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[DE]Helen

PSA: Minimum Supported Specs Changes!

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RIP me. ah well ty for the 3 years of game. under age and parents does not have money for new PC .. so yeah till they get money or time flows faster so that I can not be underage anymore  .. bye warframe :( 

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1 hour ago, KIREEK said:

1st of all, i hope this isn't the same excuse as many other games outthere, where making the game able to run on windows xp is something that takes 5 minutes

DirectX 10 on Windows XP is not possible in 5 minutes of 5 years -- it just isn't possible.

There are actually faster rendering techniques we can't do with DirectX 9 (eg: for terrain and other organic surfaces) and to support two completely different material approaches would be a lot more than a 5 minute job -- it's just not that simple I'm afraid.

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33 minutes ago, [DE]Glen said:

DirectX 10 on Windows XP is not possible in 5 minutes of 5 years -- it just isn't possible.

There are actually faster rendering techniques we can't do with DirectX 9 (eg: for terrain and other organic surfaces) and to support two completely different material approaches would be a lot more than a 5 minute job -- it's just not that simple I'm afraid.

[Need to know more intinsifies]

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Fantastic! Now I need to change my job. My company only hands out W7 32bit hardware and while travelling I use that to login & do sorties...

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17 minutes ago, Critical said:

OK, but... when will you support Vulkan along with/instead of DirectX ? :clem:

Good point, it would be great to have that option, but I would figure the graphics would need some more tinkering first. DE Steve did express interest in the idea recently so there is that; but I don't think it would be coming up soon if at all.

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On 2018-06-05 at 8:31 PM, [DE]Glen said:

DirectX 10 on Windows XP is not possible in 5 minutes of 5 years -- it just isn't possible.

There are actually faster rendering techniques we can't do with DirectX 9 (eg: for terrain and other organic surfaces) and to support two completely different material approaches would be a lot more than a 5 minute job -- it's just not that simple I'm afraid.

Maybe i didn't explain myself correctly

You are trying to use faster rendering techniques but that isn't what i'm talking about, i'm talking about an option, an option not to use the faster redering techinques if the user is on direct x9

It will create 2 ways of rendering the game yes and it will require some effort, but i really hope it pays off not to make it render for direct x9, i really hope it saves alot of time

Xcom enemy unknown is also a game that doesn't support windows xp, yet a single file and some tweaking in the exe can make it run perfectly and yet the excuses the developers gave  are exactly the same explanation as the ones in the original topic "it's not a supported OS", "takes precious delepment time" (aka 5 minutes)

So for me based on past experiences the amount of time saved is usually pretty small, i'm a bit cautious when believing it will save time, As for vulkan on top of direct x10 and 11, make sure to save alot of time, you will need it.

As for direct x10, my windows xp does have direct x10, from what i understand when the OS is detected by the game, it makes automatic assumptions, including the assumption it is on directx9, which may not be the case, i understand why it's done, but it's not accurate.

Edited by KIREEK
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6 minutes ago, KIREEK said:

Maybe i didn't explain myself correctly

You are trying to use faster rendering techniques but that isn't what i'm talking about, i'm talking about an option, an option not to use the faster redering techinques if the user is on direct x

We already have that option, meaning the devs have had to maintain a split rendering path for years. The point here is that they are finally removing that split path to allow them to modify their unified render path in ways that they couldn't do with a split path.

I've maintained split code bases before and it's a nightmare. I applaud DE for the effort to de-cruft their codebase.

 

 

 

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How will this affect console players as I assume the legacy code needed for xp/dx9 isn't in the console versionsI expect development/translation will actually speed up (with cert being the big bottleneck) since you don't have to make double sure removing legacy code didn't break thigns with every translation.

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5 hours ago, curvelo said:

Unfortunettly, if Warframe doesn't support DX9, i can't play the game anymore...

But, i hope you guys keep evolving the game, growing stronger every hotfix and update

Love you DE ❤️ 


Just google "Build a GAMING PC for 100 USD"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lt2vap
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Build+100+Gaming+PC+2018DsUiI


There's lots of examples where people have done this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dFyhn6seoow


https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windowsforbusiness/end-of-xp-support
-- This has been common knowledge in the tech community since even Windows 7 is going to end in 2020.
https://support.microsoft.com/en-au/help/13853/windows-lifecycle-fact-sheet

Maybe at this point all computers should just use some form of 3D graphics accelerator or whatever the next thing that comes along. Probably Quantum computing.

Edited by Kinjeto
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46 minutes ago, KIREEK said:

As for direct x10, my windows xp does have direct x10,

Vista was the first Windows OS to support native DX10, anything else is a hack done by a third party that DE is not at all obliged to support.

