Wrecking Wall is a bad design choice for Qorvex

[(PSN)Pablogamer585]

Qorvex's gameplay is that of a low-energy capacity frame with a massive amount of CC and tanking capabilities, similarly to Frost.
His Crucible Blast is meant to be aimed at his Chyrinka Pillars in order to better propagate the 'lash' to all enemies within their range, so as to not have to aim to each one individually, which is difficult due to the slower camera movement applied plus being stationary. However, Crucible Blast is weak on enemies with defences.

Containment Wall is a linear CC ability that groups up enemies and gives them a small debuff that has infinite duration + opens them up to finishers.
It is a very reduced angle to group up enemies, which makes hitting multiple difficult if you've not positioned yourself well, or the enemies haven't, which mind you, they do not want to usually.

That leads us to the next issue.
Qorvex's builds are kind of tight at the moment, as you want to squeeze the max amount of survivability out of him, so using three umbral mods is the right idea.
Then you need some extra range because Chyrinka Pillars do not cover that much ground, and then of course some extra duration, Adaptation, and energy max.

Your build is complete, but in order to make his base ability good against something that does have defences, you need to slot in an augment for his second, and get over 200% strength, which isn't too hard all things considered, we already have 3 umbral mods for 77% and we could use Growing Power as our aura which will probably be constantly active.

But why would I slot in an augment that forces me to go for even more strength and also reduces my modding options by 1, when I can simply replace this ability for Terrify?
It will cover 360º and I don't have to worry about enemies running away because the Chyrinka Pillars are slowing them down and making them stay in place by fighting each other thanks to the radiation procs. It cost 25 more energy to cast, true, but I save a mod slot which now can be used for Primed Flow so I keep a much healthier energy cycle.

That's the thing.
Wrecking Wall's defence removal should be intrinsic to Containment Wall so that he makes good use of his kit without having to rely on an augment for another of his abilities, when a helminth has done that better, and for less hassle. The refresh for the Pillars is a great addition as it prolongs their duration up to a minute max, but I'd like for the main attraction of this augment to be intrinsic to the ability and for it to do something else instead, like spreading the damage debuff with double the effect, for example.

 

Side note here:
Shadow Haze no longer applies a flat additive critical chance buff to allied weapons but instead works like mods.
This augment has been nerfed despite patch notes only mentioning it affecting now Sevagoth's Shadow form.

Edited June 19 by (PSN)Pablogamer585

[ChaqueXR]

Simple answer: you want more strength because as far as I know, the damage vulnerability debuff from Containment Wall scales higher with your strength as well. Also, your 3rd ability gets more max and starting stacks with more strength.

 

Strength was never a bad idea for Qorvex, despite at some point in strength value it starts to become diminishing returns, but it's still good to have a lot of strength on him nonetheless, especially that 90% of all enemy elemental vulnerabilities is streamlined now and I reckon the damage vulnerability is stronger than before.

 

I think the augment is fine, having armor strip along damage vulnerability is pretty strong and is a nice sacrifice of a mod slot. Besides, who said you need full armor strip now? You have benefits for partial armor strip with the damage reduction:armor value scale to be more linear like they showed in the patch notes. In other words, even if you don't want full strength as Qorvex, there's no harm from using the new augment especially for maintaining your pillars longer too.

 

It's a straight up buff.

[(PSN)Pablogamer585]

En 20/6/2024 a las 20:14, ChaqueXR dijo:

Simple answer: you want more strength because as far as I know, the damage vulnerability debuff from Containment Wall scales higher with your strength as well. Also, your 3rd ability gets more max and starting stacks with more strength.

I comprehend you are answering what I said here ->

Cita

But why would I slot in an augment that forces me to go for even more strength and also reduces my modding options by 1, when I can simply replace this ability for Terrify?

More strength is always better, it's a fact I don't debate, what I will, however, is needing an augment so that I can get effective use out of my frame's DPS ability, as this one is very particular mechanically, hence why defences are so important to it.
Isn't it suspicious how the third most recent frame gets an augment that precisely tackles the issue it has with making use of its DPS capabilities?

That's what I don't like, band-aiding a frame because they know it struggles due to design decisions.
Was it too much for Qorvex to come out with defence strip on his 2nd? Would he be competing with the top support / DPS frames or invalidating existing ones? I don't think so, and both Dante and Jade proved DE sometimes may not realise if this is the case either.

