Dear DE PLEASE put Auction House in game

[Marvelous_A]

4 hours ago, SqualZell said:

you are looking at it from the high ticket items, instead look at it from the 1-2 plat items... right now they are not worth the trouble to sell them so people throw them in for ducats instead. if we had an auction house, i would be throwing my 50+ trash prime parts in there for 1-2 plat each... and boom i just made myself 50plat. right now as it stands that 50 plat I would simply not have unless i buy from DE

 

also you said more transactions which is correct, also with more transactions = more competition = lower prices = people buy less from DE to afford items now

 

Edit: Basically, AH is good for us bad for DE.

Did you just assume you're the only seller in this game? Currently there are tons of sellers on WM willing to sell stuff in ridiculously low price already. If it goes automatic? GL for you.

Edited July 16, 2018 by Marvelous_A

[Marvelous_A]

2 hours ago, (PS4)Hiero_Glyph said:

So basically no one in this thread has a clue about economics or how governments earn revenue. The answer is taxes. If DE added a way to increase the number of transactions but imposed a plat seller's tax they would make so much in plat sales since they would be removing platinum from the market based on volume. Making it easier to trade would be a huge boon for DE since they are removing plat from the game every time a sale occurs.

Even if the tax was 5% DE would earn 1p on every 20p sold. If DE put a minimum tax of 1p on every transaction then even a 10p sale would remove 1p from the market but larger sales would be taxed at the 5% rate. So if someone sells something for 80p on the AH, DE gets 4p and you get 76p. DE would be removing thousands of plat from the game and players would be making way more trades all if the time since it would be convenient. And if you don't want to pay a 1p/5% tax you can always use the trade chat so it would be win-win.

And please stop suggesting that the trade chat is anything but the laziest option possible. Even the filters are poorly implemented and we don't have any way to save them or to load presets.

So for letting the actual value of premium curreny hit a new low you are creating a new plat sink that takes away 1p for each traded item. Sounds like a good idea for DE. Clearly 95% of the prime items are not selling for <20p already.

Let's be real: the ones who want AH the most are the ones who will be benefited the least. With a AH you earn as little as the cost you pay to get something. Players who will be benefited the most are those who already accumulate a lot of wealth before AH become a thing, and you will take forever to earn a quarter from their wealth by selling you dirt cheap prime junk.

Edited July 16, 2018 by Marvelous_A

[(PSN)Hiero_Glyph]

1 hour ago, (XB1)Cotton Tail said:

My God. In all the auction house threads I've seen this, this, Ladies and Gentlemen, is the most coherent and intelligent reply I have ever witnessed.

Please, may I quote this in future?

It's a public forum and ideas are to be shared so refine it as needed.

[-Helsing-]

And everything will be sold for 1 plat because of undercutters , lol

Edited July 16, 2018 by -Helsing-

[(PSN)Hiero_Glyph]

52 minutes ago, Marvelous_A said:

So for letting the actual value of premium curreny hit a new low you are creating a new plat sink that takes away 1p for each traded item. Sounds like a good idea for DE. Clearly 95% of the prime items are not selling for <20p already.

Let's be real: the ones who want AH the most are the ones who will be benefited the least. With a AH you earn as little as the cost you pay to get something. Players who will be benefited the most are those who already accumulate a lot of wealth before AH become a thing, and you will take forever to earn a quarter from their wealth by selling you dirt cheap prime junk.

You keep saying low like players will constantly undercut each other with no one ever buying. Maybe you just over value your items? Maybe you inflate the price so you can negotiate down? If you use any external trading site you can quickly find the lowest price so how would this be any different than using warframe market other than it being officially supported by DE?

And for the record, my personal suggestion is not an AH at all but players stores like Phantasy Star Universe used. Allow players to set up shops either on the relays or in their Orbiter (this would be much easier to implement). Add optional password protection and players could visit other player's shops at any time or players could use them to trade with friends privately. Anyway, this would encourage social interaction and all DE would need to do is add a search function for items in player stores. And to prevent the market from crashing (yeah, I laughed too), you just limit how many items a player can have for sale at once. 