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Well folks, this is relative. To speak badly about PC of various players, without knowing the reality of each one is simply silly. Many people here do not spend all day playing and streamming, and they use PC / NOTEBOOK for play+work.
Okay, technology needs to evolve, I agree. But I want to spend my money and stay with equipment for at least 2 to 4 years, because I do not have the money to be changing equipment or upgrading every month, especially because of games.
So, each people has a reality and condition, beyond the responsibilities and costs with other things in life.
If some feel that these players should not or do not deserve to play the game, simply because they do not have a Super-PC / Notebook, I'm sorry, I just do not agree. But the DE that solves what is best for them ($$$) then, this discussion is on their account if they think it is fair to keep these players with minor requirements or to abandon them at once.
Just think there should be the option for the player who does not have a great configuration, play too, even with the smaller settings.

PS: That's my opinion and I believe that of many here, okay? No need to argue or make vicious comments, it's just a point of view like the others here.
PS2: Yep, im included: i play on a Dell Vostro Notebook, with Intel i3 + 8Gb ram, and a S#&$ video integrated, and NO, I will not buy a pc just to play Warframe, lol  😉

Have a good game, dudes.


Cheers Tennos !!!             o/

Edited by broderbr
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Good change.

Less system configs to test for will hopefully make patching easier, and people who are still on 32bit need a solid wake up call anyway.

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The logic is that if you can pay for electricity and internet you can pay for the hardware to go along with it.

Gaming is a hobby. As for whether it's an expensive hobby. That depends on how much you want to spend.
In Australia we've got it bad because we get 10 AUD on top of every piece of hardware we buy. But I can still afford a new machine every 4 to 5 years, plus the upgrades.

 

Edited by Kinjeto

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2 minutes ago, broderbr said:

Well folks, this is relative. To speak badly about PC of various players, without knowing the reality of each one is simply silly. Many people here do not spend all day playing and streamming, and they use PC / NOTEBOOK for play+work.
Okay, technology needs to evolve, I agree. But I want to spend my money and stay with equipment for at least 2 to 4 years, because I do not have the money to be changing equipment or upgrading every month, especially because of games.
So, each people has a reality and condition, beyond the responsibilities and costs with other things in life.
If some feel that these players should not or do not deserve to play the game, simply because they do not have a Super-PC / Notebook, I'm sorry, I just do not agree. But the DE that solves what is best for them ($$$) then, this discussion is on their account if they think it is fair to keep these players with minor requirements or to abandon them at once.
Just think there should be the option for the player who does not have a great configuration, play too, even with the smaller settings.

PS: That's my opinion and I believe that of many here, okay? No need to argue or make vicious comments, it's just a point of view like the others here.

Have a good game, dudes.


Cheers Tennos !!!             o/

But this obsolete technology is not from 2 or 4 years. Its from 17 years ago.

PCs right now have 16GB to even 64GB RAM, 8GB and 6GB being enough to run most games, including Warframe. With 4GB you can play at low. However XP 32 bits can only run 3GB and some people still play with 2GB RAM PCs.

2GBs isn't enough since 2010.

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13 minutes ago, -SDM-NerevarCM said:

But this obsolete technology is not from 2 or 4 years. Its from 17 years ago.

PCs right now have 16GB to even 64GB RAM, 8GB and 6GB being enough to run most games, including Warframe. With 4GB you can play at low. However XP 32 bits can only run 3GB and some people still play with 2GB RAM PCs.

2GBs isn't enough since 2010.

Yep, about the 3Gb max on 32bits, its sucks. I even had to format my NOTEBOOK to 64bit, otherwise it would not recognize the 8Gb of memory I bought. I'm thinking now of getting an Intel i5 with an better integrated 1Gb video-chipset maybe... but more than that, I do not intend to do. If Warframe gets too heavy, I'll just have to play something else, lol

Edited by broderbr

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From a personal perspective... about time but it doesn't necessarily stop toasters from playing the game (my atom based tablet supports win 7, dx10 and 64bit...), hopefully you can do some 'matchmaking' code tweaks while you're at it so we don't end up entering a group and then the pings going into the 1-2000ms range when stuff happens. 

 

Am a bit concerned for at least one clan member though, I know he's on a toaster but not sure how old it is....

 

7 minutes ago, broderbr said:

Yep, about the 3Gb max on 32bits, its sucks. I even had to format my PC to 64bit, otherwise it would not recognize the 8Gb of memory I bought. I'm thinking now of getting an Intel i5 with an better integrated 1Gb video-chipset maybe... but more than that, I do not intend to do. If Warframe gets too heavy, I'll just have to play something else, lol

Depending on your other hardware you might be better just spending the money you'd put on the cpu towards a better gpu instead.   Without knowing your cpu can't really say for certain though. 

Edited by LSG501

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24 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

From a personal perspective... about time but it doesn't necessarily stop toasters from playing the game (my atom based tablet supports win 7, dx10 and 64bit...), hopefully you can do some 'matchmaking' code tweaks while you're at it so we don't end up entering a group and then the pings going into the 1-2000ms range when stuff happens. 

 

Am a bit concerned for at least one clan member though, I know he's on a toaster but not sure how old it is....

 

Depending on your other hardware you might be better just spending the money you'd put on the cpu towards a better gpu instead.   Without knowing your cpu can't really say for certain though. 

