Dev Workshop: Spores Revisited (Saryn)

[(PSN)Gin_Da_Merciless]

52 minutes ago, Ryim_Drykeon said:

This re-rework is very very good. Nice work.

I have only one suggestion.

Miasma:: Instead of a straight 200% damage gain for enemies under Spores (and since Miasma no longer spreads Spores), could we see a new synergy between Spore damage and Miasma damage? Such as if Spores are under 100 total damage per tic, Miasma does normal damage. 101-200 Spore dpt, Miasma does 150% damage. 201-300 dpt, 200% and so on [Numbers for example only, not facts or suggestions]. So basically, the higher one runs Spores on damage per tic, the harder Miasma hits (offset by the fact that Miasma will kill off Spore carriers and slow/stop the dpt increase with the new Degradation system). This way, players have to work to get those -big- hits with Miasma, and it puts some of the complex synergy back into Saryn that many of use loved.

I like this. You build up the spore dmg then drain some energy (depending in strength) to make Miasma stronger.  Spreading spores could work for me too.

i have to see this for myself.  I see alot of ppl complaining but ive seen some stuff and she is much more active and seems less power hungry.  I can see if she was like Vauban or Mag but u technically only have to use spore a couple times the cheapest ability she has and toxic lash a good looking ability now with a decent cost.  Now its on the player to move around and keep the damage building versus standing around and/or camping with the molt spore combo.  Either im missing something or ppl liked not working much with Saryn but again o’ll have to see for myself.

[feralknights]

I'm all for experimentation but I think at this point y'all need to just wipe the slate and roll Saryn back to pre-rework.  I really like the idea of scaling damage over duration, but she's painfully obviously balanced around Elite Onslaught and nothing else.

There were things that were good in the rework and I think could stay, or be modified a bit to feel better -- Molt got a lot better, and I liked that Misama has more teeth.  Toxic Lash was a great change.  But as it stands right now she's presented as a high armor, high HP frame meant to be in the thick of it, but the only way you're going to get value out of Spores-- what her entire kit is balanced around now-- is to stay as far from the fight as possible and precision-shot enemies and pray a Nullifier doesn't mess up your combo chain and destroy the built-up damage.

Like I said, I really like the idea of upscaling powers and duration as high-end enemies in the game often end up becoming bullet sponges, but this second pass on the Spore rework just feels awful and un-intuitive to use.  I'm spending all my time and energy babysitting a meter-- and that is precisely why I also don't like playing as Nidus.

[-HoB-AngelofRevenge]

19 minutes ago, Zero_Awakening said:

I think you completely misread what i wrote. I literally explained why not having it spread on death is troublesome and suggested solutions for either reworking spores spread on death or altering the timing on spore damage just enough so that it is possible to get a hit in on an enemy and spread spores.

The issue comes up when you have built up damage and you are moving to a new group of enemies, cast spores and either the enemy dies instantly or dies before you can shoot or hit it and spread to the rest of the group. How am I supposed to just pop spores and kill the enemy that is already dead?

 

i did not expiriences such things, but i do notice 2 sec delay on cast spore and start ticking

[Kalvorax]

3 hours ago, Top_Kekkonen said:

now Saryn is a "chase the spores minigame"

i noticed this a lot myself...particularly with max range builds......its pretty annoying to say the least.

3 hours ago, Ryim_Drykeon said:

This re-rework is very very good. Nice work.

I have only one suggestion.

Miasma:: Instead of a straight 200% damage gain for enemies under Spores (and since Miasma no longer spreads Spores), could we see a new synergy between Spore damage and Miasma damage? Such as if Spores are under 100 total damage per tic, Miasma does normal damage. 101-200 Spore dpt, Miasma does 150% damage. 201-300 dpt, 200% and so on [Numbers for example only, not facts or suggestions]. So basically, the higher one runs Spores on damage per tic, the harder Miasma hits (offset by the fact that Miasma will kill off Spore carriers and slow/stop the dpt increase with the new Degradation system). This way, players have to work to get those -big- hits with Miasma, and it puts some of the complex synergy back into Saryn that many of use loved.

now THIS is a great synergy imo....though i do wish miasma would pop spores (x amount of spores based on current damage scale of spores?)...particularly due to the rather massive range it can be at now. (iirc its 46 meters with a 235 range)

[R31N]

About a year ago i posted on a patch update that mass nuke abilities were ruining the fun for the rest of the team, banshees used to enter sedna hydron for 5-10 rounds, get all kills by just spamming 4 and then extract cause she couldn't handle higher mobs. I suggested as a solution to this, that the focus ring at the bottom right of the corner (that has no reason to exist most of the time) could be used as a loading bar, and when it's full then the 4th ability would achieve the ability's max strength.

