(XB1/PS4) Virtual Cursor Feedback Megathread

[(PSN)Croewe]

3 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

 

It's worth the extra work if it means that everyone has UI that's comfortable. Look at every other game on console and you see that they are all like how warframe used to be. A controller isn't a mouse nor is it ever going to be as precise or fast as one meaning that you shouldn't be thinking a controller should act like a mouse. I'm sure that it's more work but as I said it's worth it to make it so that you can actually play the damn game without taking forever in menus to try to do each little thing.

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

33 minutes ago, (PS4)Chris_Robet said:

It's worth the extra work if it means that everyone has UI that's comfortable. Look at every other game on console and you see that they are all like how warframe used to be. A controller isn't a mouse nor is it ever going to be as precise or fast as one meaning that you shouldn't be thinking a controller should act like a mouse. I'm sure that it's more work but as I said it's worth it to make it so that you can actually play the damn game without taking forever in menus to try to do each little thing.

You totally missed the point you didn't quote there. 

 

It's not just extra work, it's extra complexity and extra bugs. Those mean that we'd not be able to play the game. Make the distinction here between a game that actually has something broken and one that we just don't like and so we decide "nooooo they changed something and I don't like it. I refuse to play the game!" which is what you basically said, on the last page if memory serves, is the case with you. 

So your main point is pretty invalid, there. Because the game is playable right now, even if it is a step down from the very fluid system we used to have. 

 

Apart from that, saying that a controller is not a mouse is true, and I'm pretty sure that the vast majority of us here aren't surprised by that, since we made the same point months ago. 

 

Now I don't know if you've played enough to point to the specific stuff that's still broken, but that's what we really need to be focusing on. Like I keep saying, right now the only way I can see to get back to what we had is to help them move forward until they are at the point where they have everything working well and we can then ask if they will be able to give us presets for each controller built into the universal code. 

[(PSN)Croewe]

43 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

You totally missed the point you didn't quote there. 

I didn't quote it because it was too damn long to have people scroll through to see my reply.

43 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

 

It's not just extra work, it's extra complexity and extra bugs. Those mean that we'd not be able to play the game. Make the distinction here between a game that actually has something broken and one that we just don't like and so we decide "nooooo they changed something and I don't like it. I refuse to play the game!" which is what you basically said, on the last page if memory serves, is the case with you. 

It's extra work in the end. Extra complexity and extra bugs to work through means extra work. In any case they never once mentioned they had trouble with the different UI and if it was such a big problem, why never mention it?

43 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

So your main point is pretty invalid, there. Because the game is playable right now, even if it is a step down from the very fluid system we used to have. 

It's not playable for me. I've given up the game (as well as many others I know) because we don't want to waste an hour doing everything we could do in 3 minutes before.

43 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

 

Now I don't know if you've played enough to point to the specific stuff that's still broken, but that's what we really need to be focusing on. Like I keep saying, right now the only way I can see to get back to what we had is to help them move forward until they are at the point where they have everything working well and we can then ask if they will be able to give us presets for each controller built into the universal code. 

They have no interest in that at this point in case you haven't noticed we've gotten no substantial updates on the system since it first came out 3 months ago.

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

9 minutes ago, (PS4)Chris_Robet said:

I didn't quote it because it was too damn long to have people scroll through to see my reply.

That might be true if you don't know that you can quote specific pieces instead of the whole thing. The last paragraph dealt with a different matter and you would have been better off not including it. 

 

10 minutes ago, (PS4)Chris_Robet said:

It's extra work in the end. Extra complexity and extra bugs to work through means extra work. In any case they never once mentioned they had trouble with the different UI and if it was such a big problem, why never mention it?

They mentioned that they had to deal with spaghetti code. It was a major topic of conversation back when this thread was new. That's mentioning it, isn't it? Seems like it to me. Why doesn't it seem that way to you? 

13 minutes ago, (PS4)Chris_Robet said:

It's not playable for me. I've given up the game (as well as many others I know) because we don't want to waste an hour doing everything we could do in 3 minutes before.

Well the facts that you give up on many games that you know, and are exaggerating a bit don't actually mean that it's unplayable. They do mean that you chose to stop playing, as was pointed out earlier, and that, my friend, is on you. 

Firebranddd and I both agree with you that the control scheme sucks. So do most of the people who posted on this thread. But I have to tell you, I logged in just a while ago and there didn't seem to be any shortage of players. Playing the game. The game that you think is unplayable. The game you say that you haven't played for months, because you think it's unplayable. Just figured you should know. 

24 minutes ago, (PS4)Chris_Robet said:

They have no interest in that at this point in case you haven't noticed we've gotten no substantial updates on the system since it first came out 3 months ago.

LOL. You're joking right? Please tell me you're joking. Please? Pl... 

