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Khora's Planned Changes


[DE]Rebecca

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I think all of these changes are great... EXCEPT the Venari change. Venari is Khora's signature ability and there shouldn't be any situation in which she doesn't have Venari available. Using 3 should revive if she's down and resummon Venari if she is dead instead of her being permanently dead for the rest of the mission. In my experience, Venari is FAR more likely to be downed than a normal Kavat because she's so much more aggressive than a normal Kavat and the fact that she essentially has no shields.

Honestly, I'd almost rather her stay a Summoned ability like she is now because changing her stance udinh energy is going to be rough since she has 3 stances. If it was only 2, I'd be totally fine with it. But 3 stances is too much when it comes to switching abilities and costing energy. Especially if you have to move 2 steps to get to the one you actually want to use. I have the exact same problem with the Tiberon Prime.

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40 minutes ago, Fluffborg said:

Definitely a step in the right direction.

It's been said already, but Strangledome still should go. Other frames already do it better; Khora's attempt is not nearly as unique or effective, and I see its niche being filled by Ensnare already.

not true, i bought khora not even 30 minutes after her release. leveled her up. and since then each time I've ran hydron with khora I've carried the team. Many instances where people would bring unranked warframes (loki primes, other khoras, etc.) or instances where I was the only one with a maxed warframe, I used strangledome to save the objective or to provide some form of CC to revive a downed teammate. Infact just earlier today i spawned into hydron in a random squad, and the object was just about to die. pressed 4 and saved it. [SPOILER ALERT] we ended up going the full normal 10 waves and that happened on like wave 3. really early on.

At anyrate, it's sitting in a good position for a weird new ability.

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18 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

 

  • Venari
  • Venari is now a passive ability - Venari is simply there, no casting required. When she dies, she will be revived when you Revive (*it's very likely you'll have the opportunity to revive Venari like other companions, but in the event you miss that window it'll be gone until you revive)
    • Venari fights independently until she receives a command. Khora’s third ability overrides Venari’s target and changes her battle posture at an energy cost.
    • Kavat mods like Animal Instinct have been fixed so they will work properly on Venari.
    • Venari deals slash damage to enemies instead of impact damage

Most of the changes sound promising, but this right here concerns me. I really really hope this means you guys are planning on making venari a passive and giving khora a new third ability. Because losing venari would mean locking out an ability UNTIL YOU DIE AND REVIVE!!! There’s already a bug in the game that prevents players from using powers or switching to operators, forcing players to kill the themselves to fix it, we don’t need this to be a feature for Khora. If venari is a passive and Khora would gain a new ability to replace venari, like maybe an exhalted whip perhaps, then that would be great. But having a locked ability because your cat is dead (and trust me, that kavat is gonna die a lot) just sounds terrible. Let Khora recast venari back for an energy cost, or at the very least give venari a cooldown before she respawns. Being gone permanently until you die sounds terrible unless Venari becomes nothing more than a passive.

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As a console player I am looking forward to Khora much more so with these improvements. Being able to revive Venari from bleedout is a must. I'm really hoping Ensnare improvements make the ability more effective from what I've seen. As for Strangledome, synergy with Venari's stance would be fantastic: the attack posture could do a Zephyr tornado type damage share on held targets (doesn't have to be 100% but this would remove the full drawback of slowing down kills & the % being based on power strength lends to more build diversity), the protect posture could boost allies armor while in the area (maybe sharing Khora's passive or counting all pets within the area), and the heal posture could do an Oberon Reneual type effect in the area, as a whole this gives a use to Khora's third ability even in situations where Venari is dead. My only remaining though is to shift Khora's base stats a bit raising her health at the cost of shields to give Venari a better boost from health link.

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It would be easier to just revive Venari by casting the ability again, whats the point of having that ability then? She dies and you'll never be able to respawn her having an ability that you'll never use again.