 

I found good results with high range using Overextended so the detonations hit more enemies and spread easier with a larger Chyrinka Pillar, which in return meant less ability casts, and more energy I saved that could then be used for a helminth like Terrify, solving the problem of armour better than would the coming augment, but now things have changed considerably.
Armour is less of a problem as you've pointed out, so full strip is not as necessary as it used to be, and the simplification of damage vulnerability for abilities is also great, so I let a pet spread corrosive among the stacked group of enemies and don't have to really use the augment, yet, now their health is considerably higher which offsets armour being less of a concern. This problem has affected a few frames, Qorvex, Ash and Ember primarily for me.

Thing is, with the augment I have to replace an important mod on the build which is Primed Flow, for Qorvex doesn't have a lot of energy (We will talk about this in a moment for I've found a solution that makes me very happy and I think everyone has to try it) and with that 60% less strength I need to compensate with Molt augmented or slotting in a second strength mod, as two casts of Containment Wall drains half my pool, and if I was not at 100% I won't be able to cast Crucible Blast D:

This on itself is a problem too because I already have three Umbral mods (single umbral forma stills) and that severally limits my options, hence why I mentioned the build was tight, for I believe most of us build Qorvex leaning onto his superb armour & health values.
More duration is great on the pillars since Primed Continuity gives them a lifespan of 55s, if am not mistaken, which is also why I find the refresh part a bit unnecessary, also, from playing around with it today seems casting Containment Wall with the augment does refresh the duration even if you hit nothing, which must be a bug.

Referring to your point about Disometric Guard, while more strength is also good, if I'm plaguing the field with radiation the charges will be refreshing pretty often, so I also don't see the necessity of going for more strength to get additional ones per cast, as for me this is a cast once & go.

 

However, I believe you may not be right about there being benefits to partial armour stripping.
It is correct that this update has streamlined enemy defences to be simpler, so if we take a look for example at the Grineer being the primary armoured faction, they all now take increased damage from impact and corrosive, however, this is both with, and without armour factored in.
If I remove the armour off a Grineer completely, their flesh will take +damage from corrosive or impact, yet in the case of Qorvex, radiation has neutral effectiveness on their flesh, and armours, so unless Containment Wall's damage debuff is applied, they do not take increased damage, not even Bombards whose alloy armour was precisely weak to Radiation.

Therefore, there is no advantage anymore to partial armour stripping as there used to be for corrosive dealing +75% damage to ferrite armour, so reaching a critically low armour value was better than removing it completely.

 

Now, remember how I said I found a solution to the energy problem, which was one of my biggest concerns for Qorvex?
He just so happens to be the warframe with the highest armour in the game, something most people ignore because on high level content going from i-frames to i-frames is the better option, but I really like beefy frames, and this update brought one arcane which I was looking forward to a LOT: Battery Armour.
My problematic 200 energy bar has turned into a monstrous 935 energy pool, making it so I don't need to worry about Primed Flow or energy economy again, at the expense of Molt Augmented. As I originally mentioned, all three umbral mods plus Growing Power is enough strength to strip in a single cast with the augment, though I do miss my big range from Overextended, but I already know what I'll do to fix that now that I don't need to worry about energy no more.

 

Even with that in mind, this is an expensive and min-maxxed build, and I still do not find justifiable the qualities of Wrecking Wall given what I've argued initially, but I will keep using the augment since it is the only way to keep all of Qorvex's useful kit without resourcing to helminth.
This is a band-aid, they understand the problem he suffered, just like did Voruna's Ulfrun's Descent.

Do appreciate your optimistic pov honestly.

Edited Friday at 11:01 PM by (PSN)Pablogamer585

[ChaqueXR]

My "simple answer" was not to refer to how you must build Qorvex with the augment; you need strength regardless if you use it or not.

 

Now, saying needing more strength to make use of one augment in comparison to using another ability is purely debatable on only factor: how you want to play (also perceive) Qorvex.

I personally do not like pure caster warframes, such as Ember, simply because it gives me the impression that whenever I play one, the rest of my weapons/loadout is redundant as all my effectiveness comes from my abilities alone.

Qorvex is a hybrid, having punch through for his weapon + vulnerability + an ability to compliment that punch through passive, but sadly leans towards casting more abilities than using your weapons, purely because of 1st and 4th ability.

I am saying this augment is a straight up buff because it opens the option to allow you to make Qorvex a weapon platform; use augment: no need to recast pillars, damage vulnerability, armor strip, continuous status immunity as long as pillars are up. As much as people really like the 4th ability, my own mindset of not liking caster warframes gives me the ability to replace the 4th ability with a damage buff (such as Roar or Eclipse) using the augment and I probably can make it work.

 

If you want to use Qorvex abilities without relying on your weapons and more on your abilities themselves, then the augment is more or less not as redundant for you to use.

Edited Saturday at 06:09 PM by ChaqueXR
typo