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Khora's Planned Changes


[DE]Rebecca

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On 4/23/2018 at 7:51 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

Venari is now a passive ability - Venari is simply there, no casting required. When she dies, she will be revived when you Revive (*it's very likely you'll have the opportunity to revive Venari like other companions, but in the event you miss that window it'll be gone until you revive)

Seems like a lot of people are completely missing the second half of this change. Pets have a bleed-out timer, just like frames. You want a tankier Venari? Use Medi-Pet Kit. At max rank it adds 6/s regen and a +72% bleedout link. That boosts bleedout time to over a minute. Don't have that? Loyal Companion is +90% bleedout link, pushing it well past the 1 minute bleedout mark. If you can't switch to operator and revive in that time you are actively trying to kill your pet.

My recently forma'd rank 6 Venari is sitting at 968 armor (76.34% damage reduction) and 1807 HP. An effective HP of 7643.61. I'm only using Link Health and Link Armor. Shields looks like a waste of a slot, both because of my Khora build and Venari doesn't have them.

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3 minutes ago, (PS4)jockhotty said:

What if u have a beast equipped change to Khora or return Another time what happen to the sentinel or pet, as well as when u leave khora will you possibly enter a battle w nothing eqipped in that slot?

im fairly certain they are not replacing the pet slot of kora with venari. they are just making it so she shows up at the start and otherwise things menue wise wouldstay as they are right now with venari having her own slot

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Personally i love the idea of a specific pet based frame ,but at the moment even after the changes khora still feels pretty generic. The changes are a great step but still the frame still feels like a mix of other frames abilities only worse. 

If playing this game as long as i have there are a few things that i think were missed:

1) synergisitc power sets are way more fun and interesting that "passive" ones, or ones that force skewed modding as one or two powers outshine all tthe others

2) frames with unique powers are great but if they have no group utility , they will simply not be played  

3) a frame that doesnt have strong scaling or strong utility will be left behind for better scaling / utilitarian frames

 

Taking this into account, There are a few simple things that could be used to add synergy to the frame and add a compelling reason to play her.

 

whipclaw

- Striking an opponant causes venari to make an immediate attack on the target (possibly even one of the specific kavat attack mods equiped , randomly chosen or not) 

- Stiking an ensared enemy immediatly propogates the ensare (already being implemented)

- Striking an ensnared enemy causes all ensnare pulses to pull toards this victim 

- Stiking strangledome drops the current enemies but places them in ensare

 

Ensnare

- make the pulse grab all enemies in range on each pulse(being implemented)

 

Venari

- make the baseline pet passive (being implemented, but please make ressurectable as loosing a power due to ai moving to an unreachable spot would be horrible)

- add on use that summons a clone to make 1 attack vs each ensnared enemey in range ( number / damage scales with strength, preferably % based damage for scalability)

-every time vinari or a clone deals damage there is a small aoe healing / energy pulse (scaling with str / range)

 

Stangledome

- increase duration a little making kora less reliant on duration mods but still requiring a little for quality of life

-cause strangledome to debuff held enemies with garenteed cossive procs , making leaving your victim hanging a little while a worthwhile endevour.

 

These changes would create a play style based around power combinations and would add a degree of group utility .

 

Just my 2 cents but would love to see some changes like this

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5 minutes ago, nickcurcurato said:

Seems like a lot of people are completely missing the second half of this change. Pets have a bleed-out timer, just like frames. You want a tankier Venari? Use Medi-Pet Kit. At max rank it adds 6/s regen and a +72% bleedout link. That boosts bleedout time to over a minute. Don't have that? Loyal Companion is +90% bleedout link, pushing it well past the 1 minute bleedout mark. If you can't switch to operator and revive in that time you are actively trying to kill your pet.

My recently forma'd rank 6 Venari is sitting at 968 armor (76.34% damage reduction) and 1807 HP. An effective HP of 7643.61. I'm only using Link Health and Link Armor. Shields looks like a waste of a slot, both because of my Khora build and Venari doesn't have them.

unless i am missing something, not everyone who acquires khora will have done the war within, and on top of that they are more worried about the potential of venari dying on them and not being able to revive her without dieing themselves when that happens.  seems like a rather simple worry to me. without venari you only have 3 abilities, also dont want to have to worry much about their kavat in the first place mod wise

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38 minutes ago, Golmihr said:

Can't you please let use spawn and despawn her by holding down the #3, just like how Ivara and Vauban swap between their options?

