[Suggestion] Rewards For Acrobatic Gameplay

[Elhazzared]

Now you're seriously reaching.  The vast majority, huh?  I'd have a hard time doing it too if I had my controls scattered all over no-man's land on my keyboard.  That's like entering a 3-legged beagle in a dog show.  It's not my problem that you're handicapping yourself.

 

Think about the complexity of the stuff you're already doing.  Especially the hand-eye coordination required to aim while managing your weapons.  Chaining vertical runs?  All you do is rotate your view 180 degrees.  That's really it.

 

The vast majority of people cannot reach a high level of muscle memory. Go see how many people can actually use a keyboard without looking at it. You can be used to talk to people who do but how many are these people? A few hundreds in millions?

 

I am not handycaping myself. If I have all the keys together I can't even do anything properly as I'll repeatedly hit the wrong keys... Ever played WoW or anything of the like? My case it was Tor and guess what. I don't press the keys since I cannot be hitting the right ones at a time. I press things on the screen which is incredibly easier. Sure I am not as good in PVP but in PVE I do as well as anyone else. Like me there are many and we are more in numbers than the people who can actually find the right key without looking when there is a jumble of them together.

 

Hand to eye coordination is easy and I didn't said chaining between 2 different walls. I mean using the same wall where what you have to do is run up the wall, do a slide manover and a slide attack so that you can go back to run up the wall without having lost too much height.

[Satori_Mind]

They are useful for dodging. I just don't agree with giving bonus for using it.

 

So I'll quit messing around and be completely honest.  You don't want stunt bonuses or recognition because you may personally miss out on them.  Is something like 5% more affinity for kills while wallrunning really going to set you back?

Edited April 14, 2013 by FloofyRedTail

[Elhazzared]

So I'll quit messing around and be completely honest.  You don't want stunt bonuses or recognition because you may personally miss out on them.  Is something like 5% more affinity for kills while wallrunning really going to set you back?

 

If they do something like 5% afinnity, yeah I probably wont care but if they start listening too much to this nonsense going on of giving more money or even mods to people who execute acrobatics kills. Hell yes I'll be pissed off about it and i can tell you for a fact that I won't be the only one.

 

Still it begs the question. Why does dodge mechanics or getting closer to an enemy fast or even killing in him a different way that just putting a bullet through his head and 500 paces and tanking any damage like a boss be more rewarding?

 

It's good as it's stands, both styles of gameplay are equally rewarded and in fact there are warframes that were made for acrobatics and dodging by giving it more mobillity and less tank while others were specificly designed to stand there tanking while killing.

[Satori_Mind]

The fact is that not all content and rewards are going to be available to inflexible players.  The problem is armor is currently less significant the more enemies are scaled up.  If I wanted a cover shooter, I'd play a cover shooter.  Warframe is the game Vanquish wanted to be.

[Elhazzared]

The fact is that all content is available to all kinds of players right now and the game is very fun. If they move away from this they will lose a lot of customers. The game is not a cover shooter, it doesn't even has cover mechanics which I hate. If there was any cover mechanics i wouldn't have played this game past 5 minutes and it has nothing to do with inhabillity to use them, I just don't like them and find them highly stupid like putting a gun out of cover and shooting while hiting everything without looking. Cover mechanics just destroy a game for me.

 

The problem with armor currently is that DE just makes the enemies do more damage and more bullet spongy when they should give them abillities and specific ways to work or add new types of enemies with new ways to work.

[neKroMancer]

I agree with Ronyns. Acrobatic movements should gives player an edge in combat, throwing the AI's aim off while moving toward it or flanking with wallrun/slide is a good way to encourage players to play the game more daringly instead of relying on high shield/health to fight a battle.

Addition of parry mechanic is a good evidence that the game will be using mobility as durability.

[Satori_Mind]

The fact is

Pfffffhahahaha

 

See you in three months, man.  Oh wait.

[Elhazzared]

Pfffffhahahaha

 

See you in three months, man.  Oh wait.

 

Really, since closed beta have you seen it being any different?

 

Sure DE can listen to this thread and chose to screw over a lot of players, I am actually sure there are more players that can't properly handle acrobatics thatn those who can, lots of those players are paying customers.

 

How do you think most screwed over customers react? Sure, DE can change it but then they'll lose a lot of revenue.

 

I am not too afraid they will change it because I know they have to keep revenue in mind but I'll still fight against thing that will just affect the game adversly.

 

At any rate, right now everyone is happy, why go and make one large part of the community unhappy especially when the other part isn't actually that unhappy about it?

 

A system that makes everyone happy is in the end a better system.

[Chtulie]

Why should just the guy who can play the game better get better feedback stuff?

It's a co-op game, the better anyone/every-one plays the game, the better the rewards should be for everyone.

So if someone plays better, puts up a show, the chance for better loot should go up for everyone.

