Should Archwing Launchers be Cheaper?

[nokinoks]

I have 200 of these things, maybe I can make a few hundred more but I remember when this was quite difficult to make and I still use them only while hunting Terry, Garry and Harry. That being said, should they be cheaper? I have no problem using them at night but using around 6 to 7 on a regular bounty mission (5 stages assuming they are all far apart) is excessive and even my stores will hurt if I do even just 5 bounties. Now I want to make it clear here that I do not want to change their cost per se, I have Zephyr and s/he can pretty much match archwing speed and is easier to control but that's the thing -- it locks me and any other player to stick with frames with high mobility. 

Again, personally I do not have a problem with this since I enjoy playing Zephyr especially on solo mode where I can waste time dog fighting with anything that flies but on the other hand a lot of people are forced to use frames they might not really like unless they spend a significant amount of resources on archwing launchers.

So that's my question or topic for discussion I guess. Do we continue with this current state where mobile frames are top dogs or do we remove or lessen the burden on resources needed for archwing launchers so everyone can pretty much use whatever frame they want and get to point B C D and back to Cetus without having too much of a problem. 

What do you guys think?

[(XBOX)ultimategamerjr]

The problem isn't that they are expensive, it is the fact that you have to build 50 of them at a time. Currently I think it is like one of every resource to build each launchers (could be wrong on the numbers, but I know this is close), but multiplied by 50 it can get annoying, and that coupled with the 30 minute wait time can make it seem like it takes forever. I would simply suggest that they allow us to build them in quantities of 1, 10 and 25. this way we could use all of the resources we have instead of being forced to gather 50 of everything just to build them.

[ThorienKELL]

I have no major issue with those it's just that iradite is kinda scarce and I'm always hovering on 300-500, even despite of spending a lot of time on PoE. If only the containers wouldn't get few pcs. at the time ... more iradite per spawn would fix the problem.

Edited February 21, 2018 by ThorienKELL

[Teksorbkyva]

If they allowed you to queue more than one build unit of a craftable at a time, then it would be feasible to have smaller quantities because otherwise it's going to take you forever just sitting in front of your foundry manually queueing up builds.

[DarkFlameZealot]

There should be no change to the cost to build them, but they do need to be massively buffed and fixed to not die to one bullet and despawn. It's almost like just because they actually cost something now that DE essentially said "Nerf that crap to the ground so our players suffer more and don't even use it."

 

The lack of durability compared to in space and the fact that it gets wasted if you melee once is pathetic design. It works perfectly for the MR25 test (even though you can simply use your operator), but for plains it's woefully weak. Even Amesha gets destroyed instantly even with the bubbles set up early.

 

Changes to be made:

1. Archwing launcher drops should be reusable after you leave them and stay in the plains for at least a minute. There is no reason why we shouldn't be able to melee from the sky.
2. The costs do not make sense for a 1-time usage object, even if you make 50 with each blueprint. Either lower the costs slightly or make them actually useful.
3. Increase the flight ceiling in plains. Zephyr makes all archwings except itzal laughably slow and the dargyns might as well be a better vehicle to use at this point as they won't explode in one hit that you can't even see coming at you.

 

 

[Zahnny]

My problem is that DE added Archwing as a feature only to then remove Archwing features from it.

Yeah, you can fly around but the powers are severely nerfed in every way and a butterfly sneezing is enough to take you down.

"Alright, we're adding Archwings into the plains. Are there any ideas we have to improve this?" "Yes, let's take out many of the things that make Archwing, Archwing such as being unable to melee in the air, unable to easily deploy on demand without building them, having less air time than a chicken and reduced effectiveness of abilities."

I've actually been yelled at severely by trying to play a bounty using Archwing only. As it stands Archwing only seems to serve the purpose of being a transportation equipment, of which other frames and thanks to ridable daryns has also reduced the PoE archwing experience to merely a sidegrade.

EDIT: I forgot to mention the inability to use Archwing weapons in the plains. Some see this as a good thing and others a bad thing but why you can't choose is beyond me.

