Remove Fast? No, Give Us A Reason To Go Slow Instead!

[Datareaper]

So a lot of people want speed running and rushing to be basically removed from the game.  But a great many people enjoy that aspect of the game, and higher skilled player realize the benefit to just rushing a level with minimal clearing because its not generally worth the effort to kill everything you see.  But newer players and players who enjoy exploration and resource gathering despise that behavior, also a game about ninjas who don't kill anyone and just run past enemies is silly.

 

So heres what I propose to fix this problem.

Introduce two new chests\crates\boxes that are locked.  The only way to open them is by looting a key from elite\heavy type enemies.  The chance will start off low but build with each kill you get until the key drops.  Then you can go back to the chest and open it for loot.

BLUE CHEST : Credits, Uncommon mods, Fusion Cores, Resources and tier 1 void keys

RED CHEST : Individual weapon skins (camo or patterns), Alt Helmet Blueprints, Holographic badges, Rare Resources, Resources, Credits, Rare mods and Cores and tier 2 or 3 void keys

BLACK CHEST : Orokin Reactor Blueprints, Orokin Catalyst Blueprints, Forma Blueprints, Aura and Nightmare mods.

A usually chests loot would be Resources + Credits + Mod (uncommon or rare) and the Big reward (Camo skins or Blueprints) all at once.  It's a treasure chest after all!

 

Now lets say a level will usually have couple of blue chests, and a 20% chance one of them could be a red chest, and a 5% chance one could be a black chest.  And your chances to get red and black chests would be further diminished by running the same mission over and over, encouraging you to play all over the game to maximize your treasure hunting.

Another thing I suggest would be to reduce the chance or flat out remove the ability to find red and black chests for sub level 30 content.  Everything before level 30 is too easy in my opinion.

 

Some of the loot I suggested doesn't actually exist really yet.  Namely things like holographic badges and weapon skins.  But its pretty straight forward and would encourage a lot of hunting and playing to acquire all of such things.  Like running Grineer missions so you could loot a camo skin for your ogris or vipers, corpus missions for a supra camo skin.  Holographic badges would be things like a Grineer faceplate with a bullet hole in it or other neat emblems like that.

If DE ever makes more cosmetic slots on a Warframe these chests would be a great way to scatter them around in the game to be hunted for.

And finally all of these things could be available on the store for the players without the time to hunt and farm for them.

 

What this does is it gives a reason for any player to go back to killing everything they see and the game is once more about combat and not rushing.  Rushing will have its place still I imagine.  But when a Loki going FAST through a mission sees a black chest hes going to stop what hes doing and destroy everything he can find to get a key for it.  And thats awesome.

Edited August 19, 2013 by Datareaper

[Ditsydoo]

I like it, a carrot vs a stick approach with more carrot and less stick. Though the diminishing returns sound good and keys are also nice not just dropping as a mission reward but as a reason to go slow and kill everything on site.Also have the keys be able to be saved like void keys so that if the mission your in does not have a chest you can save it for the next and so on.

Adding to your idea why not have a boss carry black keys, same rule of diminishing returns for keys every time it drops so in discourages farming the same boss to often. As well as having the bonus of giving the player reasons to fight said bosses other then frames and rare loot drops.

[SoanoS]

Hmm. Giving out blueprints would stop people doing the alerts completely and rob DE from their only source of revenue, which effectively would just kill the whole game off in a month.

 

I'd rather suggest those chests containing 1,2 or 3 units of those rare materials for the system and a large amount of credits and maybe *one* mod. This would be enough incentive for the players to look around for the key. Of course, the key drop would have to be random chance, and no more than one key set per mission, and maybe not dropping the key at all. And of course, the chest would have to have one to three keys as well (depending on the chest/locker tier), which would give players an incentive to explore the whole level.

 

However, the basic idea is good, might be something worth exploring in future updates?

Edited August 19, 2013 by SoanoS

[Datareaper]

Adding to your idea why not have a boss carry black keys, same rule of diminishing returns for keys every time it drops so in discourages farming the same boss to often. As well as having the bonus of giving the player reasons to fight said bosses other then frames and rare loot drops.