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when Rebecca gets deadset on a change its gonna happen one way or another.. Please if you're going to allready this damn soon nerf Khora by the venari change Make it respawnable on its own upon a cooldown, expend full energy upon Holding 3 (as you've done with Nekros' Soul Punch augment) (or atleast half energy) because its not hard to get energy back plop down a pad or 2. but please dear God Do not make venari just fall over dead and skip bleedout i allready stated this almost 10 pages ago and on twitter,

if you Make Venari like this its going to push people to only obtain Khora for MRFodder and shelf it or worse sell it off never to bother with again. because dead cat = a locked out ability for the rest of the mission , i highly doubt anyone of us sane players would willingly burn a revive Just to get the cat back, maybe if its allready dead aaand we're bugged where we Haveto OOB/Die

Everything else looks fine Granted strangledome is Hardly unique its a smaller AoE version of Harrow's Chains and feels rather out of place for a beastmaster frame. but pleasebe nice to the community on this Dont take our New kitty away from us like this.

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I dont know the lore behind her, but. tbh if the warframe design based on spider. However, Venair is a kavat not a spider thing. I know it's easiee to use already done assets and animations and etc.. but you know, i'm just wondering 

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So if Venari dies, something that can and most likely WILL happen, you're effectively down a power...uh not a good idea DE. Make it so we can spend energy to revive venari from a distance or something? Like if Venari is down and we press the button it uses a bit more energy to revive her? I don't wanna be down a power just because I'm fighting level 180 enemies and they killed Venari...

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I shared some ideas about Venari few times for now. I still stand by them :)

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

My idea:

1. Kavat should attack but in defence mode and healing mode it should be close to you.

2. Buff healing and give healing stance anything else maybe it could give you armor?

3. Buff the damage of attack stance

4. Upgrade AI

5. Defence stance should have animation of area blind like excal's blind while dissarming enemies, also it should try to stop bullets or help other team mates

6, More animations, make her actions visible for the player so I know I use my 75 energy for something

7. Diffrent fur patterns on diffrent modes, Defence mode should have a armor which we can choose, healing type should be more visible on battlefield so players would know where to run to get Heals - add some flashy effects, some fireworks to the healing aura

----

MOST IMPORTANTLY - Make some steps to make it combo with Whip or second ability. 

1. Whip kills heals havat

Attack type - 

1. Shreads armor to increse Whip's damage on affected enemies, those enemies would have red icon above to let the player know

2. Enemies cought in second ability recive incresed damage from whip AND kavat in attack stance.

 

Defence type - 

1. Area dissarms with Blind animation, something flashy

2. Second ability and fourth ability have incresed range of grasp for dissarmed enemies 

3, It could stop bullets or give us shields or armor or put small walls.

4. I BEG YOU LET THE DEFENCE TYPE HAVE ARMOR ;-;

 

Healing type - 

1. Increse healing, area and visibility of healing aura

2. Addictional healing for every enemy cought in 4th ability or 2nd ability 

3. make it flashy so players can see where they should run for heals but kavat should run from ally to ally and heal them. Make it a medic running on the battlefield! It just blows my mind how cool would it be 

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4th Skill - Players' favourite -

My idea: 

Honestly... I would just delete it but... in case we want to make it work:

1. It should be shaped based on place you casted it from. Has the same problem as Gara's wall had

2. Increse range of pulling enemies 

3. Increse damage with every enemy cought 

4. Make enemies cought in it easier to shoot down

5. Increse range of the whole chain formation

6. Increse Whip bonus damage 

7. Killing enemies could expand it and add to the duration

8. Buff for PETS skills in general. Pet being in it would recive HP, Shield, Armor buff and let the skills regenerate faster 

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Can Venari become Khora's passive (in place of Beastshield) and current Venari ability be renamed to 'Command'?
Also, can Venari be immoral? Her health stops dropping at 2hp and if Venari has 2hp, command efficiency is 1/2 or 1/4 of its original value (Slower healing, Halved damage...)
I feel like Khora should be able to throw a deployable as a Command once she switches to the chosen command stance, to have it act like other known abilities. Venari by default acts like regular Kavat, but if Khora deploys a stance, Venari obeys the stance. It would work like:
- Throw animation should be like throwing/sticking with a whip.
- Deployable object sticks to the surface, ally or an enemy.
- If it sticks to an ally - an aura around ally should be where Venari does the stance.
- If it sticks to an enemy - an aura around an enemy should be where Venari does the stance, until enemy dies. Then the stance stays on the floor.
- If it sticks to the surface - an aura round it should be where Venari does the stance, until you move far away from it. Then Stance stops and Venari follows Khora.
- Healing heals all allies in range.
- Attack attacks enemies in range by some hierarchy.
- Ability cast costs 75 energy affected by efficiency mods.
- Ability aura range (Healing, attacking, protecting) is affected by range.
- Ability deployable can have duration (but doesn't need to)
- Khora can command by up to 60m (isn't affected by range)

Thanks!

