Jump to content
Dante Unbound: Share Bug Reports and Feedback Here! ×

Elemental Combo Chroma - Ideas for a Rework


ZodiacShinryu
 Share

Recommended Posts

I had wanted to save my thoughts on changes to Chroma until a few systems DE as mentioned had come to pass to help temper my suggestions and highlight his abilities. However Khora (what I imagined to be Chroma's sister frame to cover IPS) is still unreleased and to be "decoupled" from IPS in some ways. The Status Proc system has no definite changes (or timeline) in sight, with IPS scraped/delayed and Elemental in the far reaches of time at this point. But a possible Chroma Prime release is drawing ever closer with Zephyr Prime soon to be here; making way for the next two male primes so I figured giving some thought on these ideas might be a good idea sooner rather than later. With Chroma likely being the next Prime I figured I would put this up again. Best get the ideas out early.

I will preface that my ideas intend that Chroma will incorporate being able to shift/swap/change his base elements in a mission (In part to remove the limitations on his fashion frame). With that said, I have TWO ways I thought of implementing this concept to try to keep Chroma fluid and flexible. KEEP IN MIND that any and all numbers are flexible and more about giving a concept about how they general function. Lets start with a passive for Chroma since he will need one with the added function of being able to switch his elemental base at will in a mission.

Passive: (choices to pick from [only one])

  1. Chroma's Elemental Status Procs gain 10% strength or 50% effectiveness. Heat/Toxin contribute 60% base damage to DoT, Electric contributes 60% base damage to chains, Viral lower health by 60%, Corrosive strips by 35%, Magnetic lowers shields by 85%. Cold gains an extra 50% to its base slow to speed/fire-rate, Blast gains 2.5m range (7.5m total), Gas gains 1.5m range (4.5m total). Radiation is a bit difficult, maybe duration increase. I honestly don't know what the percentage of the slow is for cold and it might fall more in line with 10% additive rather than 50% multiplicative of base.
  2. Chroma emits an aura extending 30m from his pelt that negates elemental resistances (note that these are elements the enemy are strong to NOT weak) to 0. In this way he never "loses" damage from mismatched elemental damage while still incentivizing exploiting the enemies' weakness. Centered on his Pelt for some tactical longer range play if you wish to leave your Effigy while Chroma hangs back (note that his pelt sits on Chroma when Effigy isn't active).
  3. Chroma coverts some elemental damage dealt to himself to Energy when his element and the damage dealt match (combined elements only need to match one of the bases). Basically a built in Rage with conditions. I have considered giving him power strength too though then we start stepping on Ember's passive (even if he could utilize it so much better) and there is some worry of its synergy with Vex Armor's caps.

Elemental Cycling Implementation: to not infringe on fashion frame too much but still adhere to Chroma's namesake, his power effects have a base color based on the element with your chosen energy color as an added flair (Heat is standard fire color with your energy color mixed in say blue for orangish and blueish fire effects together). For people that remember dual color energy syndanas it would be similar to that.

  1. Spectral Scream is given the "Quiver" Treatment. Press to cycle through the elements and Hold to activate Scream.
  2. Each power is given a Hold treatment for a single element (1 Heat, 2 Cold, 3 Electric, 4 Toxin). It would mean that the elements are locked by power to have them all at Lv10 (not that it is much a problem) but you would have direct access to the element you want quickly and simply.

Now lets move on to Spectral Scream. Even after it's buff, it is still his worst power by far. So my suggestion is to add synergy and expand utility to his first power. This synergy will come in the form of Elemental Detonations. Spectral Scream is also a candidate for one of the ways to implement the cycling ability to his elements (the Ivara Quiver/Hold vs Press treatment).

[1] Spectral Scream: Spectral Scream will remain much to what it currently does. However, there will be a new mechanic to add to his variations and opening up his proc potential to all the elementals. More on the Elemental Detonation mechanic in another section (because there is a couple of way it could be implemented). Simply outlined, Spectral Scream can be used to cause explosions of elemental energy on enemies primed to explode. For people that are familiar with Mass Effect, it will work very similar. Depending on what the enemy was primed with along with the element chosen by Chroma for Spectral Scream will determine the resulting explosion that has a Range based on his Power Range stat and Damage scaled to his Power Strength.  For example, Primed Heat x Scream Heat results in Heat explosions while Primed Heat vs Scream Toxin results in Gas explosions (the reverse also causes the same effect). This will expand Chroma to full access to all elemental damage types within his kit alone. Vex Armor still synergizes.

