Thirdofherne Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 Apparently the Netherlands and Belgium have made randomised 'Lootbox' mechanics in games illegal. With other countries likely to follow suit. I was wondering how this might affect Warframe and Relics, as they are technically 'Lootboxes'. Does the fact that you can't buy Relics for Plat direct from DE protect the system? Does the fact that they can be traded for Plat between players negate this? Are changes going to have to be made? Will relics need to be made to give definite rewards? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NocheLuz Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 We didn't pay to get relics on the first place... Well, we did have that option... But who buy it anyway (lol). Also, Warframe did let you 'Choose' a reward from another person too. So, lootbox may not apply to Warframe's relics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)thefallenloser Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 Warframe is fine. We have the trading system that completely negates it. At least... it should... hopefully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)EpICFreeDoMZz Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 Unlikely because there's no real money involved. Besides the closest thing we have to lootboxes is the mod packs and there's no point buying them. As for platinum while it can be bought it can also be very easily earned. I doubt the laws would apply to warframe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoolDudeMcCool Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 I don't think "no point buying them" is a legal excuse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redspace0095 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 The only thing in Warframe that would fall foul of it would be the mod packs as you don't know what you are going to get but costs plat. But most are of the opinion that they need to go anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naftal Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 1 minute ago, CoolDudeMcCool said: I don't think "no point buying them" is a legal excuse. If there's any legal problems they can just remove mod packs from the market. I don't think anything else in the game falls to lootbox category. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsukinoki Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 (edited) Relics do not count for one very big reason: -You are not paying real money for a chance at ingame items That is what Belgium has recently ruled as gambling. Paying real money directly for a chance at an item you want. Earned "loot boxes" are perfectly fine as no money was involved in that transfer. They have no problem with free lootboxes as RNG is part of games. Edited April 26, 2018 by Tsukinoki Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artemisfortune Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 I certainly hope they don't make lootboxes illegal. Since when did the government get to decide what's allowed in games? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rune_me Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 Mod packs will probably have to go if these laws get passed. I doubt anyone will miss them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Zero_029 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 Nope. The only "paid" lootboxes in Warframe are the Mod Packs, Reloc Packs. Even then they guarantee certain rarities & quantities of mods. So overall, no. Warframe is actually a "Direct Buy" microtransaction game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VadiseReikaz Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 (edited) They should be fine. You can grind what you want out for free (With the relics that you can get off missions, off people, off syndicates, off marketplace (Not free, but why would you?)), or you can straight out buy what you want. Edited April 26, 2018 by VadiseReikaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motorfirebox Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 DE might possibly have to stop selling relics for real money. But I'd be surprised if that's a significant revenue stream for them, and since relics are so easily obtainable without spending money, they probably won't even have to do that. So no, I don't think this will affect Warframe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rune_me Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 1 minute ago, Pent_ said: I certainly hope they don't make lootboxes illegal. Since when did the government get to decide what's allowed in games? Since always. Government sets laws. Games are regulated by laws, same as anything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tarfeef101 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 Shouldn't, no. No direct paying for randomly generated items. You pay only for definite objects with your $$$. What you do after is up to you. Otherwise buying USD to go to vegas and gamble would have to be illegal too, as that's the same concept as buying plat and then getting relic/mod packs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hypernaut1 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 I don't think mod packs count because the game provides a way to earn those items in game. No one HAS to buy mod packs to get exclusive rare mods. It's simply an option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artemisfortune Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 1 minute ago, rune_me said: Since always. Government sets laws. Games are regulated by laws, same as anything else. In the US at least there isn't really any legislation on anything about video games. The ESRB is self regulated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsukinoki Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 Just now, Pent_ said: I certainly hope they don't make lootboxes illegal. Since when did the government get to decide what's allowed in games? Once it involves what can be defined legally in that governments jurisdiction as "Gambling". Gambling is regulated for quite a few reasons and if a game is falling foul of gambling then it is the right of the government to regulate that in some manner. And lets be honest, paid lootboxes are gambling. There really isn't a difference between buying a lootbox with money and buy a spin on a slot-machine. Especially the psychological aspect. SO I do hope that paid lootboxes become illegal, and it is perfectly with a governments rights to regulate it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thirdofherne Posted April 26, 2018 Author Share Posted April 26, 2018 4 minutes ago, Pent_ said: I certainly hope they don't make lootboxes illegal. Since when did the government get to decide what's allowed in games? Since they declare Lootboxes for real money to be 'gambling', and encouraging children to gamble is illegal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artemisfortune Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 1 minute ago, Tsukinoki said: Once it involves what can be defined legally in that governments jurisdiction as "Gambling". Gambling is regulated for quite a few reasons and if a game is falling foul of gambling then it is the right of the government to regulate that in some manner. And lets be honest, paid lootboxes are gambling. There really isn't a difference between buying a lootbox with money and buy a spin on a slot-machine. Especially the psychological aspect. SO I do hope that paid lootboxes become illegal, and it is perfectly with a governments rights to regulate it. I'm not saying I like lootboxes at all, but where do we draw the line? What if a game has no microtransactions yet features a lootbox mechanic? It's still gambling, but not gambling money. Will this affect CS:GO and Dota 2? Two giant games with huge lootbox systems? Is it okay if it's cosmetic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Yes-Man-Kablaam Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 1 minute ago, Pent_ said: In the US at least there isn't really any legislation on anything about video games. The ESRB is self regulated. Esrb hasn't done enough or really anything (they added a vague "in game purchases" tag now that won't differentiate between lootbox gambling and a game that has like 1 skin dlc for 99 cents) so people are stepping in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rune_me Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 1 minute ago, Pent_ said: In the US at least there isn't really any legislation on anything about video games. The ESRB is self regulated. Well the US is certainly trying it's damnest at the moment to dictate how much violence can or can't be in a videogame. And there's other countries than the US. Australia has had laws on how much and what kind of gore is allowed in games for many years now. And gambling is another issue. Most countries, including the US, has very specific laws on gambling, and that extends to games that allows gambling (like poker games, etc). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gabbynaru Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 1 minute ago, Pent_ said: In the US at least there isn't really any legislation on anything about video games. The ESRB is self regulated. No, the ESA and the ESRB are regulatory bodies, that doesn't exclude them from being under the watchful eye of the government. Since the regulatory bodies did not regulate the surge in gambling exploits, the government has all the right in the world to slap them down and enforce those regulations. Glad they do too, because the ESA and ESRB are just hives of scum and villainy. OT: I really don't think anyone will miss the mod packs, so, DE can easily do away with them and be on the safe side of the law again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
---UMBRA--- Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 (edited) there is no lootbox, lol, because we did not spend real money for drop rate increase Edited April 26, 2018 by ---UMBRA--- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xaero Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 It has to be a direct purchase for real money, right? PA's, PV's, platinum, skins are the only things you can buy for real money and there's no gambling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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