Upcoming Exalted Weapon Rework

[Kurambik]

As many of you may or may not know, exalted weapons will soon be moddable. Without the intention of sounding like a party pooper, I would just like to take a moment in order to voice some concerns that I have. I know that the changes aren't out yet and I do not know all of the ins and outs but it's good to put these out there and hope they are taken into consideration in development. (As a TL;DR for the twitter feed, these weapons will basically now all work like Venari)

• How will abilities like Landslide play into this: Abilities like Landslide are not like the typical "exalted weapons", however they still scale off mods.
• Builds will require a lot more forma: While this is not really an issue for me, it is a legitimate point to be concerned about. I feel that for newer players that may be a bit tight on forma it may lead to the frame being underestimated.
• Levelling up frames is a NIGHTMARE: Even with a booster, leveling frames takes ages. To tie in with my previous point, having to invest upward of 10 forma in a frame (and having to do it all over whenever it's primed) would take an ungodly amount of time/grind and is by no means fun. Since lately the "fun factor" of the game was being prioritised, I feel that this should be taken into consideration. As a worst case scenario, imagine if one were to optimise Titania (I know her melee is not very good but let's consider a hypothetical scenario where it was) who has two exalted weapons with say 15+ forma.
• The chore has to be done per frame: With the current system, if two exalted weapons share similar stats, one can just use the same "mod stick" for both without having to re-forma a new one. (for example I use the same mods for both Hysteria and Primal Rage(augment) since they are both crit-heavy setups)
• Mastery: How will mastery be handled? Because apparently I have been told that Venari gives mastery. For example I maxed my Valkyr prime a long time ago, will I have to get a second Valkyr (and possibly even its prime) just to get the mastery from her Talons?

My first idea to maybe mitigate this was to have it where, if the exalted weapon remains empty, then it would just draw in the mods from the respective equipped weapon. That way this feature would just be a "quality of life" to those who would want to go the extra mile while optimising. If this is out of the question, then I would suggest that the exalted weapons would come with acceptable base polarities (i.e. 3 Vs instead of some weird combination like 3 Ds) in order to at least accommodate the most expensive and essential mods out there.

Personally I feel that the first one would be by far the most elegant solution to this issue because of the fact that it's just a simple condition check from a programming point of view, leave the exalted weapon empty to inherit the mods from the respective weapon slot.

Edited May 27, 2018 by Kurambik

[Naftal]

How does leveling a frame take ages?

How long does it take for you? How long should it take?

[seprent]

uh like 2 runs of hydron and your max rank 

i believe this will only affect warframes who have a complete weapon as a ability (put away all weapons and draw it) since the twitter post had valkyr in it  landslide should be fine or unaffected in these terms since its not a put away weapons and draw a completely new weapon so Excalibur, valkyr, wukong, and mesa would be getting it i feel like missing a frame though im unsure 

the forma part for the exalted weapon is currently up in the air who knows it might be settable at no forma cost or it has no polarities but infinite capacity for mods but the traditional 8 slots all we can really do on that one is speculate and hope in the future we get more context 

[Kurambik]

1 minute ago, Naftal said:

How does leveling a frame take ages?

How long does it take for you? How long should it take?

For one thing, it takes objectively longer than a weapon, and since not having all your abilities unlocked generally means you cannot use the frame's ability to get all the kills you might have to share xp with your equipped weapon (I believe it's 50% frame 50% weapon on your weapon kills and 25% frame 75% weapon on ally kills). The warframes also need twice as much affinity to max out when comparred to weapons (900k vs 450k).

All this considered, it means that in the most ideal scenario it takes roughly twice as long. Which is in accordance with my booster Hydron runs (10 waves weapons, 2x10 to 3x10 waves frames)

[GinKenshin]

Can’t we just: 

 

1- when you lvl up a frame, the exalted wep gets lvled up too accordingly ( lvl 10,20...etc) 

 

2- Just give exalted weps a fair amount of base polarities, the good ones that is...2-3 Vs and a _ is fine imo 

[Windy_Wind]

non active exalted weapons like Atlas' knuckle and Khora's whip (and maybe Gara's glass sword) would get a huge nerf because you can't equip riven mod on them anymore. So the real question is "Will these non active exalted weapons get buffed to compensate?"

[DeMonkey]

(Still doesn't know why everyone calls them exalted weapons)

I'd just like to see it level up alongside the frame, as GinKenshin said. If I forma my frame then my weapon gets a forma as well.

[GPrime96]

29 minutes ago, Kurambik said:

 

• Levelling up frames is a NIGHTMARE: Even with a booster, leveling frames takes ages. To tie in with my previous point, having to invest upward of 10 forma in a frame (and having to do it all over whenever it's primed) would take an ungodly amount of time/grind and is by no means fun. Since lately the "fun factor" of the game was being prioritised, I feel that this should be taken into consideration. As a worst case scenario, imagine if one were to optimise Titania (I know her melee is not very good but let's consider a hypothetical scenario where it was) who has two exalted weapons with say 15+ forma.

