Ember on Fire, Frozen Frost, Electrocuted Volt, Magnetized Mag, Poisoned Saryn

[(PSN)creativedsign]

I always find it strange to see Ember (goddess of fire) on fire, or mag losing energy due to a magnetic bubble or frost being slowed by cold. How is this still a thing?

Can we get a passive:

- Ember immune to fire proc

- Frost to cold

- Mag to magnetic

- Saryn to poison

- Volt to electricity

Just like Atlas immune to knockdown lol 

Let's apply a little logic to the gameplay.

[Badgriuel]

I was thinking of making a post like this as well. It doesn't make sense that the frames that are attuned to specific elements don't have a passive damage resistance to those elements. 

[Bionicme]

- Flamethrowers can combust

- Coolers can freeze

- Magnets can be attracted

- Venomous animals can be poisoned

- Electronics can be electrocuted

- People can try

But that's about it.

Edited February 13, 2018 by Bionicme

[(PSN)creativedsign]

Just now, Bionicme said:

- Flamethrowers can combust.

- Coolers can freeze.

- Magnets can be attracted.

- Venomous animals can be poisoned

- Electronics can be electrocuted

- People can try

But that's about it.

Combust is a blast. Not fire lol I'm not asking Ember to be immune to rockets lol 

We r not specified on which specific poison saryn is spreading. So let's simplify - fire is fire, cold is cold and magnetic is magnetic lol 

[Kalvorax]

immunity? no (to OP). but resistance or even less duration from the effect...yes

[Railgun]

Mesa immune to bullets. 
Nekros immune to death 
ZEPHYR IMMUNE TO AIR

[Birdframe_Prime]

You're a little late to beat this dead horse, this has been raised and rejected by DE multiple times. The answer is that no, none of the Warframes get passive damage/proc immunity.

There's also all the other reasons, like only about three enemies in the game inflict Cold procs, two inflict cold, one inflicts electric, but dozen or more inflict Fire. The materials for Ember are the same as Rhino and he's flammable, and also if your sole purpose is to heat things up so they catch fire, that doesn't mean you can put it out again.

And then there's also the other Elemental users. What about Nezha? Or Nyx and Oberon? What about Rhino and Vauban? Even Loki uses Blast, and so does Frost in his 4 (freeze for the base damage and a 5th of the total damage is a blast at the end of the animation). If you start this, where do you stop?

Basically, the lore doesn't support it, gameplay results for who gets buffed and who doesn't is unbalanced... It's not going to happen mate.

As a side note, though:

15 minutes ago, (PS4)creativedsign said:

Combust is a blast. Not fire lol I'm not asking Ember to be immune to rockets lol 

Combust literally means 'to burst into flames'. A thing that is Combustable is flammable, can be set on fire or burned.

[Badgriuel]

48 minutes ago, Thaylien said:

You're a little late to beat this dead horse, this has been raised and rejected by DE multiple times. The answer is that no, none of the Warframes get passive damage/proc immunity.

There's also all the other reasons, like only about three enemies in the game inflict Cold procs, two inflict cold, one inflicts electric, but dozen or more inflict Fire. The materials for Ember are the same as Rhino and he's flammable, and also if your sole purpose is to heat things up so they catch fire, that doesn't mean you can put it out again.

And then there's also the other Elemental users. What about Nezha? Or Nyx and Oberon? What about Rhino and Vauban? Even Loki uses Blast, and so does Frost in his 4 (freeze for the base damage and a 5th of the total damage is a blast at the end of the animation). If you start this, where do you stop?

Basically, the lore doesn't support it, gameplay results for who gets buffed and who doesn't is unbalanced... It's not going to happen mate.

As a side note, though:

Combust literally means 'to burst into flames'. A thing that is Combustable is flammable, can be set on fire or burned.

I would say it has nothing to do with the abilities that warframe have it's more what thew warframe is built around. Ember is built around fire, frost around cold, Volt around electric, Saryn around toxic, Mag around magnetic. Just because some frames have an ability that has a certain elemental damage to it doesn't mean that that warframe is built with that elemental in mind. Where as the ones I cited are built specifically around the elements and well it's also in their names. I mean look at Saryn they probably went with that spelling as to not use you know Sarin which is a very lethal chemical. 

