(Possible Spoilers) Canonically, is there only one of each Prime warframe, or are the Tenno finally mass producing Orokin tech to create more?

[ZodiacShinryu]

2 hours ago, TARINunit9 said:

No, it really, really isn't. That was Sylvania's Titania. She knew it, she recognized it, she regretted hating it after she watched it die. And when we build it back up, it was a non-prime

She describes what is happening in the battle long before she says it is (a) Titania. She knew it was Titania as she had worked to create what she is but she doesn't ever say she recognizes that particular one.

She says, "When the Orokin found out what I had done here, they sent their Dax upon the great trees. Upon me. As the skies grew hot and my roots split into cinder, I let out a deep earthen scream. I was dying, and then sudden I felt a familiar presence… One by one, the mighty Dax began to fall, swatting hopelessly at some unseen menace. Others were snared, drifting upward in mesmerizing light and then, all at once, shredded by that unseen force. When the fires subsided, I knew what it was. Titania. My shamed creation. I felt her beating wings through my branches. I felt her mortal wounds, her weeping burns as she fell beneath my canopy. And so it was here, within this grove, she died to save me. Me, the one who had hated her most."

Honestly if it wasn't for "mesmerizing light" I would've been more inclined to say Silvana can't "see" at all, though registering light density isn't outside a plant's capabilities. It is almost all inferred description; she even confuses you as Titania (as you being similar) until you give her the last apothic. She also says, "You, you fight with the same determination as she did"; perhaps we can infer that a Tenno was controlling her then as well. However she uses "unseen" a lot then only describes feelings of realization.

Also "Titania. My shamed creation." is vague; is she referring to the actual being, or is she being nostalgic of her work? Your Titania isn't my Titania but they are both her creation (at a basal level) and it is not like the details between the Primes and Defaults are so different that you wouldn't recognize them as the same base being. She being apart of the Warframe Project knows what eventually happens to the warframes. She knew they were weapons, there would have been others to this point. In fact in the lore she mentions, "Titania is the next Warframe I've been commanded to build..." so we can assume that she has worked on others not that we know which ones.

What I am saying is I can certainly believe your theory as a possibility but you can't prove it as the truth. Especially when the Titania that came to save her wasn't with her to begin with that she herself implied; any number of variations could have been made at that point even if that our default version was there at the end. You are also one of the only people I have ever seen suggest this out of the chorus of people throwing out their ideas on the entirety of Warframe lore. So using your quote...

3 hours ago, TARINunit9 said:

Unless the devs confirm that, Silvana recognized her "Original Titania". End of discussion as far as I am concerned

*changes in bold

[Unus]

9 hours ago, TennoSeeker said:

I've been thinking about this a lot lately. After the revelations of The Sacrifice, I've been wondering if each of the Prime warframes are unique individuals, and there are only one of each within the canon. If not, are the Tenno mass producing them now, or what?

I really hope that there are multiple instances of the Prime frames, as that would make them feel more personal to me.

As far as I can tell, the production story goes a little something like this. (Bare with me, my memory can be shot with holes at times, but, they can be repaired.)

 

1. Pre-Warframe suits, originating from Pre-Plague documents, are made for "artificial soldier" production that turn out to be nothing more then flesh-rending horrors, prototypes of prototypes which exist only to consume.

2. Project is mothballed and the abominations are kept imprisoned.

3. Time passes.

4. The Zariman Ten-Zero incident occurs.

5. The children go under Marghulis' care and begin having Void-Incidents.

6. During an outbreak where a primeval rhino suit had broken loose, one of the children accidentally hijacks it's mind and creates the first Tenno transference link.

7. David's work on the rejects allows them to repurpose the production lines into producing "therapy avatars" such as the proto-volt, through which the children may channel excess energies without brutally murdering others without purpose.

8. Time passes.

9. The Sentient War erupts and the 7 Executors, recognizing the usefulness in the by-proxy powers of the children, guides the teachings and gifts of the Tenno toward more martial purposes.

10. Marghulis begins to protest the use of the children.

11. The first batches of Warframes come off the lines, all are at the prime of Orokin technology and several of are "corner-cut" models by way of being infected volunteers or abductees who's body's are used as a scaffold by which the suit's other components can be quick-grown and implanted into and onto.

12. Marghulis is illuminated by the Jade Light.

13. As War progresses and the Sentient fleet inflicts crippleing blows, prime production begins to become crippleingly slow even with the quantum blueprinting process, forceing  Orokin engineers to resort to substandard faster growing, cheaper, and less Orokin-tech-base requiring suits.