That is an excellent idea.

 

Hmm. Giving out blueprints would stop people doing the alerts completely and rob DE from their only source of revenue, which effectively would just kill the whole game off in a month.

 

I'd rather suggest those chests containing 1,2 or 3 units of those rare materials for the system and a large amount of credits and maybe *one* mod. This would be enough incentive for the players to look around for the key. Of course, the key drop would have to be random chance, and no more than one key set per mission, and maybe not dropping the key at all. And of course, the chest would have to have one to three keys as well (depending on the chest/locker tier), which would give players an incentive to explore the whole level.

 

However, the basic idea is good, might be something worth exploring in future updates?

 

How on earth do alerts generate revenue for DE, that literally makes no sense to me.  If anything they hurt sales because you can obtain reactors and cosmetics from them instead of the store.

One in ten missions containing a red chest with a possibility of having a cosmetic skin in it is actually a lower chance than getting one from an alert during the day.  The difference is instead of waiting for an alert you are playing the game and hunting for loot, taking an active part in it.

Just having materials in chests is boring and wouldn't encourage people to even bother with it.  A good majority of the game has most of the weapons and frames they want and are stockpiling resources, I know I am.  The appealing part would be the extra rare loot like what I suggested.  Credits are virtually useless as many players have millions upon millions of credits and nothing to spend them on.

 

I also was vague about key drops,  I was implying the key that matches a chest would EVENTUALLY drop during a mission, but you wouldn't be able to carry them with you to other missions.  Think like keys from Descent or Doom.

[Utgarda_Loki]

Hmm. Giving out blueprints would stop people doing the alerts completely and rob DE from their only source of revenue, which effectively would just kill the whole game off in a month.

 

 

I agree: If the chests dropped the same blueprints that you get from alerts. however, as DE adds new weapons regularly, they could spread the blueprints across the chests and alerts. this could allow them to add a staggered level to the rarity of some blueprints, which would in turn give people more of a reason to explore and play alert, which would in turn entice the player to spend money to make their invested time more enjoyable.  

 

Edit: on second thought I'm not sure how alerts gain DE income either. 

Edited August 19, 2013 by Utgarda_Loki

[susrrys]

I'd rather suggest those chests containing 1,2 or 3 units of those rare materials for the system and a large amount of credits and maybe *one* mod. 

 

No one who has been played for more than a month would stop going fast for that. Stockpiling resources is easy especially since the drop rate increases, credits are very easy to come by nowadays, and one mod is not enough to make a rusher stop.

[RAVVSlathotep]

Totally agree. You shouldn't force people to play the game the way you want, you should encourage them to try out other play styles through meaningful rewards.

You should make the key drops more common but the chests more rare. Finding a black chest and running out of enemies in the map without finding a key would be a surefire way to get people to piss in your carpet.

Also, you should make the maps way larger so that finding the chest would be a challenge. And maybe have the key appear on top of pipes in the ceiling so people would have to comb each tileset carefully. A real scavenger hunt with great rewards.

Hmm. Giving out blueprints would stop people doing the alerts completely and rob DE from their only source of revenue, which effectively would just kill the whole game off in a month.

 

I'd rather suggest those chests containing 1,2 or 3 units of those rare materials for the system and a large amount of credits and maybe *one* mod. This would be enough incentive for the players to look around for the key. Of course, the key drop would have to be random chance, and no more than one key set per mission, and maybe not dropping the key at all. And of course, the chest would have to have one to three keys as well (depending on the chest/locker tier), which would give players an incentive to explore the whole level.

 

However, the basic idea is good, might be something worth exploring in future updates?

A difficult scavenger hunt wouldn't be an efficient method to farm rares and nobody cares about credits, there are no credit sinks. One random mod is nothing, the reward has to be meaningful. Horrible idea, not worth bothering with.

[CubedOobleck]

The basic idea is nice, maybe simplify it a bit, there's no need for 3 different kinds of chests for example and some rewards you listed there are unreasonable 

[RAVVSlathotep]

I like this idea, but disagree that red/black chests should be unavailable below level 30.