From a design and player point of view it's common sense that a certain class that is built around a specific damage type would have a built in damage resistance against it, since that class is attuned to that element. The element can still do damage but its a reduced amount since that class works with that element almost exclusively. 

Also "After the poll on the founders forum she was to be named after Sarin, which is a colorless, odorless liquid, used as a chemical weapon owing to its extreme potency as a nerve agent. It was altered to Saryn when a first responder to a sarin attack suggested a name tweak, along with Sarin sounding too masculine."

Really change the proposed name of the warframe because someone that plays the game was a responder to a Sarin attack.

I could see Oberon having a passive damage reduction to radiation since 3/4 of his abilities are radiation based. 

Edited February 13, 2018 by Badgriuel

[Birdframe_Prime]

2 hours ago, Badgriuel said:

From a design and player point of view it's common sense that a certain class that is built around a specific damage type would have a built in damage resistance against it, since that class is attuned to that element. The element can still do damage but its a reduced amount since that class works with that element almost exclusively.

See point 1. Regardless of how the other games have done it, DE doesn't do passive (as in without modding, energy cost, building up Focus, interaction with frames, etc.) damage reduction. It's genuinely, on stream, been said that it's not and likely never will be on the table for discussion.

[Badgriuel]

4 minutes ago, Thaylien said:

See point 1. Regardless of how the other games have done it, DE doesn't do passive (as in without modding, energy cost, building up Focus, interaction with frames, etc.) damage reduction. It's genuinely, on stream, been said that it's not and likely never will be on the table for discussion.

Then make the passives for the warframes actually good then if their too stubborn to apply logic to specific frames. Frost: Any melee assailant that strikes Frost has a 10% chance to be temporarily frozen on impact. That's a laughably horrible passive on a frame, I could go down the list if you want. Most passives are useless after a certain point in the game due to mob scaling. 

DE seems to be very hit or miss on passive abilities, so that some frames shine at harder content and others are just meh at it or lack luster. 

[Birdframe_Prime]

3 minutes ago, Badgriuel said:

DE seems to be very hit or miss on passive abilities, so that some frames shine at harder content and others are just meh at it or lack luster. 

That's because passives are an afterthought brought on since Zephyr was first introduced with low gravity and people liked the idea of frames having some kind of themed bonus. The passives are not supposed to be powerful, the exact quote from the Devs when they were rolled out across the rest of the original warframes was 'these are flavour to the frames, themed, but not really game changing'.

They were also toned down on the most used frames because they were already considered good enough. Frost is the de-facto defense frame, his kit is already applicable at every level and his augments even more so, so his passive is minor. Loki is still in the top tier of frames in the game across the board, trivialising endgame content for other players, and so his passive is the most trivial of all. Ember is over-used and was considered powerful enough at the stages she was being played to warrant something themed, small, but kind of ridiculous too (no frame has the function of 10 Energy regen per second, not even Focus can do that... but being set on fire to get it is rare enough that it doesn't happen more than once a game, if you could set yourself on fire? Then it would be OP).

It's literally because of the feedback on passives, and players wanting them to be better, that new frames are designed with those in mind, and so their abilities are adjusted a little to compensate. But still those passives are functional, active passives. You still have to do something in order to use them.

Nidus still has to take damage and invest time and energy in his stacks to use his passives, Octavia has to actually cast an ability before she triggers the regen (meaning no casting without energy, important balance there), and that's about it...

Passives weren't supposed to be powerful, even though some turned out to be, and they definitely aren't supposed to be equal.

[Badgriuel]

3 minutes ago, Thaylien said:

That's because passives are an afterthought brought on since Zephyr was first introduced with low gravity and people liked the idea of frames having some kind of themed bonus. The passives are not supposed to be powerful, the exact quote from the Devs when they were rolled out across the rest of the original warframes was 'these are flavour to the frames, themed, but not really game changing'.