Bit of background for you, I was online when the system rolled out. We got significant improvement within 2 days. This thread talks about some of the changes that were made to improve the system. The wiki lists updates and the patches and you're free to find the page or go back through the thread and find the link I posted. So, no, you're not just wrong, you're very wrong.

 

But I have to ask you, if you think that there's been no change when there demonstrably has, is it possible that is because you haven't actually played the game in months? Maybe? Possibly? 

[(PSN)Elvenbane]

19 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

They mentioned that they had to deal with spaghetti code.

Steve makes one hyperbolic tweet and you cling to it like a drowning man that's thrown a life presever. Good thing they got rid of that darn console ui spaghetti code, now the Warframe source can be pristine goodness. They couldn't possibly redo the controller support in a nice platform independent way that could benefit everyone, nope their only recourse was to cut it out like the infested tumor node it resembled. lol

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

23 minutes ago, (PS4)Elvenbane said:

Steve makes one hyperbolic tweet and you cling to it like a drowning man that's thrown a life presever. Good thing they got rid of that darn console ui spaghetti code, now the Warframe source can be pristine goodness. They couldn't possibly redo the controller support in a nice platform independent way that could benefit everyone, nope their only recourse was to cut it out like the infested tumor node it resembled. lol

Ah, so you want to back your claim of hyperbole up, or are you just making that up? I'd love to see you back it up. (Because just between us, I actually think that you made it up.) 

 

There are an infinite number of things that could have been done. What was done is what we have. They knew that it wasn't perfect and asked for feedback. I don't think that their internal testing (read echo chamber of congratulations on how great it would be) realised how much they broke. That's where we come in. That's the entire point of the thread, for us to come in and scream that we need a hotkey for leaving the group, or that the 'profile' option on the chat in ps4 is stupid because it's linking to the wrong profile. 

 

Those are things that they can fix. One at a time, until we do get to the point where we can ask for a transition to controller friendly defaults. You know what they're not able to do? Go back in time and undo the change. Or skip forward in time and solve everything before having it brought to their attention. 

 

But hey you lot do you and keep demanding those things. Just do everyone a favour and include at least one specific thing that they need to fix in your posts when you do. 

[(PSN)Hiero_Glyph]

Sorry to interrupt. The problem isn't that changes were made, it's just that the controller UI and options were already lacking before the cursor update so what little we had that worked well was basically removed. Sure, the cursor UI is functional and it does have a few couple benefits (chat links, scrolling) but it's definitely not ideal.

Now fast forward to today and we are still way behind where we were. That's simply unacceptable as months have passed. Don't even get me started on the features/options controllers need that haven't even been acknowledged yet (separate X/Y sensitivites, more mapping options for the touch pad, a way to make alt fire consistent between the Tiberon and Pandero, etc.).

The problem is that DE hasn't given consoles a quality update for the UI in way too long. I understand we can't get hotfixes every week but we should be getting significant UI improvements every single patch. And let's be honest, DE hasn't addressed controller UI concerns in so long they may have already forgotten about them. That's simply not an acceptable solution for console/controller players.

So in the end, DE deserves some major criticism over this and I don't care about Fortuna, or Revenant, or whatever else they are trying to distract us with, I just want to know that they are dedicated to improving our user experience. And right now it doesn't seem like they care in the least.

[(PSN)Elvenbane]

1 hour ago, (PS4)Hiero_Glyph said:

So in the end, DE deserves some major criticism over this and I don't care about Fortuna, or Revenant, or whatever else they are trying to distract us with, I just want to know that they are dedicated to improving our user experience. And right now it doesn't seem like they care in the least.

What??? You'd prioritize a solid controller experience over Frame Fighter...blasphemy! :)

2 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Ah, so you want to back your claim of hyperbole up, or are you just making that up? I'd love to see you back it up. (Because just between us, I actually think that you made it up.) 

People can read Steve's twitter and decide for themselves, you sure are reading a lot into "Code spaghetti of 'IsConsole/IsPCController' (fragile)". Also missing the point entirely as well, which was ok, dedicate the resources to redo it properly.

I could tell you how long I've been writing commercial software that has to run on multiple platforms and that I understand Steve's motivation and desire to simplify far too well, but that's as futile as posting actual feedback in this thread.

They did a quick backpedal on the arsenal shortcuts, did they just add back the IsConsole/IsPCController checks? I suspect not since it seems to be different code/assests (b/w icons, etc.).

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

2 hours ago, (PS4)Elvenbane said:

What??? You'd prioritize a solid controller experience over Frame Fighter...blasphemy! 🙂

People can read Steve's twitter and decide for themselves, you sure are reading a lot into "Code spaghetti of 'IsConsole/IsPCController' (fragile)". Also missing the point entirely as well, which was ok, dedicate the resources to redo it properly.

