Profile Affinity Resets with Forma

[Voltage]

This has been a longstanding bug that should be fixed given the release of Exalted weapon modding and the addition of new mods that impact many Warframe/melee builds.

Applying Forma to a gear item locks your "XP" statistic on your profile until you reach that value + 1 from 0 to progress this counter. What does that mean? Well here is my test to display the bug.

Here is Equinox:

Equinox applies one Forma and proceeds to level.

410,985 Affinity is earned from a mission. After returning to the ship, the profile still displays the previous value: 14,060,714. The value should be 14,060,714 + 410,985 or 14,471,699 Affinity. This is because applying Forma to any gear item resets your affinity to 0 and requires you to reach your previous affinity number before counting onward. This will end up displaying incorrect statistics as the XP value will not be showing Affinity gained in between Formas. 

This does not matter whether the gear item is between level 0 and 30. This bug stays after your gear is rank 30. Regardless of your gear's level, your profile affinity is reset to zero under the hood and locks your current XP statistic.

I bring this to light because new mods and Exalted modding may reset years worth of XP on the profile page. It would be fantastic if this was addressed, because millions or even billions of affinity could be lost due to applying Forma on aged builds.

Edited January 27, 2022 by Voltage
Fixed Formatting

[Immudzen]

What does that millions or billions of affinity do? So far I have not seen it actually do anything after the frame is maxed out. Does it have any use of any kind or is it just a score?

[fellow1]

1 hour ago, Immudzen said:

What does that millions or billions of affinity do? So far I have not seen it actually do anything after the frame is maxed out. Does it have any use of any kind or is it just a score?

It shows how long have you been playing with specific frame. 

[tucker_d_dawg]

the application of a forma and re-levelling of it is trivial by comparison to the actual usage of that frame if it is a frequently used frame.

And most of those stats are so meaningless like all the other stats in WF and broken in a hundred different ways.

 

[Voltage]

1 hour ago, tucker_d_dawg said:

the application of a forma and re-levelling of it is trivial by comparison to the actual usage of that frame if it is a frequently used frame.

And most of those stats are so meaningless like all the other stats in WF and broken in a hundred different ways.

I am reporting this bug because numbers are meaningful to some players (like myself). This is a UI related bug that has been ongoing for years and I was compelled to report it in the appropriate section. Whether you feel it is meaningful or meaningless is irrelevant. Objectively, all bugs should be fixed.

Edited June 16, 2018 by --Q--Voltage

[tyrannicaltyrant]

1 hour ago, --Q--Voltage said:

I am reporting this bug because numbers are meaningful to some players (like myself). This is a UI related bug that has been ongoing for years and I was compelled to report it in the appropriate section. Whether you feel it is meaningful or meaningless is irrelevant. Objectively, all bugs should be fixed.

This isn't the appropriate section though.

[-dicht.Goko-]

27 minutes ago, tyrannicaltyrant said:

This isn't the appropriate section though.

Why? The profile section isn't part of the UI? 

[Birdframe_Prime]

Well? Your point is that you can't gain XP on the frame until you reach the original value and exceed it, right?

Considering that Forma resets your frame to 0 in all ways except for this new polarity, doesn't this kind of make sense? It's your top 'score' with that frame, they aren't going to reset it to 0 and make it look like you've played 4.9% of your time in game with that frame and earned no XP with it, are they? No, what they're going to do is reset your XP count since that Forma, but then give you a record of where you were and make you climb back up to it again.

Maybe they could put in a little qualifier text like 'XP High Score' or similar, because that's all it really is, your high-score usage with that frame since you last Forma'd it. Maybe we could get a second line saying 'current XP' to match, which would show how close you are to it, but then once you beat that previous 'high score', they would be the same, so... it wouldn't be needed.

Thinking about it... that means that my total with Zephyr (considering I put an extra Forma on her when the Exilus slots were created) was 82,582,824. We can gain so much Affinity in this game that it's kind of silly...

If all this XP total is doing is measuring your 'best score' with that frame before you stuck a Forma on it, then just play that frame more and beat it.

[motorfirebox]

18 hours ago, --Q--Voltage said:

This has been a longstanding bug that should be fixed given the release of Exalted weapon modding and the addition of new mods that impact many Warframe/melee builds.

