Jump to content
Dante Unbound: Share Bug Reports and Feedback Here! ×

Revenant Themed Warframe "Vlad" Feedback and Discussion


Synpai
 Share

Recommended Posts

1 minute ago, Tyreaus said:

Yet I proposed a manner by which it doesn't break the lore, which is only one spit-ball of an idea. Another is that it could be a frame that uses reverse-engineered Sentient-like abilities powered by void energy in lieu of Sentient energy, or that has an in-built energy translation device (since void energy already is translated in some way, seeing as how Warframe abilities don't generally affect Sentients), which makes it less effective but allows them to work with a source of void energy.

By the sole fact that they were designed with the vulnerability means there are probably hundreds of workarounds that could be devised to keep the "void is poison to the Sentients" plot aspect in line yet give Sentient-like abilities to a frame.

The Warframe can be designed with a huge Eidolon Core in his body. The lore breaking point is: he can't use void energy to power Sentient attacks. Thats it.

If his 4th power is a Sentient attack like the Eidolon's "Planetary Cannon", but uses energy from a different Sentient energy gauge. Then I'm Ok. Vlad uses the Eidolon Core to use Sentient powers, and Void Energy to use Tenno powers. Everything is fine. Pretty much like Nidus.

If he uses Sentient energy to use Tenno powers, then I'm OK, because DE never said what type of energy the Sentients use.

 

Again, the lore breaking point is: he can't use void energy to power Sentient attacks. Thats it.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I get what OP meant, and i kinda also felt disapointed with the reveal.
But to answer, its about adding variation.
It may not be good for you, me and some others, but for other large group of people may be the perfect frame.
You, we can dislike it, but that only means that it was not built for our playstyle. 

It mostly just felt bad because the pictures from before the reveal, had him always with that big katana in hands, so most people we're expecting a samurai frame, not a vampire theme one. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hey, DE.
You know all of that lore that we learned through the hell that was all of the quests to date?

Like how Sentients are disabled (no reproduction, no self-healing... thus no cellular meiosis. They're dead husks walking... er, floating?) and even directly corroded (Hello Hunhow and crew. Remember what happened to you out in the Void tower, even with a hacked Suda's protection?) by Void energy?

Like how Void energy is focused by the Operator through the Warframe? (The Void is the lifeblood of the Tenno.)

So tell me how a LIVING SENTIENT is growing and corrupting a living and Operator-Channeling Warframe? I can understand wearing a Sentient, and the use of dead Sentient parts for enhancements and weaponry is a well-established part of the lore (Exilus, Broken/War), but this is an outright contradiction. By lore, the Sentient would be being torn apart by the very Warframe it's 'afflicting'... without the Warframe even having to lift a finger.

Even the Eidolon in its full state wasn't able to overcome the Flaw, and its attempt at doing so was exactly what allowed Gara to shatter it in the first place, so nothing but bones there.

So... either you have to rewrite almost all of your lore to date, or you'd better have a very, VERY interesting, and lore friendly, reason that this amalgamation exists. I can't speak for other players, but story is a large part of why I play any game, and a major lore break without explanation is more than enough to keep me out of the game for extended periods of time, if not permanently.

I want to be able to keep playing this game, so you'd better have a bleeping good deck of aces hidden up your sleeves.

Edited by WolvenEdge
Spelling
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Chroma already wears the pelt of a sentient that becomes empowered through the same void energy the operator channels through the other warframes. So it's as easy as saying that the void is only poisonous to living sentients. Or something.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, -SDM-NerevarCM said:

That would break the lore. One thing is to be adorned in Sentient bones and energy. Other thing is use Sentient powers that only Sentients can use, especially if the Tenno needs to use Void Energy to use Sentient Powers. And that doesn't make sense.

 

Chroma's damage adaptation and element switching are already sentient-ish.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, -SDM-NerevarCM said:

Again, the lore breaking point is: he can't use void energy to power Sentient attacks. Thats it.

Directly, no, and I understand that. But, again, there's the possibility of adding devices that translate between the two within the Warframe's design, which could allow for that (and not really require a separate gauge if that's all the frame uses, mind). As I said: frames already do some kind of transformation of void energy into their abilities, or else things like Oberon's Smite would be affecting Sentients in a similar way and operator powers wouldn't work off a separate gauge and so on. That's solely working off of precedents set in mechanics, and there's still plenty of room for a more plot-heavy explanation like I provided in the outset.

