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[DE]Rebecca

Khora's Planned Changes

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4 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

PC Tenno, what a week it's been!

This post aims to go over 1 main point of Beasts of the Sanctuary: Khora!
At a glance, I think the gap between Gara and Khora's release is one of the longest between releasing new Warframes. That alone doesn't feel too good. There are a lot of reasons for this, and most of them are layered in re-designs of the Warframe (IPS/Quest goals, etc). The way Khora was released was certainly not the most ideal given the wait for a new Warframe, but we are going to make her better thanks to your experiences.

As must be said for all time, everything below is subject to change! This is especially important - while we want to give you a sense of what we're planning, it's equally important that you know we are indeed planning. 

Here's what we're planning on doing with Khora!
 

  • Ability casting times have been shortened across the board - Natural Talent is always great, but the base animations needed shortening.
  • Whipclaw
    • Whipclaw will apply to and benefit from the combo counter.
    • All enemies caught in the Strangledome will take half of Whipclaw’s attack damage when one enemy in the Strangledome is hit with Whipclaw.
    • Hitting an Ensnared enemy with Whipclaw will cause the living metal to propagate.
  • Ensnare
    • Ensnare effects multiple enemies. When an enemy is ensnared, the living metal will propagate and pull in every enemy within range. The living metal ensnaring enemies will then propagate a second time to pull in another wave of enemies within range.
    • Procs no longer wake up ensnared enemies.
  • Venari
  • Venari is now a passive ability - Venari is simply there, no casting required. When she dies, she will be revived when you Revive (*it's very likely you'll have the opportunity to revive Venari like other companions, but in the event you miss that window it'll be gone until you revive)
    • Venari fights independently until she receives a command. Khora’s third ability overrides Venari’s target and changes her battle posture at an energy cost.
    • Kavat mods like Animal Instinct have been fixed so they will work properly on Venari.
    • Venari deals slash damage to enemies instead of impact damage.
  • Strangledome
    • Once an enemy dies in the Strangledome, they will drop to the floor, making room for new victims.
    • We have other plans that are too in-progress to share yet - we'll update here with more information as we get it!

We expect to release this to PC this week for the most part - so stay tuned to notes as each hotfix rolls out. We think Wednesday at the earliest pending testing and implementation!

P.S We are also making some FX changes to simply have more oomph and visceral feels! 

Can there be a fix or tweak to the whip's accuracy? Idk if this is just me but I can't consistently hit the enemy with the whip after ragdolling them or getting them caught in the Strangledome.

Example here: 

 

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Only problem I have with Khora is her strangledome should neutralize the eximus unit aura pls for some reason she always pulls the toughest eximus units and troubling herself what a maso frame

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4 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Venari is now a passive ability - Venari is simply there, no casting required. When she dies, she will be revived when you Revive (*it's very likely you'll have the opportunity to revive Venari like other companions, but in the event you miss that window it'll be gone until you revive)

Please, for the love of all things Tenno, leave Venari re-castable. Having our pets constantly die in high level content is annoying enough already, but being able to re-cast Venari at any time helps avoid that cringe. If you force us to babysit her through bleedouts, or worse, DIE in order to recover Khora's signature ability, it'll be a huge downgrade.

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5 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Venari is now a passive ability - Venari is simply there, no casting required. When she dies, she will be revived when you Revive (*it's very likely you'll have the opportunity to revive Venari like other companions, but in the event you miss that window it'll be gone until you revive)

Since your 3 would be useless anyway, why not just press 3 again to resummon him. The way it is now it's just an incentive for players to waste their revives and if they don't it just makes the ability functionless. Having to baby-sit one cat/sentinel is enough I don't want to have two on my hands.

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seems like a good start, but still needs more imho: 

whipclaw - should deal full dmg to any/all enemies caught within the strangledome if hit while active, why only 50% of dmg? you are already using 2 abilities for this combo effect, the 50% dmg seems just like a slap in the face and a negative incentive =/

venari - should be able to be re-summoned if killed by using the 3rd ability, otherwise everything else sounds fine ; because otherwise you do realize what you are saying right? that not only is khora one of the most under-whelming frames ever released, you are saying that she has an ability that can DIE and then you will have NO 3rd ABILITY until your frame dies itself... i mean it would be one thing if khora was the new OP hotness or something and she was capable enough with 3 abilities... but lets be real, she is not... ; personally i think every use of khora's 3rd should heal venari by like 20% base hp or something, and just have it cost +50% more energy to revive venari if dead

Edited by CY13ERPUNK
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I'd like to give my input on what I am thinking of the currently planned changes for Venari.
One thing that I am afraid of is for her to become a passive pet. One that can die, making your 3rd technically useless.

Would be great if she is left as it is, while adding a lil' management to her ability.
Just like Ivara's and Vauban's toggle abilities, it'd be nice when you hold down the ability it'd mark an enemy, this is when they are in Attack and Defend Mode. The marked enemies will become Venari's priority and she will go and clear them out.
During healing mode, it would be nice if you could mark allies, of which she can go and stick to them like glue until switched ally or mode.

She does need a few fixes on the damage side tho, a bit of a boost. But that is what I would like to see changed on Venari rather than making her a passive.
Perhaps lower the ability cost of the spawning, and the hold toggle abilities could cost additional energy to mark.

Edited by Eqnum

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24 minutes ago, PsiWarp said:

5 if you have a full Arcane set

6, not 5.

IMO companions should be able to return after their death, but with a cooldown. Regen/Primed Regen could still work as insta-revive mod.

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5 hours ago, xXDeadsinxX said:

Thanks for making a dev workshop, will read when I have a chance!

