Spores w/ multiple Saryns is crap.

[TironStarstryker]

I see this a lot pubbing ESO with my Saryn Prime (who is my only good killframe atm):  If there's another Saryn in the group, our spores end up COMPETING for the three spreadable spores spots per enemy.  This results in a lot of shut-downs on BOTH sets of spores unless one of us backs way off, limiting both of our effectiveness rather severely.

There really needs to be some kind of tweak to make the spores work more cooperatively.  Maybe if it tries to spread to an enemy that already has 3 from a different saryn, it 'takes over' one of the slots (not all, just 1) instead of getting completely locked out, allowing both sets of spores to continue to spread without blocking each other.

[(PSN)Kairu_Aname]

Not saying anything is bad about your suggestion. Just my input on the matter.

I personally don't mind them not mixing well. It sort of prevents more than 1 saryn in a group. I see why you want it changed, but damn if DE will ever listen to saryn mains (spread on death)

[peterc3]

I could swear Saryn has 3 other abilities and usually you have weapons with you. Must be another game I'm thinking of.

[Misgenesis]

You can contribute by casting Miasma which is buffed massively by Spores and helps spread them too. Having more than one Saryn isnt hurting their effectiveness when they can benefit from each other.

[(PSN)Ozymandias-13-]

Addiction to watching your numbers climb is literally the only problem. 

Every ability you have benefits and is enhanced by Spores. You can still completely contribute. This issue exists with multiples of many frames in the game. That's no reason to change it when the current setup encourages team work between them.

A reason to change it would be that spores with multiple players on the team is crap.

[TironStarstryker]

Well, the problem isn't with pre-existing groups, it's with pubs.  *Lots* of people use Saryn Prime in ESO, and I've got NO way to control what I get matched with when I pub it for Liths or MR.  If there's a second Saryn, the main, iconic ability of the frame just... goes away.  And while I can think of other examples of multiples of a frame not overlapping well, I can't think of another that just gets the door completely slammed like that.

I thought of several other ways to make it cooperate better, but decided on that one because it doesn't make multiple saryns increase the overall spores damage.  You still get penalized for having multiple, just... less frustratingly.

And with two Saryns, even just using miasma gets harder, because 1.) The other Saryn is doing it too, possibly killing them off before you can fire, and 2.) You don't get the 3D locational feedback of seeing the damage from the spores tick off.  Meaning you have to rely on either line-of-sight (Despite miasmia going through... everything) or the 2D minimap radar to target it.

So I end up running around with Toxic lash, occasionally using a miasma when I can find a group that a volt or the other saryn hasn't already nuked.

Edited July 4, 2018 by TironStarstryker

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

You can't seem to build them up? Just don't.

Present spores equals a free damage buff to Miasama and builds up corrusion. Using lash popps and spreads them, no matter if it's yours and that you spend time and energy on other things then micro-managing them leads to better results for both.

I find it fun and heartbreaking at the same time when i see that people rather compete and lower both theyr results instead of working together to a better end.

Edited July 5, 2018 by (PS4)CoolD2108

[TironStarstryker]

Oh I agree.  Problem is, *every single other Saryn* I run into does it and I'm *always* the one that has to concede, and it's frustrating.  Especially as I literally only use Saryn for ESO and prefer Nyx for... most everything else.

Sometimes I'll try to create a 'hybrid spores' plague by throwing mine on one that already has theirs, and trying to get it to spread a 2-1 like in my suggestion... occasionally it works, temporarily, but it's difficult to set up and prone to getting killed off by the other guy continuing to spread his own independently.

Edited July 4, 2018 by TironStarstryker

[MasaJin]

Does no one know that all of saryn's abilities do not work on other saryn's spores? Lash doesnt pop spores unless ur aiming at them which is what everyone has to do and miasma doesnt even spread them frames can work together ember boosting fire damg frost freezeing but with saryn she literally can't do anything with a twin in the group

[IceColdHawk]

8 hours ago, peterc3 said:

I could swear Saryn has 3 other abilities and usually you have weapons with you. Must be another game I'm thinking of.

How is that any argument on spores and how they work in cooperation with others? Maybe you should start reading and understanding threads first before posting unwanted and false sarcasm.