Edited February 21, 2018 by Zahnny

[(XBOX)Tucker D Dawg]

5 minutes ago, DarkFlameZealot said:

 

Changes to be made:

1. Archwing launcher drops should be reusable after you leave them and stay in the plains for at least a minute. There is no reason why we shouldn't be able to melee from the sky.
2. The costs do not make sense for a 1-time usage object, even if you make 50 with each blueprint. Either lower the costs slightly or make them actually useful.
3. Increase the flight ceiling in plains. Zephyr makes all archwings except itzal laughably slow and the dargyns might as well be a better vehicle to use at this point as they won't explode in one hit that you can't even see coming at you.

 

 

Don't forget they need the call down time reduced.  its slow to call them, then you get the slow enter them animation, and you are still on the ground when all thats done.

Activating should launch you up zephyr style while they race down to meet you.

[peterc3]

1 minute ago, Zahnny said:

As it stands Archwing only seems to serve the purpose of being a transportation equipment

This is the case. Ignore it looking like your regular Archwing and pretend it is bright yellow and has a Taxi sign on it.

[nokinoks]

45 minutes ago, Zahnny said:

My problem is that DE added Archwing as a feature only to then remove Archwing features from it.

46 minutes ago, Zahnny said:

EDIT: I forgot to mention the inability to use Archwing weapons in the plains. Some see this as a good thing and others a bad thing but why you can't choose is beyond me

And also why is archwing on Earth so difficult and idiotic to control? I know it's on Earth but I also know that we have technology from golden people. Though it seems blatantly clear that Archwing on PoE really is just a means of transportation, so right now I am personally interested in whether we make it more accessible, maybe 100 launchers for the same amount of mats to make other frames useful in the plains? But that's just an idea. Regarding why your weapon can't be used, it's because (I believe but I'm not sure) they suck. Hear me out here, I went to a Sniper only sortie in Uranus. Now I got my vectis and used it but upon entering sharkwing my Velocitus got equipped instead and it sucked. Now it's not potatoed but I was using Ivara's prowl and doing headshots on a level 60 manic bombard but the damage was just utterly useless that I had to abort. I think there's scaling going on, for example I just found out that Itzal's cosmic crush range is 120 meters (my current level) in archwing but 40 meters on the Plains. It sucked so bad when I couldn't get loot from 60 meters away.

1 hour ago, (Xbox One)ultimategamerjr said:

The problem isn't that they are expensive, it is the fact that you have to build 50 of them at a time. Currently I think it is like one of every resource to build each launchers (could be wrong on the numbers, but I know this is close), but multiplied by 50 it can get annoying, and that coupled with the 30 minute wait time can make it seem like it takes forever. I would simply suggest that they allow us to build them in quantities of 1, 10 and 25. this way we could use all of the resources we have instead of being forced to gather 50 of everything just to build them.

This would be a very decent compromise.

 

55 minutes ago, ThorienKELL said:

I have no major issue with those it's just that iradite is kinda scarce and I'm always hovering on 300-500, even despite of spending a lot of time on PoE. If only the containers wouldn't get few pcs. at the time ... more iradite per spawn would fix the problem.

I have the same amount but I have booster on. I remember how hard it was to build my first archwing launcher so yeah, they are forcing PoE a lot on new and old players alike so I feel bad for those new on the Plains because irradite can be a *@##$ sometimes if you don't actively farm for it.

 

[(XBOX)ultimategamerjr]

1 hour ago, ThorienKELL said:

I have no major issue with those it's just that iradite is kinda scarce and I'm always hovering on 300-500, even despite of spending a lot of time on PoE. If only the containers wouldn't get few pcs. at the time ... more iradite per spawn would fix the problem.

For in case you do not know, starting up a top tier bounty gives more iradite, 5-10 per spawn, last time I checked. I will admit that I haven't done it in a while, but I haven't seen them change it in any if the patch notes.

[Kinetos]

Should be free and should be able to just immediately equip. 

Aka they simply should go away. 

There are enough practical reasons to go to ground we shouldn't have all these hard restrictions and annoying countermeasures. 

