Lets fix Zephyr once and for all

[--Q--uixotic]

Jet Stream is the only reason I use Zephyr, but unless you're cuddling with your squad it drops off them very quickly.
This should be treated like other buffs (granted to squad on cast if in range), or like Elemental Ward (granted to squad when they walk into range).

Zephyr should be valuable on the plains since Jet Stream increases the damage falloff range, allowing people to use a wider variety of guns.
That isn't the case right now since it's mostly a self-buff. 

[SweetAnubis]

i agree with most of what you had to say however i do think turbulence needs it's cast time shortened back to it's original cast time. that extra half second to cast means life or death in high level games

i like the multi tornadoes myself but would love if it had proper draw and didn't keep flinging enemies away. tornadoes suck stuff in. As for bigger tornado we can control where they go now so why not the ability to make them merge when they collide to make a bigger tornado.

 

personally i would like a little more survivability on her part as well... i mean i do like inaros but sometimes i'd like to be able to take zephyr into sorties instead of having to switch every single time i want to do anything higher level. It's at a point atm where no amount of mod combos and skill can make her truly viable for end game content.

[ObviousLee]

4 hours ago, SweetAnubis said:

i agree with most of what you had to say however i do think turbulence needs it's cast time shortened back to it's original cast time. that extra half second to cast means life or death in high level games

i like the multi tornadoes myself but would love if it had proper draw and didn't keep flinging enemies away. tornadoes suck stuff in. As for bigger tornado we can control where they go now so why not the ability to make them merge when they collide to make a bigger tornado.

 

personally i would like a little more survivability on her part as well... i mean i do like inaros but sometimes i'd like to be able to take zephyr into sorties instead of having to switch every single time i want to do anything higher level. It's at a point atm where no amount of mod combos and skill can make her truly viable for end game content.

I've taken her through sorties recently. It's doable sure, but you can't really use tailwind during the missions as it leaves you vulnerable during the duration of its cast. The re-cast of tornadoes although a massive QoL buff to her, isn't that great when the tornadoes chase off after god knows what forcing you to recast just to make it hit the enemies you're hoping it does. Add to that the turbulence effects although gorgeous, take a bit longer than desired which means you have to time your casts before entering rooms to maintain safety. All in all kinda bonkey.

[DjKaplis]

Very much like the suggestion about Zephyr's 4th - an option to make it into a single big tornado (base diameter around 5m) that you can guide and that truly holds enemies inside (either make this default or with augment).

Or just at least make tornados spawn where you point them and not move away on their own unless you manually move them. That would also work.

Edited April 1, 2018 by DjKaplis

[(XBOX)EntrTheLight]

On ‎3‎/‎20‎/‎2018 at 9:08 PM, ObviousLee said:

Yes folks, it's me again. It's been a minute but I'm back again to throw my two cents into the frame I love and adore to try to get her to where I feel she should be thematically and mechanically.

 

So, that said let's just jump right on in.

We're going to review her current kit's strengths and weaknesses in detail, and in doing so I'll make my suggestions on where she can be fixed in such a way that can accommodate as many desired play-styles as possible.

So lets start with the bane of all that is joy and happiness for me in regards to her kit: Tailwind. Tailwind as most of you reading this will likely know, is a dual function skill that works one of two ways: press 1 for instant cast to rocket at relatively high speeds in the direction of the cursor, or hold 1 to charge up for a hover that has you sitting in the air for roughly ten seconds.