Here is my opinion and suggestions:

  • Whipclaw: Sounds pretty good so far, hopefully it’s decent enough in-action. Hopefully we see other frames get the same treatment as well. *cough Wukong’s Iron Jab cough*
  • Ensnare: Liking these changes for sure.
  • Venari: Definitely a positive boost in the right direction with this ability. 
    • Idea 1: Make the ability one of Khora’s passives and replace ability into something different
    • Idea 2: Keep the ability as a passive
  • Strangedome: Still needs to completely replaced by something else, it’s way way too similar to Harrow’s Condem and Vauban’s Vortex.

Hopefully this helps the problems and challenges you face with Khora, she is in a dire need of major changes.

that suggestion on replacing strangledome is completely unnecessary

its pretty unique and far from harrow's and vauban's abilities if you really think about it,

just my opinion tho no hate :3 

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she is like her personal kavat, i think the change with the fact that she loses her untill revive is better, other option is to, make venari reform after certain ammount of skills have been used or with her steel cage skill, like nidus passive

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I would love if Venari's damage or speed were affected by khora's ability strength. 
It would also be great to see Venari's heal ability scale off of ability strength or Venari's Defense mode be affected by strength(affects number of enemies disarmed or something along those lines)!

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I have the exact same problem with her acting like a regular pet. I do not like the idea that she can go down and become permadowned for the rest of the mission. I mean it's Khora's signature skill. 3 should bring her back if she goes down. I've had her get killed frequently compared to my Kavat so I'm legitimately worried about this.

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6 minutes ago, TrickshotMcGee said:

That's if you have 2 full sets. One set gives you one revive.

Yeah but then what's the point of talking about 5 if it's not maximum.

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5 hours ago, IEpicWolfI said:

 So replace summoning the Kavat with an exalted whip?

 

 

 

Please?

YEESS YEEEESSS PLEASE!!! MAKE STRANGLEDOME HER 3 AND GIVE HER THE EXALTED WHIP LOL PLLLEEEEAAASSSEEE!!!!

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The point is that her #3rd ability has a finite limit before it gets locked. Why is that type of drawback necessary when Khora is already being shunned as a lackluster frame?

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Nice to see she's getting the love she needs, most of those changes sound quite nice. However I'm still of the opinion Strangledome needs to go or be baked into ensnare somehow (I loathe it it so much and even with these fixes it'll still be a pain). I'd actually like to see an ability that interacts with Venari to replace it, be it a frenzy ability that amplifies her stance effects, some kind of transformation or AoE attack, or whatever. I know a lot of people are begging for the exalted whip but imo that will suffer from one of the same problems Strangledome does, it's too similar to other things and adds nothing new to the game. It's just sad to me that a beastmaster based frame doesn't have any abilities that actually interacts with her beast, which the whips & snares don't.

Edited by Baeyo

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Venari's abilities need to be triggerable on command to make him really useful. As it stands, even with the buffs he's receiving it's simply not worth it unless you can attack/disarm/heal when you want to and not whenever the precept cycles for Venari.

What I would suggest:

  • Mode switching works as it does now, free and instant. Venari's behaviours are largely unchanged, maybe a bit weaker. Attacks enemies like a normal kavat and occasionally does the chaining combo in attack mode, knocks down and occasionally disarms enemies in protect mode, stays near Khora and occasionally emits a weaker healing pulse in healing mode.
  • When 3 is held with a certain mode active, Venari casts a more powerful version of his ability in an area. Casting attack makes him chain and slash enemies in the marked area, protect has him rush to nearby enemies and disarm+knock them down, casting heal has him rush to every ally in range and heal a percentage of their health. These would cost energy and possibly have a cooldown between recasts.

Also please make Venari resummonable on death (he doesn't need a bleedout timer in addition to this) and have his abilities scale off Khora's power stats (strength increases damage and healing in the respective modes, range increases the range of his attacks and disarms).

 

In addition, to increase the synergy Venari has with Khora's other abilities, please consider have him do finisher damage against targets ensnared in Khora's 2 or 4.

 

I'm very happy with the changes to the other abilities, thank you for moving on them so quickly.

Edited by atejas

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5 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Venari is simply there, no casting required. When she dies, she will be revived when you Revive (*it's very likely you'll have the opportunity to revive Venari like other companions, but in the event you miss that window it'll be gone until you revive)

Can we please just spend the current cost to summon her again, if she dies? The possibility of an ability just dying like that, and the button doing nothing afterward unless the warframe also dies, does not sit well with many people.

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i'd remove her 2
move kavat to 2, make resummonable after death with press
move dome to 3, make it a bit bigger and add a little duration
add exalted whip
 

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How about this to both increase Venari's survivability and synergy with her skills:

  • Damage done with Khora's skills heals Venari without having to equip Pack Leader
  • So does properly whipping enemies (aka normal attacks with an equipped whip class weapon, no-spin-to-win bs)
  • If Venari dies, you have to "heal" him (her?) this way fully and can then resummon with 3

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I think her 4's still underwhelming as in, it doesn't have that ultimate "oomph" factor in. But hopefully more changes will eventually change that.

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To make Venari better in my opinion:

  1. Keep Venari as a passive and when she dies, pressing 3 will summon her for an energy cost
  2. Make her 3 battle postures not cost energy to change, however
    1. Make them change on holding 3
    2. Pressing Khora's 3 will command Venari to perform an action within context of her currently selected posture, this should cost energy as well.
    3. In regard to Venari's context actions:
      1. Attack posture should make Venari attack in that area starting with the enemy the reticule is pointed at.
      2. Protect posture should send Venari to protect the area the reticule is pointed at, a change to protect below.
      3. Heal posture should send Venari to an area or to a specific person.
    4. Protect should do a small radial disarm within a few meters instead of a single target

 

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