Update 23: Mods, Forma, and Destruction of Builds

[Evhel]

6 hours ago, allibound said:

I'm honestly shocked the forums aren't burning in the wake of a horde of angry, frothing, pictchfork-toting players screaming about the 20+ forma we've effectively lost.  I'm at a loss for words at how much of a setback this is for me in time and effort.  All this wait for a quest I did casually in 1 evening and now a month-long grind just to get back to where I was.  Crap like this is why I stop playing for months on end, and why almost none of my friends ever log in anymore.

This. Primed disappointment for the quest, but who cares about that. Exalted Weapons should have inherited any already spent forma on the frame.

As for the Umbra mods, in my opinion such mods should be "Umbra-locked". Only for Exc Umbra, and other umbras (if we ever get to have more).

[Telogor]

6 hours ago, Oreades said:

Eh the stats on the new mods are kinda meh, most of them don't compare to the Primed variants.

That's the thing: the only mod that's not as good is Sacrificial Pressure.  The rest are all almost twice as effective as the generic version.  So basically we have un-forma-able Primed Intensify, Vitality, and Steel Fiber.

[10-N0]

Boys, This quest is called "THE SACRIFICE" for a reason. 

[Kletse]

Such an obvious forma sink. In a nice package.
Well.. Keeps us going i guess.

[Oreades]

11 minutes ago, Telogor said:

That's the thing: the only mod that's not as good is Sacrificial Pressure.  The rest are all almost twice as effective as the generic version.  So basically we have un-forma-able Primed Intensify, Vitality, and Steel Fiber.

I don't remember the Intensify being better, I'll have to take another look at it. 

As for the Vitality mods....... *pfffffft*

I can't remember the last time I bothered to add a survivability mod to any of my builds. Actually I do, it was my pre WoF nerf Ember. I can't think of another frame that I use them off the top of my head, I might still have them in Nidus and Inaros but I practically never play them. So I can't say for certain.

For the rest of the game they just aren't that great because you are either killing everything so fast that survivability isn't really an issue OR everything is oneshotting you and there is very little overlap.

Edit:

Tho in fairness I do advocate newer players invest in the shield bonus mods because outside of toxin damage shields can really take the edge off the early game. Knowing that when they hit mid-end game they by and large won't be using them anymore. So to do so knowing that any Endo they put in those mods is effectively throwing it away.

Edited June 15, 2018 by Oreades

[Kinky_Skeleton]

7 hours ago, --Q--Voltage said:

All in all, Update 23: The Sacrifice has completely shifted the Meta of modding and punishes players for their years of investment. New mods cannot be polarized for, and exalted weapons require double the investment for the same outcome.

Meta of modding? I don't really think so, If the meta of modding is to be more powerful by using forma and making room for mods to become more powerful then here u go 5 new mods to make exactly that. I don't mean to sound rude or like an idiot but what even is the point of total XP earn it doesn't really matter really.  And i totally disagree with the fact of you saying "...Punishes the player..." its not at all a punishment. No one said you HAVE to use the mods nor are u Forced to use the mods. The builds every one create have worked fine if not Excellent before they added them so If u want the mods on ur build u brought that on ur self and at that point it's not a punishment. On the point of exalted weapons it was a risky move but in the long run it will help a lot so people can make builds on that table rather than always having to pull out a said weapon and use that says build for for the Exalted to work it even shows u now what damagelse it does so u know how to mod it with out having to use the wiki making the building for it a lot easier to accomplish. And at last  the idea of not polarizing the umbra mod slots makes a lot of sense since we just found, learned, and basically tamed an umbra this doesn't mean we know how it works or how to recreatexplain it's unique slots while also really bringing out the "Sacrifices" people have to make to fit them on.

 

Basically what I'm getting at is that the sacrifice didn't ruin anything with the modding system it's all the matter of choice and if YOU the player want to Sacrifice ur time and builds to try and fit the mods on. If you really are gonna complain about the grind you shouldn't really be playing a grinding game such as warfare then. But hey that's just my opinion I may not have been a primed veteran but I have been thro warfare for quit sometime now and known that ur *stats* and *master Rank* mean nothing and that your ability to play is all that matters

[Kinky_Skeleton]

6 hours ago, allibound said:

I'm honestly shocked the forums aren't burning in the wake of a horde of angry, frothing, pictchfork-toting players screaming about the 20+ forma we've effectively lost.  I'm at a loss for words at how much of a setback this is for me in time and effort.  All this wait for a quest I did casually in 1 evening and now a month-long grind just to get back to where I was.  Crap like this is why I stop playing for months on end, and why almost none of my friends ever log in anymore.