[Hypernaut1]

sometimes you just got to work for things a little in a game. I see no problem with that

[Bao]

Also for those of you who don't know, Archwing Launcher costs have already been lowered from the initial value. It used to cost 3x what we see now for the same number of launchers. I've made 500 since Plains was released and have not had to go back to make more. If you're traveling about 100, 200 meters, you can bullet jump over there. Trying to get across the map? Sure, pop an archwing. Tracking down an Eidolon? Perfect for that job. You technically can use archwings to help with bounties, but don't expect them to do absurd amounts of damage like they normally do in regular archwing missions. 

 

Ive found it pretty useful to hang out in Itzal's  Penumbra and snipe incoming troops or hit an Amesha bubble to help with damage control. It's an option, not a requirement to fight in archwing on the Plains. 

 

As for being downed quite often in archwing on Earth, it's no different in regular missions. I've had plenty of teammates go down in those missions. At least you're not left hanging in the air dead when you get knocked out of archwing. 

[nokinoks]

51 minutes ago, Kinetos said:

Should be free and should be able to just immediately equip. 

Aka they simply should go away. 

There are enough practical reasons to go to ground we shouldn't have all these hard restrictions and annoying countermeasures. 

This is DE's hustle tho, I get it. I'd like as well for the orbiter to just come down but I guess Ordis is too lazy for that and would rather I wait in front of Cetus while my team is 600 meters away.

40 minutes ago, Hypernaut1 said:

sometimes you just got to work for things a little in a game. I see no problem with that

It's not the working part, it's the I'm-afraid-I-will-be-in-a-team-of-four-Zephyrs part. Kidding aside, you don't think that only the handful of mobile frames being actually viable for bounties is an issue? By viable I mean that they will arrive at a relatively similar time that a Zephyr can fly towards a different point. And not even that, it's the reality I suppose, people are motivated by incentives. Use a mobile frame or use resources OR the worst option that some choose, use a frame like Frost and then bullet jump your way around the map while your team is doing all the bounty. What I'm trying to say is, even if grinding for them isn't that much difficult once you get into it, the people might not use them anyway because the grind is significant enough and therefore we will have nothing but Nova/Volt/Zephyr during bounties, I have never even seen a Titania in a bounty before so even among the top tier mobile frames not all are used. 

So basically, they are not hard to farm compared to other things, but people might not use them anyway as they are still significantly difficult and we might end up with just a few frames in PoE instead of a whole roster. 

31 minutes ago, Bao said:

Also for those of you who don't know, Archwing Launcher costs have already been lowered from the initial value. It used to cost 3x what we see now for the same number of launchers. I've made 500 since Plains was released and have not had to go back to make more. If you're traveling about 100, 200 meters, you can bullet jump over there. Trying to get across the map? Sure, pop an archwing. Tracking down an Eidolon? Perfect for that job. You technically can use archwings to help with bounties, but don't expect them to do absurd amounts of damage like they normally do in regular archwing missions. 

 

Ive found it pretty useful to hang out in Itzal's  Penumbra and snipe incoming troops or hit an Amesha bubble to help with damage control. It's an option, not a requirement to fight in archwing on the Plains. 

 

As for being downed quite often in archwing on Earth, it's no different in regular missions. I've had plenty of teammates go down in those missions. At least you're not left hanging in the air dead when you get knocked out of archwing. 

Thanks for the info, I get surprised sometimes when I hear how high cost of things used to be, like how much kuva was needed to roll rivens before. Regarding being downed, well I don't have a problem with this personally because archwing control sucks so bad that I will never attempt to fight in archwing. You can't even consistently touch the ground, but that isn't really a point of discussion here I suppose.

[Kinetos]

1 hour ago, Hypernaut1 said:

sometimes you just got to work for things a little in a game. I see no problem with that

I totally wouldn't mind having to farm for fuel if beacons and disablers went away. Imo it's just mechanically bad right now. I don't even need to grind I have enough stocked up, I want improvements to actually using it. Working for *good* stuff is fine. 

[Hypernaut1]

1 hour ago, Kinetos said:

 

 

 

I totally wouldn't mind having to farm for fuel if beacons and disablers went away. Imo it's just mechanically bad right now. I don't even need to grind I have enough stocked up, I want improvements to actually using it. Working for *good* stuff is fine. 

i can see your point. it could use some QoL.

Edited February 21, 2018 by Hypernaut1