Applying Forma to a gear item locks your "XP" statistic on your profile until you reach that value + 1 from 0 to progress this counter. What does that mean? Well here is my test to display the bug.

Here is Equinox:

Equinox applies one Forma and proceeds to level.

410,985 Affinity is earned from a mission. After returning to the ship, the profile still displays the previous value: 14,060,714. The value should be 14,060,714 + 410,985 or 14,471,699 Affinity. This is because applying Forma to any gear item resets your affinity to 0 and requires you to reach your previous affinity number before counting onward. This will end up displaying incorrect statistics as the XP value will not be showing Affinity gained in between Formas.

Here is a video format of the bug in question:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

I bring this to light because new mods and Exalted modding may reset years worth of XP on the profile page. It would be fantastic if this was addressed, because millions or even billions of affinity could be lost due to applying Forma on years old Warframes.

Are you sure it's not just only counting affinity that you earn past rank 30?

[Voltage]

6 hours ago, motorfirebox said:

Are you sure it's not just only counting affinity that you earn past rank 30?

Thank you for bringing this to my attention! Yes, this bug still exists after passing rank 30 on a gear item. I posted a second video in the OP displaying this test. My apologies for non-extensive portrayal of testing.

Edited June 17, 2018 by --Q--Voltage

[tyrannicaltyrant]

17 hours ago, -dicht.Goko- said:

Why? The profile section isn't part of the UI? 

Forums aren't for reporting bugs specified.

[-dicht.Goko-]

1 minute ago, tyrannicaltyrant said:

Forums aren't for reporting bugs specified.

You're wrong. 

Plenty of bugs are reported on the forums. Just take a look. 

Glad I good help. 

[motorfirebox]

3 hours ago, tyrannicaltyrant said:

Forums aren't for reporting bugs specified.

The subforum titled "PC Bugs"... isn't for reporting bugs?

[Inanegrain62]

14 hours ago, tyrannicaltyrant said:

Forums aren't for reporting bugs specified.

A lot of bugs usually fall into general.

 

I'd think that a bug like this would fall under User Interference as it's for the user to view.

[Derek_Icelord]

You seem unhealthily obsessed with a tiny UI detail that virtually no one will ever see...

[Senguash]

1 hour ago, Derek_Icelord said:

You seem unhealthily obsessed with a tiny UI detail that virtually no one will ever see...

People will notice once the amount gets ridiculous enough.

Just trust me, it's one of those things where, just because you don't care and do indeed represent the majority, doesn't there's noone who cares.

[Arksofia]

This bug also has the nasty issue of making older "more used" gear items appear as your "most used", even though something newer (with forma) should have taken its place. I have this issue with Rhino and Carrier (still my most used items) even though I have used Inaros (who has 2 forma) far more.

[Sebastian-Sekkusu]

See the reason that these numbers matter to a select few players, is the same reason that you can go higher than Master Rank 14. Because it gives you bragging rights. Oh I'm MR 20, that means I've played ALOT of this game, your words hold more weight than a MR 2 trying to explain something. If Two Nezha mains are trying to tell you how to build yours for generic runs. Which are you going to listen to? The one with 4billion affinity gained, or the one with only fourteen million? You're going to listen to the one with four billion. Now lets say for arguing in favor of the OP, the one with fourteen million actually has a 4 forma build that can solo even April 1st gift of the lotus missions with the lvl 1000 juggernauts. But the one with 4 billion has been using random mods without forma, and doesn't really have a clue what he's doing. Well, you'll copy the guy with the 4 billion affinity because he's clearly done more on that frame.

Then you have Clans, MANY clans are competitive, and use your affinity stats as a basis of your membership. Oh, you've stopped gaining affinity on your frames? It's not gone up in a week? You must have stopped playing, so kick. Or they feel that you're not pulling your weight to keep your clan as the "best" clan there is. so they kick you for that. It's a numbers game. You can literally just walk through missions with your eyes closed after MR6 if you have a good build, so what's left to do? Aim for the "highest score" to show your place among players.

[nms.]