I could tell you how long I've been writing commercial software that has to run on multiple platforms and that I understand Steve's motivation and desire to simplify far too well, but that's as futile as posting actual feedback in this thread.

They did a quick backpedal on the arsenal shortcuts, did they just add back the IsConsole/IsPCController checks? I suspect not since it seems to be different code/assests (b/w icons, etc.).

So... In a word, 'No'? 

 

Nobody has disagreed that this is a step down. Nobody disagrees that they screwed up when they released this. Nobody doesn't want to have more improvement. 

 

But we're here right now. And they thought that what they gave us was good. It's up to us to tell them what still needs fixing. 

[(PSN)Elvenbane]

7 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

It's up to us to tell them what still needs fixing. 

Sure it is. Hey, I have a great idea; since you're full of 'optimism' and over half the posts are yours anyway, why not be useful for once and help DE out.

Comb through all 82 pages of feedback (which apparently wasn't sufficient to let DE know were not amused) and itemize everything that remains to be addressed. Post the list here, forward it to Danielle and wherever else it might get looked at.

If your serious about helping DE and truly believe they're listening you'd be doing everyone a big service, Godspeed Tenno, we're counting on you!

 

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

Oh I do it with the stuff that affects me the most. 

7 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

That's where we come in. That's the entire point of the thread, for us to come in and scream that we need a hotkey for leaving the group, or that the 'profile' option on the chat in ps4 is stupid because it's linking to the wrong profile. 

Emphasis as it was in the original. 

 

I did it just a little while ago, it's still on the page, maybe you've seen it? Used to be "give us a way to close chat without refusing invites". We're good on that one now, I guess. 

 

And you're welcome. 😊

[(PSN)Elvenbane]

4 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Oh I do it with the stuff that affects me the most. 

Emphasis as it was in the original. 

 

I did it just a little while ago, it's still on the page, maybe you've seen it? Used to be "give us a way to close chat without refusing invites". We're good on that one now, I guess. 

 

And you're welcome. 😊

No, no, this won't do at all, you can't expect DE to slog through every post. I guess you weren't serious about helping, I'm disappointed. :(

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

Like I said I do it with the stuff that I consider important at the time. The hotkey to leave is priority number one for me right now. (It looks like that's something they're adding back into the game soon. Maybe) The chat profile would be a general improvement as well. We already have a system that snaps to the menu option on dpad press. 

[(PSN)corpusbonds]

Just gunna post some more issues we’ve noticed happen more often since the Nidus Deluxe update.

-When modding your warframe, if you try to change configurations it won’t change. You’ll have to manually click on them to change.

-Hovering over your mod on your warframe to remove a mod snaps the cursor to your mods to be sorted (by rank, name, etc.)

-Some times trying to even change your warframes/appearance/mods won’t register and you’ll have to back out to do it again.

-Unable to leave a squad (know this was posted by it’s becoming more frequent).

-Cursor spazzes at random and scrolls to the side of the star chart; cannot be moved and need to back out in order to move it again.

 I’m sure there’s more, but I can’t think of any at the moment.

[(XBOX)Tucker D Dawg]

Pre-dating this slow UI change - but persisting - we (on XB at least) STILL can't hold down the right RB to donate sentient cores and have them autoincrement.

At MR25, if we wanted to donate the thousands of cores we have to mash the bumper button.  TWO HUNDRED AND SIXTY TIMES if doing intact sentient cores.

Finding stuff in the inventory still sucks - the pictures mean nothing if every different item uses the same picture.

Moving up to squad menu on console is still painful, navigating it equally so, and seeing what frames are in the squad is tedious.

 

[(PSN)Hiero_Glyph]

23 minutes ago, (XB1)Tucker D Dawg said:

Pre-dating this slow UI change - but persisting - we (on XB at least) STILL can't hold down the right RB to donate sentient cores and have them autoincrement.

At MR25, if we wanted to donate the thousands of cores we have to mash the bumper button.  TWO HUNDRED AND SIXTY TIMES if doing intact sentient cores.

Finding stuff in the inventory still sucks - the pictures mean nothing if every different item uses the same picture.

Moving up to squad menu on console is still painful, navigating it equally so, and seeing what frames are in the squad is tedious.

 

At least for the inventory there is an option to enable names over the pictures. I have no idea why it is turned off by default because as you noted the pictures are 99% pointless. This is yet another example of the disconnect between DE's vision of a new UI and a functional UI.

[(PSN)IraWretched]

3 hours ago, (XB1)Tucker D Dawg said:

Pre-dating this slow UI change - but persisting - we (on XB at least) STILL can't hold down the right RB to donate sentient cores and have them autoincrement.