[peterc3]

7 minutes ago, (PS4)Hiero_Glyph said:

You keep saying low like players will constantly undercut each other with no one ever buying. Maybe you just over value your items? Maybe you inflate the price so you can negotiate down? If you use any external trading site you can quickly find the lowest price so how would this be any different than using warframe market other than it being officially supported by DE?

And for the record, my personal suggestion is not an AH at all but players stores like Phantasy Star Universe used. Allow players to set up shops either on the relays or in their Orbiter (this would be much easier to implement). Add optional password protection and players could visit other player's shops at any time or players could use them to trade with friends privately. Anyway, this would encourage social interaction and all DE would need to do is add a search function for items in player stores. And to prevent the market from crashing (yeah, I laughed too), you just limit how many items a player can have for sale at once. 

Congrats, Maroo's Bazaar is in game, right now and is exactly what you've described.

[(PSN)Hiero_Glyph]

5 minutes ago, -Helsing- said:

And everything will be sold for 1 plat because of undercutters , lol

Now you are just making stuff up. Its supply and demand and if no one wants an item or players are willing to sell it for nothing then the value will go down. If, however, an item is worth more then eventually the market price will stabilize and while there will be undercutters it will be a 5-10p difference in price, not everything for 1p. Truth be told the only people who get hurt are the ones that are cheating other players because there is no way to guess market value in-game except for the trade chat.

[(PSN)Hiero_Glyph]

2 minutes ago, peterc3 said:

Congrats, Maroo's Bazaar is in game, right now and is exactly what you've described.

Not even close but I don't fault you for taking the lazy option (DE did).

Edited July 16, 2018 by (PS4)Hiero_Glyph

[Marvelous_A]

25 minutes ago, (PS4)Hiero_Glyph said:

You keep saying low like players will constantly undercut each other with no one ever buying. Maybe you just over value your items? Maybe you inflate the price so you can negotiate down? If you use any external trading site you can quickly find the lowest price so how would this be any different than using warframe market other than it being officially supported by DE?

You know what the funny thing is? YOU ARE NOT WRONG! The current value of 95% items of this game comes purely from the time cost of making a trade, the time you spent in trade chat. These items are all drops in-game with little real money cost, and given the number of players in this game, price of nearly all items will drop sharply coz the number of suppliers will increase dramatically. And what's more interesting, I'm currently sitting with ten of thousands of plat already, so this will only do good for me. I hope it's the case for you also coz if AH is a thing, making plat by selling your extra prime stuff will be extraordinary difficult, if not already is. For the rare items, let's hope dedicated traders clan won't make a monopoly in this game which has been repetitively found in some other games with AH.

Personally I think AH supporters ignore a simple fact, in this market all players are buyers and sellers at the same time. When you get something with little money, you sell it with little money also. It's just a myth that creating an AH will make earning plat easier, if anything, the price of items crashes and so does the value of your effort. The only people ever get benefits from it, are paid players and those who already have a lot of plat in their account, like me, coz they don't need to work in-game for more plat but they can get everything with reduced price.

As for your personal suggestion, it doesn't mean anything here coz it's a thread discussing the typical AH. So it's meaningless for me to make a comment on it also.

Edited July 16, 2018 by Marvelous_A

[peterc3]

Just now, (PS4)Hiero_Glyph said:

Not even close but I don't fault you for taking the lazy option.

Do you mind noting in your posts if you are just going to bark at people in bad faith, so they don't waste their time?

[(PSN)Hiero_Glyph]

10 minutes ago, peterc3 said:

Do you mind noting in your posts if you are just going to bark at people in bad faith, so they don't waste their time?

Listen, you don't even know anything about PSU, let alone how the players stores worked yet you felt the need to claim it works exactly like Maroo's, which it doesn't. So how am I at fault for correcting your mistake?

[peterc3]

1 minute ago, (PS4)Hiero_Glyph said:

Listen, you don't even know anything about PSU, let alone how the players stores worked yet you felt the need to claim it works exactly like Maroo's, which it doesn't. So how am I at fault for correcting your mistake?

My bad, your suggestion is the one thing DE will not add, offline generation of Plat. Changes it from not happening to really not happening.

