Thought about nuke frames

[Chauvesouris]

Would it would be simpler to put a cooldown timer on some more powerful abilities? I am thinking about things like pre-rework Ash Bladestorm, or the new resonance quake. Instead of nerfing/reowrking them add a cooldown timer. Such nuke abilities are not necesseray broken because they are powerful, but because they are powerful and spammable. Ash's press 4 to win would not have been such broken if after each use, you would have to wait like 45sec or something. Or Ember's WoF could be turned into a duration ability followed by a cooldown so people would not constantly kill everything in low level nor go AFK.

[(PSN)thefallenloser]

Then it's completely unreliable to use.

[Rawbeard]

cooldowns would go against the energy cost mechanic. you would have to add mods that affect it and whoops, back at zero. you can't add a "stop having fun!" mechanics like you want it to

[bad4youLT]

we had cooldowns long time ago , nobody liked it so DE changed to energy system

[Trichouette]

il y a 8 minutes, Chauvesouris a dit :

Would it would be simpler to put a cooldown timer on some more powerful abilities? I am thinking about things like pre-rework Ash Bladestorm, or the new resonance quake. Instead of nerfing/reowrking them add a cooldown timer. Such nuke abilities are not necesseray broken because they are powerful, but because they are powerful and spammable. Ash's press 4 to win would not have been such broken if after each use, you would have to wait like 45sec or something. Or Ember's WoF could be turned into a duration ability followed by a cooldown so people would not constantly kill everything in low level nor go AFK.

Whenever you mention cooldown as a mean to balance the game, you trigger a huge part of the community who will tell you "devs said no" about cooldowns.

I believe no energy and cooldown applied to every ability (and some ability having "charge" mechanics) would balance out the game way better, but people will cry about how "it breaks the flow of the game" and "it's supposed to be a fast paced game".

 

[shoopypit]

3 hours ago, Trichouette said:

Whenever you mention cooldown as a mean to balance the game, you trigger a huge part of the community who will tell you "devs said no" about cooldowns.

I believe no energy and cooldown applied to every ability (and some ability having "charge" mechanics) would balance out the game way better, but people will cry about how "it breaks the flow of the game" and "it's supposed to be a fast paced game".

 

They would have to redo all the abilities. Change up the energy cost, duration period and everything on top of adding cooldowns. I am not completely against it, and might work well as a lumped in overhaul with a big update. But honestly the system as it is now works well I think. 

[Trichouette]

Il y a 11 heures, shoopypit a dit :

They would have to redo all the abilities. Change up the energy cost, duration period and everything on top of adding cooldowns. I am not completely against it, and might work well as a lumped in overhaul with a big update. But honestly the system as it is now works well I think. 

Works well.... It works so well devs are forced to nerf abilities because players either spam them, leave them enabled for forever or use them long enough to stunlock a map.

Sure it would take a lot of work to do, but the outcome would be players being able to spam tiny abilities without relying on zenurik and saving big abilities for times they really need it (and not "look at me i'm nova I press 4")

[xBelgabor]

Just no, no, no and no. I've had that in Fortnite PvE and it triggered the hell out of me. Either energy cost in some way or cooldowns, not both.

[-RS-Covenant]

Are you actually requesting weaker abilities?

[Chauvesouris]

Il y a 23 heures, Rawbeard a dit :

cooldowns would go against the energy cost mechanic. you would have to add mods that affect it and whoops, back at zero. you can't add a "stop having fun!" mechanics like you want it to

I did not meant 'remove the energy mechanic' but just 'add a cooldown only for the most powerful abilities that potentially lets one AFK or force the rest of team AFK'. I mean you can spam ember fire balls all day no one cares. but (pre rework) bladestorm was a prime exemple of press4towin that could have been cooled down,.

[(PSN)Frost_Nephilim]

9 hours ago, Trichouette said:

Works well.... It works so well devs are forced to nerf abilities because players either spam them, leave them enabled for forever or use them long enough to stunlock a map.

Sure it would take a lot of work to do, but the outcome would be players being able to spam tiny abilities without relying on zenurik and saving big abilities for times they really need it (and not "look at me i'm nova I press 4")

You do realize you're offering more nerfs and worst nerfs, than the current ones, spamming abilities is fun af.... HOWEVER, a short period of you not being able to use embers world on fire ability after a duration of it being active has went by sounds pretty dam good.

You have your times to shine, then ember has hers I mean issa mother flipping win for old ember lovers, win for old ember haters, and win for change ember creators wanting her to be more mobile which she'll have to be when the ult goes down for a few seconds. Start using her other abilities. 

 

If not that maker her range of her 4th ability almost like a pulse, increase its range back to normal after 10 seconds of it being halved, then halving it after 40seconds of it being returned to normal, then repeat. Ehh that idea is kinda poo but Something like that

Edited February 15, 2018 by (PS4)Ghost--00--

[Rawbeard]

56 minutes ago, Chauvesouris said:

I did not meant 'remove the energy mechanic'

I know, but having both is terrible design in a fast paced game

[Trichouette]

Il y a 1 heure, (PS4)Ghost--00-- a dit :

You do realize you're offering more nerfs and worst nerfs, than the current ones, spamming abilities is fun af.... HOWEVER, a short period of you not being able to use embers world on fire ability after a duration of it being active has went by sounds pretty dam good.

You have your times to shine, then ember has hers I mean issa mother flipping win for old ember lovers, win for old ember haters, and win for change ember creators wanting her to be more mobile which she'll have to be when the ult goes down for a few seconds. Start using her other abilities. 

So you KINDA understand that abilities are more welcome to be OP when "cooldown" exist.

It wouldn't be an issue if efficiency/trinity/energy plate didn't exist, but they do.

 

And cooldown would mean each ability has its own spamming capability. Right now why would you use your precious energy to use something like ember's 1 when you can save that energy for world on fire ?

 

I know that cooldowns sound like a huge nerf, but people tend to forget that cooldown also mean you can spam without caring about saving energy for one ability, and you can stop modding your whole frame around "that one ability you'll spam"

Well done cooldown wouldn't break the flow of the game.

[(PSN)Frost_Nephilim]

Nope changed my mind lol

[Lord_Yawgmoth]

why r u saying there r no cds in warframe that is wrong

rhinos roar and ironskin cant be recast while active just to mention one of many abilities that is basically a cd, ofc with ironskin augment u can force a recast by double casting

i also think cds r not good for wf i mean u can pick a tanky frame and  weapons and play through all the content if u have the right mods for u r weapon that s how unimportant abilities already are ofc there r some unique abilities like harrows group immortality which seem kinda broken but just think about how annoying it would be to hunt for teralyst and co without it...

what i d like to see is to make abilities like embers fireball into something at the same lvl of a weapon

i want to play a fireball throwing casterframe  too, but  as it is now i have to rely on my machine gun on higher lvls to even stand a chance...

Edited February 15, 2018 by Lord_Yawgmoth

[SenorClipClop]

On 2/15/2018 at 5:17 AM, Chauvesouris said:

Such nuke abilities are not necesseray broken because they are powerful, but because they are powerful and spammable.

You're hitting it pretty on the head here, butnI think a big part of these abilities getting nerfed is because they offer huge power for zero involvement (a button press, usually). When lazy strats are the most effective ones, interest in playing the frame in an engaging way plummets. Case in point, GD has been blowing up with players who think Banshee is 100% useless due to the Resonating Quake change.