No Un-Banning After Second Incident?

[SymphNo9]

...

Also, simple checks like these do catch lots of hackers.  Most people who want to cheat at videogames are completely stupid.  They think, hey, CheatEngine worked great for my single player games, even on a few mp games (people used to use it in Dungeon Defenders) lets try it in Warframe.  Or they just read a random forum post somewhere talking about Cheat Engine.

 

 

Ha! I remember that...but to be fair, TE did a big mistake. Storing the save files on local, essentially screaming, hack me please. I admit I was one of those who used CE to pimp my gear to higher numbers without getting detected. But I got tired of TE's poor decisions of gear stats (you could use 100 hours to farm up your gear to only see it be completely useless on the next patch). Though, I never sold my gear to others and mainly only used it when in solo play or helping friends out, unlike some of the others who went amok with trading and partly ruined a good experience for those who were still new and haven't put into hours of grinding yet.

 

Point is, this will happen to DE too, if they didn't make this bold decision with their current security.

[XDeathCoreX]

 

Use cheats, automation software (bots), hacks, mods or any other unauthorized third-party software, tools or content designed to modify the Software, the Service or the Game experience;

 

Since you were curious Mr. XDeathCoreX

So simply having cheat engine open and NOT using it isn't against the EULA so all this EULA talk and people hiding behind the EULA is silly.

 

Seems the developers are just paranoid and so are half the people here.

 

But is using the tool to modify other games really against the EULA...

 

In the end, all that EULA talk was pointless.

 

People need a better defense then a EULA no one ever reads.

[XDeathCoreX]

Also, simple checks like these do catch lots of hackers.  Most people who want to cheat at videogames are completely stupid.  They think, hey, CheatEngine worked great for my single player games, even on a few mp games (people used to use it in Dungeon Defenders) lets try it in Warframe.  Or they just read a random forum post somewhere talking about Cheat Engine.

If they are that stupid, does this system really need to ban people forever including the innocent ones?

[crow-k]

My new defense. 

[Mainabi]

So simply having cheat engine open and NOT using it isn't against the EULA so all this EULA talk and people hiding behind the EULA is silly.

 

Seems the developers are just paranoid and so are half the people here.

 

But is using the tool to modify other games really against the EULA...

 

In the end, all that EULA talk was pointless.

 

People need a better defense then a EULA no one ever reads.

it's not paranoid, people got unbanned after the first time that should be lesson enough to be careful, yet he did the same mistake again. I don't know why you're trying to defend CheatEngine User. Simply be cautious problem solved

[crow-k]

If they are that stupid, does this system really need to ban people forever including the innocent ones?

Which ones would you consider innocent? Also many players who opened tickets were allowed to regain their accounts. ITT guy loses it 2 times, friend pours out some beer for his fallen homies. 

[XDeathCoreX]

it's not paranoid, people got unbanned after the first time that should be lesson enough to be careful, yet he did the same mistake again. I don't know why you're trying to defend CheatEngine User. Simply be cautious problem solved

It's about the average user of any cheat program for any offline game. Be cautious as you want, humans tend to make the same mistake down the road. Watch this country get into another pointless war as soon as a republican is president or perhaps more job loss, worse economy,etc. Do those republicans ever learn?

Edited May 10, 2013 by XDeathCoreX

[XDeathCoreX]

Which ones would you consider innocent? 

What do you think? Are all players that use cheat engine offline guilty?

[crow-k]

If they were offline they wouldnt have been banned. Even those people got re-instated to the game via a support ticket. if DE lets him back fine. But your 11 pages of trolling are old now. He failed, you failed with him, and I failed for thinking I could explain it to you. Bye

[XDeathCoreX]

If they were offline they wouldnt have been banned. Even those people got re-instated to the game via a support ticket. if DE lets him back fine. But your 11 pages of trolling are old now. He failed, you failed with him, and I failed for thinking I could explain it to you. Bye

11 pages?  Explain what? That was someone else.

 

And I meant single player game. PC does not have to be offline.

Edited May 10, 2013 by XDeathCoreX

[Enot83]

So simply having cheat engine open and NOT using it isn't against the EULA so all this EULA talk and people hiding behind the EULA is silly.

 

Seems the developers are just paranoid and so are half the people here.