On 2018-07-11 at 8:47 PM, DamienSilves said:

See the reason that these numbers matter to a select few players, is the same reason that you can go higher than Master Rank 14. Because it gives you bragging rights. Oh I'm MR 20, that means I've played ALOT of this game, your words hold more weight than a MR 2 trying to explain something. If Two Nezha mains are trying to tell you how to build yours for generic runs. Which are you going to listen to? The one with 4billion affinity gained, or the one with only fourteen million? You're going to listen to the one with four billion. Now lets say for arguing in favor of the OP, the one with fourteen million actually has a 4 forma build that can solo even April 1st gift of the lotus missions with the lvl 1000 juggernauts. But the one with 4 billion has been using random mods without forma, and doesn't really have a clue what he's doing. Well, you'll copy the guy with the 4 billion affinity because he's clearly done more on that frame.

Then you have Clans, MANY clans are competitive, and use your affinity stats as a basis of your membership. Oh, you've stopped gaining affinity on your frames? It's not gone up in a week? You must have stopped playing, so kick. Or they feel that you're not pulling your weight to keep your clan as the "best" clan there is. so they kick you for that. It's a numbers game. You can literally just walk through missions with your eyes closed after MR6 if you have a good build, so what's left to do? Aim for the "highest score" to show your place among players.

What are you babbling on? Nice stereotyping there, solid evidence you bring on... You don't even know why he wants to keep his affinity numbers. With how easy it is in this game to earn affinity and gain MR by simply standing still, not sure you yourself understand the fallacy in that story of yours. I don't know who or what clan in your limited exposure hurt you but, you are stereotyping and blowing that out of proportion.

Yes, warframe is a game of numbers, it's a game of records, numbers are the only thing in this that can give people a sense of completion, progress and satisfaction. You are placing too much importance on your own view and yourself if you think people just go around swinging their profile stats onto anyone or onto you voluntarily without ask. The actual majority of players don't have time for it, or don't really have time or care to show it around randoms.

Anyone who has spent a couple hundred hours in this game will know for a fact that these cases of advanced players "sh*tting" on noobs left and right explaining something are rare. It's the opposite, they want to complete everything with the most efficiency and in the best way possible. They will not waste their time arguing about trivial crap, unless asked about. They want their time to count. Playing bookworm with noobs is a waste of time. There's more chance of getting an advanced player to sh*t on you by making him wait standing 1 meter away from extraction than by saying anything about the game that is not true, but the reality is, that player will simply ignore you to mark you and leave squad once the mission is done. You will get the eventual mouthblasting moron, but again, minority. Unless your insightful experience is region chat talk, which is majority idiots, regardless of hours played.

Let's be realistic, an actual genuine MR 2 (i.e new player not some alt account smurfer) can't explain jacksh*t about game mechanics aside bullet jump, because a true MR 2 will have 3-15 in mission hours, you only need to rank up like 4 pieces of equipment to make it to MR 2 from MR 0. That type of player probably doesn't know there's a wiki for the game either. You don't need to go that high in number, taking your own example, there's a incredibly high probability that an MR 6 player will be able to explain game mechanics better than an MR 2.

Quote

Then you have Clans, MANY clans are competitive, and use your affinity stats as a basis of your membership. Oh, you've stopped gaining affinity on your frames? It's not gone up in a week? You must have stopped playing, so kick. Or they feel that you're not pulling your weight to keep your clan as the "best" clan there is. so they kick you for that. It's a numbers game. You can literally just walk through missions with your eyes closed after MR6 if you have a good build, so what's left to do? Aim for the "highest score" to show your place among players

What are we talking here? You had 1 bad experience with some nerdo neckbeard clan owner and now you are preaching like the majority of competitive clans do this? Just by the word "competitive" it's obvious we are talking about a minority. Any shred of actual clan competitiveness that existed in this game died when dark sector and rails were removed.

There are also plenty of good clans that are competitive or non-competitive and give 0 f*cks about any of what you just said. Most on both sides typically have a simple requirement to not be AWOL for more than a specific set of weeks, yes, even non-competitive clans. This requirement is to keep up with resources and to keep up with event rewards for the clan. You go into a clan to be part of the clan, participation is the expectation, not to be a solo transient player that is inside a clan. You don't want to participate, then dont join a clan, or ask what their policy is on taking hiatus instead of clan hopping then getting pissy when you get the boot, or make your own clan. If it's a relaxed clan, chances are that if you have been participating and expressly tell the clan owner/regulator you won't be able to login for the next 3 months because of life, you won't be kicked.