If you rely on killing with the Warframe’s abilties instead of your weapons, it should last as long as leveling up weapons

 

30 minutes ago, Kurambik said:

 

• The chore has to be done per frame: With the current system, if two exalted weapons share similar stats, one can just use the same "mod stick" for both without having to re-forma a new one.

Formaing every frame shouldn’t that big of a deal. I would put more forma into normal weapon than Warframes.

I’m really hoping to try modding exalted weapon seperately since i can rely on a build that fits my playstyle with normal weapons and the performance of the exalted weapons build.

[DeMonkey]

2 minutes ago, VPrime96 said:

If you rely on killing with the Warframe’s abilties instead of your weapons, it should last as long as leveling up weapons

No? Frames require double as much affinity as weapons do.

[IceColdHawk]

9 minutes ago, DeMonkey said:

(Still doesn't know why everyone calls them exalted weapons)

The original and first "exalted weapon" is called "Exalted Blade". And so people refer to similar abilities as "exalted weapon" to give an insight on what is meant. Kinda like how catalysts get called potatoes.

[DeMonkey]

1 minute ago, IceColdHawk said:

The original and first "exalted weapon" is called "Exalted Blade". And so people refer to similar abilities as "exalted weapon" to give an insight on what is meant. Kinda like how catalysts get called potatoes.

No **** Hawky 

At least catalysts actually look like Potatoes though, there's nothing ''exalted'' about Valkyr's Claws or Ivara's Bow is my point. 

[GinKenshin]

10 minutes ago, DeMonkey said:

(Still doesn't know why everyone calls them exalted weapons)

I'd just like to see it level up alongside the frame, as GinKenshin said. If I forma my frame then my weapon gets a forma as well.

Actually the last bit might turn people a bit off, since some frames need a D or 2 and a few - as well, thus the wep will have these ‘useless’ polarities too...or if you mean the wep get a polarity of your choosing and is separate from the frame polarity then that’s even better (basically 1 Forma giving you 2 polarities on 2 separate items) 

 

   That’s why I find it better to just have a lot of base polarities from the get-go, while still being able to Forma the wep itself

 

   Also this might be hard to implement but when you Forma the wep the frame shouldn’t get reset, just treat it like a normal wep. I don’t know how it is with khora and venari though 😕

[IceColdHawk]

Just now, DeMonkey said:

At least catalysts actually look like Potatoes though

Your face looks like a potato. ❤️

[DeMonkey]

1 minute ago, GinKenshin said:

or if you mean the wep get a polarity of your choosing and is separate from the frame polarity then that’s even better

That one.

1 minute ago, IceColdHawk said:

Your face looks like a potato. ❤️

Your Mother looks like a...

...very nice person, I'm sure. Wonderful woman. 10/10. 

[NinjaKitsune56]

36 minutes ago, Kurambik said:

For one thing, it takes objectively longer than a weapon, and since not having all your abilities unlocked generally means you cannot use the frame's ability to get all the kills you might have to share xp with your equipped weapon (I believe it's 50% frame 50% weapon on your weapon kills and 25% frame 75% weapon on ally kills). The warframes also need twice as much affinity to max out when comparred to weapons (900k vs 450k).

All this considered, it means that in the most ideal scenario it takes roughly twice as long. Which is in accordance with my booster Hydron runs (10 waves weapons, 2x10 to 3x10 waves frames)

If you're going to only wave 10 and calling it an xp farm, you're doing it wrong. A standard (so to speak) xp farm is 20 waves (defense,) then extract.

[Doom_Bunny]

Instead of making another section and going through forma again. Why can't we just have the stats for abilities that feed off mods in the same modding menu? Tiberon prime already has three pages of ui showing the varying stats. Just put a button in the melee/primary/secondary modding screen that'll bring up the stats for affected abilities.

10 minutes ago, DeMonkey said:

No **** Hawky 

At least catalysts actually look like Potatoes though, there's nothing ''exalted'' about Valkyr's Claws or Ivara's Bow is my point. 

The third one is obviously why they call them exalted.

 

exalted

ɪɡˈzɔːltɪd/

adjective

adjective: exalted

1. 1.

   (of a person or their rank or status) at a high or powerful level.

   "it had taken her years of infighting to reach her present exalted rank"

   synonyms:

   high, high-ranking, elevated, prominent, superior, lofty, grand, noble, dignified, eminent, prestigious, august, illustrious, distinguished, esteemed, venerable; More influential, important, powerful "he is no longer fit to retain his exalted office"

   antonyms:

   low

2. 2.

   of a noble, elevated, or lofty nature.