Point is: OP made a request, didn't get into the technical details, and his request and the extant plot leaves more than enough wiggle room for something to be put in to make it happen, be it just some translation device gimmick or for the frame to be some mad experiment kinda shiz.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Frame like the new one, Nyx, & Maybe Nekros all kinda have one problem and it’s not even the frame problem. But controlling enemies or Possess falls short with enemies that don’t really make It worthwhile outside of CC. Enemies don’t nearly do dmg to each other like they can inflict on us. Something tells me DE knows this because Nyx mind control ability have an augment that increases the controlled target by 500%. 

It shouldn’t even be an augment. It would be nice to see enemies do moderate dmg to each other but abilities like this aren’t really that great other than CC and pretty much just having extra targets for the enemies that aren’t control to fire upon instead of you. I think any enemy controlled by a Warframe should innate do atleast 800% more dmg by default. Or something to make enemies firepower hit as hard on themselves like they do us on high levels before making Warframe abilities revolve around controlling enemies.

 

anyone have any thoughts? This just isn’t on the new frame itself but also Nyx & Nekros Shadows of the Dead. Since frames are starting to get a 3rd look. I think this needs more major looking into. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, atejas said:

 

Chroma's damage adaptation and element switching are already sentient-ish.

I don't think Sentients can switch elements. They can adapt to damage like elemental damage. Looks like each Sentient have its own set of powers.

Example: The "Eidolon Sentient" uses elements like eletricity and water. Based on Hunhow's fragments, he uses lasers and wind.

We don't have many Sentients in game to know how they use their powers. If its high tech weapons, or something more "magical" like the Tenno

 

And a Warframe becoming stronger after taking damage isn't something uncommon. Rhino and Nidus can do this too. Warframes are weak to radiation because of alloy armor, and they never overcome this weakness. A Rhino after casting Iron Skin still takes a lot of damage from corrosive and puncture attacks.

However the Sentients become nearly invulnerable after they adapt, even radiation, puncture or everything. Its a different adaptation than the Warframes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Nekros and Nyx kind of need some retweaking anyway and i'm sure they will eventually get them. Still wanting shadows to be a passive of sorts just like the prime trailer showed and maybe the actual undead being undead, zombies instead.

 

Nyx's augment needs to just be merged with her skillset in general for mind control.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would have to agree that so far, this doesn't work within the lore established by quests, cephalon entries, and events so far. Particularly Octavia's Anthem and Plague Star's Eidolon Phylaxis. The Void energy degradation is well established for Sentient so far which this shows contrary elements; then Sentient are established by Plague Star as being immune completely to Techncoyte - the core elements of our warframes - its contrary to the quest for the warframe to have integrated Sentient parts. Think of it like a Teflon coating on the Sentient parts; they can be attached to the outer warframe or made into weapons, but to be integrated into a technocyte organism like a warframe, impossible as established so far in the Warframe Setting.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, atejas said:

Chroma already wears the pelt of a sentient that becomes empowered through the same void energy the operator channels through the other warframes. So it's as easy as saying that the void is only poisonous to living sentients. Or something.

No lore entry, or even the wiki, states that Chroma's 'dragon' is Sentient in nature. It bears no resemblance artistically nor in its abilities to any Sentient known. His own ability descriptions don't even recognize it as a separate entity from himself, so we can best surmise that it is of the same technocyte-based tissue as the warframes themselves.

The only parts of Sentients that are known to even somewhat withstand the Void are their bones... from which we have lore stating that we have built weapons.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 minutes ago, AdunSaveMe said:

Sentient-themed =/= literally a sentient

I think DE knows their own lore ;I

Described in stream as 'afflicted by a sentient'. Not literally a sentient, not even sentient-themed.

I think you didn't pay attention.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, Tyreaus said:

Directly, no, and I understand that. But, again, there's the possibility of adding devices that translate between the two within the Warframe's design, which could allow for that (and not really require a separate gauge if that's all the frame uses, mind). As I said: frames already do some kind of transformation of void energy into their abilities, or else things like Oberon's Smite would be affecting Sentients in a similar way and operator powers wouldn't work off a separate gauge and so on. That's solely working off of precedents set in mechanics, and there's still plenty of room for a more plot-heavy explanation like I provided in the outset.