They were also toned down on the most used frames because they were already considered good enough. Frost is the de-facto defense frame, his kit is already applicable at every level and his augments even more so, so his passive is minor. Loki is still in the top tier of frames in the game across the board, trivialising endgame content for other players, and so his passive is the most trivial of all. Ember is over-used and was considered powerful enough at the stages she was being played to warrant something themed, small, but kind of ridiculous too (no frame has the function of 10 Energy regen per second, not even Focus can do that... but being set on fire to get it is rare enough that it doesn't happen more than once a game, if you could set yourself on fire? Then it would be OP).

It's literally because of the feedback on passives, and players wanting them to be better, that new frames are designed with those in mind, and so their abilities are adjusted a little to compensate. But still those passives are functional, active passives. You still have to do something in order to use them.

Nidus still has to take damage and invest time and energy in his stacks to use his passives, Octavia has to actually cast an ability before she triggers the regen (meaning no casting without energy, important balance there), and that's about it...

Passives weren't supposed to be powerful, even though some turned out to be, and they definitely aren't supposed to be equal.

Then you have certain frames that well have pretty good passives if paired with certain weapons and builds and those passives don't require you to use an ability to trigger them, it's just always active. 

[Birdframe_Prime]

22 minutes ago, Badgriuel said:

Then you have certain frames that well have pretty good passives if paired with certain weapons and builds and those passives don't require you to use an ability to trigger them, it's just always active. 

You're driving this further and further away from the point. And have not presented anything that would change that point, especially not in the eyes of the developers.

Passives that boost the effects of a weapon or damage type depend on your ability to apply them to the enemy, it's an active skill that you need to actually use and build for. You can't use a different type of weapon, you sacrifice versatility for that specialisation.

Everything in Warframe costs, even if it's just a small cost like having to pick one weapon over another because even though the second weapon would have been more powerful normally, it's better paired with the specific frame.

Which is why you will never have passive damage resistance, because it's something for nothing.

But look at it another way, if you want to make the passives better, why not work with them and make them active? Why not, instead of a percent chance of an enemy that hits Frost becomes frozen, why not a percent chance that an enemy hit by Frost's melee becomes frozen? And Saryn's passive of extending elemental proc duration is already incredibly useful in long-term play, I don't see how nerfing her ability strength to get damage reduction on an elemental status type that only three enemies in the game can inflict is a benefit. For Volt the passive he has already has potential, except it needs some kind of duration on it too, instead of just on the next attack and reset the counter, it adds to the next few seconds of attack, and then resets.

There's so much you could do with 'active' effect passives, and you and the OP want to just... relegate them to preventing damage/procs that are grossly imbalanced in the game? Cold and Shock eximus units are the only cold/electric dealing enemies that can actually proc some modicum of effects on us, every other enemy that can deal that damage just deals the damage. The only enemy to actually proc Magnetic on us is the Disruptor Ancient... everything else is Traps, and most of those traps are Grineer. The immunity passives would do nothing compared to what active-use passives could do.

[Badgriuel]

3 minutes ago, Thaylien said:

You're driving this further and further away from the point. And have not presented anything that would change that point, especially not in the eyes of the developers.

Passives that boost the effects of a weapon or damage type depend on your ability to apply them to the enemy, it's an active skill that you need to actually use and build for. You can't use a different type of weapon, you sacrifice versatility for that specialisation.

Everything in Warframe costs, even if it's just a small cost like having to pick one weapon over another because even though the second weapon would have been more powerful normally, it's better paired with the specific frame.

Which is why you will never have passive damage resistance, because it's something for nothing.

But look at it another way, if you want to make the passives better, why not work with them and make them active? Why not, instead of a percent chance of an enemy that hits Frost becomes frozen, why not a percent chance that an enemy hit by Frost's melee becomes frozen? And Saryn's passive of extending elemental proc duration is already incredibly useful in long-term play, I don't see how nerfing her ability strength to get damage reduction on an elemental status type that only three enemies in the game can inflict is a benefit. For Volt the passive he has already has potential, except it needs some kind of duration on it too, instead of just on the next attack and reset the counter, it adds to the next few seconds of attack, and then resets.