   "his exalted hopes of human progress"

   synonyms:

   noble, lofty, high-minded, elevated, intellectual, ideal, sublime; More inflated, pretentious "their hearts were stirred by his exalted aims"

   antonyms:

   base

3. 3.

   in a state of extreme happiness.

   "I felt exalted and newly alive"

   synonyms:

   elated, exultant, jubilant, joyful, joyous, triumphant, rapturous, rhapsodic, ecstatic, blissful, transported, delighted, happy, gleeful, exuberant, exhilarated; More informalhigh, up "she felt tired but spiritually exalted"

   antonyms:

   depressed, low

Edited May 25, 2018 by Postal_pat

[DeMonkey]

1 minute ago, Postal_pat said:

exalted

ɪɡˈzɔːltɪd/

adjective

adjective: exalted

Exactly my point, none of that fits say.. Ivara's Bow, since it's an adjective you would generally apply to a human being, not an object.

I blame DE. They probably started referring to new weapons as Exalted Weapons and the forums joined in. Damn you forums... buncha sheep. 

 

 

[(XBOX)Evilpricetag]

I only care atm if these weapons are going to level up seperate and give us MR. Will I have to get a valkyr again for MR fodder her non prime exaulted hystaria?

[DeMonkey]

10 minutes ago, (XB1)Evilpricetag said:

I only care atm if these weapons are going to level up seperate and give us MR. Will I have to get a valkyr again for MR fodder her non prime exaulted hystaria?

Apparently Venari provides MR, so potentially yeah.

Hmmm... If they make it so that there's a primed version of Valkyr's Talons... Does that mean there's going to be Primed Exalted Blade...?

Are founders getting more MR!?

Is this a pedestal to petition for Excalibur Prime to come back!?

 

I'm kidding, before anyone attempts to crucify me.

Edited May 25, 2018 by DeMonkey

[IceColdHawk]

10 minutes ago, (XB1)Evilpricetag said:

I only care atm if these weapons are going to level up seperate and give us MR. Will I have to get a valkyr again for MR fodder her non prime exaulted hystaria?

There is no non prime hysteria. Just "Hysteria". The same ability on prime and non prime. Primes don't have individual abilities.

[Gamma745]

10 minutes ago, DeMonkey said:

Exactly my point, none of that fits say.. Ivara's Bow, since it's an adjective you would generally apply to a human being, not an object.

I blame DE. They probably started referring to new weapons as Exalted Weapons and the forums joined in. Damn you forums... buncha sheep. 

 

  Hide contents

 

 

 

Well, what do you propose we call them, then? Ability weapon doesn't sound as good.

 

On topic:

1 hour ago, Kurambik said:

then I would suggest that the exalted weapons would come with acceptable base polarities (i.e. 3 Vs instead of some weird combination like 3 Ds) in order to at least accommodate the most expensive and essential mods out there.

This one suggestion kinda sounds like a tricky subject. Some people can find different combination of polarity "acceptable". Some people may prefer with 2 V and 1 -, or maybe even 2 V and 1 D.

[EinheriarJudith]

ill prolly shelf the frames that get this treatment. im not one that condones the increase of grind just cause. doubling the amount of forma to be used is stupid imo. its one thing to do that to weapons but to have it be double for these frames? no thanks. a good gateway for frames was when they introduced no shield frames like nidus and inaros. venari is just another kavat.

[Chushingura]

In my opinion DE should give 1 exalted weapon for each Warframe to do that... 
The gameplay goes from bad to worse... 

[DeMonkey]

1 minute ago, Gamma745 said:

Well, what do you propose we call them, then? Ability weapon doesn't sound as good.

Do they need an adjective? Ability weapon sounds fine. Unique if you really must, frames and their ''unique'' weapons.

Better than further ruining the English language 

2 minutes ago, Gamma745 said:

This one suggestion kinda sounds like a tricky subject. Some people can find different combination of polarity "acceptable". Some people may prefer with 2 V and 1 -, or maybe even 2 V and 1 D.

I don't think there's any winning with regards to innate weapon polarities here.

If DE were to simply raise the weapons forma rank to that of the frames current rank and give us a bunch of free polarities to put on it. Then hell yeah, we can each pick whatever we want with no issue at all.

[Gamma745]

20 minutes ago, DeMonkey said:

If DE were to simply raise the weapons forma rank to that of the frames current rank and give us a bunch of free polarities to put on it. Then hell yeah, we can each pick whatever we want with no issue at all.

True, that does sound like the most optimal solution, though it will be a script/coding nightmare regarding us who already have the Frame in question, not to mention the hassle of first and foremost picking out the polarity as soon as we start the game.

I mean, can you imagine: "Pick polarities for X Warframe you own. Done? okay, Y Warframe, Z Warframe, and so on."

That sounds like so much work on DE side, and a weird hassle on our side.