon in a horid way so you can't play it the way it first was meant to be.
No thanks.

[UdsUds]

Make Zephyr air time movable like Wukong's cloud..

Then again if I would ask greedily would be OK to be able to toggle hover on an off.

eg.

Charge it and its on, will drain energy/sec holding charge while aiming horizontally or above will propel you towards thus lets you boost than once so you can gauge how HIGH you want to go. 

Spoiler

dont do drugs kids

Charging it aiming at an enemy (same level of you while flying like ships) or when looking down will dive bomb a target (enemy below specially in the plains) or an area. (this is cool) ... more details is that when you charge and was like aiming for a capture target you will lock dive bomb towards them HOMING :D

* this will not lock you for other action until you click the ability again while flying towards the target... (you can shoot , cast and do other stuffs while flying towards the aimed target or location)

* speed of flight is affected by STR? (I'm not good with deciding this. If its implemented would like STR as you go slower flight speed because of  overextended)

 

Edited February 17, 2018 by UdsUds

[Cytobel]

After trying out Atlas seriously for the first time ever, I'd say the rework is pretty decent.  I still feel as if he needs more raw HP to start with, and the rubble needs to have a larger pickup radius (if I'm being greedy, I would also ask that rubble count as health orbs for abilities and mods that care about such things), but he's much more playable.

I will note that his wall (2nd ability thingy) is as useful as teats on a boar hog, and the Rumblers are just really expensive rubble-in-waiting (it's not even much rubble either), but I can feel good about playing this stony bruiser against most mobs.  Unfortunately, MOST MOBS is the operative phrase.  Atlas is still surprisingly delicate at times, so T4-type Void missions are not exactly to be recommended.

As to changes, easier pickup on the rubble comes first and foremost.  Next up, maybe rubble from Path of Statues as well?  That's 2 QoL suggestions off the cuff.

As to mechanical alterations, a redesign of the wall is called for...  Sorry, but there's no saving a wall that a half-drunk shepherd could outdo, and at nearly the same speed as Atlas.

The Rumblers are sort of a joke in my eyes, but whatever.  If they're here, then let them petrify on cancellation (I thought this was a thing, but I haven't seen it work), AND let them drop a sizable quantity of rubble on death.  They would then act as living, punching petrification grenades that are also medkits for Atlas.  They could also drop health orbs on death, granting Atlas a modicum of beneficial team-play.  As he stands, he needs the extra healing.

Speaking of healing, Atlas' health pool is somewhat shallow.  Bumping him up to closer to 1000 health (with Vitality on, of course) would let him survive considerably more damage while still carrying a build focused on ability usage, making him more action-oriented.  That's the key for me, continuously doing something.  Else if, I just fall asleep.  He needs more raw HP in order to accomplish this, but not too much more.

Realistically, this Atlas is CLOSE.  Very, very close.  A few tweaks that we don't currently have mod space for (without an Augment slot, that is), and he'll be just about perfect.

Edited February 17, 2018 by Cytobel

[DarthKaijin]

Atles change is a improvement but only prolem I have is his 3 ability. 

• Petrified enemies are completely immune to status effects. Any duration-based status effect, such as a Bleed proc, that is applied before an enemy is petrified will be interrupted until Petrify wears off.

I did some test and I find that enemies 60 and higher dmg falls off alot if they are perrified. So untIL they remove that part no point playing atles. He becomes a hinder more then anything. 

[An8rchy]

So, when will Ember be buffed ? this nerf was completly redundant
U can still nuke low lvl missions, and other frames can do it better

Ember needs her range back. 
At least acknowledge  she is dead at this point, she needs more than 3 abilities that set enemies on fire ....   

[Borg1611]

I thought I had heard or read that bladestorm was going to remove corpses if it killed enemies, which makes it seem like it could have been a new alternative to stealth farming. Unfortunately it seems to still break the stealth multiplier, leaving us with only the same old stealth multiplier frames on Adaro until you theoretically eventually do something about focus acquisition outside of farming Eidolon's in efficient meta groups or doing things like stealth farming of Adaro. 

It seems like a frame advertised as one of the more aggressive stealth frames should be able to actually take advantage of the stealth multiplier. 

[Cornelius.EE]

@[DE]Danielle Please consider further feedback on Ember. Here is what I have after one week of testing the changes. I also posted a detailed evaluation of the WoF change earlier in this thread.

1) Fireball:

• The fact that the residual flames can proc Heat is nice and can give some extra CC, but the duration is a little too short to be used effectively for area denial. Making the duration modifiable by mods would make this much more useful.
• The charge effect is fun, but the damage is too weak to be useful. Fireball requires direct aiming, and I can usually deal way more damage with my gun in the same amount of time. Fireball's primary function is emergency single-target CC while reloading or moving. Ember is an energy-hungry frame (now even more so), and using Fireball to directly supplement weapon damage is very inefficient. The charge mechanic could be made useful if:
• Charging extends the duration of the residual flames
  AND/OR
• Charging increases the buff from Fireball Frenzy (given that it's already hard to hit teammates that are moving like Roborovski hamsters who've had too much caffeine, I think this would be fair in terms of difficulty/reward)

One minor annoyance voiced by teammates was that the Napalm-like flames hindered their vision whenever they received the Fireball Frenzy buff. Perhaps the flames can be made more transparent? I think that'd be useful, especially for players who don't want to give up using brighter energy colors - Fashionframe and all that

2) Accelerant:

- This is by far Ember's best and most unique ability (when the augment is used). No complaints here.