At MR25, if we wanted to donate the thousands of cores we have to mash the bumper button.  TWO HUNDRED AND SIXTY TIMES if doing intact sentient cores.

Finding stuff in the inventory still sucks - the pictures mean nothing if every different item uses the same picture.

Moving up to squad menu on console is still painful, navigating it equally so, and seeing what frames are in the squad is tedious.

 

I FEEL THIS IN MY SOUL

[(PSN)corpusbonds]

9 hours ago, (XB1)Tucker D Dawg said:

Pre-dating this slow UI change - but persisting - we (on XB at least) STILL can't hold down the right RB to donate sentient cores and have them autoincrement.

At MR25, if we wanted to donate the thousands of cores we have to mash the bumper button.  TWO HUNDRED AND SIXTY TIMES if doing intact sentient cores.

Finding stuff in the inventory still sucks - the pictures mean nothing if every different item uses the same picture.

Moving up to squad menu on console is still painful, navigating it equally so, and seeing what frames are in the squad is tedious.

 

On PS4 too. I just gave up donating the small cores due to this. 🙄

[(PSN)Firebrandd]

On 2018-08-17 at 10:51 AM, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Unified code means that if it works on one, it'll work on all. So we all benefit from it getting fixed once.

What a nice dream that is! It seems to me like it's much more of a headache to try to get one piece of code to work in three different ways rather than get the three pieces of code to work together smoothly.  It seems to me like asking a diesel engine, gasoline engine, and an electric engine to all use the same type of fuel. Apples and oranges, buddy.

Edited August 21, 2018 by (PS4)Firebrandd

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

5 hours ago, (PS4)Firebrandd said:

What a nice dream that is! It seems to me like it's much more of a headache to try to get one piece of code to work in three different ways rather than get the three pieces of code to work together smoothly.  It seems to me like asking a diesel engine, gasoline engine, and an electric engine to all use the same type of fuel. Apples and oranges, buddy.

That's actually a bit backwards. The three pieces of code didn't work together at all, did they? And trying to apply improvements and upgrades like new tyres was causing things to occasionally break. What we got is a single engine meant to replace all three and feed the power generated to the drive train. 

If they can get that done, then anybody who works on the engine, would be able to make the improvement to all existing engines no matter what fuel that customer wants to use. 

Multi-fuel engines are actually a thing. Mine runs on gasoline and compressed natural gas. I tend to top up with a couple of bucks a week. #living_that_dream 😉

[(PSN)MOGREASE]

Old system was better only good thing about cursor is being able to see the [mod/item] more efficiently. The new menus are a real problem to. Everything is way to small nothing is labeled and it's not in color. The old menus were so much easier and better to use and everything was labeled without having to click directly on it. 

[BeastKing9]

personally i dont understand why people have an issue with it, its not that bad, however i hate having to press square to preview a frame or wep.... thats my only gripe

[(PSN)Hiero_Glyph]

8 hours ago, BeastKing9 said:

personally i dont understand why people have an issue with it, its not that bad, however i hate having to press square to preview a frame or wep.... thats my only gripe

The problem is that nearly everything takes longer to do. The only two improvements are scrolling and clicking links in chat. Let me upgrade you to rotary phones and we'll see how much you enjoy them after a month.

[(PSN)corpusbonds]

19 minutes ago, (PS4)Hiero_Glyph said:

The problem is that nearly everything takes longer to do. The only two improvements are scrolling and clicking links in chat. Let me upgrade you to rotary phones and we'll see how much you enjoy them after a month.

Not to mention all of the glitches that come with it.

 

[(PSN)Firebrandd]

Someone please tell me why Fortuna and Railjack and melee 3.i'msickofpoints are so much more important than listening to player feedback and fixing everything they broke. I want to know who is putting pressure on the dev team to rush out crappy half-assed code instead of taking the time necessary to give us what we're asking for.  We did NOT ask for new UI or unnecessary themes, but oh boy that was way more important than returning the ability to leave a squad without having to wait for the mission to load so we can abort or having to close application and log back in. Please tell me why it is so important that consoles get updates the same time as PC?  We've always been a couple weeks to a month behind PC, and frankly I don't see what's wrong with waiting. I still think the dev team has their head stuck up their collective bums for trying to force one code to work on three different systems.  To me, that's just crazy talk. I understand the desire for streamlined code that doesn't give you nightmares every time you want to make a tiny change.  That would be sweet. The reality remains that PCs are not consoles and that Xbox and PlayStation aren't PCs.  You can't expect them all to run the same code smoothly. "Unified code" in this case is trying to force consoles to be PCs and that's messed up. We bought consoles because we didn't want to be tied to the PC to play and now we have a dev team trying to force our consoles to be PCs.