So then everyone is motivated to put up a show for the others as well so the drop quality goes up for everyone.

 

What you don't want is what we got now. Playing better is actually less efficient. Going slow, going in every nook & cranny, finding all the storage containers, let the computer keep spawning enemies, that's much more efficient for the metagame. With the sole exception of grinding bosses, doing anything but playing the game like a bullet ninja, like bulletstorm, like the club, is the best way to play.

[YellowJacketXV]

That's implying that some of us don't play this game like God Hand with a high level Furax on a "Rush" Loki.

[WingsOfGryphin]

they just cannot time things right to do acorbatics and it will make them feel like they are being cheated of advantages others are getting. In other cases there are people who don't like doing acrobatics and they shouldn't be penalised for not doing them.

 

The current way is the better, you can do acrobatics or not, it doesn't affect your gains at the end of the mission, it's all about how you want to have your fun.

 

You might as well toss aiming in this discussion. Why the F*** then they don't make autoaims when there are tons of people that can't do it right. So why people with good aim should be rewarded? HUH? ^ I was just making a point with this sentence. Supporting monkeys on computers will bring downfall to gaming.

[Elhazzared]

You might as well toss aiming in this discussion. Why the F*** then they don't make autoaims when there are tons of people that can't do it right. So why people with good aim should be rewarded? HUH? ^ I was just making a point with this sentence. Supporting monkeys on computers will bring downfall to gaming.

 

I dunno, maybe because this is a shooter and not a score attack game? it would make a lot more sense to actually reward for kills/assists than for acrobactics which by the way is not what this game is all about, this was something nice given to us by the Dev but the game is still primarely a shooter. An action shooter but a shooter first and foremost.

[Insanityman]

I agree with Ronyn. the benefits of acrobatics should be in how they can make you effective, not in some random number bonus applied to damage or crit chance or affinity. If you have a height advantage, you're already getting more head shots.  If the enemy aim was suitably (noticeably!) disrupted so that you COULD wall run, flip, flying kick-then-somersault-second kick into a group of enemies and still have enough health or shields left to survive and escape, thats the balance that should be sought.  You dont want people pulling all those stunts then getting stuck in AND taking all the fun from the guys at range, but the two styles should complement each other. There are certain situations (maybe ive been over my head, maybe not) where if i did anything but fire a shot or two before ducking back into cover id have been roasted.  The more agile frames need to be able to use their agility to get an advantage in combat against an enemy rather than simply being able to skip them before they get entrenched.  For the small groups of enemies this is a joke, I can pull it off on a mod-less ember. For large groups (8+) in tight spaces wall running just paints the wall red.  Maybe its a matter of thinning the grineer herd before trying stunts. Mix and match play styles for greatest effect.  But i think because we see a lot more of the tactical pacing of cover shooters (except in giant arenas) that maybe the stunt runners could use some love (at least while theyre moving at mach 3, once you're in melee combat, prepare to run or be hosed).  

 

Do we request some mods that make warframes more durable while stunting in an effort to give them gap closers that arent Slash Dash? Will that make Slash Dash obsolete?  Will this make kick-and-run style warframes dedicated to crowd control overpowered?

 

Its not a matter of more affinity, its a matter of making all the playstyles viable without making one of them "the most efficient and effective" and thereby make it "the one used to farm because of the afforementioned effectiveness and efficiency".

[WiggidyWack]

Kinda disgusts me how many people in this thread are advocating handholding so hard. I don't really care for an acrobatics reward system, but the people saying it shouldn't be added because it penalises other players just make me laugh. The idea isn't to penalise players, it's to reward better players, because yes, getting a perfect paris shot while wallrunning is harder than doing it while standing still.

[Elhazzared]

If you want to call that holding hand that's is up to you. For me holding hands is deliberatly make the game easier so that anyone can finish it no matter how bad they are at the game. Adding something that would make this a score attack game rather than a shooter and giving a real bonus to those who could score attack higher is just plain bad. No matter how hard the game is right now (and not that hard really) I can finish any mission killing anything that crosses me. Even that is something that some players have troubles with though not my case. Would I feel cheated if they gave other people bonus for acrobacies? Damn right I would, especially when the game is supposed to give you a variety of choices in how to approuch a situation but then goes on rewarding a particular type of approuch.

 

Sorry, that's not holding hand, that's just stupidity. If you want to play a score attack game then you'll find many elsewhere, both in single player and multiplayer.

 

A perfect shot from a wallrun paris is just as effective as one from a guy standing still. in the end the outcome is the same, enemy dies. One shouldn't be more rewarding than the other, they are different ways of playing the game and I don't see why anyone should be forced to play it the way you like it.

 

This is just like a discussion between rushers and explorers. Explorers shouldn't be penalised for wanting to explore the whole level and rushers shouldn't be penalised for rushing through the whole map acomplishing only the objective. They are different playstyles which have their merits and should be equally rewarded.