So depending on the mission type and mob level, a sedna hydron banshee could use her old resonating quake on full strength in about 10th wave, and before that, as the ring would be still loading her 4th skill would be weak. This was an easy solution that wouldn't require lot of changes on frame abilities as we knew them, it would protect the gameplay experience for others in parties with nuking frames, and would sustain all the fun too, cause nuking abilities are fun indeed, they have to be in the game, it's the bad use of them that makes them bad. 
4 old embers running around the stage at wave 15 is a nice thing to see, it's warframe.

Well obviously it didn't happen.

 

We know what happened to ember, when you lay an eye on the end of year statistics i bet you ll see that nobody plays with her anymore. So much for the 'original aoe frame'. You know what makes this even worse? You turned her to dust at the same time you unvaulted her in packs of 45euros. People that wanted that p flamed syandana paid for it to finally use it on their ember, and in the end they just paid for something they don't use. Consumers also tend to remember this kind of behavior.

Now it's saryn's time, Saryn was the perfect and only example of balance and how all frames should be in this game, 1st ability could be casted on the 2nd, the 3rd had a meaning and even using the 4th would respect the action around. Saryn could mass kill mobs over time, but was also giving a chance to teammates to claim and kill the mobs on their own. Another amazing thing was that one could ground slam spores on decoy/mobs to make them spread everywhere.
These are unique ideas.

I don't know why you thought to change saryn, there are so many frames that trully require your attention, but now I don't know how this can be fixed. You know that it's no fun at all if the spores don't spread after they dot-kill mobs on their own, right? Of course you can just do what you did on ember too, release a quick fix-tweak and burn saryn, case closed.

You make the game complicated for no reason at all, -don't take away abilities add more even if they're ^useless^- and what's worse is that you ruin the fun too. Who cares if an ember can cast an ogris like fireball? world on fire and firequake was her style. To play this new saryn is to try to catch your shadow, running around like crazy for nothing, well to catch a spore. Why we need spores anyway? we already kill everything with swords, right?

 

Just keep the fun on the game, cause if you complicate and ruin all frame abilities in the end it impacts the game itself.

 

ps. I m not against changes, I 'd love a 'fresh twist - twist not earthquake', if it's fun indeed and doesn't make a mess for no reason, and the gaming experience worse. You can use new ideas not to rework trademark frames but to make new ones.

[Slimspadey101]

I don't understand why people are on about "chasing spores" when there is no good reason to do that now. I mean you can just cast new spores and let the stragglers be. Why chase?

[Purity]

4 hours ago, feralknights said:

I'm all for experimentation but I think at this point y'all need to just wipe the slate and roll Saryn back to pre-rework.  I really like the idea of scaling damage over duration, but she's painfully obviously balanced around Elite Onslaught and nothing else.

There were things that were good in the rework and I think could stay, or be modified a bit to feel better -- Molt got a lot better, and I liked that Misama has more teeth.  Toxic Lash was a great change.  But as it stands right now she's presented as a high armor, high HP frame meant to be in the thick of it, but the only way you're going to get value out of Spores-- what her entire kit is balanced around now-- is to stay as far from the fight as possible and precision-shot enemies and pray a Nullifier doesn't mess up your combo chain and destroy the built-up damage.

Like I said, I really like the idea of upscaling powers and duration as high-end enemies in the game often end up becoming bullet sponges, but this second pass on the Spore rework just feels awful and un-intuitive to use.  I'm spending all my time and energy babysitting a meter-- and that is precisely why I also don't like playing as Nidus.

Saryn 4.0 needs to be saryn 2.0 lol. I get they did work and stuff but jesus, they butchered 1 to an unrecognizable game in itself lol. I mean I dont play anymore but I sympathize especially with saryn mains. Even if 1 was the only thing rolled back to 2.0 and 4 became the corrosive proc I think everyone would be aight with that.