• Strengths: High mobility beyond parkour systems that allows for large distance of travel, as well as the ability to hold a particular altitude for a duration .
• Weaknesses: High duration builds which positively effect the better part of her kit(Turbiulence and Tornado) gimp the usefulness of Tailwind in the overwhelming majority of the games content(sans Plains). Hover offers zero mobility without the use of another action, being melee attacking to get out of the hover or casting tailwind again. I've been told rolling out of hover works as well but I've had mixed results, not sure if bug or not but I digress. High duration Tailwind works well on the plains, I'll admit that much outright as the play space is large and open enough to really house the ability effectively. The same cannot be said about the rest of the games content. High duration builds in tile sets will see you grinding your face into walls till the animation lock expires and the ability finishes its cast or worse, have you diving beak first into the chest of an enemy only to be melee hit and take substantial (if not lethal) damage that you have zero ability to defend against. The augment)Target Fixation) is genuinely impossible to capitalize on even with a max strength build, due to the nature of how tailwind currently functions as it requires you to pass by enemies and thus hit them with the ability to gain the effect which resets upon touching the ground. Meaning essentially it's a waste of a slot to use as you're never able to effectively even build around it.

This, is a mechanical failure in design. The current state of tailwind, whether one likes it above its former incarnation or not, leaves you slamming into walls, doesn't work very well with the vast majority of the game, defenseless against enemies until the duration ends and is only genuinely applicable in 1% of the game(The plains). Don't get me wrong here, the ability isn't trash, but it's a far cry from what it has the potential to be. So, How do we fix this? Simple: we re-arrange the existing mechanics of the current rendition of Tailwind for more cohesion and versatility. Here's what I have in mind.

• Remove the animation lock on tailwind. This in of itself would at least give more control to the player in regards to when they want the ability to end for the instant cast and prevent players from being at the mercy of corridors and enemies.No more three seconds of high-intensity wall inspections or getting brained by butchers/chargers who aren't here just lookin for a "good time".
• Tie the distance and rate of travel to power strength instead of duration. This allows for max duration builds that aren't gimping any of her skills. Tying Tailwind to strength also bolsters the effectiveness of Target fixation, when coupled with what else I have in mind.
• Take the charge mechanic for the hover, and revamp it to a persistent flight mode. The mechanics already exist in no less than three incarnations(Tailwind itself, razorwing, and archwing) so it's not that much of a switch as is. Limit the initial "flight speed" to a happy medium between the jog speed(moving forward without pressing sprint) and sprint speed. This allows for full control of flight without running the risk of slamming into things in narrow hallways. so for arguments sake a stock non thrust flight speed of say 1.05, and pressing sprint will give you the same speed as if you used the ability for its instant cast.
• Holding aim engages the hover mode. This allows for controller users to not be kicked to the metaphorical curb in terms of mapping. It also offers point break control for when you want to go from breakneck speeds to stopping on a dime for whatever reason. Pressing jump disengages the flight mode and normal warframe travel can be resumed.
• Make Divebomb be triggered on collision of enemy contact or hard collision. What I mean by this is if you're for example flying down a hallway with zero obstructions, and you glance off a wall divebomb is not triggered and you just kinda skitter alongside the wall until you rectify your vector(direction of flight). If you fly straight at the wall however, the AoE of divebomb is then triggered. Collision with enemies would also trigger the effect, however not impede the flight. This would essentially make Tailwind a highly mobile form of cc as well as allow for rapid tactical positioning.
• Edit: Instead of using aim to initiate glide, tapping s should engage hover and tapping s again should resume flight courtesy of @Azamagon

In summary: This rendition of Tailwind offers greater cohesion, control, mobility and crowd control without gimping the remainder of your kit in relation to the majority of the games content. It also allows for one to now effectively build around the augment while simultaneously turning Zephyr into an airborne bulldozer without taking an arm and leg to conjure up new systems to make it possible. It's mechanics that already exist in the kit as it currently is, just needs to be re-aligned.

Air burst: Second ability of the kit that centers around strong cc for cheap casts that allow for Zephyr to remove enemies from her faze to avoid melee damage.

• Strengths: Instant cast, wide AoE cc that forces knockdown of enemies that comes cheap and even cheaper in the air. It's great as a preemptive or reactive skill for halting enemy advancement or attacks.
• Weaknesses: lack of outright damage, sometimes triggers prematurely due to surface clipping or (rarely) goes straight through surfaces and fails to trigger at all.