Augment Afterburn Changes: A couple of changes to increase it's effectiveness and incorporate the Detonations. The elemental projectile can cause Elemental Detonations that leave behind a hazard for the enemy. The hazard matches the detonation and the size is fixed 5m and duration set for 10sec scaling with Power Duration. Most of the elementals have a hazard already in the game (Heat, Cold, Elec, Toxin/Gas, Magnetic/Radiation). Magnetic could draw in targets slowly.

Elemental Ward has functioned fairly well with Chroma over the years. Changes to this power are also fairly limited but need to be addressed with the fact that Chroma can now change his element at will. Note that many things will be the same as current Wards and if not explicitly mentioned would carry over to the new Ward.

[2] Elemental Ward: I think that the Wards contain some redundant functions (like Cold reflection and Elec retaliation or Heat vs Cold tanking). I would like to define mostly Cold and Heat from each other while separating the overlap of reflection of Cold and Elec (for the most part the cold reflection is weak anyway). With the ability to change elements during missions and the inability of recasting Ward (though it is an option), certain effects are tied to a single cast of Ward (this is the case currently anyway). Most of the time this wont matter for all the offensive effects. For example, changing from heat to something else and then back to heat will not insta-recover your health to yourself or allies from the Health Boost. This effect will only take effect once per cast of Elemental Ward. Same for Elec and Shields. Elemental Wards still don't stack with other Wards.

  • Heat: lose the small AoE Heat damage, retain the Health Boost function. Move Cold's Armor bonus to Heat. Add a Health regeneration of 3%/second (fixed) of current Max Health 10-30 (perhaps moddable) Health/second. Effective Health Tank [edit 7/4/18: Percentage might be too much. He is not meant to be a healer competing with Oberon or even Khora. Just a healing source to lax some minor damage and recover and make use of the max health boost out of combat; mostly for allies.]
  • Cold: lose the reflective damage, armor bonus (moved). Add an aura scaled with Power Range that gradually increases effect with prolonged exposure, lowering the armor and attack of the enemy to 50% while under the effect. Enemies affected with Cold proc hasten the effect. Defensive Debuffer
  • Electric: retains functionality with addition of increased Shield recharge rate, perhaps a small shield recovery on Chroma kills. Offensive Lockdown [edit 7/4/18: I have debated a shield regeneration for a more robust shield discharge but I think it might get in the way of Vex Fury. A shield recovery on kills while Elec Ward is up gives you more freedom and an active source for increasing retaliation damage.]
  • Toxin: retains functionality with additional melee status chance. Offensive Status Scalability (guns have reload rates already present so a boost for melee)

Augment Everlasting Ward Changes: Minor. Allies are granted the current Ward type for the remaining duration even when out of range of Chroma. The Ward retains its element even if the granting Chroma changes his element.

There isn't much to say about Vex Armor. The calculation changes to his damage buff in Fury was warranted though those same calculations hampered his Scorn Armor buff pretty severely. The recast is fairly decent at least. Personally I would like to move all (not just Chroma) damage and armor buffs to multiplicative. Then refine the numbers to where they need to be so that the UI for all frames is the same and easy to compare between them. It also doesn't make modding more complicated. For example, say there is a same high power strength Rhino and Chroma. Roar gives a 250% boost immediately while Chroma has a 350-400% cap when he maxs his buff instead of 900ish% additive.

[3] Vex Armor:  to address the rampancy of self-damage (it is my personal opinion that no frame should be inclined to abuse self-damage to benefit from an ability reliably). These options could be taken alone or combined as seen fit or none at all.

  • Vex could benefit from a "Taunt" effect while removing damage done to self as a buff source. This increase in threat level would have enemies focus on Chroma over other available targets when they are in range. It could function similar to Valkyr's Hysteria aura but inversely. The aura expands when Chroma is not taking damage and shrinks when he does take damage. It makes positioning important if you want to draw fire from allies as well as gives him some reprieve if you get hammered.
  • Allies under the effects of Vex's Aura also can increase the buffs for you, following the same rules. Basically allowing everyone participate in strengthening the buffs.
  • Vex starts out with a small amount of stacks. For example, maybe Vex on cast starts with 20% of the max caps. This effect could be additive per cast (not only refreshing the duration but also adding stacks). It would take the energy of 5 casts to max caps but you wouldn't need to take a hit in the cases of your allies locking down whole tiles with CC.