Yep, its a Notebook, so the upgrades they are not very cheap...
Youre right, the gpu really is a garbage, integrated (Intel chipset), I think 128Mb, or even this, lol. In low specs/configs, the game runs decently, for the quality and technology of the graphics used. But maps on Earth/Eidolon or some with many particles/elements (smoke, water, fire), the fps is shameful.
But I've seen an i5 / i7 with better integrated video (I think 1Gb video), maybe I put one.
But since I've been passionate about games for a long time and ever played, I might invest in a PC, but not now.

I'll do my best with what I have, here (Brazil) taxes are very "salty", lol... you know i mean 😉

Edited by broderbr
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2 hours ago, KIREEK said:

Maybe i didn't explain myself correctly

You are trying to use faster rendering techniques but that isn't what i'm talking about, i'm talking about an option, an option not to use the faster redering techinques if the user is on direct x9

It will create 2 ways of rendering the game yes and it will require some effort, but i really hope it pays off not to make it render for direct x9, i really hope it saves alot of time

Xcom enemy unknown is also a game that doesn't support windows xp, yet a single file and some tweaking in the exe can make it run perfectly and yet the excuses the developers gave  are exactly the same explanation as the ones in the original topic "it's not a supported OS".

So for me based on past experiences the amount of time saved is usually pretty small, i'm a bit cautious when believing it will save time, As for vulkan on top of direct x10 and 11, make sure to save alot of time, you will need it.

As for direct x10, my windows xp does have direct x10, from what i understand when the OS is detected by the game, it makes automatic assumptions, including the assumption it is on directx9, which may not be the case, i understand why it's done, but it's not accurate.

Here is your biggest issue. Do you understand why we do this thing called making something "not supported"?  It is because tech grows at an exponential rate. If you do not grow with that tech then you end up left behind. For one the graphics and quality suffer. For two...you pay more money trying to support something that will never improve and therefor is holding you back. And the third thing...if they do not support the use of that OS, and you have a tech issue...what do you think you will be doing? You will contact them...they will try to help you...they won't have access to anything to help you...you get frustrated and blame DE for your issue. It is your issue. You need to decide a few things. One...how much do I value gaming, and two how much do I value whatever else I am blowing my money on? I am disabled....I get squat per month for income. I do not use a potato. I live on less than a grand a month. If I can upgrade my pc so can you.

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2 minutes ago, broderbr said:

Yep, its a Notebook, so the upgrades they are not very cheap...
Youre right, the gpu really is a garbage, integrated (Intel chipset), I think 128Mb, or even this, lol. In low specs/configs, the game runs decently, for the quality and technology of the graphics used. But maps on Earth/Eidolon or some with many particles/elements (smoke, water, fire), the fps is shameful.
But I've seen an i5 / i7 with better integrated video (I think 1Gb video), maybe I put one.
But since I've been passionate about games for a long time and ever played, I might invest in a PC, but not now.

I'll do my best with what I have, here (Brazil) taxes are very "salty", lol... you know i mean 😉

Are you sure you can put a new cpu in your laptop, many are soldered in these days and can't be changed.

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6 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

Are you sure you can put a new cpu in your laptop, many are soldered in these days and can't be changed.

Yeah man, you're right. I'm not sure if it's soldered, it sure must be. But anyway, I'll have to make the best with what I have now, lol... who knows, some day hahahaha 😉

Maybe I start broadcasting my gameplays on Twitch and I get famous + rich. Hence I get a decent PC 😉
 The channel will be named "Shame Plays", hahaha  😄

Edited by broderbr
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26 minutes ago, ZhouDraconis said:

Here is your biggest issue. Do you understand why we do this thing called making something "not supported"?  It is because tech grows at an exponential rate. If you do not grow with that tech then you end up left behind. For one the graphics and quality suffer. For two...you pay more money trying to support something that will never improve and therefor is holding you back. And the third thing...if they do not support the use of that OS, and you have a tech issue...what do you think you will be doing? You will contact them...they will try to help you...they won't have access to anything to help you...you get frustrated and blame DE for your issue. It is your issue. You need to decide a few things. One...how much do I value gaming, and two how much do I value whatever else I am blowing my money on? I am disabled....I get squat per month for income. I do not use a potato. I live on less than a grand a month. If I can upgrade my pc so can you.

But i have chosen not to, however i have installed windows 7 64 bit just incase, i have disabled the boot option and things are normal now, but i still haven't tested the performance as it takes time to install the game, but it is there when i need it, altought it will take some time to get used to it.

If the performance is bad or direct x10 is removed, i'll wipe warframe and windows 7 with it, because the bulk of my everyday life is on a different OS.

I am still upset about the change, even if i will be able to play,i understand your point of view even if i disagree with certain things

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8 hours ago, [DE]Helen said:

With all of this in mind, we plan to change Warframe’s Minimum Supported Specs to Dx10

R.I.P my performance

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