3) Fire Blast:

• The damage buff is very welcome, but still not enough to make the ability useful. With a 244% strength build, Flash Accelerant provides +122% heat damage to the whole team and Fireball Frenzy provides an additional +244% to everyone other than Ember. An extra 50% is not worth it given Fire Blast's high energy cost and the restriction of shooting through the ring. Restricted mobility means death at high levels, and the ring's unmoddable radius does not help. Please remember that heat damage already needs special circumstances (e.g. 4xCP when dealing with Grineer and Corrupted) to be useful compared to other elements.
• Fire Blast has the following problems _{(keep Snow Globe in mind for comparison, since it is conceptually similar)}:

1. Does not knock back targets that are on fire (unlike Snow Globe)
2. Range is not moddable (unlike Snow Globe)
3. Damage buff in not moddable (to be fair, slow % is not moddable on Snow Globe either, but see below)
4. The flames create no barrier without the augment since the ring damage is negligible at higher levels (Snow Globe slows everything in its range while active without needing an augment; also, Snow Globe can deal finisher damage that scales with enemy health)

• Please consider implementing at least some of the following to give players a reason to build for and use this ability:

1. Make the damage buff scale with power strength (from a QoL perspective, an icon with buff strength would also be appreciated)
2. Make ability and ring radius scale with power range (modding for range would not make this OP because the blast is already line-of-sight-limited, and sacrificing strength for range hurts Ember's other abilities)
3. Transfer the augment's function to the base ability, but make status chance scale with ability strength
4. Change knock-back mechanic so it works on enemies that are animation-locked (e.g. on fire)

4) World on Fire:

I've already discussed this at length in previous posts, but here goes:

• I mostly agree with the motivation behind the change: WoF was OP below lvl 50 or so, required little effort to use at those levels, and made other players feel irrelevant
• However, I have a serious problem with how this was addressed, because the change hurts Ember's high-level viability, especially with high-strength builds

Energy drain is now excessive. Even running WoF episodically leaves much less energy to refresh buffs on teammates. This is a problem because:

1.  Even though this wasn't the most popular way of using Ember, her most effective builds for sorties involved high strength, Flash Accelerant (optionally also Fireball Frenzy) for team DPS buff, and CC from WoF (without Firequake)
2. So under some circumstances (e.g. 4xCP, viral + heat weapon builds), Ember could give a better DPS buff than Nova or a Rhino of comparable power strength, while with the same build also providing decent CC from WoF heat procs (not Firequake)
3. Now Ember can either be a good but very finicky DPS buffer (much weaker than Banshee or even Octavia under most circumstances) OR a sub-par CC provider (with low strength, high efficiency, Overextended, and Firequake). She cannot do both good DPS and CC at the same time anymore, and that was the only thing that previously made her even remotely worth using above lvl 80 (of course I'm just talking in terms of effectiveness; there are other reasons to use a frame such as fun, aesthetics, etc.)

The energy drain would have been restrictive but manageable on its own, but combined with the reduced range, it really kills Ember:

1. The reduced range is not enough for reliable CC anymore while the increased damage, which was supposed to compensate for this, is still predictably irrelevant at the levels where CC becomes useful
2. Using Overextended works, but kills Ember's strength, which her other abilities require to be usable. This also necessitates the use of Firequake because of the reduced WoF status chance. Firequake usually reduces team DPS (see my previous posts) and is therefore sub-optimal
3. Without Overextended, toggling WoF on an off to preserve range still allows for good CC. However, the activation cost means that Ember does not have enough energy to keep buffing allies, which again means she has to choose between CC and buffs

Please consider implementing at least some of the following changes. These still keep WoF from killing everything at low-levels, while keeping it viable in sorties and beyond:

• Revert range and energy drain changes. Make damage fall off with range
    OR
• Revert range and energy drain changes. Make WoF always do zero damage beyond half-range
• Keep the range and energy drain changes, but reward players who play actively but making weapon kills slow or reverse the counter
• If insistent on keeping the new mechanics, please at least dial back the numbers a bit. Making the energy and range penalties start at 15s (or even making the initial timer affected by mods) or capping the range penalty at 33% instead of 50% would go a long way.

Please, there are ways of correcting WoF without making Ember (as much as I hate to say this) objectively one of the worst frames in the game. Also (and this is specifically addressed to the members of the Dev team who came up with these changes), what is the deal with making so many of Ember's ability mechanics unaffected by mods? One of the main attractions of this game is customization in terms of both playing style and cosmetics. Good design = balanced game without artificial/arbitrary restrictions. There are ways of making something not OP without putting it in shackles!

 

Edited February 18, 2018 by Cornelius.EE
All edits: various spelling and word use corrections

[DeadMansChest]

TBH, I'd rather DE just revert Ember's change in its entirety until they get an actual, proper rework in place instead of leaving her awkwardly sitting in the corner for several updates where Oberon was several updates ago (to whom also sat in that corner for a long time)

 

I say that simply because the nerf did nothing to combat the issues that were meant to be addressed and only hurt her already tight CC capabilities.

Edited February 18, 2018 by DeadMansChest