Requirements For High Tier Mod Fusions

[vats3]

I know no one talks about this anymore but there is a seriously large amount of mods needed to rank up a mod past rank 4-5 in my for instence im going to use organ shatter because i have a full page of them

 

model used

(starting lvl)+(number of dub mods)->(ending lvl)

 

 

from last lvl

 

0+1->1

1+2->2

2+4->3

3+8->4

4+16->5

 

from lvl 0

 

0+1->1

0+3->2

0+7->3

0+15->4

0+31->5 

 

it in fact took more then a page to just get to rank 5, also it follows a simple math formula 2^(x-1) 

 

now if we took this farther for some of the mods that have a cap of 10 

 

from last lvl

 

5+32->6

6+64->7

7+128->8

8+256->9

9+512->10

 

from lvl 0

 

0+63->6

0+127->7

0+255->8

0+511->9

0+1023->10

 

now im sure you have realised that it requires 1 for any one lvl to the next then it requires to get all the way to the last lvl before that one (i.e. it takes 512 to go from 9->10 but only 511 to go from 0->9). This system works while the cap is 5 but when you get to the 8 or 9th lvl it stops becoming worth it at all (and if its a common you are spending 300k to go from 0->10 and if its a rare 900k) im sure someone has brought this up before but seriously there is a huge problem in this, geting something to rank 10 is impossible, this is 1000 mods and 300k if you are making a common and all dubs something needs to change in this

[Argoms]

In the end- why do you need rank 10 damage bonus anyway? You're already overleveled at the current "endgame", and when new content that expects you to have maxed damage bonuses comes, wouldn't that come with content that has more valuable drops (say, rare fusion cores) too?

 

Right now, it's one of those extremely long-term goals that barely benefits you apart from the feeling of satisfaction given. Until we get enemies that require this level of mods, we don't have a reason to stop making it so hard to acquire said level.

[Rabcor]

So this is why it's taking me so long to get my serration to level 6... and so many credits. this formula works fine until after level 5, after level 5 it should (in my opinion) instead of doubling itself increase by 16 per level, so 48 for level 6, 64 for level 7, 80 for level 8, 96 for level 9 and 110 for level 10.

 

it'll still be hard as all hell to get up to level 10, but it'll just be possible now instead of impossible. and it will require a total of

 

429 (i think, lazy to calculate) instead of 1023

 

that sounds way more reasonable, and way easier to actually do.

 

 

And to my above poster, We are now... but end-game content has not been added yet, so nothing is final at the game's current state. we hope for more powerful Warframes and weapons by the end of the game, so that the bosses and missions on the next planets will be harder than if they'd make them assuming our power level to be what it is now on average rather than what it is by maximum.

Edited May 2, 2013 by rabcor

[Xtorma]

We have no idea where the game is headed. This may seem insurmountable to people while beta is still going on, but when they finaly get to the point where they are ready for release, it may be much quicker.

[kaizoku222]

We have no idea where the game is headed. This may seem insurmountable to people while beta is still going on, but when they finaly get to the point where they are ready for release, it may be much quicker.

 

It's absurd and doesn't work *now*. That's why we're giving feeback *now*, so DE can either say "Yeah this is intended as the endgame will compensate for this mechanic" or "Man we really didn't know how absurd this was until you pointed it out".

 

"It's a beta" is never, *ever* an excuse for bad design, and this is bad design. It's currently arbitrary, restrictive, exceedingly costly, and grindy to level mods to their maximum potential. This is really bad for a beta, as a very small group of people are going to have the resources to actually test that maximum potential and give feedback on how it functions.

 

There isn't a good reason for this design, and DE hasn't said anything at all about why it is this way. Never assume the devs have a plan for something that doesn't work current, or they will never be inclined to fix anything.

[Cakes]

First off, we need to address a problem that poppoed up after establishing that fusing a mod to Rank 10 being impossible:
To the players who are now queuing up to recieve their "I did something impossible in Warframe" trophy award, I am sorry but we ran out of them and are in the process of making more. Lots more.

 

The fusion process boils down to exponentially rising costs for linear growth. By design it rewards long term dedication in ranking up a specific mod. The game's current balance in mission difficulty allows casual players to reach mod ranks to tackle the harder missions in a reasonably short amount of game time. The vast majority of mods are capped at Rank 5, with a cap of Rank 10 reserved for only a select few common and uncommon mods which modify base stats. Fusing a mod to Rank 10 is designed to be a long term investment, during which the credit costs are virtually negligible in comparison to the rate of acquiring duplicates. Wanting to skip the arduous process of fusing only duplicates and swapping in other mods or fusion cores raises the credit costs.

 

You know why no one talks about it anymore? Because with the devs addressing base shield/health gain, mod drop rates, and rate of credit gain, the fusion process of the few mods which go up to Rank 10 is for the most part reasonable post-Rank 5 when viewed as a long term commitment. Incidentally, Rank 10 mods aren't necessary to progress to the hardest missions in the game. In the game's current state, it essentially rewards the player with win-more. Problems in the process arise only when a player expects to fuse a mod to Rank 10 within a short time span.

Edited May 2, 2013 by Cakes

[Xtorma]

It's absurd and doesn't work *now*. That's why we're giving feeback *now*, so DE can either say "Yeah this is intended as the endgame will compensate for this mechanic" or "Man we really didn't know how absurd this was until you pointed it out".

 

"It's a beta" is never, *ever* an excuse for bad design, and this is bad design. It's currently arbitrary, restrictive, exceedingly costly, and grindy to level mods to their maximum potential. This is really bad for a beta, as a very small group of people are going to have the resources to actually test that maximum potential and give feedback on how it functions.

 

There isn't a good reason for this design, and DE hasn't said anything at all about why it is this way. Never assume the devs have a plan for something that doesn't work current, or they will never be inclined to fix anything.

I find the fact that we have no idea what direction they are taking the game is the underlying problem here. You can't really label this "bad design" until you know all the parameters, which they keep from us for whatever reasons they have. I agree they should be more forthcoming with data on the direction the game is going, I just don't think we have enough information to condemn a feature as bad design yet.

[kaizoku222]

Xtorma, on 02 May 2013 - 05:58 AM, said:

I find the fact that we have no idea what direction they are taking the game is the underlying problem here. You can't really label this "bad design" until you know all the parameters, which they keep from us for whatever reasons they have. I agree they should be more forthcoming with data on the direction the game is going, I just don't think we have enough information to condemn a feature as bad design yet.

Yes we do, we have all the information beta testers can have, other than developer intent, to determine good or bad design choices. As testers it is not our responsibility to speculate on what the future of the game might be, only what the reality of it is right now. And seeing as nearly all of our frames potency now comes from mods, level 5 or 10 mods are "end game" gear, basically a goal everyone wants to get (and one of the only long term goals we have). The issue is that as the game is now that goal is nearly unattainable and determined by random chance, both are bad design as the game is now.

Until DE either shows or tells us what the future of the game will be it's our responsibility as testers to tell them what's wrong now in this version of Warframe.