New Augment, Inward Vex: Vex Armor's buff share aura is nullified (basically reverts to old style Vex) while increasing Chroma's Scorn and Fury caps by 2x (100% or double).

Effigy has a niche role with Chroma which is mostly for farming credits. It doesn't do a lot of damage (with how scaling works) and has minor close range CC capabilities. It is basically a turret version of his first power that takes even greater amounts of energy to sustain. My suggestions will change Effigy to a duration based pet (inspired by Khora's first preview to be honest) while also adding synergy options with Spectral Scream's Elemental Detonations. How it exactly will function kind of depends on how the implementation of elemental cycling is chosen.

[4] Effigy: becomes a 20sec base scalable power duration pet (still has a Health pool). Effigy's element is the element of Chroma on cast but Effigy will remain that element even if Chroma changes until it is recast. Effigy can cause status procs of its element. Effigy can be commanded to move to where you are aiming by pressing 4 again (moving part of Guided Effigy to the base power). Depending on the cycling method you can end Effigy early by Holding 4 to instantly recall your pelt (Elemental Cycling Implementation 1) or by aiming at your Effigy and pressing 4 again (Elemental Cycling Implementation 2). Being able to move your Effigy anywhere at any time (provided it is a valid location) means that you can command it into view if you move away from it. Effigy has a new effect added to its roar AoE that will prime the enemies affected for elemental detonation from Spectral Scream. As a duration based power, it should ease the pressures on energy for Spectral Scream (any of his powers really). In reality it could stay a drain but it should have a lower drain in such a case. Edit 7/4/18: Effigy benefits from Health and Armor mods on Chroma as well

Augment Guided Effigy Changes: Mostly the same. Adds the Elemental collision damage when Effigy is moving. Could increase the movement speed of Effigy when moving. It also forces a roar which would prime them for detonation.

New Mechanic, Elemental Combo Detonation: There are a couple of ways this mechanic could be implemented. As said before it will function very similarly to how detonations in Mass Effect worked. The goal of the mechanic is to provide an extra push to damage with the AoE detonation while adding utility by providing a Proc source that can consist of any element, Base or Combined.

  1. Effigy has the ability to "prime" targets with its roar AoE. Effigy will prime enemies affected to the element that Effigy is at the time of the roar. Chroma can detonate affected enemies by simply procing the affect targets with Spectral Scream. Same elements explode as the base element while differing elements combine. The explosions are a small AoE (scaled by Range) and Damage (scaled by Strength) with a forced respective Proc to all enemies hit. The Combo is limited to once per "primed" enemy (they are reverted to normal after detonation) and is gated by Effigy's ability to roar but otherwise can be detonated as many times as Effigy roars.
  2. Chroma's Spectral Scream consumes base elemental procs already on the target for the detonations. Possible multi-detonations at once if multiple base elemental procs are already present on a target. With this method there could be small synergy with teammates (like Frost, Ember, Volt, Saryn or other Chromas) and weapons. There would probably be a small cooldown per enemy to prevent snowballing status effects feeding each other.

 

A concept... maybe an OP concept but my dream for Chroma anyway.


Edit 7/4/18: Some additional ideas for thought.

[1][4] Exalted Dragon's Breath: With the addition of moddable Exalted/Unique Warframe abilities, an option opens for Chroma's Spectral Scream (also could extend to Effigy or the other way around if you wish to view it that way) to be fit into this system. With this change, Spectral Scream (and perhaps Effigy) could be moved on to Beam type weaponry mechanics and modding. It fits slightly better than some other Powers that are affected by weapon mods because Spectral Scream locks you into a stance/posture on a toggle drain. It also gives better access to it's weapon type without forcing Chroma to a beam weapon. That being said there is the Forma investment (honestly not as big a deal as I think the community makes it out to be) though for Chroma in particular it would be a new perk completely rather than recovering losses. Power positional swap of Spectral Scream and Effigy could be an option for those that care for such things.

Combining Elemental Ward and Vex Armor: With Vex calculation changes also came aura share Vex. Being an aura fits it a lot closer to Ward functionality so combining together can make it more practical and open up a slot for a new power... a full elemental kit. In the combination, Ward's range could be boosted to the 18m base Vex now enjoys and Ward could be recast able. Even if Chroma doesn't get a elemental cycling function, it would boost Ward's base functionality to be more reliable for any squad composition and strategy due to how Vex benefits universally. Whether Vex benefits would be directly attached to the Ward aura or remain with Chroma's position is debatable but should it be connected with the aura completely, Everlasting Ward augment would allow more lax sharing of Vex as well.