Either way, why does it matter to you what clans do or not do? If you get kicked for a reason like no movement in equipment affinity, then find another clan that doesn't roll that type of draconian bullsh*t. It's your fault you even spent any time in clans where you don't agree with their rules. Like with pretty much everything of ownership, clan owners make their own rules and are the ones that make the decision about players, you don't have any kind of "right" to be in their clan and they don't need any reason to kick anyone. They can sweep clean their clans if they want and there's zip anyone can say about it. It's your fault, because these draconian-type of people are easy to spot, it was your choice to stay and deal with their sh*t to the point you are now generalizing that many do this.

 

Edited July 18, 2018 by nms.

[Kinky_Skeleton]

On 2018-06-16 at 1:17 PM, Thaylien said:

Well? Your point is that you can't gain XP on the frame until you reach the original value and exceed it, right?

Considering that Forma resets your frame to 0 in all ways except for this new polarity, doesn't this kind of make sense? It's your top 'score' with that frame, they aren't going to reset it to 0 and make it look like you've played 4.9% of your time in game with that frame and earned no XP with it, are they? No, what they're going to do is reset your XP count since that Forma, but then give you a record of where you were and make you climb back up to it again.

Maybe they could put in a little qualifier text like 'XP High Score' or similar, because that's all it really is, your high-score usage with that frame since you last Forma'd it. Maybe we could get a second line saying 'current XP' to match, which would show how close you are to it, but then once you beat that previous 'high score', they would be the same, so... it wouldn't be needed.

Thinking about it... that means that my total with Zephyr (considering I put an extra Forma on her when the Exilus slots were created) was 82,582,824. We can gain so much Affinity in this game that it's kind of silly...

If all this XP total is doing is measuring your 'best score' with that frame before you stuck a Forma on it, then just play that frame more and beat it.

I am gonna agree with this man here, it's not a state that should reset it's a high score kinda thing. The value shold reset to zero because like forming u are starting from scratch and have to work up again to reach/beat your high score. But another thing tho, even if it is supposed to work the way you say this isnt really a big thing that Desperately needs to be fixed rn now there were game stoping/crashing bugs, there are glitches that stop u from progressing certain quest and then there's the fact that says me frames and weapons could still use a rebalance even after the recently development work shop. There are some guns that require a really high MR but when u get them u realize "hey this sucks, and a matter of fact there is a gun that does this same thing for a lower MR and it does more damage" some weapons don't even get to shine as they are usually used as mastery farming and that's it. See what I'm getting at there are bigger problems than this Stat number chart and if u r basing players off of this. Then u should stop being such an asset then. Numbers are not every thing especially in that shish is game

[Kinky_Skeleton]

4 hours ago, nms. said:

What are you babbling on? Nice stereotyping there, solid evidence you bring on... You don't even know why he wants to keep his affinity numbers. With how easy it is in this game to earn affinity and gain MR by simply standing still, not sure you yourself understand the fallacy in that story of yours. I don't know who or what clan in your limited exposure hurt you but, you are stereotyping and blowing that out of proportion.

Yes, warframe is a game of numbers, it's a game of records, numbers are the only thing in this that can give people a sense of completion, progress and satisfaction. You are placing too much importance on your own view and yourself if you think people just go around swinging their profile stats onto anyone or onto you voluntarily without ask. The actual majority of players don't have time for it, or don't really have time or care to show it around randoms.

Anyone who has spent a couple hundred hours in this game will know for a fact that these cases of advanced players "sh*tting" on noobs left and right explaining something are rare. It's the opposite, they want to complete everything with the most efficiency and in the best way possible. They will not waste their time arguing about trivial crap, unless asked about. They want their time to count. Playing bookworm with noobs is a waste of time. There's more chance of getting an advanced player to sh*t on you by making him wait standing 1 meter away from extraction than by saying anything about the game that is not true, but the reality is, that player will simply ignore you to mark you and leave squad once the mission is done. You will get the eventual mouthblasting moron, but again, minority. Unless your insightful experience is region chat talk, which is majority idiots, regardless of hours played.