[azak]

Lack little to ruin the Saryn... Sweet Saryn, what they doing with you?!

[haze777]

Not sure I like saryn.  I mean , Spores don't spread on kill sooo , going max dmg spore is counter intuitive so instead of being a heavy damage mage, we now have a support mage .

In my opinion: Spore is now a decent tool to remove armor and deal a bit of dmg, ( not a nuke skill worth having, specially with the amount of energy needed to keep high numbers alive) ,  her 2nd skill is the same,  third skill is the main skill now (  the most consistent and reliable of all ) and 4rth is just ok .  ITs not that bad , but just idk, not so my type .

What I would like : Spore : increase spread range, make it consistent , but prevent spores from killing enemies ( leave them at 1 hp,  that way , u cannot afk sit onslaught ) .

                            : Molt:  Attract enemies affected by spore ( and explode doing more dmg the more venom counters you have)

                             : toxic lash: Spreads spores, Applies the same toxic buff to weapon and melee, but also heals saryn by 1( times the amount of venom counters you have)  hp , for every spore detonated.

                             : Miasma : Every second the spores is active, increases Miasma dmg ( just like spore now, dmg increases as infection spreads) but it does not decay , once unleashed it will deal x amount of damage as viral aoe  and reset back to 0 (and for every enemy killed with spores on, you get a venom counter.  ( kinda like the new infested warframe) .

 

this way, saryn stays interactive, non cheap, and gets more effective over time ( kinda like the infested warframe also does) Venom counters would need  a cap, but this will prevent miasma aoe map overkill, spore aoe map overkill  while keeping saryn fun, strong, interactive  and very very toxic ( in a good way).

 

 

[Ozamchist]

Spore changes are spot on.
I initially thought the change death no longer propagating spores would be a problem, but after some usage and build adjustment (that's a thing you can do people) the recast combined with the improved/less buggy range I realized that its not there as a nerf to saryn, but its kind of there to prevent spores from going out of control and subsequently requiring an actual nerf. You can build up damage quite quickly, and if you aren't one of those dorks that stink at energy management, you can build up spores damage quite quickly and turn her one into a sneeze of death, which in early levels usually results in you wiping the very memory of the bloke from existence (in short for early to mid game stuff you may want to tone it down for better results nothing new here with that though, she's always was, and still is, Princess Overkill).

You do have to take a more active role in spreading spores, but they are overall much more rewarding, and actively spreading spores isn't really an issue since toxic lashes duration has been buffed significantly and can be used on guns now too.

Nothing to say about Molt, the augment is still a cornerstone of the ability, but it provides a lot more utility now which was always its purpose.

Toxic lash is a monster as usual.

I actually use miasma... sorta... kinda... everyonce in a while... Ok that skill could probably still use something tbh, but the rework is still fresh and I'm still tinkering.

Nice to see all the "Frame is dead to me now" "She's nerfed!" comments as usual. Never change Warframe community. Actually no that's a lie, please stop its embarrassing.

[Azrael]

7 hours ago, blaes said:

talk about not knowing stuff. 30k instant AoE damage (per worm, so up to 270k at once) not enough to qualify as spike damage for you?

You ignored what I actually wrote. Read it again, I said it doesn't do instant spike damage. You have to wait for the maggots to slowly make their way over to enemies, or put ravenous down in the middle of them, it's not the same as Miasma and doesn't do a viral proc.

you also seem to have fundamentally misunderstood me. I'm not arguing that Saryn is BETTER than Nidus, I'm saying that the claim "saryn is a worse version of nidus" is nonsense. You keep talking about things nidus does well, or how you don't need speed if enemies are CC'd (which is, uh... kind of a weird statement. The two don't serve the same purpose at all) but my entire point was that the player was saying they were the same ability when in fact they are totally different. So I'm not sure what you're arguing about, especially since you said you agree with my main point.

But for real, how did you decide that CC is a replacement for speed? That's just a strange line of reasoning right there. "I wish I could go super fast. Oh wait, no I don't, I have CC!" It's just.... a strange way of looking at things. But okay, it doesn't matter.