As for a new power there are some ideas to go around. I think I like the concept of more a Debuff/Attack power to compliment Ward being more a Buff/Support power. Should this become an option it could be possible to remove the remaining offensive aspects (like Toxin's close range poison) on Ward in favor of focusing on Buffs while this focuses on Debuffs. Also doesn't necessarily require a cycling method. Very preliminary...

[3][2] Elemental Auspice: Chroma unleashes an elemental attack based on his current elemental alignment.

  • Heat: Chroma spits out Magma in front of himself (perhaps conal). It deals heat damage on initial contact to enemy on cast and a Heat proc. The magma leaves a zone that that slows enemies that tread upon it as well as smaller Heat based DoT with low chances to proc heat panic. Zone Denial
  • Cold: Chroma roars conjuring icicle spires to in a short distance (radial based on Chroma's position) around him to impale enemies (I imagined it looks like a thorny flower made of ice that surrounds him completely). The growth extends quickly outward from Chroma on all sides (even above) damaging everything in the radius while a short-lived stun-to-knockback/down as the icicles shatter. Enemies hit also have some armor destroyed (I was think like shattering impact). Short Range Punish
  • Electric: Chroma rears back to charge a beam of electrical energy (perhaps opticor or synapse like). The beam travels along reticle aiming until reaching the environment where it will discharge radially. Chroma's movement speed increases by number of enemies hit. Long Range Nuke
  • Toxin: Chroma releases a cloud of bile-ous toxin that persists in the area for a short duration. Enemies affected by the cloud receive a toxin based on the enemies max health and exhibit reduced accuracy for the duration. Moderate Scalable DoT

Somethings might need to be reshuffled over from Wards should another power come to be. For example, Cold Ward might need to be redone and it's effects moved to Auspice. The toxin effect on Ward would also be removed perhaps another effect given or expanded. I think Elec Ward could remain as it is.

Again to end it... maybe an OP concept but my dream for Chroma anyway!

Edited by ZodiacShinryu
Updated 7/4/18
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, ZodiacShinryu said:

A concept... maybe an OP concept but my dream for Chroma anyway.

Chroma is supposed to be OP, he is a freaking dragon, his thing is dealing damage and taking names!

No wait, not any more. He's had a "fix" after 3 FKING YEARS!!!! YOU DON'T "FIX" AFTER 3 YEARS! He's been castrated, his thing taken away.

Chroma needs to be OP again.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, ZodiacShinryu said:

Spectral Scream is given the "Quiver" Treatment. Press to cycle through the elements and Hold to activate Scream.

No.  I maybe the only one against this quiver treatment for Chroma, but I see it causing more problems then being a helping solution.  The reason it works for Ivara and Vauban is because they are tactical in nature, they adapt to the environment around them.  Chroma I see as the dragon coming in and being in your face ready for combat.  While I would try to adapt to the "quiver system," I just feel it would detract from his identity as a frame.

Not to mention, in the past I have seen and experienced many quiver misfires through both Vauban and Ivara from lag issues, like setting off noise arrows at my feet, or have it on sleep and it gets altered into a dashwire.  I actually shelved Vauban after failing eight times to get one spring out as it kept shifting to tripwire.  It's far from this perfect system everyone else makes it out to be.

 

3 hours ago, ZodiacShinryu said:

Chroma coverts some elemental damage dealt to himself to Energy when his element and the damage dealt match (combined elements only need to match one of the bases). Basically a built in Rage with conditions. I have considered giving him power strength too though then we start stepping on Ember's passive (even if he could utilize it so much better) and there is some worry of its synergy with Vex Armor's caps.

This doesn't look too bad, though.  Provided it's not like Ember's passive BS where the proc actually has to trigger.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Olianu said:

Not to mention, in the past I have seen and experienced many quiver misfires through both Vauban and Ivara from lag issues, like setting off noise arrows at my feet, or have it on sleep and it gets altered into a dashwire.  I actually shelved Vauban after failing eight times to get one spring out as it kept shifting to tripwire.  It's far from this perfect system everyone else makes it out to be.