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My personal opinions after playing her:

Her 1 should hit harder, I understand that it's meant to stack with her 2 & 4, but should still hit harder.

Her 2 should make the target either invincible or give them damage resist similar to Trinity's Well of Life, and any connected target should take damage from her one, instead of just "hit" targets.

Venari  should swap similar to Vauban's Traps, and should be really cheap to swap modes, perhaps if Venari goes down, you can spend so much energy to re-summon her.

Her 4 is interesting, and frankly I've got no idea how to improve it other then improving the duration on it, without having to run 200% Duration.

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19 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Venari is now a passive ability - Venari is simply there, no casting required. When she dies, she will be revived when you Revive (*it's very likely you'll have the opportunity to revive Venari like other companions, but in the event you miss that window it'll be gone until you revive)

Would it be possible if we had venari still castable like it is now but not have any duration as if it was a passive; we would still summon venari in originally but any time venari dies, we could summon her back albiet with a bit of a energy cost to do so.

This would alleviate the potential issue of Khora losing a quarter of her kit cause Venari's AI wasn't attempting to stay alive and also preventing Khora players needing to suicide just to get Venari back.

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I know I'm flogging a dead horse, but... Exalted Whip as a potential 4th? Venari has a cycling mechanic, but if Venari is going to be passive, then just give Venari a Venari specific mod or two. Like Smeeta's Charm and Mischief. Sure, Venari would use abilities at random then, but then we could get rid of Khora's 3rd ability which will soon be rendered absolutely useless by pet death. Having a Warframe ability that is completely dependent on wonky companion AI doesn't seem particularly... reliable or desirable.

If we completely scratch Venari as an ability, and assign Strangledome as Khora's 3rd...

...Then maybe Steve could dredge up those old Exalted Whip codes and animations from the dev build, and add them to our public build Khora as her 4th?

...Pretty please?

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Venari perma-death is a really bad idea. There are no other Warframes in the game that lose 1/4 of their usability because of companion AI or one-shot galore endgame content. If Venari is going to be permanently tied to Khora's 3, then Venari needs to either be unkillable or easily revived with energy spent.

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@[DE]Rebecca
Her ultimate still looks quite annoying, of course hanged enemies in different places looks cool, but practically it's very annoying, and her Ult does not look like Ult for 100 energy, do not get me wrong, skill have very interesting and cool mechanics and can be a good CC skill for 2 or 3, but in usability it's not that useful for 4, also is quite annoying to hit, but it's just my opinion...
Also, may I wright my idea ? I know not best, but conceptually may give Khora some more control flexibility.

For Ultimate -
My opinion, is better to give her Traps, let me explain -
- Khora with her 4 can place the Trap in the Targeted place (3m/3m for example, or round 3m/r), she can place 3-5 traps without Mods and ~10 with mods, This traps grab enemies in ~10m radius and chain them in the center of the trap (each trap can grab limited number of enemies, or no), Khora's 1 deal bonus damage to chained enemies and each Trap poisons chained enemies and deal Toxic or Gas damage (damage over time). I think such mechanics will make her more flexible in CC in zonal control and it can be useful as in defencive same in offencive gameplay, also enemy grabbing and hanging animations will not be such annoying as it is now, Also, can leave the existing Agro-mechanics (when not chained enemies attack the enemies chained in the trap)...


Sorry for my bad English.

And thank you and all DE team for all your work and thank you for listening community, you do a great job. 

P.S. - Also Please, do not force us to chase one more pet to revive, I'm afraid that gameplay can turn into a simulator of resurrection of pets.