Edited July 5, 2018 by IceColdHawk

[TironStarstryker]

3 hours ago, IceColdHawk said:

How is that any argument on spores and how they work in cooperation with others? Maybe you should start reading and understanding threads first before posting unwanted and false sarcasm.

It's an indirect attack on the premise, basically implying that spores being crippled is irrelevant when there's still so many other things you can do.

Which would be a decent point, if she wasn't pretty much based around that one ability.  (and the second ability is a decoy, which is hardly a replacement.)

Edited July 5, 2018 by TironStarstryker

[IceColdHawk]

8 hours ago, TironStarstryker said:

It's an indirect attack on the premise, basically implying that spores being crippled is irrelevant when there's still so many other things you can do.

Which would be a decent point, if she wasn't pretty much based around that one ability.  (and the second ability is a decoy, which is hardly a replacement.)

No, it's never a "decent point" to say "Well that frame has 1 useless ability but the rest is good so it's fine!". If there is something useless or not working as it should, then it needs to be pointed out and eventually fixed/reworked.

Well i wouldn't say spores are useless but as you said, they currently don't really work well together with other saryns. That's an issue that can be brought to attention to the devs for them to take another look at it in terms of coop gameplay. I see no reason why you have to shoot down threads that only suggest healthy stuff with non-arguments like "Rest is fine so deal with it.". It's like telling you to play a different frame. Nonsense.

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

vor 13 Stunden schrieb MasaJin:

Does no one know that all of saryn's abilities do not work on other saryn's spores? Lash doesnt pop spores unless ur aiming at them which is what everyone has to do and miasma doesnt even spread them frames can work together ember boosting fire damg frost freezeing but with saryn she literally can't do anything with a twin in the group

Worked fine the last time i tried it with melee. Should it really not, isn't that to be considered a bug?

Instead of adressing it as one and aiming for a fix all i've seen are people using it as an excuse to drive this spore per saryn agenda...to basicly quadruple her sheer aoe potential if you're using nothing but saryns. To be fair, this thread isn't one of those but it would probably lower the aoe potential, what isn't exactly a solution eather.

Shouldn't we try to, idk, aim for a fix to what she was balanced around at this point?

Edited July 5, 2018 by (PS4)CoolD2108

[Prof.549]

Tl;dr

"This bad other Saryn is stealing my numbers, help DE  And no, i will only use one ability, you wont force me to play as you, DE, wants! #freedomfighters "

[MasaJin]

4 hours ago, (PS4)CoolD2108 said:

Worked fine the last time i tried it with melee. Should it really not, isn't that to be considered a bug?

Instead of adressing it as one and aiming for a fix all i've seen are people using it as an excuse to drive this spore per saryn agenda...to basicly quadruple her sheer aoe potential if you're using nothing but saryns. To be fair, this thread isn't one of those but it would probably lower the aoe potential, what isn't exactly a solution eather.

Shouldn't we try to, idk, aim for a fix to what she was balanced around at this point?

Melee in general just pops spores i personally would be fine to help another saryn spread spores if i could pop them like my own kill numbers aren't my concern 

I just wish squadies had a easier time helping the spores spread rather than wiping em out

[Cibyllae]

 

On 2018-05-31 at 5:21 PM, Cibyllae said:

https://twitter.com/PabloPoon

[TironStarstryker]

Two problems with that quote.

First, the 'hard cap' for spores on a single enemy is TWELVE. 

The 'three spores per enemy' is on spores that are automatically spread by the death of an enemy or the spore being 'popped'.

Second, it doesn't at all address my suggestion, as it's pretty clear the *only* idea he had for making multiple Saryns work was to allow more than 3 spread-spores on a single target, which I specifically did NOT suggest as I thought it would be too powerful and encourage all-saryn teams.

What I DID suggest was keeping the limit of 3 spread spores per target, but allowing one to be REPLACED, so that there are 2 of the original spores and 1 of the second Saryn's.  This would allow 2 or 3 saryns (but not four) to not bash into each other.

And just to be clear, I am actively looking for another killframe to use in ESO *exclusively because of this issue*.  I am fully intending to stop using Saryn ENTIRELY as soon as I get an alternative, because there's too many frakking Saryns running ESO and no way to avoid them other than leaving matches.