Understandable, adding another layer of complexity will add to the volatility of the system under pressure, especially under lag (or other poor conditions). That being said, lag isn't suppose to happen, even knowing that it is fairly common because of how the game connects people. Particularly, if you end up in these conditions, worrying about switching your powers is the least of your concerns because you probably are having a hard time just activating the power at all. While I wouldn't say it is perfect, it is the best way to open him up without just making up a new kit (or a new frame). That being said, with how I envisioned this concept, he doesn't really "need" to cycle in a mission but at best it would limit him to a single branch of the elements.

Personally I like "Cycling Implementation 2" best because the elements are Hold function on each power individually. Want Heat? Hold 1. Want Toxin? Hold 4. Want Heat again? Hold 1. You don't need to deal with rotating the "quiver wheel" and can access the elements directly. Misfiring would be reduced though lag is lag and could be annoying but you also don't need to switch elements if you don't want to and it wouldn't get in your way if you want to just stay one element (it would just be Chroma as usual).

I also really wanted to see Khora because she didn't look like she need to actually activate her power to change forms. If just cycling to the element on his 1 would change his element without actually needing to activate his 1, I think that it would be pretty swift and easy to get to what you want. It also could open up Scream to being able to change elements while he is breathing fire.

5 hours ago, Olianu said:

No.  I maybe the only one against this quiver treatment for Chroma, but I see it causing more problems then being a helping solution.  The reason it works for Ivara and Vauban is because they are tactical in nature, they adapt to the environment around them.  Chroma I see as the dragon coming in and being in your face ready for combat.  While I would try to adapt to the "quiver system," I just feel it would detract from his identity as a frame.

The beauty of this concept is that it is all additive (more focused on his lesser powers of 1 and 4). You don't have to change his elements (you can still access the new mechanic as a single element), it is just an option to exploit the enemy or provide further utility. I intentionally left Chroma's base abilities intact to preserve him as he currently is, though I buffed up Heat tanking to be de facto and gave Cold ways to mitigate damage (and increase damage to enemies) for not only yourself but your allies too by being a debuffer.

I imagined the situation like Eidolons. Chroma could be in Heat form taking damage with ease then when he is ready switch to Toxin form (because of reload bonus) and just hose the enemy. Then depending on his passive (and squad set up) could go back to Heat to take damage easily or maybe another element and make use of his elemental rage passive. I wouldn't say it detracts from his identity but enhances it as he is always able to be in advantage and dominating every move the enemy has.

6 hours ago, Olianu said:

This doesn't look too bad, though.  Provided it's not like Ember's passive BS where the proc actually has to trigger.

I envisioned it to be like Rage. So it would just need to be matching elemental damage to convert to energy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, ZodiacShinryu said:

While I wouldn't say it is perfect, it is the best way to open him up without just making up a new kit (or a new frame).

While discussing this, I was wondering.  what if his powers were based off his four actual armor colors and not his energy?  Like first = 1st power, secondary = second power, tertiary = third and Accents = fourth

That way you could mix and match which parts of him you need at the time?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Olianu said:

While discussing this, I was wondering.  what if his powers were based off his four actual armor colors and not his energy?  Like first = 1st power, secondary = second power, tertiary = third and Accents = fourth

That way you could mix and match which parts of him you need at the time?

This kills the fashion frame.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, Olianu said:

While discussing this, I was wondering.  what if his powers were based off his four actual armor colors and not his energy?  Like first = 1st power, secondary = second power, tertiary = third and Accents = fourth

That way you could mix and match which parts of him you need at the time?

no thanks, this would only bring up fashion frame problems

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 hours ago, Olianu said:

While discussing this, I was wondering.  what if his powers were based off his four actual armor colors and not his energy?  Like first = 1st power, secondary = second power, tertiary = third and Accents = fourth

That way you could mix and match which parts of him you need at the time?

Part of this rework is to remove the infringing part on customization in the first place. There are a couple of problems with implementing it this way: His third power doesn't have an element affinity so it would be useless to include it that way, when the evitable Chroma Prime comes Accent will be tied to his golden sections which people may or may not want to change (I know I like the gold trim on primes), and his secondary color becomes the most important (even in my rework) because Elemental Ward is a buff ability. Energy color is the least intrusive if were going to use keep it under this type of system.

If we want to talk about customization in this fashion, we are better off pushing for a new UI that you can pick the power energy effects from. Then you can pick the relevant power elements for what ever reason you have without touching "fashion frame".

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 hours ago, Faaaiieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee said:

This is Chroma, an ancient legend, master of the elements.