Let's be realistic, an actual genuine MR 2 (i.e new player not some alt account smurfer) can't explain jacksh*t about game mechanics aside bullet jump, because a true MR 2 will have 3-15 in mission hours, you only need to rank up like 4 pieces of equipment to make it to MR 2 from MR 0. That type of player probably doesn't know there's a wiki for the game either. You don't need to go that high in number, taking your own example, there's a incredibly high probability that an MR 6 player will be able to explain game mechanics better than an MR 2.

What are we talking here? You had 1 bad experience with some nerdo neckbeard clan owner and now you are preaching like the majority of competitive clans do this? Just by the word "competitive" it's obvious we are talking about a minority. Any shred of actual clan competitiveness that existed in this game died when dark sector and rails were removed.

There are also plenty of good clans that are competitive or non-competitive and give 0 f*cks about any of what you just said. Most on both sides typically have a simple requirement to not be AWOL for more than a specific set of weeks, yes, even non-competitive clans. This requirement is to keep up with resources and to keep up with event rewards for the clan. You go into a clan to be part of the clan, participation is the expectation, not to be a solo transient player that is inside a clan. You don't want to participate, then dont join a clan, or ask what their policy is on taking hiatus instead of clan hopping then getting pissy when you get the boot, or make your own clan. If it's a relaxed clan, chances are that if you have been participating and expressly tell the clan owner/regulator you won't be able to login for the next 3 months because of life, you won't be kicked.

Either way, why does it matter to you what clans do or not do? If you get kicked for a reason like no movement in equipment affinity, then find another clan that doesn't roll that type of draconian bullsh*t. It's your fault you even spent any time in clans where you don't agree with their rules. Like with pretty much everything of ownership, clan owners make their own rules and are the ones that make the decision about players, you don't have any kind of "right" to be in their clan and they don't need any reason to kick anyone. They can sweep clean their clans if they want and there's zip anyone can say about it. It's your fault, because these draconian-type of people are easy to spot, it was your choice to stay and deal with their sh*t to the point you are now generalizing that many do this.

 

As Of About the MR u can be someone who knows a lot about the game but have a low MR like 10-18. Why? because MR is based off of the weapons, frames, and nodes u have completed (only counting each up to one time) to shorten this up you can try and play many frames and weapons once u find a weapon u enjoy and can do endgame along with your favorite  warframes (like my cousin has done) ur MR won't even budge now because your just using and formaing the same weapon and warframe over and over and over again and since MR only counts the items u level up max only once ur MR just won't move so people judging others by there low MR don't even kow how MR works them selves. It's basically a number that says "yeah I use a lot of stuff"

[Voltage]

On 2018-06-16 at 2:17 PM, Thaylien said:

If all this XP total is doing is measuring your 'best score' with that frame before you stuck a Forma on it, then just play that frame more and beat it.

This is my Nova Prime and my Mission Time:

Based on 20.8% usage and 417,000,000 XP for the sake of easier math, I have played Nova Prime for roughly 752.75 hours or 31 days, 8 hours, 45 minutes, and 18 seconds. Please tell me how you can feasibly "beat that". I would have to gain roughly 553,969 XP per hour for 31 days of in mission time. Changing the statistic to "High Score" would be another possible solution, but items like Umbral mods which I would be able to fit with 2 more Forma to my Nova Prime would not be realistic to slot considering the Affinity progression I would lose.

I don't see the need to discuss what the meaning of this statistic is. The profile UI clearly states "XP". Why should this value reset when applying Forma? If it said high score, I would not have made this thread to begin with.

2 hours ago, brandonwaite69 said:

[...] this isnt really a big thing that Desperately needs to be fixed rn now there were game stoping/crashing bugs, there are glitches that stop u from progressing certain quest and then there's the fact that says me frames and weapons could still use a rebalance even after the recently development work shop. [...]

Please refer to this comment I made earlier:

On 2018-06-16 at 10:30 AM, --Q--Voltage said:

I am reporting this bug because numbers are meaningful to some players (like myself). This is a UI related bug that has been ongoing for years and I was compelled to report it in the appropriate section. Whether you feel it is meaningful or meaningless is irrelevant. Objectively, all bugs should be fixed.