Honestly not much to say about this ability from my end as it functions (fairly) well for what a cc frame should be should be using. Personally I feel it could do a bit more to possibly force a slash proc, but I'm honestly not sure and it's up for debate.

Turbulence: The "I don't care about guns shooting at me but plz dun hit meh wit yo melee" ability. Zephyrs immensely enjoyable defensive ability with a run speed increasing augment to boot.

• Strengths: Do you find yourself being shot in the face? Detron crewman got'cha down? Is that corrupted heavy gunner laying down a literal wall of bullets preventing you from safely murdering the ever living hell out of her? WELL LOOK NO FURTHER! What you need is TURBULENCE: THE GUN DENIER! Turbulence is effectively perfect in that it redirects projectiles away from Zephyr and has a very strong augment to accompany it(Jet Stream) for the purposes of evasion and/or jumping into the thick of the fight.
• Weaknesses: Melee and lor range builds. Yup, that's it. oh and AoE from enemies but that's player positioning more so than a fault on the ability itself in my opinion.

There really isn't much to change or suggest changing here without risking a lynch mob, so I'll refrain from what amounts to a useless movement and just agree that the ability is fine as is.

 

Tornado: Summoning a maelstrom of nasty is great as an "oh snap" button, and even more so now that it can be recast on demand alongside the damage mechanic that has been incorporated. Tornado, out of all the abilities in the kit that could use some tweaking needs the least amount I believe, but tweaking it needs none the less.

• Strengths: Hilarious crowd control, recastable, and monster levels of damage potential.
• Weaknesses: The ability has to be babysat in order to make the most out of it as it tracks to your cursor, the tornadoes hold enemies only so/so, and the wandering is still problematic to a slight degree in relation to terrain that isn't the plains.

How we fix: We make Tornado exactly as its name says: A tornado.Singular. One very large, stationary tornado with a massive draw radius that houses enemies within the funnel instead of casting them aloft on the outer rim of the ability to be dumped unceremoniously onto the dirt. This removes the need to monitor the ability, as well as having roving twisters going all over hell and high water looking for a baddy to blow around. Funnel clouds can be retrofitted to function as the tornado ability currently functions, with the ability to utilize air burst in tandem with tornado as it also currently does. What this means is that without funnel clouds on your loadout casting tornado will give you a massive singular tornado that holds enemies inside it, but with funnel clouds you get the ability as it currently functions with the option to spam air burst into it to merge them into the one gigantic tornado. Alternatively, it could be made so it's the other way around and the singular massive tornado be an augment? Either or in all honesty.

 

So, in closing what we have presented before you is a more solid, cohesive skill set that fits the theme with mechanics that match. You get a wind themed frame that's covered in flight surfaces(even has an empennage for a cod piece) able to actually dominate the skies and fulfill her role better than ever before. She becomes more versatile, and allows for multiple styles of play that doesn't remove anything from anyone, but instead gives to all.

All feedback is welcome, but keep it civil, and keep it logical. Remember: I don't like is not an acceptable argument in relation to the suggestion of how the frames issues are remedied by my plan. If you don't like it, that's completely fine. Just remember when posting a disagreement to ask yourself "how does this rework not fix her current and already existing issues".

Well done! I agree with a lot of things here actually, although I always have thought Zephyr should be the tornado... but Inaros stole that from her.  I also have thought that she should have a ability like Exalted Blade (Excalibur's ultimate), only Zephyr would have 4-6 daggers based on power strength and be able to throw said daggers to a location where tornadoes would roam within the radius of thrown dagger... while also having her own combos while she has ability active.  Just my thoughts.  I love Zephyr and I want her to shine, but she is very difficult with the animation lock and annoying tornado control the way she is now.  

May have gone on a little, so in short: I support your idea.  It looks well written and effective.