Chroma, confounds his foes and strengthens his allies with elemental caprice.

I think changing elements with ward should be done to pronounce the identity of Chroma.

Last I checked he does paint with all the elements.

I think doing it would make chroma weaker, diluting his abilities and consequentially their strength, while pulling his identity into an unwanted direction.

No more toxin or electric dragons, just confused ice dragons who fart fire occasionally.

edit: your change is probably easier for DE to implement then actually rebalancing chromas kit, so it will probably be done and chroma won’t get any better or be more of an elemental dragon. Muh Heart

Edited by BigPapiPimp
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, BigPapiPimp said:

Last I checked he does paint with all the elements.

I think doing it would make chroma weaker, diluting his abilities and consequentially their strength, while pulling his identity into an unwanted direction.

No more toxin or electric dragons, just confused ice dragons who fart fire occasionally.

edit: your change is probably easier for DE to implement then actually rebalancing chromas kit, so it will probably be done and chroma won’t get any better or be more of an elemental dragon. Muh Heart

I am not sure I understand what you mean.

He can only currently only use 4 of the 10 elements.

Why would he be weaker? Because DE would nerf his ward because he can use all of them in a single mission? I mean maybe, there really isn't a reason to but they could. But it certainly doesn't dilute his abilities because for 2 of the 4 it simply changes a damage type (both of which no one even cares about, they could do impact damage and no one would bat an eye) and Vex doesn't even element. Ward is the only thing that has any dramatic change currently. To which, are you saying Ivara's Quiver or Vauban's Minelayer (which still includes a Bounce pad just to be clear) dilutes their abilities? Or Equinox would have stronger abilities if she was made into 2 separate frames? I still would've liked to see Khora. Assuming he can't stack his Wards on himself (you can't stack Wards now) all being able to shift elements does is allow you to micromanage if you feel like it. Vex Armor is the only ability anyone really cares about and it is present in every single form Chroma has now and isn't affected by elemental choice.

Why would this get rid of toxin and elec dragons? IMO it would give more reason to use them. And people already using them aren't suddenly going to abandon them simply because they can change to heat or cold in a mission. Confused ice dragons? Because of the calculation changes to Vex, Heat is a better tank option than Cold right now so if they are confused it is because they are using Cold in the first place.

19 hours ago, Faaaiieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee said:

I think changing elements with ward should be done to pronounce the identity of Chroma.

In my rework, I said that it could be set on his Scream. It could be on his Ward or it could be on his Effigy. It really doesn't matter where it just matters how.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

27 minutes ago, ZodiacShinryu said:

I am not sure I understand what you mean.

He can only currently only use 4 of the 10 elements.

Why would he be weaker? Because DE would nerf his ward because he can use all of them in a single mission? I mean maybe, there really isn't a reason to but they could. But it certainly doesn't dilute his abilities because for 2 of the 4 it simply changes a damage type (both of which no one even cares about, they could do impact damage and no one would bat an eye) and Vex doesn't even element. Ward is the only thing that has any dramatic change currently. To which, are you saying Ivara's Quiver or Vauban's Minelayer (which still includes a Bounce pad just to be clear) dilutes their abilities? Or Equinox would have stronger abilities if she was made into 2 separate frames? I still would've liked to see Khora. Assuming he can't stack his Wards on himself (you can't stack Wards now) all being able to shift elements does is allow you to micromanage if you feel like it. Vex Armor is the only ability anyone really cares about and it is present in every single form Chroma has now and isn't affected by elemental choice.

Why would this get rid of toxin and elec dragons? IMO it would give more reason to use them. And people already using them aren't suddenly going to abandon them simply because they can change to heat or cold in a mission. Confused ice dragons? Because of the calculation changes to Vex, Heat is a better tank option than Cold right now so if they are confused it is because they are using Cold in the first place.

In my rework, I said that it could be set on his Scream. It could be on his Ward or it could be on his Effigy. It really doesn't matter where it just matters how.

He would be weaker because his abilities would be balanced around any combination of his potential wards, screams, and pelts, instead of a set combination.

He uses all the elements, not all the elemental combinations.

See, you admit that one would be used over the other, so he still wouldn’t be a “master of elements” he’d just be a confused fire chroma who spit lightning. It would do nothing for the problems of chromas current design, just allow people to ignore them easier, giving up on his original idea for an uninspired bandaid.

Anything else?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, BigPapiPimp said:

He would be weaker because his abilities would be balanced around any combination of his potential wards, screams, and pelts, instead of a set combination.