 

8 hours ago, blaes said:

when is the last time you reached over 15k stored damage for spore? as for armour stripping, weapons can do it very easily and very quickly

even 2k or 3k damage is really good. You're misrepresenting how the ability works. Virulence does 86k damage to enemies in a line or in Larva, one time. Spores does (for example) 2k damage per tick to everyone in a large area ignoring line of sight, until they are dead. 2k damage per tick will kill high level enemies fairly quickly without you having to target them or even find them. You can't just compare one tick from spores with the virulence spike damage and say "see? virulence does 43x more damage!" I mean, it's kind of weird to say that spores doesn't do much damage, and then also complain that you have to move fast to hit enemies before spores can kill them and how it's annoying to have spores wreck everything in radius and then start to decay. If it's killing everything around you too fast for you to keep up, then it's doing damage.

Same things go for weapons. You're comparing completely stripping armor from one or two enemies in a small area with a torid, to partially stripping armor from every enemy in a large radius ignoring line of sight. The two aren't comparable, they work differently and serve a different purpose. Maybe I'm using my corrosive pox but I'd also like them to be mostly stripped by the time I get to them? Provided of course that I get to them at all before spores kills them. You know, because of how weak spores is. That's why I have trouble spreading it, because it does no damage.

Once again, why are we even arguing? What is this debate even about? Why do people keep pretending that Saryn's abilities are the same as nidus's, or a torid, or pox, or whatever, when they very obviously aren't and you even agree they aren't?

 

7 hours ago, blaes said:

maybe you should have tried to really play saryn before the rework

Ah yes, one of the many reasons I rarely come to the forums these days. Every time you disagree with ANYONE, someone always says "you haven't played [frame]" or makes some other kind of well poisoning argument like "you're just a dracoborn!" I half expect someone else to come and claim that I only play on Hydron, or Akkad, or something. You even suggested that I "try the torid or pox." Real classy.

[Azrael]

3 hours ago, Slimspadey101 said:

I don't understand why people are on about "chasing spores" when there is no good reason to do that now. I mean you can just cast new spores and let the stragglers be. Why chase?

Because recasting drops your spore damage by a significant amount. This is one of the things I dislike about the rework, actually.

[R31N]

6 minutes ago, TermiteFrame said:

Spore changes are spot on.
I initially thought the change death no longer propagating spores would be a problem, but after some usage and build adjustment (that's a thing you can do people) the recast combined with the improved/less buggy range I realized that its not there as a nerf to saryn, but its kind of there to prevent spores from going out of control and subsequently requiring an actual nerf. You can build up damage quite quickly, and if you aren't one of those dorks that stink at energy management, you can build up spores damage quite quickly and turn her one into a sneeze of death, which in early levels usually results in you wiping the very memory of the bloke from existence (in short for early to mid game stuff you may want to tone it down for better results nothing new here with that though, she's always was, and still is, Princess Overkill).

You do have to take a more active role in spreading spores, but they are overall much more rewarding, and actively spreading spores isn't really an issue since toxic lashes duration has been buffed significantly and can be used on guns now too.

Nothing to say about Molt, the augment is still a cornerstone of the ability, but it provides a lot more utility now which was always its purpose.

Toxic lash is a monster as usual.

I actually use miasma... sorta... kinda... everyonce in a while... Ok that skill could probably still use something tbh, but the rework is still fresh and I'm still tinkering.

Nice to see all the "Frame is dead to me now" "She's nerfed!" comments as usual. Never change Warframe community. Actually no that's a lie, please stop its embarrassing.

Thank god you re not one of those dorks too, who can t handle energy management. And I guess you re a healthy part of the community that changes. I'd add that everything is good if you want to see it that way.

Saryn has changed for worse, at least she s good at extermination missions now. It's not on saryn's job description tho, she has another role.

And you know what else, it's obious that the man behind these changes haven't thought it so well, not in this case, or ember's too.
it's like 'got rework things to do, i don t know why, i don t like stationary saryn, I don t like nukes either, let s give her super nuking spores, because the general idea is to make players use more rifles and swords. You know what? Keep the super spores but make them don't last? what do u guys at our community think? we re already working on a change but please do say, we don t watch'. 

No, they don t have a big plan, the man just needs to 'rework'. The only big plan is frame abilities become narrow, and where there used to be 10 different builds for every frame, now they re only 2.

[Ozamchist]

12 minutes ago, R31N said:

Saryn has changed for worse, at least she s good at extermination missions now. It's not on saryn's job description tho, she has another role.