 

But is using the tool to modify other games really against the EULA...

 

In the end, all that EULA talk was pointless.

 

People need a better defense then a EULA no one ever reads.

 

Incorrect, you are taking a subsection as the overriding evidence of the entire EULA agreement.  This is only one part of a classification of unauthorized 3rd party program, that if capable of doing that, is monitored for according to section 4 of the EULA.  Since that is the exact purpose of a program such as cheat engine, seeing it running they can ban you.  It does not need to be actively doing the things outlined in section 2, only capable of doing these things.

 

 

 

use any unauthorized third-party software that intercepts, “mines”, or otherwise collects information from, within or through the Software or Service, including without limitation, any software that reads areas of RAM used by the Software to store information about a character, in-game items or the Software environment; provided, however, that Digital Extremes may, in its sole discretion, allow the use of specified third party user interfaces;

 

It's laughable that you guys glom onto 1 piece of information without taking the time to read through the intent of the document.

 

 modify, or allow or cause to be modified, any files that are a part of the Software in any way not expressly authorized by Digital Extremes in writing in each instance;

 

And there is more, and more, and more all in the EULA.  It's pretty clear, running a program capable of doing these things is gonna put you at their discretion. 

Edited May 10, 2013 by Enot83

[Mainabi]

It's about the average user of any cheat program for any offline game. Be cautious as you want, humans tend to make the same mistake down the road. Watch this country get into another pointless war as soon as a republican is president or perhaps more job loss, worse economy,etc. Do those republicans ever learn?

yes it's human to make mistakes, it's also human to learn from mistakes,

if you're stupid enough to make a bigger mistake twice, you don't deserve to play the game at all.

 

"The wise are instructed by reason, average minds by experience, the stupid by necessity and the brute by instinct." quote by Marcus Tullius Cicero

 

So most people here are "wise" enough not to run any CE-Tools etc while warframe is running. there are also some cases people don't know and they will get banned accidentaly. But DE is nice enough and if it's really honest and true that it was just an accident they will ban you for the first time.

If you can use a pc and learn how to download a game, register yourself on this forum and play that game you should be at least average enough to learn from that mistake and not do it again.

BUT the case with the OP is simply he did it again, the only question is if he got the mindset of a brute or a stupid.

 

DE support is by far the best support for any Online Games I've played (and I've played lots of online games, contacted so many supports including many f2p games)

Crying that DE is unfair by that anti cheat concept is simply rude and anything but true.

DE is more than fair,

- you made a mistake and bought something wrong with platinum? they're nice enough to refund the plat so you can change the purchase (only if there's a real case of mistake!)

- they even unban users, because they know the detection is sensible, BUT they actually don't have to unban those guys, yet they do it, it's far from beeing unfair, 

 

Sorry but you're trying to much, it simply looks like you really want to cheat in this game, but thanks to that you're so scared and won't try anything anymore close to that. 

 

but honestly if that's really the case DE has alraedy won that war :) and the discussion is over

Edited May 11, 2013 by SeiraSunmin

[Shockness]

I deleted cheat engine because i just knew i would accidently click on it and ruin everything D:

[Bubsters]

Why would you need to cheat in this easy as hell game?

[nofo]

I doubt they ban by IP, that is useless to anyone who even knows how to use google.

 

@ OP, your friend deserves it. Loading up hacks and then playing an online game is stupid. To all the people suggesting less harsh measures, would you rather more hackers and less upset careless people who modify other games or less hackers and careless people getting punished for it.

 

Stop being stupid, if you want to hack ANYTHING do it on a machine that isn't running online games or be very careful.

Edited May 11, 2013 by nofo

[Quetzhal]

This is an out-of-curiosity question, but was hacking much of a problem before they implemented the fix? I saw maybe one topic mentioning that it could be done, and none whatsoever complaining about teammates that were flying around with infinite ammo/shields/etc.

Edited May 11, 2013 by Quetzhal

[Mainabi]

This is an out-of-curiosity question, but was hacking much of a problem before they implemented the fix? I saw maybe one topic mentioning that it could be done, and none whatsoever complaining about teammates that were flying around with infinite ammo/shields/etc.

let me explain it again

you can disconnect when you're playing solo.

 

which means all data in that solo game is stored in your memory till you upload it when the game ends (mission failed or finished), that also means anything was cheatable.