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19 hours ago, xXDeadsinxX said:
      • If Venari is staying an ability passive, we should be able to heal Venari by hitting 3, similar to how Nekros’ Shadows of the Dead works
  •  

what a great idea 

like Ivara 1 ability that can do 4 abilities in 1 ..... you make khora  3 do many things like 

  1. heal Venari is she need health 
  2. revive her if she died at cost of energy or let's say some % of khora  health
  3. CC Guardian 1: venari will be on guard for a range to attack any enemy come close or 2: CC Healer Venari will always go to ally who need health and heal him at cost of khora energy 

dont know what else .. but that all i have now 

 

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19 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:
  • Ability casting times have been shortened across the board - Natural Talent is always great, but the base animations needed shortening.
  • Whipclaw
    • Whipclaw will apply to and benefit from the combo counter.
    • All enemies caught in the Strangledome will take half of Whipclaw’s attack damage when one enemy in the Strangledome is hit with Whipclaw.
    • Hitting an Ensnared enemy with Whipclaw will cause the living metal to propagate.
  • Ensnare
    • Ensnare affects multiple enemies. When an enemy is ensnared, the living metal will propagate and pull in every enemy within range. The living metal ensnaring enemies will then propagate a second time to pull in another wave of enemies within range.
    • Procs no longer wake up ensnared enemies.
  • Venari
  • Venari is now a passive ability - Venari is simply there, no casting required. When she dies, she will be revived when you Revive (*it's very likely you'll have the opportunity to revive Venari like other companions, but in the event you miss that window it'll be gone until you revive)
    • Venari fights independently until she receives a command. Khora’s third ability overrides Venari’s target and changes her battle posture at an energy cost.
    • Kavat mods like Animal Instinct have been fixed so they will work properly on Venari.
    • Venari deals slash damage to enemies instead of impact damage.
  • Strangledome
    • Once an enemy dies in the Strangledome, they will drop to the floor, making room for new victims.
    • We have other plans that are too in-progress to share yet - we'll update here with more information as we get it!

We expect to release this to PC this week for the most part - so stay tuned to notes as each hotfix rolls out. We think Wednesday at the earliest pending testing and implementation!

P.S We are also making some FX changes to simply have more oomph and visceral feels! 

That sounds... really nice.

However I cannot help but think about how amazing she would be if she had an exalted whip.

Also, I feel like it would have been interesting if she could instantly kill an enemy with Strangledome or Ensnare after some time on top of dealing damage. I mean they are not taking damage on their armor, they are getting choked to death.

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  • Venari
  • Venari is now a passive ability - Venari is simply there, no casting required. When she dies, she will be revived when you Revive (*it's very likely you'll have the opportunity to revive Venari like other companions, but in the event you miss that window it'll be gone until you revive)
    • Venari fights independently until she receives a command. Khora’s third ability overrides Venari’s target and changes her battle posture at an energy cost.
    • Kavat mods like Animal Instinct have been fixed so they will work properly on Venari.
    • Venari deals slash damage to enemies instead of impact damage.

Question which I would like to know is if it has been answered not sure but at the moment Venari has three posture which you cycle through Attack / Protect / Heal which you have to cycle twice to get from Attack to heal posture unless I am doing something wrong here. With your changes would that not mean we are paying an energy cost twice just to get from A to C also would it not be nice to actually know if Venari heal is in cool down cause it not always healing when you need it to It could just be me not paying much attention I am no pro xD.

Side note got Khora on release I think she an amazing frame got her with natural talent to even everything out doing well with double strangle dome and arca shotgun combo to clean out my dome lol she good for defence get top score every time. The said changes to come in are much needed for her animation to long, whip had its issues plus what with that hitbox its off you can aim accurately and it wont touch the target, snare changes are good like it as it was as well, dome way to small guess that why you can plant two off them but costly on energy without efficiency.

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19 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

 

  • Venari
  • Venari is now a passive ability - Venari is simply there, no casting required. When she dies, she will be revived when you Revive (*it's very likely you'll have the opportunity to revive Venari like other companions, but in the event you miss that window it'll be gone until you revive)
    • Venari fights independently until she receives a command. Khora’s third ability overrides Venari’s target and changes her battle posture at an energy cost.
    • Kavat mods like Animal Instinct have been fixed so they will work properly on Venari.
    • Venari deals slash damage to enemies instead of impact damage.

Khora being able to block off one ability entirely until she bleeds out completely is not good game design. She needs a way to revive Venari without dying.

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