Tell me where you think she's worse.

[blaes]

13 minutes ago, Azrael said:

Every time you disagree with ANYONE

It's not about disagreeing, it's about nitpicking while showing blatant ignorance on the subject.

2 minutes ago, TermiteFrame said:

Tell me where you think she's worse.

damage ramp-up (particularly visible against high level enemies).

I am personally very satisfied with the direction saryn is taking, but she still suffers from a few problems with spores (notably the disparity between damage ramp-up and decay or the difficulty in spreading it after a recast if it's been well ramped up).

[R31N]

You can read my post above. The rework didn t help the nuking problem, they just did it. If i have to chase mobs to hit spores, I can kill the mobs as well with my sword, spores or no spores.

What word of the 'builds become narrow, available builds become less when at the same time we have more mods than ever' you don't understand?
You think this is for the game's good?

[Ozamchist]

2 minutes ago, blaes said:

It's not about disagreeing, it's about nitpicking while showing blatant ignorance on the subject.

damage ramp-up (particularly visible against high level enemies).

I am personally very satisfied with the direction saryn is taking, but she still suffers from a few problems with spores (notably the disparity between damage ramp-up and decay or the difficulty in spreading it after a recast if it's been well ramped up).

Wasn't directed at you, but I feel her damage ramp up shines against higher level stuff.

[Ozamchist]

3 minutes ago, R31N said:

You can read my post above. The rework didn t help the nuking problem, they just did it. If i have to chase mobs to hit spores, I can kill the mobs as well with my sword, spores or no spores.

What word of the 'builds become narrow, available builds become less when at the same time we have more mods than ever' you don't understand?
You think this is for the game's good?

If you're not going to be more specific on the mission type then I can't help you.
And I don't know where you are having trouble nuking. She's much better at murdering things with her abilities now.

[blaes]

Just now, TermiteFrame said:

Wasn't directed at you, but I feel her damage ramp up shines against higher level stuff.

Against higher level stuff (or any stuff, really), the current ramp up is limited to 20dmg/s, multiplied by power strength. 60dmg/s with 300% pwr strength. Using spore to spread weapons toxin procs, we could reach 30 000dmg per tick in less than 10s. That's a ramp up of over 3 000dmg/s. And that wasn't even the max possible.

[R31N]

You 're talking alone, the nuking problem is when a frame wipes every mob in a map and the rest of the team can't do nothing but watch.

What DE is supposed that is trying to do is balance the frames so they don't wipe mobs on a button press, and make room so players won't only rely on spamming abilities but use weapons too.

Reworked frames are poor and they don't make sense, they're crazy calculated. Currenty an ember needs 160 or more efficiency to be played, saryn 45. A Saryn with 250range has 35m spore radius and 45m miasma.

Instead of kicking the <3 out of the original and primary role frames they can create a new spore frame, or a buffer frame. This way they would have more freedom to adjust new ability ideas too.

Btw thank you but I don't need your help, and I m not gonna spam the forum either. If you get it then you get it.

[Jakizu]

On 2018-05-23 at 5:26 PM, [DE]Danielle said:

Spores changes are live in Hotfix 22.20.5!

 

We'll be moving feedback to the dedicated Spores Revisited Feedback MEGATHREAD - cya there!

---

(If you’re just learning about Saryn’s “Revisiting”, this is a follow up of the original workshop changes that went live in update 22.20.0)

If you’re a frequent workshop peruser, you might recall this bold 16 font-size section in the original Saryn Revisited 2.0 dev workshop thread:

Well, here we are! We’re coming up on a week of having reworked Saryn on PC, and it’s clear from what we’ve been reading in your feedback that you’ve all been busy testing her new kit. At the forefront of this workshop is Saryn’s Spores - Being the more drastically modified ability in the first iteration, change was to be anticipated!

In this workshop we’ll aim to break down the changes to Spores coming in a future PC update. Feedback is welcomed and encouraged as long as it comes in its most constructive of forms. And yup, you guessed it! Everything you read below is subject to change prior to and after launch. 

So let’s get into it! Here’s what we’re looking at changing with Spores.