Not all of us enjoy having an active pet running around.

I have to agree a pet on a spy mission? No thanks i do extreme stuff w sentinels as it is

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I like how we can mod Venari in the arsenal page. It'd be nice if we could do something like that with Ivara's Exalted Bow and Excalibur's Exalted Blade. Would be nice to give Khora an exalted whip on her 3rd, especially if Venari is now passive. Mayhaps pressing the 'use' button to make her go into protection or heal mode? Also for spy missions or such, it'd be nice if Venari just automatically goes stealth like Feral Kavats.

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here's my suggestion

why not make them three venari on the lose to be a passive ability.
first venari that fights independently. 
second venari that defend its master.
third venari that heals allies. 

and hopefully we can customize each venari mods and skins base on kavats patterns and colors.

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11 minutes ago, -Apeiron- said:

here's my suggestion

why not make them three venari on the lose to be a passive ability.
first venari that fights independently. 
second venari that defend its master.
third venari that heals allies. 

and hopefully we can customize each venari mods and skins base on kavats patterns and colors.

easily op and lore breaking as venari is venari. your essentially suggesting the potential to have 3-4 pets active at once and if you could mod them all there is no way to properly balance that especially if each gets their own hunters recovery which means many many more heals on top of the dedicated healer venari.

there is only 1 venari for 1 khora. get 4 khoras in a match that's already 8 possible pets.  bumping that number to 16 would be to nuts even for this game.

tho color customization is already a thing for venari i'm not entirely sure if she will get different skins or not in the future

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59 minutes ago, nickcurcurato said:

Seems like a lot of people are completely missing the second half of this change. Pets have a bleed-out timer, just like frames. You want a tankier Venari? Use Medi-Pet Kit. At max rank it adds 6/s regen and a +72% bleedout link. That boosts bleedout time to over a minute. Don't have that? Loyal Companion is +90% bleedout link, pushing it well past the 1 minute bleedout mark. If you can't switch to operator and revive in that time you are actively trying to kill your pet.

My recently forma'd rank 6 Venari is sitting at 968 armor (76.34% damage reduction) and 1807 HP. An effective HP of 7643.61. I'm only using Link Health and Link Armor. Shields looks like a waste of a slot, both because of my Khora build and Venari doesn't have them.

Its not that you dont have the time but the AI is bad enough that Venari can get stuck several tilesets away and bleedout before you get there. 

Bugs like Venari getting killed in the air can also mean the context menu for reviving can be missing entirely.

What people ask for is a way to get her back if they miss the bleedout timer becasue S#&$ happens. Be it a huge energy cost, health or something else. 

I know for a fact that if they implement this and she dies in any of the two above mentioned examples i will not kill myself to get her back i will play the mission to its end and get her back the next mission.  

I dont kill myself for things like carrier or helios either. Or kavats and kubrows for that matter.

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21 minutes ago, shinkido said:

unless i am missing something, not everyone who acquires khora will have done the war within, and on top of that they are more worried about the potential of venari dying on them and not being able to revive her without dieing themselves when that happens.  seems like a rather simple worry to me. without venari you only have 3 abilities, also dont want to have to worry much about their kavat in the first place mod wise

War Within completed or not, it's very easy to build Venari in a way that you have over a minute to revive it. There are ways to stack the odds of reviving Venari heavily in your favor. Maybe coding the ability to function in so many ways is not worth the effort of creating even more potential problems with having it function reliably in all situations? Maybe they can make it reliable one day but that could be weeks or months away. Why postpone the needed changes for a change that is a nice to have for, what is probably, most users?

Wanna roll with a pet frame? You get all of the benefits and drawbacks that come with the territory.

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26 minutes ago, nickcurcurato said:

War Within completed or not, it's very easy to build Venari in a way that you have over a minute to revive it. There are ways to stack the odds of reviving Venari heavily in your favor. Maybe coding the ability to function in so many ways is not worth the effort of creating even more potential problems with having it function reliably in all situations? Maybe they can make it reliable one day but that could be weeks or months away. Why postpone the needed changes for a change that is a nice to have for, what is probably, most users?