 

We don't need more things to turn off newbies/lower level players. Instead, those black chests should contain less rare mods, with higher level chests giving rarer, more powerful mods.

What we don't need is more people stopping at low levels because there isn't enough end game. We shouldn't encourage people to stay low, most weapons are already mastery rank 0. New friends aren't better than old friends, the game is easy enough as it is for the new people.

This idea would encourage players to play the game instead of waiting for an alert and only dropping in when they see what they want, which is never.

[SoanoS]

Datareaper, answer to your question:

 

The alerts are there to give "free" players a chance at getting something they cannot afford to buy, while still keeping it relatively rare. If people just knew there was no possible way to get those blueprints and other goodies aside from paying up, a lot of them would just lose interest and leave. So it keeps them playing the game and their interest up. Interested players are more likely to spend money on platinum as well for warframe and weapon slots.

[susrrys]

Interested players are more likely to spend money on platinum as well for warframe and weapon slots.

 

Anyone who plays warframe for a long period of time will end up buying plat for slots. Anyone who plays for a long period of time and is impatient will spend plat on anything else. This will not really be a reliable way of getting potatoes, but it will give people a reason to play the game rather than watch alerts and only play when something they want shows up. 

[Destro6677]

What we don't need is more people stopping at low levels because there isn't enough end game. We shouldn't encourage people to stay low, most weapons are already mastery rank 0. New friends aren't better than old friends, the game is easy enough as it is for the new people.

This idea would encourage players to play the game instead of waiting for an alert and only dropping in when they see what they want, which is never.

Let me ask you Ravv, what would be a better incentive for you to play and explore as a new player?

 

1. I need to quickly level up, because if I don't get to level 30 missions, I won't get all those mods. Hmm, wait, to get to level 30 missions, I'm going to need to farm for so many hours because the RNG isn't great.. Sighs. I think I'll pick warframe up some other time while I go play a lil pvp.

 

2. Wow, a black chest! I'll absolutely have to go kill everything now! I can't wait to get some rarer mods! Then, I can go tackle level 30 missions which will get me better mods!

 

See what I mean?

[Datareaper]

I like this idea, but disagree that red/black chests should be unavailable below level 30.

 

We don't need more things to turn off newbies/lower level players. Instead, those black chests should contain less rare mods, with higher level chests giving rarer, more powerful mods.

No, if anything we need more discouragement from farming low level crap.  It's not challenging or fun and shouldn't be rewarded beyond showing a friend the ropes and being their bodyguard.

Making red and black chests available at higher levels is a pretty damn good incentive to get strong enough to hunt for them.

 

The basic idea is nice, maybe simplify it a bit, there's no need for 3 different kinds of chests for example and some rewards you listed there are unreasonable 

Unreasonable how.  One in twenty missions might net you a Orokin catalyst or reactor.  That could be an hour or two or clearing missions at breakneck pace.

[Marabitos]

Love it. It leans a bit far towards the RPG end of things (possibly too far for some people that want this to be a PvP shooter...morons...). It would definitely add some depth to things and push people to clear out a zone rather than rush through it in under 2 mins. I may play with a fast frame, but I enjoy combat still. If I didnt want to kill things Id go play The Sims. I might hang myself if I played that game... My life is boring but not that bad :P

[Jefftiffy]

I will have to say I like the idea and I don't care about how many credits they give you. I am working on getting Frost Prime as my second Warframe and I have over 450k credits even with donating to my clan's dojo and constantly building stuff in the foundry just to have it for later. Modding is the biggest drain on it but I never get enough mods to make a major dent on my pocket.

[RAVVSlathotep]

Datareaper, answer to your question:

 

The alerts are there to give "free" players a chance at getting something they cannot afford to buy, while still keeping it relatively rare. If people just knew there was no possible way to get those blueprints and other goodies aside from paying up, a lot of them would just lose interest and leave. So it keeps them playing the game and their interest up. Interested players are more likely to spend money on platinum as well for warframe and weapon slots.

What the hell are you talking about? A random chance at a potato each month (depending on whether or not you sleep) is how you piss people off.