14. By sheer Tenno power in addition to throwing millions of humans and thousands of Dax at the problem, the Orokin survive amongst the crumbleing architecture and ravaging cities.

15. The Orokin order a celebratory victory festival of sorts in one of their untouched cities on Mercury.

16. The Tenno kill off every last Orokin in attendance, sympathetic or otherwise, erasing all genetic unlock codes for stable production of Primes from existence and leaveing only the faulty ghost-echos of the quantum blueprints as the last source of primes.

Addendum= Interspersed between all these post Marghulian Jade-Lighting is "Ballas engages in horrifyingly elaborate revenge porn against everyone who has ever wronged him and their children's children's children, sireing the "passion project" Umbral Mistakes in the process.

 

So, basically? I beleive that, at some point, there was an Operator for each suit-line was based around how and what they focused their Void energy into and how their mind worked, but, I do not beleive there was an ultra-upgraded "first model". Just an Operator who's mind "clicked" quite well in a certain style. Could almost think of each Warframe suit as a "personality type" from a Meier's/ Briggs' test.

 

Oof, sorry folks, just can't stop jawin.

[SilentMobius]

9 hours ago, TennoSeeker said:

I've been thinking about this a lot lately. After the revelations of The Sacrifice, I've been wondering if each of the Prime warframes are unique individuals, and there are only one of each within the canon. If not, are the Tenno mass producing them now, or what?

I really hope that there are multiple instances of the Prime frames, as that would make them feel more personal to me.

Regardless of how the original Primes were made (From the Sacrifice we can only assume what was said in the Virtuvian applies)

However.

Tenno build all our 'Frames, so whatever happened to create those blueprints, after that point we build them in our orbiter.

[TARINunit9]

9 hours ago, ZodiacShinryu said:

She describes what is happening in the battle long before she says it is (a) Titania. She knew it was Titania as she had worked to create what she is but she doesn't ever say she recognizes that particular one.

-snip-

Also "Titania. My shamed creation." is vague

Dude, you accuse me of trying to change the narrative to fit my headcanon, then you try and split hairs to that exact and insane a degree?!

[ZodiacShinryu]

5 hours ago, TARINunit9 said:

Dude, you accuse me of trying to change the narrative to fit my headcanon, then you try and split hairs to that exact and insane a degree?!

But I am not changing the narrative, I am simply looking at the possibilities. I am not the one trying to prove something with information hinging mostly from this one quest. I am contesting your theory because your overall theory relies so much on it and it has run counter to the current prevailing theory (like I said you are one of the extremely few people that has suggested that order, and a follow community lore fairly closely). I have said it like 3 or 4 times now, I don't have to be right, the "Prime first" doesn't have to be right but without supporting evidence it doesn't mean much in any case. There is still plenty of blank spots in our Warframe Project knowledge, we only have tangible information on (a single) Umbra which we can extend on conjecture. Of which Excalibur Umbra came out more "Prime" (a term the Orokin and Ballas likely wouldn't have used anyway) than any of our defaults and Ballas certainly wasn't doing that out of Pride or Punishment.

And you say split hairs but I wasn't even stretching for that meaning. We know all different kinds of variations of frames existed during the Orokin Era (the forest guardian specters prove that enough) and she being part of the Project would know that very well. And you don't need to look far into US Law to find people that treat whole brands/styles/works as their creation whether the courts side with them or the "offshoot brands". She took considerable time of her work in the basis of what Titania is no matter what she would inevitably look like. No matter what she was responsible for her "creation" in the first place.

Your interpretation makes for a touching sympathetic story if it is that straightforward (and it could be) but we have a time period that is unaccounted for and other circumstances what would make a difference. As such we diverge.

[TARINunit9]

(OK, let's see if I can do this without getting hostile)

2 minutes ago, ZodiacShinryu said:

I am not the one trying to prove something with information hinging mostly from this one quest.

If we want to get technical, the "Prime first" status quo isn't even in the game unlike the Titania quest. It was implied by the devs outside of the game, quite a long time before the Titania quest. That would normally constitute hard evidence (what TvTropes calls "Word of God"), which is why I would like to ask the devs to just settle this for us in the next devstream

4 minutes ago, ZodiacShinryu said:

Your interpretation makes for a touching sympathetic story if it is that straightforward (and it could be) but we have a time period that is unaccounted for and other circumstances what would make a difference. As such we diverge.

Thank you, that calmed me down quickly. I was ready to blast you over specks and planks in each other's eyeballs, but at least now I know you understand my platform as much as I understand yours