Wanna roll with a pet frame? You get all of the benefits and drawbacks that come with the territory.

wana roll with a pet frame that dosent have a normal pet. venari should not have the same drawback of death normal kubrows and kavats have, and giving it sentinal death rules is not good enough when you factor in those pets are optional and venari is mandatory for khora. having a recast for after death is a simple solution espetially since at the moment while there IS a duration, its a long one and she can be recast. if they move her to being there as a passive, getting rid of being able to recast her just seems BAD as there WILL be reasons you cant revive your pet. that is already a thing with the normal ones even WITH long bleedout times.

not sure why some people in support of the move to passive want venari to not be able to be recast.  after all, comparing a version where dead venari can be recast without yourself dying to bring her back sentinal style, and a version where. if she dose die you can only bring her back sentinal style. the first choice of just recasting venari is hands down without question the superior version to want. especially with venari being tied directly to khora making this new teritory to begin with

venari death is in the game. casting her again is already in the game. if DE can change venari from full cast to full passive, its not hard to think they could keep venaris ability to be recast after she dies

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i think her strangledome needs more range on the dome itself when running with Range mods, and that instead of the stance change with her three you swap AI and player between the khora and the pet, allowing you to actually become the cat with its respective skills, so if you need to heal and the AI is being dumb you can heal, or if you just wanna pounce and play with grineer like they are catnip you can, i figure when you switch to the cat khora can basically act like a smarter spector

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3 minutes ago, Accaliah said:

i think her strangledome needs more range on the dome itself when running with Range mods, and that instead of the stance change with her three you swap AI and player between the khora and the pet, allowing you to actually become the cat with its respective skills, so if you need to heal and the AI is being dumb you can heal, or if you just wanna pounce and play with grineer like they are catnip you can, i figure when you switch to the cat khora can basically act like a smarter spector

while playing as the kavat sounds amazingly fun and something i would love. this sounds like it would be alot of work for them to implament, and in terms of ai... well... as far as it has been demonstrated in this game to my knowledge... there is not a smarter ai that fits the description of smarter specter i can think of,. soooo yeah. ALOT of work would need to be done to even get the base down for playing the kavat in the first place, and that s not mentioning the technical difficulties of not having you fall threw the world when trying to do what venari is able to do on her own. 

and the fact it would take so much work sucks because the idea is so cool but it means there is nearly no chance it would be done...

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2 hours ago, nickcurcurato said:

Seems like a lot of people are completely missing the second half of this change. Pets have a bleed-out timer, just like frames. You want a tankier Venari? Use Medi-Pet Kit. At max rank it adds 6/s regen and a +72% bleedout link. That boosts bleedout time to over a minute. Don't have that? Loyal Companion is +90% bleedout link, pushing it well past the 1 minute bleedout mark. If you can't switch to operator and revive in that time you are actively trying to kill your pet.

My recently forma'd rank 6 Venari is sitting at 968 armor (76.34% damage reduction) and 1807 HP. An effective HP of 7643.61. I'm only using Link Health and Link Armor. Shields looks like a waste of a slot, both because of my Khora build and Venari doesn't have them.

First of all... reviving one pet is already enough to most of us... now you have to revive two...

Also take a note that Venari does not use packed-leader mod for some reason, therefore only way to heal her is to let her going through regeneration... which is far from enough in any high end missions.  It may sounds a lot that you have effective hp of 7650, but in reality... this number goes down rather quick if she does not have any useful ability to protect herself. 

I dislike #3 change.  I'd rather keep duration based than having to res this useless cat every so often for the novelty.

 

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3 minutes ago, DreadWarlock said:

If you guys do give us an Exalted Whip in the end, make it not work with Maiming Strike. I swear people only want that ability because of possible Spin2Win tactics. 

if they did give khora the whip, why would you want it to NOT work with maim?? so what if others want to do that, "you" don't have to build that way if "you" don't like it. so why hope others wont get that option?

seems a bit selfish to me but i don't know your reasoning for wanting to limit others choice. so i'll leave it at that

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