Point is: OP made a request, didn't get into the technical details, and his request and the extant plot leaves more than enough wiggle room for something to be put in to make it happen, be it just some translation device gimmick or for the frame to be some mad experiment kinda shiz.

Yes, they can simply make "Vlad" right hand made of a Sentient energy core and make him use his right hand to create Sentient powers. That woudn't break the lore.

And about the Tenno "gauge". That simply exists to make the player use the Tenno instead of the Warframe. Based on the lore, all Tenno powers are Void powers, then they should be able to damage the Sentient. However if we could do that, Ash could 1 hit ko the Eidolon easily or Nova could simply make him slow as a turtle.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, LazerSkink said:

 

I 100% see them using this. The naming of most frames is incredibly simple, so the mythology based ones or generally too fancy are unlikely.

A good example is nekros. We had a name suggestion thread for him and that idea was mentioned by me and a few others to be "necros" based on necrosis.

Edited by Vilemyre
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Vilemyre said:

A good example is nekros. We had a name suggestion thread for him and that idea was mentioned by me and a few others to be "necros" base don necrosis.

 

Nekros is a direct translation of "dead" in Greek, aka super simple. Yeah, he's just one of many frames with names easy to get the idea behind.

Edited by LazerSkink
dead, not death
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, -SDM-NerevarCM said:

And about the Tenno "gauge". That simply exists to make the player use the Tenno instead of the Warframe. Based on the lore, all Tenno powers are Void powers, then they should be able to damage the Sentient. However if we could do that, Ash could 1 hit ko the Eidolon easily or Nova could simply make him slow as a turtle.

It's kind of an aside at this point but:

The void, so far as I know, doesn't have elemental properties like radiation and whatnot else. So even if they do still have void energy at their core, it seems there's something else going on to give the abilities those extra properties.

That said, they could have made some Warframe abilities damage Eidolons and Sentients, but at a much reduced rate compared to amps (which are meant to do thousands of damage anyway) and with much fewer effects (Nova wouldn't be able to slow them, for example, and other status effects wouldn't proc as normal). The void's a poison, which entails there's a lethal dose, which entails greater and purer concentrations (like those not filtered through a frame) would do more damage. And something like that would fit just a tiny bit better with the story and the use of the Warframes as a whole.

But, like I said, that's kind of an aside lol.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Tyreaus said:

The void, so far as I know, doesn't have elemental properties like radiation and whatnot else. So even if they do still have void energy at their core, it seems there's something else going on to give the abilities those extra properties.

Oh no, thats in the lore. The Warframe transforms the Void energy in the powers we have. Thats the entire idea of the Warframe, a conduit, a lens to focus the Tenno power.

Now how they do this is the mistery. Maybe Frost transforms Void Energy in Ice, or he uses Void Energy to reduce temperatures around him and then use water in the air to make Ice. We don't know.

But the Warframe is the one that transforms Void Energy in powers. Pure Void Energy doesn't have elemental properties. We only know that it damages Sentients and if you are exposed from a long period of time, you go insane.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Been having a discussion in another thread about this, but I can spitball an idea:

The Sentient afflicting the frame is basically serving as part of a symbiosis of sorts. It doesn't affect the frame any further than the equivalent of the epidermis (lest it be annihilated by the void energy that reaches lethal concentrations deeper in), and the frame makes sure not to kill it by going too heavy with void powers. In kind, the Sentient helps out the frame do its framey business because it knows if it doesn't, its death is guaranteed. Doesn't fit super well with the abilities but, IMO, the abilities don't fit a Sentient frame terribly well in the first place, so it's a sin already committed.

And as for how that started? Could be all sorts of things. Maybe it's just a sad, lonely Sentient that Vlad's operator took pity on, one looking just to survive instead of murdering everything. Who knows. For the most part, the other factions have their share of complexities, from the Corpus and the Perrin Sequence to the Grineer and Steel Meridian, so another "rogue" Sentient probably isn't too far-fetched in principle. Not like there's no other precedent, after all.

EDIT: Or maybe I'm still misinterpreting something. Can't recall the stream ad-verbatim and I'm really multitasking too much to be able to double-check. Sorry!

Edited by Tyreaus
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...