It doesn't matter what this bug means to you. I understand many players find this meaningless, but that does not negate the fact that this is clearly a UI bug. I am just doing my job as a PC (Open Beta) Tester and reporting an issue I see within the game.

Edited July 19, 2018 by --Q--Voltage

[Birdframe_Prime]

4 hours ago, --Q--Voltage said:

but items like Umbral mods which I would be able to fit with 2 more Forma to my Nova Prime would not be realistic to slot considering the Affinity progression I would lose

Oh dear, this topics back... still, let's be fair.

My question to you is 'what are you actually losing'? You have a number next to your frame, it does not relate to anything. I mean, it literally doesn't... This isn't like XP Gain relating to a level up, or gain relating to your ability to perform anything in the game.

It's literally a distance measure that shows the most Affinity you've ever gained with that frame between Forma applications. There is no importance attached to this. Ever. Never has been.

4 hours ago, --Q--Voltage said:

I don't see the need to discuss what the meaning of this statistic is. The profile UI clearly states "XP". Why should this value reset when applying Forma? If it said high score, I would not have made this thread to begin with.

You're countering yourself though. The profile says XP, and the mechanic for Warframe is that everything resets with Forma, and so your XP counter (because you clearly have progressed with that frame) doesn't reset to 0 due to... we don't know...

But you're countering yourself because you say you don't see the meaning of discussing this statistic, coupled with the statement that if you'd known what this statistic meant you wouldn't have made the thread... So we told you what it meant, and what it means is... that if you'd known this before you wouldn't have said anything?

I agree, the statistic could be clearer. I'm with you 100% on that.

But it doesn't actually have any relevance. It's a nothing stat. And worrying about it to the point of starting circular discussions about not wanting to know what it means when the thread is to find out what the stat means... is just kind of silly.

[.Yes]

9 hours ago, Thaylien said:

Oh dear, this topics back... still, let's be fair.

My question to you is 'what are you actually losing'? You have a number next to your frame, it does not relate to anything. I mean, it literally doesn't... This isn't like XP Gain relating to a level up, or gain relating to your ability to perform anything in the game.

It's literally a distance measure that shows the most Affinity you've ever gained with that frame between Forma applications. There is no importance attached to this. Ever. Never has been.

You're countering yourself though. The profile says XP, and the mechanic for Warframe is that everything resets with Forma, and so your XP counter (because you clearly have progressed with that frame) doesn't reset to 0 due to... we don't know...

But you're countering yourself because you say you don't see the meaning of discussing this statistic, coupled with the statement that if you'd known what this statistic meant you wouldn't have made the thread... So we told you what it meant, and what it means is... that if you'd known this before you wouldn't have said anything?

I agree, the statistic could be clearer. I'm with you 100% on that.

But it doesn't actually have any relevance. It's a nothing stat. And worrying about it to the point of starting circular discussions about not wanting to know what it means when the thread is to find out what the stat means... is just kind of silly.

Delegitimising a topic or thread because you personally do not see worth in it is incoherent and messy. OP clearly sees something that does not work properly and is doing their best to bring it up to DE so that a solution can come to this. If there is no given meaning to those numbers to you personally, or by DE, then the player can tag a meaning to it. That amount of affinity on my favourite warframe shows my dedication, and love of playstyle that it brings. 

It was never about 'what OP was losing' its about OP finding a bug, and bringing attention to it in the appropriate forum. If you do not understand the significance to threads like this, please feel free to ask rather than to attempt (poorly) to deconstruct a feedback post, thank you.

[Birdframe_Prime]

50 minutes ago, --Q--Phanini said:

OP clearly sees something that does not work properly and is doing their best to bring it up to DE so that a solution can come to this.

I'm trying to avoid further debate, and only replying because I was directly quoted, because we already explained that it is, for the little purpose it has, working properly.

The answer to the thread was:

• It's not bugged
• It's supposed to do that
• [Explanation of why]

But the response to that was a circular contradiction, basically saying that if OP had known this was what it was doing and why, they wouldn't have made the thread, except that they didn't actually want to discuss the 'why' part.

When a clear answer and explanation is given, only to be responded to with the equivalent of 'well I think it's a bug no matter what you say'... That's when the thread should end because it's clear that the person that began the thread won't accept an opinion other than their own.