It's once again back to what is said in a previous comment, it is a set back but in the long run making the builds for such exalted weapons will be a lot easier since u can make the build, see the stats, and not have to waste time finding the weapon u modded just for ur exalted weapon builds. It is a set back but long term it will help not only us but new player that join and don't know aboUT such things. But hey its a grind in a grind game. If u complain about that u shouldn't be playing warframe by know u should know the game is extremely grindy, and this isn't even the worse update/change they did there have been worse in they he past

[Arniox]

7 hours ago, --Q--Voltage said:

If I were to Forma her for the 7th time, that number would stay stagnant until I earned another 172,469,920 + 1 XP. This should not be the case. A welcome change to address this is that Forma should freeze your XP earned until you are level 30 again. This way, players can apply Forma to fit Umbra Mods and not feel like years of Affinity gain has gone down the drain

This is just a number... It does literally nothing.. At all. Why do you care so much about a small number on your account that no one will ever see cause no one checks profiles anymore. 

[Gabry_96]

I'm against letting all the frames forma the Umbra polarity. I mean, it's called like that because it's a... Umbra polarity. For Umbra frames. Letting a, say, Excalibur, forma his slots into Umbra polarities, would take away all the uniqueness of Excal Umbra. 

[Arniox]

7 hours ago, allibound said:

I'm honestly shocked the forums aren't burning in the wake of a horde of angry, frothing, pictchfork-toting players screaming about the 20+ forma we've effectively lost.  I'm at a loss for words at how much of a setback this is for me in time and effort.  All this wait for a quest I did casually in 1 evening and now a month-long grind just to get back to where I was.  Crap like this is why I stop playing for months on end, and why almost none of my friends ever log in anymore.

Month grind.... I did all frames in one day... 

[Voltage]

1 hour ago, Equilibrior said:

In what way does the accumulated XP with one frame have any effect on the game after he is maxed once.

To my knowledge this number just represents how much affinity this frame has collected, nothing more.

Do you have a source that explains this number deeper?

I hope this answers your question (I also added this thread to OP). I am happy to try and explain what you are asking if this thread I made does not answer it. 

22 minutes ago, Arniox said:

This is just a number... It does literally nothing.. At all. Why do you care so much about a small number on your account that no one will ever see cause no one checks profiles anymore. 

Numbers mean many things to different players. I respect your opinion that this number does not affect the game in an immense way, but many players value their profile stats. This is why people push Events, get good Lunaro stats, have a high Conclave K/D, etc. It just looks good to some people.

A bug is a bug. Whether this bug affects you is irrelevant given that objectively, bugs should be fixed.

[LuckyCharm]

A bunch of us called it even before the exalted modding became live. Saying they'd add polarities so we didnt have to start from scratch. I don't know about you guys but I rarely use - polarities on my weapons, effectively meaning I have to redo those too. I'm always out of forma and well i'm pretty much out again without even starting on the sacrificial or umbral formaing grind. 

 

[ALEX_IV]

9 hours ago, --Q--Voltage said:

1) Warframe and weapon slots should be able to be polarized as an Umbra slot. This is simple. Players should be able to polarize any slot on gear with the new polarity. It promotes build diversity and adds a layer of grind worth both a veteran's and new player's time. 

For warframes, of course not. Why would you be able to? 
It's obvious they are intended to be used only on umbra warframes, hence why you can't add that polarity to normal warframes (i.e. they are not umbra)

Edited June 16, 2018 by ALEX_IV

[Voltage]

8 minutes ago, ALEX_IV said:

For warframes, of course not. Why would you be able to? 
It's obvious they are intended to be used only on umbra warframes, hence why you can't add that polarity to normal warframes (i.e. they are not umbra)

Intended =/= healthy. Allowing these mods to be placed on normal Warframes, but disallowing you to Forma them in is just nonsensical. The sacrifice of The Sacrifice should not be our build diversity.

[ALEX_IV]

3 minutes ago, --Q--Voltage said:

Intended =/= healthy. Allowing these mods to be placed on normal Warframes, but disallowing you to Forma them in is just nonsensical. The sacrifice of The Sacrifice should not be our build diversity.

Healthy? Really? Sorry but that is just bull. Disallowing you to forma them is not nonsensical, it's logical. Again, they are not umbra Warframes, they are supposed to be a step down.