[-Helsing-]

15 minutes ago, (PS4)Hiero_Glyph said:

Now you are just making stuff up. Its supply and demand and if no one wants an item or players are willing to sell it for nothing then the value will go down. If, however, an item is worth more then eventually the market price will stabilize and while there will be undercutters it will be a 5-10p difference in price, not everything for 1p. Truth be told the only people who get hurt are the ones that are cheating other players because there is no way to guess market value in-game except for the trade chat.

Ever tried to play any kind of MMO ? Tried to sell ores , cloths , herbs or anything ?

Everyone will undercut you even if it is a single copper - who do you think will a person looking for said item buy from ?

 

Ever tried the steam market ? You won't sell anything if you won't undercut yourself and even then it is not guaranteed that said item will sell in the forseeable future without you undercutting your own price again.

If this ever happened Id probably quit the game and I dont even sell stuff at all , would be just pointless to play in the long run If you didnt shell out money yourself to buy plat , which I already did enough times to be honest.

So sorry I am not making stuff up , I have over a decade of experience with this problem that I never ever want to see in this game as it is absolutely NOT needed. Thank you

And if someone got so called "cheated" by someone else , the person can then only blame themselves when they knowingly agreed to a set price.

[(PSN)cjdreadful]

Whether or not it would hurt the game is beside the point. Warframe has been out for how long? Someone has always been asking for this since day one. If DE hasn't done it by now they're not going to. Waste your breath though by all means. All the time ya'll spend arguing on the forums you could be in trade chat js. 

[GlaikitMayflies]

Every time someone suggests this, naysayers will always counter it with either trade chat, as if trade chat is a substantial alternative; or the most ironic one, being Warframe.Market. No one never manages to actually refute the subject.

Let's first understand why trade chat is not as substantial an option, as many others are led to believe. First off, no, chat does not immunize you towards scams, nor does it prevent people from undercutting others. If anything, trade chat is the most exploitable one; offering the most privy, the ability to "catch" as many clueless players as possible. In other words, chat enables people a huge fishing pond, with the chances to net at least one gullible player who will fall for such a price. Chat also has an unintended "feature", in which people are constantly bombard with inconsistent prices, varying with each player, leading to a flawed understanding of item values. For example, one person will sell real low, another will sell 400% more. Such a "feature" leads to, at best, a "good" deal; at worst, a gullible player who will fall for such a obvious scam. Chat also comes with it an unintuitive UI, that has failed to make necessary essential changes to better the interface; unless of course, you count filters as a great improvement upon the UI. I suppose asking for simple QOL changes is too much, huh.

Next is the irony of warframe.market, and how it discredits from those who use it as a means to silence people, or to suggest it as an alternative to a proper auction house. Warframe.market is the literal antithesis of why you shouldn't use it as an example, when you are trying to argue that warframe doesn't need a auction house. For starters, warframe.market is far more accessible, intuitive, and functional, than say the trade chat. Warframe.market also provides people with necessary information to gauge an items worth, before considering on buying or selling stuff. In other words, your chances of being scammed dramatically get lowered, once you get an idea of how much an item is going for. Then apply that knowledge to determine on how to buy or sell. The only question is why arn't more people using the website, instead of the flimsy excuse for a trade UI, that is chat.

Let us now discuss a couple of misconceptions surrounding the application of a auction house. First off prices will not further fall due to an auction house, the player market has already been disrupted due to the more accessible prime farming, rivens, and other several factors. I doubt an auction house will further damage the payer driven market. " But users are already abusing Warframe.market, by going very low. Therefore this is why we shouldn't have a auction house." First this is wrong, and just shows a poor understanding of the website. Most "people" who post such prices, are botters, and are never in game; Nor are they online on the website. It's but a flimsy attempt to lower prices, but ultimately fails as always. "But what if we get botters in the auction house!" I'm sure a company like DE would be able to develop systems in which are capable of catching this type of behavior. "But what about the prices! Wouldn't they fall?" Remember this is a player driven economy; players are fully responsible for defining the prices of the goods they peddle. If people want to undervalue their time and dedication, by selling low, then that is their fault. "But what about DE, surely this will affect their bottom line?!" Sure, but come now, big boy DE doesn't need you to worry about their finances, they already make enough money from prime access, tennocon, and other various monetization options. I'm sure creating a proper trading UI, will not make them go bankrupt. " But what about the value of plat, wouldn't this affect it?" A valid point, but I don't think streamlining a proper trading UI will affect plat value.