He uses all the elements, not all the elemental combinations.

See, you admit that one would be used over the other, so he still wouldn’t be a “master of elements” he’d just be a confused fire chroma who spit lightning. It would do nothing for the problems of chromas current design, just allow people to ignore them easier, giving up on his original idea for an uninspired bandaid.

Anything else?

That's not how you balance things (perhaps "should" should be the operative word). DE hasn't even fully shown how they would handle this situation; I am not saying they wouldn't nerf his wards because its possible but I literally can't see the reason they should. Again I would have liked to see Khora because she would've been the closest comparison. But of the closest precedent, we have Equinox which her forms are not balanced against each other because they can not exist at the same time (well not in a matter controllable by the player anyway). She cant even seamlessly move between them without losing everything.

You balance what you can use at any single point in given time not the plurality of availability. Again assuming Chroma can not gain the benefits of multiple Wards at a time (especially on his own), he at any given point is at the capabilities of whatever single form we choose from now at any point in a mission. Example, being able to change from Fire to Toxin doesn't make Toxin any more durable or even powerful than what we currently have; they are fundamentally separate because they can't exist at the same time. If you can run the mission as them separately then being able to run them in a mission by basically swapping them out in real time is no different (the results are the same); a problem arises when you can do things with swapping that can't be done as them separately (and there is no such content in existence where this is true currently and probably ever because DE doesn't want hardcore parameters). Any potential gain is offset by the differences the Wards already display; in so far as to say that to gain the benefits of the new element you have to give up the benefits of the old element if even just for a moment. With all that said, the majority of his strengths are located in Vex and that is available to all the elements.

What did I admit exactly? Cold and Heat butt heads with each other because they via for the same role. Ever since they changed the Health Boost from healing others to per cast of Ward, Heat fell behind because it became a tank competition with Cold instead of an alternative. But now that Chroma isn't stacking crazy amounts of armor with the Vex change, Cold has fallen behind because Heat provides more eHp. In a game of stats and numbers, there is always a leading contender; that is why there is a META. If you look at my OP on the Elemental Ward section you will notice that I made Heat the default tank with Cold being a new alternative to both damage and survivability (of course that is to a point of enemy scaling). If they don't compete, they become alternatives that can be explored if one so chooses.

The problem in the favorability of Chroma's forms are less about Chroma and more the rest of the game and how people perceive the "endgame". Survivability (and his power is located outside his elemental choice) is favored which pushes out Elec and Toxin. Then the numbers favor Heat over Cold, that is just how it goes. To fix that, DE has to fix the power gaps between the Player and the Enemy. To be clear the player is so much more powerful than the enemy units that the enemies have to scale aggressively. And that aggressive power curve then reinforces survivability or powerful disabling utility. As long as this is the case the defensive Wards will always beat the offensive ones.

As far as anything else... He certainly can't be a "Master of Elements" if he can't even use the elements when he wants. Besides being locked in an element only encourages people to stick to the META to get through the most content. And honestly it'll be hard to ever get real deep in to it as long as his NON-ELEMENTAL ability towers so far head of his elemental ones. But cutting Vex is more or less like making a new frame which will have its foreseeable effects on the community. Though I suppose at this point they could just roll it into Ward and make a new 3.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, BigPapiPimp said:

He would be weaker because his abilities would be balanced around any combination of his potential wards, screams, and pelts, instead of a set combination.

He uses all the elements, not all the elemental combinations.

See, you admit that one would be used over the other, so he still wouldn’t be a “master of elements” he’d just be a confused fire chroma who spit lightning. It would do nothing for the problems of chromas current design, just allow people to ignore them easier, giving up on his original idea for an uninspired bandaid.

Anything else?

I have no idea that inflexibility was good and wanted by the player base. This would keep the burden and annoyance that kept people from liking Chroma or the current Chroma user still suffer. By simply giving the quiver treatment and making no change for the wards buff it will obviously make it a bandaid, but changing the functionality and/or usefulness of ward will actually fix it.

 

I'd like see toxic ward give rate of fire rate buff and an addition or twist mechanic for electric ward.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 months later...

With the possibility of Chroma Prime fast approaching. I felt that I would put my ideas out there again with some updates and other looks based on the systems that have been changed and/or released since the initial post. Rather than make a whole new topic with the same information (plus whatever I add) I figured I'd recycle this topic.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...