• Can be re-cast while active and will no longer detonate all active Spores:
   
  • Based on feedback, detonating on recast felt like an unnatural transition from Saryn’s original makeup. So in an effort to maintain her roots, we’ve removed the detonate mechanic on recast so that Spores can be cast onto multiple targets.
    
    With this came the need to find a space where Spores’ escalating damage and its reinstated recast “sans detonation” can live harmoniously together. That said, recasting on infected enemies will put new Spores on a target with a 20% decrease to its damage per enemy (scales with Power Strength) for 50% of the Energy cost.

• Fixed inconsistent spreading ranges:

  • The most common report we received requested we look the seemingly inconsistent spreading nature of Spores. After rummaging around in the code for an answer, we discovered an unintended mechanic that determined range based on the specific action taken (we’ll call this “spread condition”).
    
    Currently, if you do anything other than directly shoot a Spore or hit (but not kill) an enemy while Toxic Lash is active, the range is half of its intended value. In order to fix these inconsistencies, we’ve removed this mechanic and established a new standard base range across the board regardless of spread condition: 

  •  

    Spread Condition	Old Base Range	New Base Range
    When shooting a Spore	16m	16m
    When hitting (but not killing) an enemy with Toxic Lash active	16m	16m
    When killing an enemy with or without Toxic Lash on	8m	16m
    When an ally kills an enemy	8m	16m
    When a Spore’s tick damage kills an enemy	8m	NA*

    *We’ve outright removed spread on enemies that die to a Spore’s tick damage. Being the only wholly passive way to spread Spores, it allowed for that “set it and forget it” play style we were trying combat with Saryn in the original workshop. 

• Spores’ damage growth over time per Spore is now determined per enemy infected. And with it, a max limit of 10 infected enemies to maintain a max damage growth limit over time. To better explain this change and how it all breaks down, let’s explore it further by comparing its current state to its changed state:
   
  • Current: Damage growth is determined per Spore, so 1 damage per Spore every second. For example, let’s say there are 5 enemies. You cast Spores on one of the enemies in that group. 3 Spores are now active on that enemy. Damaging that enemy with Toxic Lash disperses a single Spore to the surrounding 4 enemies for a grand total of 7 Spores (4 enemies with a single Spore + the 3 original Spores on cast). This maintains a damage growth of 7 damage every second. 
     
  • Changed: Damage growth is determined per enemy infected, so 2 damage (can be modded with Ability Strength) per enemy infected by Spores every second up to a maximum of 10 enemies. So, using that same example, 5 infected enemies would set the damage growth to 10 damage every second (Modded damage growth of x * # of enemies infected up to 10). Reaching 10 infected enemies would set the maximum damage growth at 20 every second.
    • Edit: To clarify, the number of infected enemies is uncapped! You can infect more than 10 enemies, but the damage growth is dependent on that max. 
    • For the sake of best describing the intent of this change, we’d like to point out some of the unexpected irony between both workshops. While work on Saryn began very early on this year, the first assumption was that change was amidst her performance in Elite Sanctuary Onslaught. What actually ended up transpiring (post rework) was quite the opposite. Saryn as she is now continues to take charge in Onslaught (more so now than before). However, she’s a bit of a “one cast wonder” in Simaris’ realm. Sitting back and watching Spores destroy a map didn’t fall in line with that fun factor we were looking for with Saryn, and especially not for the other members in Saryn squads.
• Damage per second will “decay” (decrease over time) instead of vanishing once no infected enemies remain: 
  • First, the damage per enemy you’ve accumulated will instantly drop by 20%, which will then commence the decay of the remaining damage by 10% per second (can be modded with Duration).
  • Decaying can be observed in the damage per enemy meter located above Saryn’s ability icons. 
  • Nullifying effects (including Data-Conduits) increases the decay by 30% per second.

We’ll be updating the workshop with new information and changes to Spores as they come up. Thank you for your feedback!

I've literally played as saryn since her release faithfully and always loves everything about her. The revisit and this revisit 2.0 are amazing though I understand the need to adjust spores. I'm always open minded to her changes as they always work out for the best. This change through for me seems like a "containment nerf". With this change you're casting a lot "chasing the high" of spores. 

Thank you for the range fixes but would it be acceptable to increase the max number of damage climbing enemy's from 10 to 20 or 30 at the 2 damage climb giving for a 40 damage a tick?. That way with the decay rate we can more comfortably stack our damage. 