The horrible alert system is what's killing the game alongside DE wanting to force people to all play the same way. People are only interested in an alert if they are already interested in the gameplay itself and chances are that most people who get to clan tech mastery rank have gotten platinum in one way or another beforehand and most have never gotten a forma or potato from the alert system outside the livestream ones.

Those who pay do it because they like the game, not because of the chance at getting a forma alert per month while they're asleep.

It's people like you that are killing the game slowly by convincing DE that the alert system is a-ok and cosmetics are not profitable.

[Datareaper]

I will have to say I like the idea and I don't care about how many credits they give you. I am working on getting Frost Prime as my second Warframe and I have over 450k credits even with donating to my clan's dojo and constantly building stuff in the foundry just to have it for later. Modding is the biggest drain on it but I never get enough mods to make a major dent on my pocket.

A good treasure chest should always vomit out gold in addition to the real loot.  It's like the filler.

[RAVVSlathotep]

Let me ask you Ravv, what would be a better incentive for you to play and explore as a new player?

 

1. I need to quickly level up, because if I don't get to level 30 missions, I won't get all those mods. Hmm, wait, to get to level 30 missions, I'm going to need to farm for so many hours because the RNG isn't great.. Sighs. I think I'll pick warframe up some other time while I go play a lil pvp.

 

2. Wow, a black chest! I'll absolutely have to go kill everything now! I can't wait to get some rarer mods! Then, I can go tackle level 30 missions which will get me better mods!

 

See what I mean?

While I understand your point of view, that would only make old players farm easy missions for the chests. Also, I completed my star map in less than 5 days. The fourth planet out of fourteen in the system is 30+ already.

There is no excuse for them to not have 3 planets completed in the first couple of days. Also, the things inside the chest would be endgame material, not newtrash. You don't give potatoes to someone who doesn't know how to play the game, they might end up potatoing their mk1 braton

[Destro6677]

Sorry Reaper, I accidentally skimmed through your post and missed the part about mods being included in blue chests. I assumed that blues would drop credits and mats.

Re-reading it, I agree with you that Blacks with their high-end drops should be at level 30 and above.

Yes, Ravv, that was my mistake in not reading Reaper's post carefully that the blues already do drop mods.

However, from a business point of view, I don't see how giving away weapon skins would work in the devs favor. Cosmetics are the only thing unobtainable in most f2p games without payment of real money.

As for alerts, I completely agree that they reward a person for being in the right place at the right time, and that alt helmets and other goodies should have a chance to show up in-game.

Edited August 19, 2013 by Destro6677

[RAVVSlathotep]

Sorry Reaper, I accidentally skimmed through your post and missed the part about mods being included in blue chests. I assumed that blues would drop credits and mats.

Re-reading it, I agree with you that Blacks with their high-end drops should be at level 30 and above.

Yes, Ravv, that was my mistake in not reading Reaper's post carefully that the blues already do drop mods.

However, from a business point of view, I don't see how giving away weapon skins would work in the devs favor. Cosmetics are the only thing unobtainable in most f2p games without payment of real money.

As for alerts, I completely agree that they reward a person for being in the right place at the right time, and that alt helmets and other goodies should have a chance to show up in-game.

Cosmetics should be rewarded to people with enough dedication, but I see your point. I guess I can agree with that.

[Datareaper]

The difference between undermining alerts and what I'm suggesting is that I'm suggesting things like individual camo skins and holo badges be added to the pool of loot  on top of cosmetic helmets.  This actually encourages more market use for players with extra money to spend or not enough time to hunt for chests.  Right now a lot of people I know just wait around for a reactor alert and the small pool of cosmetic helmets that everyone has by now.

[Khaos_Zand3r]

Yes please! Also, put the possibility of these chests as being highest in the secret rooms, so that secret rooms are actually worth going to.

[LocoWithGun]

You realize that people will find a way to rush this system too, right?

[Brimir]

I dunno.

 

Artifically keeping people moving at snail's pace might annoy people.

[RAVVSlathotep]

I dunno.

 

Artifically keeping people moving at snail's pace might annoy people.

But they already do that with double doors and having to wait for slows to stop being idiots and get sh*t done