 

in theory you can cheat the amount of credits, of the resossources, the exp and if you're skilled enough you should even be able to "cheat" the drops, telling you getting 1000x multishot or whatever in a run.

thus that also means you could easily do godmode and ammo cheat, maybe even modify the defense pod/generator HP/shield data. damage cheats should be also possible.

 

well that's the theory, since all data was calculated on your own pc, while playing solo.

[SymphNo9]

Seira is absolutely correct. It is also why whenever you go from "Online" to "Solo", it says you disconnected from the host list and why it makes sense you can pause your solo game. Also, just because the topic at hand isn't being discussed, doesn't mean it is non-existent.

[Quetzhal]

let me explain it again

you can disconnect when you're playing solo.

 

which means all data in that solo game is stored in your memory till you upload it when the game ends (mission failed or finished), that also means anything was cheatable.

 

in theory you can cheat the amount of credits, of the resossources, the exp and if you're skilled enough you should even be able to "cheat" the drops, telling you getting 1000x multishot or whatever in a run.

thus that also means you could easily do godmode and ammo cheat, maybe even modify the defense pod/generator HP/shield data. damage cheats should be also possible.

 

well that's the theory, since all data was calculated on your own pc, while playing solo.

I wasn't making an argument for or against the ban system. I was asking because I wanted the information to help me form an opinion. I wasn't trying to make a point. o_o

Blah, I guess the way I worded it made it sound like that though. Sorry. =/

 

Also, just because the topic at hand isn't being discussed, doesn't mean it is non-existent.

True, but that's why I was asking, in case other people had access to information I didn't. I have no idea how prevalent it was.

Edit: I may have missed the point. If you guys were trying to say that cheats would basically be undetectable to other players, resulting in the lack of discussion (and an impossibility to give any sort of estimation), then fair enough. Sorry, kinda tired right now.

Edited May 11, 2013 by Quetzhal

[Mainabi]

I wasn't making an argument for or against the ban system. I was asking because I wanted the information to help me form an opinion. I wasn't trying to make a point. o_o

Blah, I guess the way I worded it made it sound like that though. Sorry. =/

 

True, but that's why I was asking, in case other people had access to information I didn't. I have no idea how prevalent it was.

Edit: I may have missed the point. If you guys were trying to say that cheats would basically be undetectable to other players, resulting in the lack of discussion (and an impossibility to give any sort of estimation), then fair enough. Sorry, kinda tired right now.

oh I've thought you were asking what cheat engine could do, sowie :o

[XDeathCoreX]

Should people really be punished harshly for easy to make mistakes? And I suggested long temporary bans leading to permanent.

[Quetzhal]

oh I've thought you were asking what cheat engine could do, sowie :o

Ohh. Okay. No worries. XD

[Notso]

OP states that his friend even tried to hack the client in the first place, why would he get the money back?

 

He actually didn't. The OP's friend who tried to hack to get Pt and the OP's clan mate who was incorrectly banned are two different people. OP only brought up the hacking friend to point out that CE can't be used for hacks that actually hurt the game.

[Notso]

I've no read the entire thread, and I just have a small thing to point out:

 

While I haven't seen a single person in the argument with Cignal argue without logical fallacy [on both sides of the argument], Cignal's original point about the name check being superfluous is a valid one.

 

We know that DE has implemented a scanner that checks the names of all the processes you have running, and if "CheatEngine.exe" is among them, you are instabanned. We also know that there is a second system in place that bans users for injecting into "Warframe.exe" [using CE or otherwise]. All Cignal is saying is that any hacker capable of bypassing the second system is tremendously unlikely to not also bypass the first system. Thus, the first system's necessity is completely negated by the existence of the second system. There is no cheater who would not be caught by the second system but would be caught by the first.

[Notso]

Well look at it like this, maybe its a better analogy..... You rob a store and get away with it, BUT a store right next to it identifies you and sends you to jail even though you never robbed that one. It may be a rather harsh example but it serves the point.

 

Actually, that's also a rubbish analogy. Continuing with the theme of these analogies, a better one would be:

 

You rob a store and get away with it, except you own the store - you do this simply for fun, for the thrill of robbing but at no cost to anybody. The next-door store sees you, reports you, and you get sent to jail.