There's so much you could do with 'active' effect passives, and you and the OP want to just... relegate them to preventing damage/procs that are grossly imbalanced in the game? Cold and Shock eximus units are the only cold/electric dealing enemies that can actually proc some modicum of effects on us, every other enemy that can deal that damage just deals the damage. The only enemy to actually proc Magnetic on us is the Disruptor Ancient... everything else is Traps, and most of those traps are Grineer. The immunity passives would do nothing compared to what active-use passives could do.

I get where you're coming from, I don't just want a passive damage reduction. Its something that should be there on top of the passive warframe ability they get. Again I don't want immunity to damage but just a simple damage reduction since certain frames are built around specific elements. It's a built in damage reduction and that's it, it doesn't have to be a major number just something that's an extra thing to have to make the frame stand out a bit more. 

 

[(PSN)Arktyk2000]

Bump! Awesome idea!

[Terrornaut]

5 hours ago, SergeantSunshine said:

Mesa immune to bullets. 
Nekros immune to death 
ZEPHYR IMMUNE TO AIR

I have nothing useful to contribute to this thread that has not already been said but lololol this

[Birdframe_Prime]

1 hour ago, Badgriuel said:

Again I don't want immunity to damage but just a simple damage reduction since certain frames are built around specific elements

This. This is my point. It's not me saying this, it's the Devs: They do not want, and are not considering, passive damage reduction of any kind. That's it. That's all. And I'm getting tired of having to explain it every week when these threads come up.

That's why I suggested switching up the passives for more active-engagement ones, there could be more, but please... see some sense in this simple point; damage reduction costs, it will never be free, it will never be passive.

[(PSN)Silverback73]

12 hours ago, Terrornaut said:

I have nothing useful to contribute to this thread that has not already been said but lololol this

Lol, I sense a humorous run starting.

LOKI IMMUNE TO EFFORT.

[Birdframe_Prime]

1 minute ago, (PS4)Silverback73 said:

Lol, I sense a humorous run starting.

LOKI IMMUNE TO EFFORT.

Nidus immune to... Infested? Nah, too practical... Tentacles.

Nova immune to Cosmic Entropy. Damn you Dark Matter!!

Oberon immune to goats. Shifty-eyed things...

Valkyr immune to angry shouting. NO U!!

Equinox immune to anti-LGBT sentiments. Inclusion!

Gara immune to broken glass. Apparently this includes Lego blocks.

Harrow immune to jokes about catholic priests and young boys. 'nuff said.

Inaros immune to sand. I don't like sand, it's course, and it gets everywhere.

Titania immune to fictional women with insect wings. They bite.

Ash immune to ninjas. The ultimate defense in Conclave...

Vauban immune to traps. No, not the anime kind.

Octavia immune to your mixtape. It ain't fire.

[(PSN)thefallenloser]

Khora immune to BDSM----

[(PSN)Boomstickman98]

1 hour ago, Thaylien said:

Equinox immune to anti-LGBT sentiments. Inclusion!

Just want to point out that Equinox is not trans (unfortunately). DE confirmed that both forms are female. 

Other than that, smart choices there!

[Birdframe_Prime]

18 minutes ago, (PS4)Boomstickman98 said:

Just want to point out that Equinox is not trans (unfortunately). DE confirmed that both forms are female. 

I fail to see how it changes it ^^ She's still immune to Anti-LGBT sentiments, regardless, inclusionism!

[(PSN)Boomstickman98]

3 minutes ago, Thaylien said:

I fail to see how it changes it ^^ She's still immune to Anti-LGBT sentiments, regardless, inclusionism!

eh, touche I suppose.

[Dresnan]

Still, if they wanted they could have integrated a passive resistance (like 30% at max level) to each warframe for "their element" without it being "game -breaking".

[(PSN)Silverback73]

8 hours ago, Dresnan said:

Still, if they wanted they could have integrated a passive resistance (like 30% at max level) to each warframe for "their element" without it being "game -breaking".

I could accept this, but not immunity. 😊