You can't have everything. There is already a good build diversity, 3 mods aren't going to affect it, considering they are just upgraded versions of other mods.

[Devious_Machine]

they should just make umbra mods only usable on umbra frames, problem solved.

[-Pure]

8 hours ago, Misgenesis said:

Yes, lets do away with the balancing of these mods shall we? Unless they increased the capacity drain further there would be no way to make this work.

Did anyone consider that in order to make use of these mods you would have to deliberately Sacrifice for it.

Balance? In Warframe? Where? Literally the dumbest point to ever bring out. This game is as far away from balanced as it gets. This is a power fantasy, you can literally one shot everything until the games mechanics forces you to cheese it. The game is inherently unbalanced from the ground up, they might as well allow you to forma those polarities in, theres no reason not to.

[-cS-dalonico]

tho i agree the profile thing reset should ofc not happen, you or anyone calling on not willing to forma bc of such meh stat is just laughable, lemme say 😛

[-cS-dalonico]

hace 1 hora, Devious_Machine dijo:

they should just make umbra mods only usable on umbra frames, problem solved.

will we even get more umbra frames? 😛

[-cS-dalonico]

hace 1 hora, ALEX_IV dijo:

Healthy? Really? Sorry but that is just bull. Disallowing you to forma them is not nonsensical, it's logical. Again, they are not umbra Warframes, they are supposed to be a step down.

You can't have everything. There is already a good build diversity, 3 mods aren't going to affect it, considering they are just upgraded versions of other mods.

I kinda agree on that it doesnt hurt to have some differentiation between frame types (normie/prime/"umbra"-if its even going to be a "new class" and not just this excal thing)

we already have base stat differences that are kind of important when looking at many normie vs prime instances. 

BUT I would agree on that if theres not going to be more umbras... these mods (polarities) should be fitable(form-able/polarizable) into the existing frames (or at least the primes? idk)

[--END--Rikutatis]

1 hour ago, -Pure said:

Balance? In Warframe? Where? Literally the dumbest point to ever bring out. This game is as far away from balanced as it gets. This is a power fantasy, you can literally one shot everything until the games mechanics forces you to cheese it. The game is inherently unbalanced from the ground up, they might as well allow you to forma those polarities in, theres no reason not to.

With each new update there's more and more power creep added into the game, however the difficulty and challenge are not being raised to compensate. We're still fighting pretty much the same enemies save a couple new eidolons this year that require a pretty specific setup anyways. PoE introduced zaws and operator arcanes, the vast majorities of primaries/secondaries got buffed, then arcanes got buffed and were made much more available to all, now you guys want the Umbra exclusive polarity to be used by all frames which would add even more power creep in the form of power strength builds and survivability. I really don't think regular warframes need these polarities, let this be something special for umbra frames. You can still use those mods, you just need to make some hard choices on which ones to fit, maybe rework your build and so on. I mean, honestly. We need more difficulty and challenge in the game, not to get even more powerful to fight the same enemies we're already one shotting anyways. 

[Ammo_Case]

12 hours ago, --Q--Voltage said:

 

1) Warframe and weapon slots should be able to be polarized as an Umbra slot. This is simple. Players should be able to polarize any slot on gear with the new polarity. It promotes build diversity and adds a layer of grind worth both a veteran's and new player's time.

 

I think everyone is backing this up. This is very worth it even if it took 3 forma for one of these polarities i would do it. Please DE we want to fit full build to our warframe's

 

[megamino]

Let me guess in the future, let me sink this in

PLAYERS: We want polarized Umbra Slot

DE: yes (but in the end we will nerf the mod because it's too powerful for other non umbra warframe)

My Question is, do you really need umbra mod to survive? Before umbra, some of you can do sortie without any problem, if there is uniqueness don't kill those uniqueness with this kind of suggestion. You must know that umbra is umbra, the mods is for umbra only. There's no simple explanation than that. You want to use that mod? Go on but know your sacrifice. For me? Excalibur Umbra just need little adjustment because he has intensify, health and armor in, the 3 most useful thing you have with regular excalibur, the only thing is to maxed out those mod and see what happened.

The sacrifical mod also not that powerful as primed pressure point, so why bother? 🙂

[ALEX_IV]

34 minutes ago, T-Swag814 said:

I think everyone is backing this up.

 

No we don't.

[KrackerRitz]

The entitlement is strong.
I just hope the new mods are farmable eventually.. I wouldn't mind several ranks of each mod.