If you managed to read through this whole thing, can we at least agree that the current means of selling and buying, in game, are not adequate? Can we at least agree that we need a proper UI for trading, doesn't necessarily mean a auction house, just a proper trading UI.

Edited July 16, 2018 by GlaikitMayflies

[GuardWarg]

Sure. But considering how stubborn Steve is regarding the UI as is, I won't be holding my breath.

[Ohforf3]

7 hours ago, Marvelous_A said:

WM is literally an auction house but you don't even bother moving yourself to dojo and do the trading. If you want plat that much without doing any work, why don't you just buy plat?

Yes Warframe Market is literally an auction house and a Honda Fit is literally a Maserati GranTurismo.

Warframe market is like the Amazon Marketplace.  An auction house is like eBay.

[Navarc]

7 hours ago, Marvelous_A said:

WM is literally an auction house but you don't even bother moving yourself to dojo and do the trading. If you want plat that much without doing any work, why don't you just buy plat?

It's not an auction house if there are no auctions going on whatsoever. Auctions are very crucial to label something an auction house.

[Marvelous_A]

30 minutes ago, Ohforf3 said:

Yes Warframe Market is literally an auction house and a Honda Fit is literally a Maserati GranTurismo.

Warframe market is like the Amazon Marketplace.  An auction house is like eBay.

Be it Honda or Maserati, Amazon or eBay when people are asking for an AH I know they expect a wholesale market where everything is dirt cheap and they are the only one who try to make money from the others

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

If AH becomes a thing, they will find out the only thing changed is their goodies going dirt cheap, and by that time I will take their prime junk with 1p each and drink their tears.

Edited July 16, 2018 by Marvelous_A

[Kimimoto]

On 2018-07-14 at 3:53 PM, (PS4)DirtyJester27 said:

I want to search for what I'm after and buy it.

Then Warframe.market is the place for you

[(PSN)Schobii564]

11 hours ago, Ohforf3 said:

I have seen auctions added to several games and they have all hurt the community rather than helping.  Items with low value become worth even less while resellers attempt to dominate the market for high value items driving the prices through the roof.

 

I know some think it will be bad for DE but good for the players but in reality it will be good for DE in the short term, bad for the players and in the long run for DE.  It will make being F2P harder and drive away potential new customers because they have no chance to advance without spending real money.  In an F2P game like this players are content for other players so losing the F2P players will take content away from the paying players so they become more likely to leave.

 

The trade system is broken and changes are needed.  Making the system even more broken doesn't help.

This right here, auction houses are so easily exploitable that i dont even wanna think about them adding one, my fav example is still runescape, where you can sell the most basic bronze equipment for thousands of gold coins, its ridiculous

[Daffan]

Auction house is bad idea because you have the players who can buy out everything and control pricing. 

 

 

[Kyenhael]

On 2018-07-15 at 4:58 AM, Koldraxon-732 said:

Warframe's trading system involves the premium currency. Automating the process would kill the economy.

I really would like you to enlighten me on how having an AH that uses premium currency can ruin the economy.

A streamlined trading system would bring not only more sellers, but also but buyers. I know i rather grind all my mods and parts till my eyes bleed than have my sanity and time taken away from me in trade chat. 

If there were an easier way to trade, I would probably be buying a lot more things from other players. So maybe your individual item prices would decrease a little, but the number of sales would certainly increase. In the meantime it would give everyone time to enjoy the game more. 

But ok, dont add an AH. I'll just keep my plat to myself. 

[GlaikitMayflies]

4 hours ago, Daffan said:

Auction house is bad idea because you have the players who can buy out everything and control pricing. 

 

 

Sure, but this already occurs now. Just because you can't see it, doesn't mean it doesn't happen. An auction house will just make such things more visible to the public. You will be able to more easily see how people already exploit other players.

[GlaikitMayflies]

7 hours ago, (PS4)Schobii564 said:

This right here, auction houses are so easily exploitable that i dont even wanna think about them adding one, my fav example is still runescape, where you can sell the most basic bronze equipment for thousands of gold coins, its ridiculous

You act as if an auction house will of a sudden dramatically change player behavior. I can assure you, the implementation of an auction house, or proper trading UI, won't change what people are already doing.