Also spreading on death was nice, very nice. But for the sake of gameplay i agree with it being taken away. However I've notice miasma doesn't pop spores therefore spreading them. Since spread on death is a no go can we get that synergy back?

I understand different people's  feeling and bias but I feel like I'm being forced to shoot heroin using spores. These tweaks I feel would flow wit the ideology behind the revisit while still giving us dedicated and veteran saryn users an enjoyable poison experience within damage limits. 

If not and this is a permanent change I think the decay rate should be rethought. I'm willing to admit I'm still tying to make this work efficiently but so far I'm not having any luck. 

 

P.S. Please please please please please [DE]Pablo when tweaking her again take in consider the staples to veteran player rather than the request and demand of new players. No offense but requests like [let us attatch spores to mold again but dont allow us to pop them, change spores to toxin and toxic lash to corrosive, and a multitude of other bad ideas] I feel come from those who either don't really connect with saryn or honestly don't understand enough to know what the asking. 

P.P.S. [DE]Megan awesome #*!%ing job helping with the new audio for her skill set. I absolutely love the new feel when I cast.

[Top_Kekkonen]

6 hours ago, Slimspadey101 said:

I don't understand why people are on about "chasing spores" when there is no good reason to do that now. I mean you can just cast new spores and let the stragglers be. Why chase?

You need to chase the spores because spores cost energy, and if you recast and recast, you'll quickly find out that spores has turned into a energy black hole. And Saryn in her current state has never been so energy hungry. 

[kusanagikyo]

2 hours ago, TermiteFrame said:

Wasn't directed at you, but I feel her damage ramp up shines against higher level stuff.

Saryn spore the pre rework with my javlok. 1 cast spore and 1 shot already spread 9,5k damage per tick. That only take like 1s to setup. Even again lvl 120 corrupted heavy gunner. I only need to shot 5 time cast spore then shot again to pop. It spread already do 6k to 9k damage per tick without need any armor strips. And it only take like 3s total to do it. After the rework the ramp up only like 90dmg/s for 30 infected with 3 spore each. The re rework even worst just 60dms/s with 300 str. Not mention that viral cut the hp by half with mean it will double the damage.

[Purity]

3 hours ago, Jakizu said:

I've literally played as saryn since her release faithfully and always loves everything about her. The revisit and this revisit 2.0 are amazing though I understand the need to adjust spores. I'm always open minded to her changes as they always work out for the best. This change through for me seems like a "containment nerf". With this change you're casting a lot "chasing the high" of spores. 

Thank you for the range fixes but would it be acceptable to increase the max number of damage climbing enemy's from 10 to 20 or 30 at the 2 damage climb giving for a 40 damage a tick?. That way with the decay rate we can more comfortably stack our damage. 

Also spreading on death was nice, very nice. But for the sake of gameplay i agree with it being taken away. However I've notice miasma doesn't pop spores therefore spreading them. Since spread on death is a no go can we get that synergy back?

I understand different people's  feeling and bias but I feel like I'm being forced to shoot heroin using spores. These tweaks I feel would flow wit the ideology behind the revisit while still giving us dedicated and veteran saryn users an enjoyable poison experience within damage limits. 

If not and this is a permanent change I think the decay rate should be rethought. I'm willing to admit I'm still tying to make this work efficiently but so far I'm not having any luck. 

 

P.S. Please please please please please [DE]Pablo when tweaking her again take in consider the staples to veteran player rather than the request and demand of new players. No offense but requests like [let us attatch spores to mold again but dont allow us to pop them, change spores to toxin and toxic lash to corrosive, and a multitude of other bad ideas] I feel come from those who either don't really connect with saryn or honestly don't understand enough to know what the asking. 

P.P.S. [DE]Megan awesome #*!%ing job helping with the new audio for her skill set. I absolutely love the new feel when I cast.

Ur P.S. is pure facts (or they could reroll but meh). I can't test her tbh and I really wish they would at least re roll corrosive to viral still :/. I just hope nodding wouldn't be limited to needing 220 range to be actually useable without have to spam too much

[Rydiak]

A target dying with Spores on it should increase the Infection counter, independent of the "max 10" counter increases. This would promote actually KILLING things as a way to increase your counter, as opposed to WANTING THINGS TO LIVE to increase it.